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Adobe heralds subscription-only future for Photoshop and Creative Suite

May 6, 2013 at 18:28:56 GMT

SOFTWARE NEWS ADOBE CREATIVE-CLOUD PHOTOSHOP

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Adobe has said it will no longer be developing its Creative Suite range of software, leaving its subscription and cloud-based Creative Cloud as the only way of accessing the latest version of Photoshop. Adobe has been trying to encourage users away from the traditional one-off payment licenses and on to a monthly payment model, with features such as online storage and syncing between devices. This latest move ups the ante by making it the only option for future versions of the software.

Adobe is clearly concerned about alienating existing users and has set the pricing of its Creative Cloud products at a similar level to its existing software. The cost of licensing just Photoshop CC over 18 months (the typical life-span of a version of Photoshop), is similar to the existing version-to-version upgrade prices, if you commit to a 24-month contract. Paying to use Photoshop CC on an ad-hoc, on/off basis will cost more (though opening the option of only paying for the software when you need it).

Adobe says it will continue to support CS6 but will not be replacing it. This allows it to focus its efforts on a single line of products, rather than trying to support both, in tandem. It also says it will allow the addition of processor-intensive features, such as Camera Shake Reduction tool, where the work can be conducted in the cloud.

To soften the blow, Adobe is offering discounted rates for current owners of Creative Suite (including previous versions), valid until August 2013. The move will not affect Lightroom customers, who will continue to be able to purchase 'perpetual' licenses.

However, while the move clearly makes sense for a company whose software has always been so widely pirated, such a dramatic move will undoubtedly be unsettling for many people who have always thought of software as a one-off purchase.

Adobe has published an open letter to its users and says it wants to start a dialogue with its user-base over the changes.

Press Release:

Adobe Accelerates Shift to the Cloud

New Product Innovation to be Delivered Exclusively Through Adobe Creative Cloud

LOS ANGELES — May 6, 2013 — At Adobe MAX, The Creativity Conference, Adobe (Nasdaq:ADBE) today accelerated its shift to the cloud with a major update to Adobe® Creative Cloud™, the company’s flagship offering for creatives. Today’s update to Creative Cloud is packed with features, reimagining the creative process through a new set of “CC” desktop applications and enhanced cross-device collaboration and publishing capabilities (see separate press release). With this update, creative files can be stored, synced and shared, via Creative Cloud, on Mac OS, Windows, iOS and Android; and Behance, the world’s leading online creative community, is integrated with Creative Cloud, so customers can showcase work, get feedback on projects and gain global exposure.

Creative Cloud’s advanced capabilities are making it a hit with the worldwide creative community: more than a half million paid members, and well over 2 million total members have signed up for Creative Cloud since it was launched in April 2012.

Adobe also announced that the company will focus creative software development efforts on its Creative Cloud offering moving forward. While Adobe Creative Suite® 6 products will continue to be supported and available for purchase, the company has no plans for future releases of Creative Suite or other CS products. Focusing development on Creative Cloud will not only accelerate the rate at which Adobe can innovate but also broaden the type of innovation the company can offer the creative community.

“We launched Creative Cloud a year ago and it has been a runaway success,” said David Wadhwani, senior vice president and general manager, Digital Media, Adobe. “By focusing our energy -- and our talented engineers -- on Creative Cloud, we’re able to put innovation in our members’ hands at a much faster pace.”

On top of new collaboration and publishing services and the integration of Behance, today’s announced update to Creative Cloud includes stunning versions of Adobe’s next generation of desktop applications -- including Adobe Photoshop® CC, InDesign® CC, Illustrator® CC, Dreamweaver® CC and Premiere® Pro CC. Adobe’s desktop tools, previously known as Creative Suite (CS), are now branded CC to reflect that they are an integral part of Creative Cloud and have been reinvented to support a more intuitive, connected way of creating.

Adobe is facilitating the transition to Creative Cloud with attractive pricing plans and promotions for individual members, teams and enterprise customers. For more details, visit: https://creative.adobe.com/plans. Adobe will continue to sell licenses for all CS6 products via electronic download from adobe.com and participating resellers.

About Creative Cloud

Adobe Creative Cloud is a membership-based service that provides users with access to download and install Adobe creative desktop applications; game developer tools and integration with the Adobe Touch Apps. With Creative Cloud membership, users also have access to: a vibrant global creative community; publishing services to deliver apps and websites; cloud storage and the ability to sync to virtually any device; and new products and exclusive updates as they’re developed.

Membership Plans and Availability

By signing up for Creative Cloud today, creatives will be set up to immediately download and use these latest cloud-enabled innovations from Adobe, when they are available next month. Creative Cloud membership for individuals is US$49.99 per month based on annual membership; existing customers who own CS3 to CS5.5 get their first year of Creative Cloud at the discounted rate of US $29.99 per month. Students and teachers can get Creative Cloud for $29.99 per month. Promotional pricing is available for some customers, including CS6 users. A team version of Creative Cloud includes everything individual members receive plus 100GB of storage and centralized deployment and administration capabilities. Creative Cloud for teams is priced at US $69.99 per month per seat. Existing customers, who own a volume license of CS3 or later, get their first year of Creative Cloud for teams at the discounted rate of US $39.99 per month per seat if they sign up before the end of August 2013.

Adobe also announced Creative Cloud for enterprise today and special licensing programs for educational institutions and government. For more details, visit: https://creative.adobe.com/plans.

