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Is this the new Leica 'Mini M'?

May 29, 2013 at 18:07:29 GMT

OTHER NEWS LEICA MINI-M

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Leica has announced that it has a 'new family member' coming on June 11th and, as the German manufacturer continues to tease the 'Mini M' on its website, a photo has emerged which may reveal more details about the forthcoming camera. According to mirrorlessrumors.com, a 'French iPad app' has published what seems to be an advertisement for the new Mini M and, if genuine, it reveals that the Mini will sport a 16MP APS-C sensor and an 28-70mm (equivalent) F3.5-6.4 zoom lens.

Other details from the supposed French advert include full HD video recording and aluminum body construction. Ironically (but not unexpectedly) the photograph indicates that the purported M Mini lacks an optical viewfinder. Why is that ironic? Well, because according to Leica lore, the 'M' in Leica M stands for 'Messsucher', which is German for 'rangefinder'. Of course there's every reason to expect that even if it doesn't offer a 'true' Leica M experience, like the X-2 and (M Typ 240) the new camera will support an optional electronic viewfinder of some description (we're holding out for a re-badged version of the very nice Olympus VF4).

Meanwhile, the mysterious black box on Leica's website has opened slightly...

According to mirrorlessrumors.com the new camera will cost 2450 Euros (~$3100). What do you make of this latest rumor? Let us know in the comments.

Comments

Total comments: 366

That has GOT to be a kit lens. If this thing does not mount all M lenses, it will be truly DOA.

1 upvote

There is a problem with that spec:

The X2 is APSC with an 24/2.8 lens.
When cropped to a 70mm-equivalent FoV (47mm), it corresponds to 47/5.5.

If true, this new camera would be 18-47/3.5-6.4. This is a worse spec than the X2 at everything above 23mm and makes the zoom offering obsolete (ignoring pixel peeping).

The leak may be real but I am then wondering what Leica engineers have been smoking lately ;)

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

1 upvote

The new opening in the box appears to reveal a finder. Whether it's an X with an optical or hybrid finder, or full-frame digltal CL, that's certainly more what I'd like to see than what's shown in the mockup photo that heads this announcement.

0 upvotes

On closer examination, what seemed like a finder window is just the inside of the box above what looks like the contents. Wishful thinking on my part.

0 upvotes

No, this is not what's in the box.

4 upvotes

Where is Ricoh GR review? Who cares about Leica anyway?

5 upvotes

those specs are so 2012 and totally lame.

3 upvotes

You're too generous.

3 upvotes

This cam is so 2008 and late. (Why yes, I AM a Poet)

1 upvote

wow... a really expensive cropped-sensor camera with no view-finder and a really slow and limited zoom lens that you can't change... is this really Leica?

2 upvotes

that the price is more then twice the X-E1 fuji with an equivalent lens but there is no way it will be twice as good.
It may be a great competitor / alternative / 2nd choice from Germany.
Lets wait until we got all the details.

0 upvotes

x-e1's kit zoom is much better.

0 upvotes

The romancing of Leica, the iconic brand conceived by Oskar Barnach in 1913, goes on.

Whether one like the brand or not, they introduced the first portable camera using 35mm cinematic film. That revolutionalized the way people can take pictures. Its the "point and shoot" camera of the era.

Many photography hopefuls thinks that by owning a Leica, they would instantly turn themselves into photographers. Don't get me wrong. They still make some of the world's best lenses. However, as for digital cameras, they are struggling.

I wonder whether Henri Cartier-Bresson would have chosen a Leica if he started photography in 2013? Could it be an Olympus E-P5?

Like "The Great Gatsby", the world needs romance and romance makes life worth living.

Interesting to know what this new camera would turn out to be.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting

3 upvotes

a new baby of a species extinct in the wild.

3 upvotes

Looks legit since it is boring as hell(no mount, non FF, lens looks like a Canon EF-S kit). The leaked image above doesn't appear opposing the slightly opened box in their website.
The zoom is probably Leica's answer to their growing Asian market.

0 upvotes

According to mirrorlessrumours "The Leica Mini M is an APS-C sensor camera with fixed [28-70mm f3.5-6.3] zoom lens". Lens spec seem a bit pedestrian if it is fixed (rather than a new lens mount).