Comments

Total comments: 1899

The real discussion here is not if you get access to the program thru the cloud, thru a cd or whatever, the real problem here is that adobe is forcing us to rent the software instead of just letting us buy the darn thing.

They are trying to transform PS and etc, in a service, rather than a product or merchandise.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting

5 upvotes

Right, not too many people are confused by that point, though some are; you're not the first person to point out the confusion.

3 upvotes

Yes, you right thankfully. I have refreshed the main point because it seemed lost from some of the last comments.

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Thanks. That is the man point. Rent forever or lose access.

2 upvotes

Microsoft are pushing in the same direction with Office 360. Forget the nonsense about R&D costs. There's a point at which new possibilities for updates are not significant enough to persuade people to shell out for the latest version. They are not introducing this to take greater leaps and bounds, but because they know a mature software product can introduce smaller and smaller improvements. Hence they want us to pay more for less.

4 upvotes

jberk:

That's rent forever or lose access to the software; it's NOT as some have said rent forever or lose access to files (with the caveat that if you save in an Adobe only format you may lose file access until other software opens that file format.)

1 upvote

Photoshop is already a service you don't buy it you buy a licence to use the software and the disks it comes on (If you get physical media). At the moment you pay once an get that for life. The thing they are changing is that service will also include cloud integrated functionality which has a continuing cost so if that is essential for the software they would have to charge for that no matter what. I wish they would still offer both versions so people can chose but I can see the CC versions being much more productive for me.

0 upvotes

Here's a thought. How many people here have at least once in their lives lost their job and it took 3, 4, 8, 12 months to find a new one? Yes, I am raising my hand too.

During that dry period, did you do like I did and cancel the cable, the newspaper, and even consider cancelling all non-essential memberships, retirement plans, kids' soccer, and other subscriptions except for the electric, water, and gas services? Yep, me too.

Maybe the "pros" will consider their Adobe membership critical, and will cancel their health club memberships instead. They cost about the same, $50 per month, depending on where you live.

But I think for most people, when family finances get tight as in this example, the priority will be to feed the wife and kids, not Adobe. So the Adobe subcription model might end up hurting Adobe in down times.

But then again, I still see a lot of apathy. Most of you will probably just put your Adobe membership on the credit card even when you have no job, right?

12 upvotes

No I won't feed adobe and I won't be able to edit photos during that mid period. Painful to lose that hobby under the circumstances. It is exactly why I bought cs6 through an upgrade last year as opposed to going to the cloud. I didn't want to lose access.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Someone else pointed this out, yesterday, and "Framer" told them that they should consider another career if they couldn't keep the $50/month rolling.

Couldn't believe it when I read it: what gross misunderstanding of creativity.

In the past and, increasingly, in our digital future, creative people disrupt from below, not from above. They come out of nowhere and change the world in ways "establishment" players could never have imagined. It's inconceivable to me that Adobe--maker of the world's premier creative tools--has essentially priced these "out of nowhere" innovators out of being able to use their tools.

That's what's going to kill Adobe: gross misunderstanding of the Creative people they serve--people who work on shoestring budgets, hopes, and dreams, not a guaranteed $50/month.

So when someone changes the world with stuff made in Pixelmator, or GIMP, or whatever, Adobe is really going to look foolish. It'll happen. Disruption from below is the meme of our times.

13 upvotes

I think you are right. Especially in this case.

1 upvote

What we are seeing here it is, may be, a generational change, a new way to understand possession and owning of things. A new understanding in which some how renting it is way better than having.

So, the way the things go, in the next future you will not buy a car but you will be suscribed to it.

Welcome to my net said the spider to the fly.
Welcome to my cloud said the lightning to the shrikes.

4 upvotes

Excellent point. The new generation is scary stuff. All's well till electricity fails, and then its a disaster.

0 upvotes

Absolutely. Just because a phone is smart doesn't mean the user is. I work with people who have kids and these folks shell out hundreds a month ostensibly to can keep in touch with their kids, who can't just use a phone. So what's another few bucks a month, right?

1 upvote

The mob has spoken, but how many of them have ever used the product or even know how?

1 upvote

OK, so now we're going to hear from the "real pros"?

After the real criticisms have been discussed there eventually comes a time in a forum when the "real pros", the fanboys and the self-made made men jump in.

2 upvotes

Please don't hold back. Tell us exactly how you feel and what you're thinking. I really do not know, that's why I'm asking.

0 upvotes

The product? You mean Photoshop?

0 upvotes

I work in the Photoshop/LR plugin industry doing development, support, testing, etc. I deal with professional photographers worldwide on a daily basis that use Photoshop and/or Lightroom in support. I've also done all the major trade shows numerous times and so have a lot of insight into how the average shooter uses Photoshop and/or Lightroom to process images.

In a nutshell, the VAST majority use Photoshop and/or Lightroom mainly to batch process images with a minor bit of healing/adjustment brush for retouching. They mostly use the prevalent overpriced/overhyped actions to get that 'look' and a few plugins for skin retouching or noise reduction. Other than that, most of these people have little clue about color management, printing, CMYK output or for that matter, don't even know how to use any of the basic tools.

So the overall tool power of Photoshop isn't even touched yet these people will continue to be hogtied to Adobe just to be able to run their actions & plugins.

2 upvotes

Agreed on most only use a very small portion of PS power. Level of use is very I similar to Microsoft Excel really

0 upvotes

Maybe ... but what's your take on the topic of this article? You know, the subscription model and all that jazz?

0 upvotes

I've been using it since it came out due to being forced to as a developer to keep up with the 'internal' updates. I've had numerous issues with the phone home scenario where I've been stuck on the road with no internet access and was unable to use Photoshop. I've had it repeatedly tell me that I have more than 2 systems installed when I haven't. This was on both mac and Windows systems. The Adobe Crapplication Manager is garbage as most of us already know.
I've only had a handful of customers that are on the plan and most don't even know anything about it. Of the few using it, only a couple used any cloud features or any program besides Photoshop or Lightroom.

0 upvotes

I wish topaz Labs would take all their wonderful plug ins and create a stand alone application then I would say "bye- byeAdobe" or Corel cmon and make Paintshop Pro Mac compatible.

4 upvotes

Topaz has that application. It is called photoFXLab.

1 upvote

As an Australian who hadn't yet 'bought in' its brilliant. I was looking at 1k to get started before upgrades down the track and it was just too much to bother.

From a piracy perspective, it offers the ability to buy in to a legitimate copy that gets regular updates, without having to use workarounds. It won't stop all pirates, but it removes the above entry problem for those who want to be legitimate without it costing an arm and a leg to get started.

I do feel sorry for those who were upgraders but there are some of us who it's works for extremely well.

0 upvotes

Google Trends on "Alternatives to photoshop". Nice spike.

http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=%22alternatives+to+photoshop%22

3 upvotes

This makes a lot of sense to me financially but I do have real worries. For £14 a month for the first year I get all my apps up to date. I do usually upgrade as they come out. Yes next year I will have to pay more but still less overall than my average spend. I can stop any time after the first year and still be exactly where I am now. Having a subscription means they can release individual apps and not have to wait until the whole family is upgraded so that suite users don't lose out.
My concern is that it seems to me that their incentive to innovate and develop will decline. Before they wanted the upgrade revenue, now they will effectively get that whether they innovate or not. The only motivation is migration and new users and I am not sure that is such an incentive.
I do think in the long run it will make it much harder to pirate and they will tie in students in a clever but devious way but I have never been sure that they actually lose that much in revenue to pirates.

Comment edited 11 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Apparently 4-5x the numbers of photoshop sold are pirated, and I suspect that figure was before Bitorrent etc took off, so piracy is a real issue. I dont expect that to change however.

0 upvotes

It doesn't matter how many pirated users are out there, it only matters how many of them would have bought the full version in terms of lost revenue. The 2 figures are not even close to the same. Cloud install apps don't need enterprise versions or physical media so can have bespoke installation files, you log onto your account and the installation files are hardware and user account specific rather than the installed app. This I am sure will not be impossible to get around but it almost certainly will not be able to be done just by downloading a cracked install file.

Comment edited 17 seconds after posting

1 upvote

To understand Adobe's mindset on this, you need to study the youtube videos on the Adobe CEO parroting Adobe-speak, absolutely refusing to answer the Australian journalist's questions why Australian prices are close to double US prices. Once you get that, you realise the Adobe CEO really thinks he can do that to the entire world - just parrot this mantra of why CC is the best value, ignoring the complaints, and people are just going to suck it up and pay.

Even professional photographers etc. once you retire, you still keep paying this Adobe tax until you die, if you even want to review your archives.

This will also haunt people considering archiving their data in Lightroom format. What if Adobe pulls this stunt on your Lightroom files? In the video, look closely at the Adobe CEO's greedy face, and you know he's capable of doing this to Lightroom as well.

5 upvotes

Adobe Phototoshop is still relevant? Don't see any need to upgrade . Plenty of other alternatives out there.

0 upvotes

Ahh, it seems the venting is almost complete.

Now back to our regular program:

Which of these 2 lenses is sharper? ...

0 upvotes

Users from the Adobe perspective:

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6 upvotes

You just keep repeating yourself. No need to say the same thing seven times...

2 upvotes

Are you trying to be the voice of conscience?

1 upvote

I've not read all the posts here, but it seems to be most comments are negative and against making Adobe products subscription only. For me who use Dreamweaver, Lightroom, Photoshop, Illustrator and the occasional Flash, Creative Cloud is a really good deal, making it a lot cheaper than buying the products any other way as well as taking the hassle and lump expense out of upgrading.

Many say they can't afford Creative Cloud. Most probably wouldn't be able to afford current Adobe products at full price and so, presumably, have pirated versions. I can't see why Adobe should care for what they think. It should be just as easy to get pirated versions of future products, though, for those who are so inclined. The CSn pirated versions come with a good recipe for blocking the application from "phoning home," which is - as far as I know - the only way they check if the registration is valid.

For those who can't afford it or don't like it, they should just stay with the cheaper alternatives.

1 upvote

Good F'n grief, pirates don't complain about costs...they just steal it.

15 upvotes

No, if you read comments here, a lot of people here that complains owns legit version of Photoshop. If people are usig pirate photoshop, they don't need to complain as it doesn't matter to them anyway as they will continue to pirate it.

Many users are like me, who only upgrade every 2-3 versions as there is no need to upgrade every single version.
So it's like $200USD every 3-4 years, this compares to $240 per year with the subscription model.
Yes we will get the latest version with the subscription model, but we DON'T NEED that, and don't want to be forced to pay for every single upgrade.