Also a lot of commenters on that site are already calling it fake due to the wording on the lens not following the general Leica style, but DPR seems to be quite accurate when they pick out rumours to post (perhaps because they've already been playing with one under NDA ;)

0 upvotes

Leica's putting itself in a very sensitive position. While some people will gladly forfeit the modern functionality of a lot of cameras for the experience of using a full-frame rangefinder camera.

But by dropping the sensor to an APS-C size the camera is going to be pitted directly against the likes or Sony and Fuji both of which produce cameras capable of rendering very beautiful pictures and already have their own followers.

I'm curious, and I won't say I have no interest in it, but I think that if this camera doesn't perform as well as its direct competitors it will tarnish the Leica brand a little.

1 upvote

Or, on the funny side of things, maybe this Mini M Leica is a plan made into a product by some brilliant Leica's marketing manager, who wanted to get rid of all the 200K dots LCDs and other pre-2004 tech, together with some glass chips that remained after the fabrication of APO Summicrons. They have half succeeded depleting the stock with X1 and X2 .. :-)

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

4 upvotes

"Do not want!"

3 upvotes

Fuji killed Leica.

3 upvotes

No Leica will live on it has a stable list of clientele, too many people aspire to own one

1 upvote

on the contrary, it's the Japanese who keep the cabbage alive.

0 upvotes

No that is the Koreans. Kimchi.

0 upvotes

Yes. In terms of a sub 3k$ camera.

0 upvotes

The game of publicity....

1 upvote

Get a Pentax K-01 for $400. Better images, better style!

5 upvotes

Pentax uses Leica lenses?

0 upvotes

I'm disappointed if this is what they are offering. Why not an EVF M with an M mount?

1 upvote

So glad I got a GRX with M mount.
APS-C (Ok, only 12MP, but really nice ones) and I can use just about every Leica lens ever made and many many more from other lens-makers via adapters...

Now if only DxO would recognize DNGs... :-(

5 upvotes

When will CSC makers get that serious photographers want built-in viewfinders? And an f2.8 lens wouldn't go amiss, either. This looks suspiciously like a re-boxed, re-badged Panasonic.

If it had had a built-in VF and an f2.8 lens, I'd have taken out a bank loan to get one. As it is, meh.

1 upvote

The name is going to be...Vario X.
An X2 with zoom, but more solid built.

0 upvotes

It'd make sense to call it XV-1.

0 upvotes

The name is vario x. I held it in my hand 2 days ago.

0 upvotes

Witch regards to the M referring to 'Messsucher', 'mini M' may only be a nickname. When you look at Leica's website you'll see that the X2 is nicked 'micro M' and the D-lux 6 is nicked 'nano M'.

The new camera is shown on the website as '? Mini M'. Hence it will likely bear another name and is probably not a Messsucher...

0 upvotes

If only it was a:
• fixed 35mm f1.4 leica lens on an aps-c sensor (50mm equiv)
• fixed 50mm f2 leica lens on a FF sensor
• FF digital version of the CL/minilux with the fixed 40mm f2.4 summarit lens

It would create some serious competition for
Fuji & Sony RX-1 imo, even at $3100.

3 upvotes

Why fixed?
Get a GXR and use a 35 Summilux, OR a 50 Summicron OR a Summarit OR OR OR etc,,,

1 upvote

Fixed lenses can keep the camera compact (makes the design a whole lot more efficient), and optimize sensor performance for the lens specifically. Add to that the possibility of a leaf shutter, and since we're talking about Leica a consistent design for the complete package. Maybe with a OVF that would have the proper focal-length and framelines to match the lens. Maybe even a (basic) rangefinder too. While keeping the M sales safe for not being interchangeable.

2 upvotes

"this will be great for street photography"

i had to say that, because no one else had until now and the comments felt empty.

Comment edited 16 seconds after posting

2 upvotes

I don't get it. The AF will probably not be fast enough. And nobody does street with a zoom really. If that was the joke then, haha ?

Comment edited 49 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

Yeah, with a slow lens like it has. It will be GREAT.

0 upvotes

Nope.