8 upvotes

Excellent job of just about missing most of the valid points offered regarding the subscription model. And thanks Dad for letting us know that if we can't afford something we shouldn't buy it.

6 upvotes

I can see that you would not like this but Adobe want to make money and they don't make much. if any, money from customers like you. If everyone did that then they would be out of business very quickly. They had already said that upgrade pricing would only be available for one version so you would have been out of pocket anyway.

1 upvote

It's likely in the long run this will reduce pirated versions. The phone home issue is one safeguard but cloud based apps don't need enterprise versions or physical media so can have bespoke installation files, you log onto your account and the installation files are hardware and user account specific rather than the installed app. Using the Creative cloud versions I never have to enter licence codes user details or anything. That said, I don't think pirated versions cost them as much as they claim because, as others have said, they were never going to buy the full price app. I hope they do re introduce one off lifetime use payments though so that they still have a user base who make new versions profitable.

1 upvote

I think I get it now. Adobe is simply tired of having whiney, broke and/or penny pinching customers who only reluctantly spend money once every several years, or even maybe plan to only ever buy it once on their lives, and base an entire career on a student copy they bought in college. So Adobe changes to a subscription model that (a) makes the monthly income more predictable, and (b) drives up the per-seat income to compensate for the loss of y'all. Then they can focus on their core customer base, those who can afford and appreciate the value of their products.

Heck, I have nothing to do with Adobe except as a customer, and I'm sick of reading your diatribes. Please just go buy those alternative products you keep talking about and get on with your lives.

8 upvotes

Spot on, Milnor. Spot on.

1 upvote

Every 1000 posts an idiot come in and share his useless opinion! You won the price for today!

6 upvotes

Go ahead, pay monthly for the rest of your life. Five years from now I can pull out an old MacBook Pro, load PS CS4 and actually do something. Holy Cow, I paid for it fully and it never stopped working. OMG!

6 upvotes

... and (c) establish the "up grade dictatorship".
Liberty is made of options, and liberty is all we are losing here. Why it is so difficult to offer the option of a simple and healthy purchase... even in the cloud? You pay it, you download it and you own it... for ever if is that what you want.

1 upvote

Nobody is forcing you to make yourself sick by reading the "diatribes"...perhaps S&M isn't your bag. Ever since I purchased a Photoshop 3 license, followed each version upgrade path to version 6 that I have now. Yes...I paid for the upgrades. I don't like the new plans. Pennies add up after a while.

Comment edited 56 seconds after posting

1 upvote

Adobe wants people who don't mind paying for software, over and over, forever. And what company wouldn't? The last thing they need is people who stop to ask if they're getting enough value or if the new version is an improvement on the previous one.

0 upvotes

"There was a glory called Adobe, Proximo... this is not it.
THIS IS NOT IT!"

"We are mere pixels and digits, Maximus...
PIXELS AND DIGITS!"

2 upvotes

I love the Gladiator reference.

0 upvotes

Where did Adobe get this idea from? Apple? Too bad Steve Jobs died, maybe he could help them make it work.

0 upvotes

How to rid yourself of hobbyists and amateurs in a few simple steps. First you enforce a company professional license model, then you still rip off European customers (Australia is no no longer robbed on photo$hop pricing it seems, only Europe is over 50% more expensive)

Hope my not buying that license makes a difference... aka I hope there enough amateur photographers to dent their income sufficiently.

Love the software, hate the company (with a vengeance)

13 upvotes

Ha, best street price here in Sydney is about $950(AUD) - pickup from CBD store. We are in the same boat as dear old Europe.
Personally, still not sure if I'll actually buy the final physical disk, or rent the damn thing. My original CS is way out of date - so no discount on any purchase.
What do you good people think - Rent or Buy?

Comment edited 6 minutes after posting

2 upvotes

@ RudivanS : For me renting is an absolute NO. I have upgraded to CS6 when it came out and stay with it. Photoshop CS6 has every single tool / feature I need to get my jobs done... all the new features they have announced for the Cloudy One to come in June are nice gimmicks, no must have tools... e.g. the new filter to reduce the blur that results from camera shake... I already have such a tool, it's called tripod. I also decided not to upgrade to Lightroom 5. Besides of Lightroom 4 I already use Capture One for my Phase One RAW files and in the future I will do all my RAW adjustments with this tool... think about it: If you buy now, you have a Photoshop version that works for the years to come, combine it with some RAW Converter from another company to make sure you'll get all the new camera updates in the future... save the money you have to spend for renting the software for the next years and buy a nice new lens from that saved money... makes much more sense to me...

2 upvotes

"What do you good people think - Rent or Buy?"

You can't buy any Adobe software. You can only licence it.

Every single copy of Adobe software in the world is owned by one entity - Adobe. Only Adobe owns Adobe software.

So your question should be 'licence a set version for an umlimited time' or 'licence unlimited versions for a set time period'.

1 upvote

Wow, thanks for the licensing clarification for us noobs, we had no idea.

0 upvotes

Maybe their marketing guru evangelist paradigm shifters were thinking about beer. You know the saying, "It's impossible to own beer, you can only rent it."

2 upvotes

I do rent it. Every time I finish one I have to pay for another. I want a perpetual beer license, then I can pay once and drink all I like until I need to upgrade my beer.

0 upvotes

"Adobe is clearly concerned about alienating existing users ... "

Huh? What? Where do you get that idea?

Comment edited 12 minutes after posting

2 upvotes

Just had a look at the Adobe Facebook page; clearly they are not "concerned about alienating existing users" looking at some of their responses to questions. The responses in turn generate even more negative comments; looking like a good example of why corporate marketing should not be allowed near Facebook!

Comment edited 16 seconds after posting

2 upvotes

Like this; I have Photoshop for both Windows and Mac. They get upgraded when a new addition comes out. I don't want to put Adobe on my credit card for life.

At this point I'm staying with CS6 for Mac and CS5 for Windows instead of upgrading. I think that could be interpreted as "alienating" a user.

1 upvote

Unfortunately, what Adobe's financial models did not account for is consumer psychology. That's what accounts for a lot of the anger, in addition to the price increases. The simple fact is that people want to own something. They don't want to rent it. Even if the cost were cheaper to rent there's a satisfaction with owning and having control. Imagine if the government condemns your home, legally through eminent domain, and tells you they will lease it back to you. They pitch the idea to by telling you that leasing will actually be cheaper than buying. People would be furious because the cost is not the only factor. When you own your own home you have control of it. When you rent you are a slave to the landlord. Future price increases are unpredictable and out of your control. You will never pay off and own the asset.

This subscription model is even worse than the hypo above. Not only do you lose control you are actually paying higher prices. It's a lose / lose for the consumer.

17 upvotes

For a company it's not bad.

A fix cost, fully deductible, helping in assessing your operation's cost and forecast.

Also, for a company/professional the cost is ok. Compared to the total monthly cost of any employee and to what her/his work will be billed it adds peanuts.

Obviously we are talking about the western world. Companies in developing countries who are voted to domestic business would be hard hit, but one needn't to downplay the flexibility and creativity of these societies.
They will be getting full steam ahead with new solutions in no time.

Those left behind are the hobbyist/amateurs, for whom the opportunity cost would be hard to justify or just out of reach.

It is true that the most of them use very little from a CS package and could fulfill their needs with simpler and cheaper -or free like GIMP- solutions.

I will stick to LR (with an occasional bent to GIMP) as long as it will be available outside the cloud scheme. Keeping options open just in case...

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

3 upvotes

Its difficult to capex rented software against a project, its not all roses and sunshine for companies either.

1 upvote

I'm not so sure. Isn't the reason corporate IT guys like the cloud that they don't have to maintain the software on all the company's computers? These programs still do a full instal AND add new features every once in a while. Seems like an IT nightmare.

0 upvotes

Hmm I doubt a monthly fee will make it easier. There are a lot of companies that have an occassional need for adobe software. Getting immediate hold of the company creditcard as soon as the task is on the desk is a recepy for trouble, antilust for the product

In many cases it will work like; The boss is in a meeting but I want to continue with a job so I have too look for alternative software to adjust photo/ create design. Or i had already asked for a license last month and I do not feel comfortable to ask again for only 2 photo adjustments. Or wait a second Gimp is free, unlimited, no hassle with how brief or lengthy the photojob is.

0 upvotes

What are the viable options? LR for RAWs (at least for a while, it would not surprise me if it too was "clouded" in the near future) and Corel PaintShopPro for other editing? Or something else? I wonder if PaintShop is good these days.

I so hate the idea of having to learn a new program and having to unlearn Photoshop but I guess that's how it will go.

My only consolance is that all the pirate users too will (at least I hope so) eventually have to let go of Photoshop. I hate it when I pay good money for the software and so many others just download it for free.

5 upvotes

Everyone keeps talking about piracy. Piracy used to be a big problem, but I doubt it is nearly as bad as it once was. Modern software like PS requires a serial number and a handshake with the Adobe servers. It is getting harder to pull off piracy. I think all this change is simply greed and has little or nothing to do with piracy.

3 upvotes

Have you ever heard of cracks???

3 upvotes

I have the latest version of PSP and it is certainly no PhotoShop, but then again it is not too bad if you combine it with Corel's AfterShot Pro. The PSP ultimate comes with NIK 3.0 suite which is awesome! The two together cost the same as LR. LR is better, but the PSP/AfterShot combo is decent enough. The only fly in the ointment is the update frequency and camera/lens support. The most recent AfterShot update was in December! Yo Corel, get with it, here is your chance.

1 upvote

If it has all-round 16-bit editing and good layers plus robust colour profile support I will probably give it a try. At some point after JASC sold it to Corel I got frustrated with all the bugs I experienced but maybe it has matured since then. Will need to look into this. I will use LR as long as it can be bought (and not crippled) and after that will have a look at alternatives. Aperture seems to be getting many favourable mentions.

Edit: I had a look at the PaintShop Pro X5 Ultimate but could not find info on the bit depth and profile support. Back in the day there were limitations on these. But man it seems like an affordable alternative.

Comment edited 8 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

Corel is going to be laughing all the way to the bank with this mess by Adobe.

The cloud is the mother of all lock-ins, some things are good for the cloud, but NOT everything is a good business to be on the cloud.

When the greedy CEO of Adobe wakes up, a lot of market will be lost. If I had shares of Adobe, I would be dumping them right about now because that decision is going to cost them dearly.

Just like Microsoft and Windows 8, all the customers yelling at them "NO" and they went ahead with it. Results? Sales are flat...

11 upvotes

>> Just like Microsoft and Windows 8, all the customers yelling at them "NO" and they went ahead with it. Results? Sales are flat...