0 upvotes

just print out the receipt on a t-shirt. people will be stunned, and AF speed will no longer be a problem.

2 upvotes

Dear DPR, why not call Leica and ask Roger if this definitely isn't the camera? Free publicity is great but if this is a hoax, it won't do anybody any good.

4 upvotes

There is less than 2 weeks until you know. Be patient!

0 upvotes

The 'official' photo from Leica of the open box shows a camera without a lens mounted. So one can assume this silly, slow as molasses zoom lens isn't fixed. Or- one would hope. What is certain is that NO ONE (not even Leica diehards) are liking the idea of this zoom lens. And rightfully so.

Either way- I can't believe how many websites have ran with the photo as if it's legit. But then again- Leica haven't discredited it yet....

1 upvote

a black mount? looks more like a lens to me

0 upvotes

My goodness, Leica are certainly receiving some opprobrium in this thread for something they may or may not have done.

1 upvote

(Comment deleted by author)

Comment edited 6 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

It's a FAKE. If not, "M" would mean Meshugge for ever...

Comment edited 14 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Regardless if this is mock up or not, Leica clearly just lost it.
I mean, I'm a huge fan of Leica-M cameras and lenses, but calling D-Lux and X2 - microM and nanoM respectively is just plain stupid.

And if this indeed the camera, why call it mini-M, its just an X with the zoom, so call it XZ1 or just Z1.

7 upvotes

@ Shigzeo and whoever else shares his/her opinion:

Manufacturers making good products almost always have -or sooner or later develop- a good name. There are watch manufacturers, to use the same paradigm, producing very fine products, say, Seiko, as good as ones by, say, Omega but cost a fraction of the Omega ones. Similarly, photo gear manufacturers, such as Canon and Pentax, produce cameras of comparable quality to Leica ones without costing more than a fraction of the price. There is logic and then there is madness or, if you like, what Peter Lim described.

Leica's pricing is unacceptable.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 1 minute after posting

0 upvotes

Sure expensive but if you like a rangefinder setup in a camera they are great....... not sure what all this is about partly truth partly fiction............... if all truth then it is a brain dump

0 upvotes

You know I have never even considered Leica. I am fixing to travel some. Is the lens better than the top L lenses from Canon? Is the camera better than a top body from Canon. I know it will be smaller. I was thinking the Sigma 35 mm lens
with Canon gear. But this price range is ok with me if a superior product? Does anyone shoot with both systems?

0 upvotes

Good Canon+Sigma lenses can't come close to good Leica lenses for optical quality. Go with Canon if you really need fast AF.

Anyhow why not Fuji X, Samsung NX or Olympus?

0 upvotes

I like Leica and would still love to own a nice M2 at some point in the future, but if this is real Leica badly needs a reality check. The exclusivity of the Leica brand is not an excuse to just build any type of camera and slap a red dot on it. With Fuji offering a high(er) end alternative at half the price, Leica needs to step up and prove its exclusivity with compelling products. This feels like the opposite.

2 upvotes

16-50mm F2.8 (24-75mm) and no AA filter would be a no-brainier for such a camera, at such a price tag.
F3.5-6.4 is way too slow and doesnt make sense.

2 upvotes

This must be a hoax. Very nice photoshopping job. Well done :-)

2 upvotes

28-70/3.5-6.4 ???? Is that all they offer for that price, why was it not possible to make it ILS, there are enough mounts they can use, like NEX, Fuji, Samsung NX, or 4/3 mount.

0 upvotes

so, we pay here 2500$ for a Fuji style box without viewfinder. In some way this is a Panasonic apsc camera for an exorbitant price tag. It is nothing more to say than Leicaridiculous, like always. If now, Pana and Olympus could build the same thing with apsc, viewfinder, and for the usual 1200$ that it is worth, including lens, it will hit the top.

0 upvotes

The prestige Leica camera is good to show off and tell great story about it. Leica cam must use expensive leather strip hang on the neck. Just like Rolex watch, the little 'Red Dot' telling you are difference from other person, photography skill is not importance.
Who need the Rolex to tell the time ? Yes! You no need to use the Leica to take top quality photo, the true is most of the Japanese camera can do a better job!However when you own the Leica cam you can start to tell the great story of Leica. Me? No, I don't own Leica.