And still they have sold more Win 8 licences in 6 months (100 million) than there are Macs in use worldwide (in 2012 there had been sold 122 million Macs since the foundation of Apple)... Just goes to show that the total PC market is enormous.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

But overall sales of win 8 are flat and investors are asking for Ballmer to hang. They just announced that they are working incleaning the metro mess.... These companies are measured on growth not volume of sales

5 upvotes

The REALLY insiduous thing about Win8, is that many brand new machines will ONLY run Win8 - their BIOS prevents booting from and/or installing earlier versions of Windows - or Linux. I know, I have an HP ElitePad 900, which is a lovely tablet - but TOTALLY LOCKED to Windows 8.

1 upvote

The only reason so many win 8 licenses have been sold is because you literally can't buy a new PC with out windows 8 on it.

0 upvotes

There are two things to note here. First you can not buy a new PC with Win7 anymore. And second, most of the enterprises who buy Win8 licenses do a downgrade and install Win7.

1 upvote

What I don't understand is: Given the comments here and in other online resources, it seems that the vast majority of potential users despise (...if not resent...) this move.
Now, it's not like there's another, all-new demographics to tap into.
I wonder what do they know that we don't...
PK

Comment edited 26 seconds after posting

5 upvotes

My guess is Adobe is assuming they have us by the short hairs and we will have no other options. If so, their assumption may well prove to be a costly one to their business model. I think there are plenty of alternatives available for those who really want to find them and learn to use them. I've seen about 99% negative responses today, but those are mostly from individuals. I'm curious how businesses with multi-users will react. I suspect they won't be happy either, but I'm not sure they will change to alternatives. It is more difficult to make a corporate switch to alternatives than it s for an individual to switch. Time will tell.

3 upvotes

They know how many enterprise-class customers they have. Bigger enterprises will just just write the check; it's 100% deductible in this model (with no need to depreciate) so they probably like it.

What you're hearing from here is mostly individual or small-seat license groups here, and that's a horse of a different color.

Adobe is trading them for us.

Comment edited 45 seconds after posting

2 upvotes

That's easy. For us, who have already paid the big bucks and only think in terms of upgrades for one product, it's a bad thing.

But from their perspective, they've lowered the entry fee to their product range from hundreds of dollars to $50.

They're doing what Apple did with Final Cut: lure new clients while alienating a long-established client base.

0 upvotes

old model: perpetual license
new model: perpetual payments
A "Priceless" move in the true meaning of the word.

12 upvotes

Another word for "priceless" is "worthless".

3 upvotes

From an Adobe blog:

"Q: If you’re going to continue selling Photoshop CS6, will I still get Camera Raw updates?

A: Because Adobe is still selling Photoshop CS6, those customers will continue to receive updated file format compatibility via Adobe Camera Raw 8. When we update ACR8 with new camera support, Photoshop CS6 customers can work with the new version of the Camera Raw plug-in. No new features or functionality will be available in ACR to Photoshop CS6 customers as part of those updates."

So yes we can get ACR updates that work with PS CS6, but they won't contain anything new. WTF! Why give us ACR8 compatibility when it won't do anything for us? We will still have no new cameras added--EVER. What total BS this is!

1 upvote

'new camera support' means you get compatibility with Raw files Adobe supported since the current ACR release. So you can open the same Raw files as a CC user but will not have any of their new tools or features.

3 upvotes

The fact that new cameras will be supported goes part of the way to placate CS6 users. However, what this statement does not make clear is whether improvements in ACR that are not new tools/features but improvements in existing features (e.g., smart sharpen, which is said to have been improved) will be included in the CS6/ACR upgrades. It they're not, then CS6 users are being left behind even more. The more I think about it, the more this seems like pure blackmail, and a huge PR disaster for Adobe. I unsubscribed from Adobe's email notification about Photoshop, and suggest others do the same.

2 upvotes

The bigger longterm issue is whether you want to keep saving your files in Photoshop PSD format because, sure as death and taxes, there's coming a day when CS6 won't be upgraded with new camera models. That's fine if you never intend to upgrade your DSLR, but if you do, in that day in the not too distant future, Adobe will have you by the smalls because then you will need to use their software to open your archive of files. You must think longterm. Adobe cannot be trusted. What if they make even Lightroom have an annual licence? By all means use it to edit your photos, but you must consider the long term implications of storing data in Adobe's file formats that can only be opened by their software. Do you want to pay an annual fee to Adobe for the rest of your life. Even with taxes, you stop paying the highest taxes once you retire. Not so with Adobe's annual tax. This is for life, man. Think carefully.

Comment edited 25 seconds after posting

1 upvote

Yes I will "join". But under extreme duress!
Because I don't have a US address anymore I will pay $16.11 for the initial year. (That's the bonus I get for 20 years of using Photoshop since v2.5.
After that it's $32.22 per year. That's $579.96 over the typical lifespan of 18 months. Which in the US used to be $189 or in Europe $295. So the price will double. Or triple compared to the US price.
Because there is no physical product to ship this price difference between the US and Europe is pure greed on behalf of Adobe. They do it just because they can.

And you know what? I could have accepted a small price hike, like striking the cheaper 2d version. Or 10% more because it is sooo much more expensive to send all those bits over the internet.

This is will turn into a PR nightmare. Adobe is the proverbial bully. The dictator; the tyrant mentioned in the same breath with the likes of Gaddafi and Saddam Hussein. Pirates will be liberators. Using pirated software will be defiance.

3 upvotes

Wait a minute, first you say you will join, then later you say "I could have accepted a small price hike".

If you are joining, then you have accepted the WHOLE price hike, not just a small one.

It's all about the words we use, isn't it?

0 upvotes

It sounds to me they have admitted they can no longer bring anything new to the table to keep people upgrading

8 upvotes

I posted my thoughts on getting reamed by Adobe on their Facebook page. They responded with this info about Lightroom:

Adobe: "Hi Jack, Lightroom will continue to be available as a perpetual license: http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdotcom/2013/05/answering-your-questions-about-photoshop-cc.html#LRBoxPerpetual"

Good news about LR but still bad news about PS.

0 upvotes

That is just like what they said in the recent response to DPR about how much more expensive PS will be for most photographers now. It is clear they now consider LR their product for photographers and PS is now just for big corporate buyers.

0 upvotes

Now that people hate Adobe more than Canon's 18mp sensor, Canon has no reason to ever upgrade it! Nooooooo!

1 upvote

meh. still hate the sensor more.
you can pirate photoshop but you cant pirate a new sensor.

2 upvotes

NO THANKS !
Didn't know Adobe can be so dumb !
Anyway their S/W aren't that great.
Just look at HUGE and SLOW Adobe Reader versus the SLIM and FAST Foxit Reader !
The DEMISE of Adobe draws near.
RIP Adobe ...............

Comment edited 40 seconds after posting

3 upvotes

Congratulations Adobe! You have moved into the realm of software mafia by forcing users to buy every version of your software updates, whether they want to or not. I have been a PS customer for 15 years as a photographer. Now, I’m hoping to find a competitor with a good quality product so I can say adios to Adobe mafia. Way to alienate your dedicated customers Adobe!!! I hope your greed is your demise!

A former PS customer

9 upvotes

how much did you you spend in these 15 years on PS? is it gonna cost you that much more in the future? i'm just asking, i'm no expert, but i am somewhat of a cloud-fan :)...

0 upvotes

but adobe has shifted from giving you a perpetual license to requiring you to make perpetual payments.

4 upvotes

@ddosh - so you are a cloud fan. Hmmmmm ... why?

2 upvotes

He must own adobe stock and think people will actually buy into their nonsense

0 upvotes

If I were Adobe CEO I'd feed some trolls...

1 upvote

Humm they once changed the taste of COCA COLA where did that get them

will the same thing happen here .

3 upvotes

one can only hope

3 upvotes

You are correct. Adobe will have to re-think this.
As some have stated, if you switch to CC then you will never be able to open any of the files you edited with a new version of PS, Illustrator, etc.... unless you have an active membership. So if you think that once you retire you have time to look back at old pictures, forget it. No looking back unless Adobe gets paid. Your files are essentially useless.
I am keeping CS6 until this is resolved.

3 upvotes

When they launched New Coke, it was a secret plan to change the type of sugar they used. Cane sugar was in original recipe. Taking old coke off for several months, they hoped the public would not notice the change to high fructose corn syrup. Classic Coke comes back with new cheaper sugar and remains that way to this day. CEO of Coke is a genius and gets a huge bonus. THAT is the new coke REAL story. Maybe Adobe has to also use cheaper sugar through misdirection. Like no more middlemen selling CDs.

3 upvotes

@ssfriend. Hmmmmm ,,,, just save as TIFF and you can open with anything.

1 upvote

I am counting on it.

0 upvotes

Or... convert all your new Cameras raw files to DNG and continue using your old version of CS3, 4, 5, etc. forever.

1 upvote

as long as there is an upgraded support for new camera RAW
WAIT !
that's only for CC (Cash Cows)

1 upvote

I feel sorry for all those people that went the .DNG way.... They are now stuck with Adobe... Nobody else exept for Adobe itselfs uses their 'open' standard...

9 upvotes

R.I.P Photoshop 1990 - 2013

11 upvotes

It goes back farther than that on the Mac. I first used it when I worked as a technical writer for the US Coast Guard in the late 1980s. I think it is about 25 years old now, maybe a little more than even that.

1 upvote

Wow Adobe, what a way to make Netflix's move look consumer friendly!

11 upvotes

I take it, nobody likes this subscription nonsense?

22 upvotes

Well there's probably someone who only needs to use PhotoShop for 3 months total/ever who's saying: "Great, just saved about 450usd."

4 upvotes

well, i'm like almost afraid to admit it, but i do like the subscription...
for me it was the ideal solution; instead of spending more than a thousand euro's (how much did/does it cost to get your copy of PS, Ai, Id, Lightroom,...), i payed 60(!) euro's and i was able to use almost everything (if not all) that was in their creative suite. I think they should let people to have a choice, and certainly make a difference for pro's and amateurs, please don't bite my head off, i think it's a good discussion

1 upvote

It'll take some one who only occasionally requires PS 3 months to learn. If you only need photo editing software occasionally, look elsewhere.

1 upvote

ddoosh:

I paid about 275 USD for Photoshop CS5 (It was on sale very briefly and I had the money), then I paid 200 USD for the upgrade to CS6.

So yeah I have a problem with Adobe charging me 600 USD year in and year out for use of Photoshop. (I wouldn't care if Adobe wanted to offer the subscription plan in addition to the full purchase plan--that would make sense if you only needed to use the software for say 90 days, but unlike my CAD software which tried both for awhile, Adobe is forcing one to pay year in and year out if I want to use "Photoshop CS7".)