1 upvote

Just one question: what toothpaste to do you use? What shoes do you wear? Slacks? Shirts? Watch? Car? music player? Speaker? Hifi? headphones?

If everything you use is 100% as cheap as it gets or best price-performance, prestige/luxury be damned, then your comment gets the pass. Otherwise, why ever do you spill on Leica and its supporters parade? Nothing is added to discussions by haters. Especially if those haters can't put their lives in the comparometer.

Outside of people who have no money at all (who woudn't be reading this forum in the first place), there are very very few people who don't, in some area, splurge.

And what is wrong with that?

Does your watch make you tell time better? No? Then why did you choose Timex vs a cheap Chinese knockoff? That is a major waste. Same with your Honda vs. a Kia. Endless road. Endless road.

10 upvotes

I used to shoot with a Leica M6. Sure, it has a red dot and it wasn't cheap. But that camera was a beautiful machine. The way it handled and operated was second to none. It was absolutely reliable and would (and did) take a beating without missing a beat.

To save "most Japanese cameras can do a better job" is absolute rubbish. Most Japanese cameras are aimed at an entirely different photographer and entirely different photography than the Leica.

You say what you did from the opinion of someone who isn't a Leica owner. So, you have no knowledge of what you say. Which pretty much makes your comment worthless.

3 upvotes

Yes I am using all cheap and good staff !

0 upvotes

Nope...it's either all cheap, or all good....it wont be both.

5 upvotes

@WellyNZ

Yeah back in the film days and when there was mechanical goodness, now what is Leica? All electronic and certainly a modern M won't take a beating or shower without failure, and the M9 was a disaster with such an underperforming sensor for the extreme prices they demanded. And different photography? If you really need a different camera to make a difference in your photography then surely it's YOU that needs to change and not the camera, a RF camera is nice to work with, but what can an M take that no DSLR/Mirrorless can take? (oh right, insane F/0.95 shallow shots...)

1 upvote

Peter KT Lim:

Optically the Japanese camera makers still can't match Leica lenses--with the sometime exception of Olympus at its best. And yes the Japanese made Zeiss lenses come close so you can use one of those on say a Nikon DSLR body.

When doing their best lens design and manufacturing, Samsung NX lenses approach Leica lenses. But Samsung aint Japanese.

No Fuji X lenses still miss something that Leica sees.

Comment edited 29 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

@Nishi Drew,

My mistake. You're quite correct. Any camera is capable of shooting any kind of photography. I'm going to head out now to capture surfers in action with my 8x10 large format camera.

0 upvotes

Stooping to rumors? There is no way this is the camera.

2 upvotes

I have a Leica M7 and I am big Leica fan, but A Fuji X-E1 and a Fujion 18-55 zoom lens cost half the cost of new Leica and you can change the lens and it is less than half. The Leica lens goes from F3.5 and the Fujion is F2.8, only a half of a stop. But at 80mm the Fujion, which is longer, max's out at F4. The Leica is F5.6, a full stop. Oh and the Fujion has OIS. Both 16MP, but Fuji has no AA and killer JPEGs. Oh and the X-E1 has a EVF. You have to buy the Leica.
Leica foot shoot. Like the X-1 and X-2, this camra will not sell. $3k, uhg. I would rather waste $3k on the Sony RX-1.
How sad!

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting

7 upvotes

f5.6? you overestimated it.

1 upvote

That sums my anxieties about this camera, it just seems like the wrong camera, The red dot will get it into the hands of the faithful but as a photographic tool and even as just a nice thing to own, Fuji and Sony have this thing covered (based on what we can see, which could be a load of tosh)

If you want a Leica keep saving and get a proper M,

0 upvotes

km25:

Why are camera jpgs important to you? Yes the Fuji does them well, but raw is still better.

Fuji X lenses lack something optically that Leica has, Zeiss too. And on a good day Olympus and Samsung.

0 upvotes

Why the Lens is very Slooow ?
and I hope next time the design is better, included the grip

0 upvotes

Leica, stick to where you are most respected...

LENSES.

Talk to Carl Zeiss, please...

7 upvotes

The M9 and the S2 are both very respectable (if expensive) cameras.

Leica could sell a lot more of the S series cameras if it were usable at ISO 3200 and past.

And the problem is no other manufacturer is currently selling an M mount digital body (I believe Epson stopped the R-D1x). Yet there's a real motivation to use Leica+Zeiss M mount lenses.

Feel free to encourage Sony/Konica or Epson/Voightlander to return to the M mount rangefinder body market.

0 upvotes

I think the photo is a mockup.
- Lens does not have a serial number.
- Lens is marked differently: 70mm on the barrel, and 18-46 on the thread for example. One is 135 format measure, the other APS-C? It's a semantic mismatch.
- Text on thread goes in opposite to Leica's direction (should be clockwise)
- Large areas of flat, uniform colour are visible on top of popup flash, next to flash mount and above assist light — like someone's been erasing and smudging colour
- When moving image curves into highlights which better shows if the image was composed out of several differently taken images, in the lower right corner a dark rectangle is visible, showing someone's been erasing something there.

10 upvotes

The Digilux 2 did not have a S/N on the lens, also had 35mm equivalents on the barrel, as well as the lens text just like this mockup. Also the 50mm APO Summicron has text direction similar to this.

With that, I still think is a mockup myself.

7 upvotes

Actually,I correct myself. This is the real thing. Leica X Vario. Or something like that is written next to hot shoe. No real forger would ever bother to go to such an extent to disappoint everyone if Leica can do it anyway.

0 upvotes

What we wanted...

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2VmZ0MkeuBQ/UPBBVNUEwZI/AAAAAAAAEhI/Q-XQxM2OEPo/s1600/CL_20.jpg

And what we got? A turd covered fixed lens.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting

5 upvotes

That is exactly what we wanted -- a digital CL.

2 upvotes

Why nobody tells the Truth? Leica are JUST Panasonic cameras, with cosmetic changes and a higher price tag!!!!!
Buy Panasonic, same lens and specs, and save 1000's.....
Many examples around!

5 upvotes

What Panasonic has a full frame or APS-C sensor ?

5 upvotes

All your Panasonics are belong to us

3 upvotes

What Panasonic has a 24mp FF sensor? What Panasonic has a monochrome only sensor without bayer filter? You really dont know what you're talking about...do,you?

1 upvote

I assume he meant all those cameras that are Panasonic. I am quite sure he knows that the M cameras are not.

Good entertainment thoug that some are totally imagination free :)

0 upvotes

Hi,

I cannot really believe that. They cannot be so ... hmm ... blind.
There are very nice mFT cameras with very nice primes, there are also very nice Sony Nex cameras - ok, very few primes and finally there is the Fuji X-System which brings nearly everything what stands for Leica: OVF plus EVF, very good primes and a extremly interesting roadmap plus a very good standard zoom.
And Leica? Leica thiinks they can win market shares with an expensive (but nice looking) system with a dark zoom and no primes. For them, I don't hope so and whait curiously for the announcement - even when I am already sold to the X-system ;)

Regards,
Daniel

Comment edited 10 minutes after posting

3 upvotes

Bravo, Fuji, for actually trying to advance the camera viewfinder system.

3 upvotes

It's nice to have some cameras that aren't exercises in cost-cutting. I can't think of one Japanese-designed (most are built in China, Vietnam, etc) camera that doesn't have examples of cost-cutting on or in their body from plastic, uncoated finder optics to the old chrome-plated brass (instead of stainless steel) strap eyelets.

Comment edited 33 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

Photographers do not buy these.
Trophy wives, middle aged single label wh0re men and spoiled ex wives do.
The more expensive it is the more they love it.

3 upvotes

verdict: epic failure ... again

2 upvotes

I have given up on Leica a long time ago. The issue is that you can't take any better pictures with this camera compared to any other mirrorless ones. So why pay the premium? And like someone said, there is not even a EVF built into it! That said, this is my opinion.

1 upvote

Hallelujah brother. Shoot what you got and can afford. A pro can make great images with junk.....amateurs need to get real.

0 upvotes

spiderhunter:

You imply that you've used this camera?

0 upvotes

Total comments: 366


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