1 upvote

Need alternative to Photoshop?

Photoline: www.pl32.com

Runs even from USB stick.

1 upvote

luchs-

Um the Photoline raw converter is awful and doesn't open many raw file formats. (I tried it because of the recommendations here, it's okay editing software.)

1 upvote

Either non-professional customers will essentially be jettisoned or this may evolve to more of a cell-phone model, where one pays by how much they use a program (ping tracking?). Why should someone who uses only one program rather infrequently as opposed to a professional using multiple programs hours a day pay the same monthly fee. At least with a cell phone, you can dial down somewhat. I wouldn't even want to work with the full program-more complex, more processor intensive than I need.

3 upvotes

Well.. today ADBE lost 1.91% in a flat Nasdaq...
It's not much (and it's nothing for a share that has gaining unrelentingly in the last four years), but still...

Comment edited 13 seconds after posting

4 upvotes

I, too, will not pay a monthly fee that ultimately costs more than the annual upgrade fee for features I don't want or may never use. Adobe has joined the ranks of other corporations that couldn't care less about their loyal customers and is all about their profit! As "they" say, the only thing constant in life is change." I guess it's time for a photo software change!

by Christine D.

14 upvotes

Dumb, dumb, dumb,dumb. Are all companies now hiring MBAs with a concentration in "How to Lose Customers and Kill Companies?" I seem to be having more and more experiences with companies that I use and depend on that are like this Adobe mess. My MANY hundreds of dollars invested in Adobe software now seem wasted, or at least will be in time as my CS6 and LR4 become non-functional.

My investment in Adobe stock has paid off. I sold it today before the #### hits the fan and the investment world loses faith in the company as most of its customers have after hearing and digesting today's news. Once good companies fail because they start to think that only they know what is best for their customers, when all they have to do to succeed is LISTEN to their customers.

This is a sad day in my photographic life. Adobe - you've let me down.

6 upvotes

Likewise. Sold for 45.50, made some money.
This idea will bomb. I am sure they will re-think and come up with a way to grant a perpetual license to CC users after a specific version has been subscribed to for a given amount of time. So that at some point you can decide to stop paying and stick with the version you have.

2 upvotes

I teach classes and brag about the power of PS but now I question the insensitivity of this "improvement" Adobe offers. Who did they beta this to...aliens?

2 upvotes

JL Whaley:

But honestly CS6 and LR4 aren't going to become nonfunctional, it's that at a certain point they'll be non-upgradeable. And then many years from now you won't be able to get a new computer that will run them.

0 upvotes

You most likely can run CS6 for a very long time. Even with new hardware and operating system. You just have to use it in a virtualized environment.

0 upvotes

MarkusDanniel,

Possibly, but then the hardware will need to be fast, even fast for a future computer.

0 upvotes

1) CS 6 in the Windows 8 Compatibility Mode in Windows 9
2) don't upgrade to the next Windows - just buy new HW
3) when the new hardware is no longer recognized, go virtual
OK, good...BUT
I'd rather use the CS 6 until I get a new camera
which is no longer supported - only for CC (Cash Cows) >:-(
THEN switch to Corel or some other SW
never ever go back to Adobe !!

1 upvote

Shitstorm at Adobes Facebook Page continues. Not one single positive comment.
https://www.facebook.com/Adobe

9 upvotes

According to a couple of Adobe trolls Stu and GW there were 3000 "likes"...

4 upvotes

It really doesnt look good judging by the reactions posted !

1 upvote

Worse than shooting your own foot with a .50 cal M2 I guess...

...and I hope at least as painful for them.

2 upvotes

CC gets more costly if you live outside of the US

Single app $19.99 or if in UK £17.58 a month.
Existing CS customers $29.99 or £27.34 if in the UK.

Tourist rate today is £1 = $1.51

How can Adobe justify the differential?

I guess my legitimate PS CS6 will be my last PS version. As am amateur I cannot justify this price hike. Please Adobe rethink.

4 upvotes

It's the cost of shipping all those gigabytes on a cargo ship across the Atlantic.

...or are they using a cargo plane? :-|

7 upvotes

And then every handpicked gigabyte gets packed in a silk envelope and is shipped individually to the European continent as Priority Mail.

Thus another price hike from approximately 20€ (=17.58£) to 24.59€ for the single "app". That's some 32 US$ per month!

Time for consumers in other parts of the world to act like the people of Oz and drag Adobe right up to the bar and the judge for their obscene gouging of customers outside the US.

4 upvotes

I got my first version of 4.0 and have spent enough on upgrades to buy it all over again. My reward...monthly payments I can take to my grave. I am already looking at other software options. However, Classic Coke was a wonderful marketing story with a happy ending. Et tu, Adobe?

1 upvote

Started using Pagemaker and Photoshop years and years ago. Moved onto (and purchased) CS-1 -2 -3 -4 -5 -6.
Now Adobe is screwing with us!!!
I've been loyal for many years, but I see it is time to find a replacement and NO LONGER use any of Adobe's software!!!

Adobe must think that there isn't anything else to use!
http://www.quark.com/
http://www.corel.com/
http://www.serif.com/
http://www.magix.com/us/
and on and on and on and on

2 upvotes

I have actually been playing with Corel Paint Shop Pro which I haven't used since X3 and I am nicely impressed. It is not CS6 but it is not that far either, the RAW processing toolset is decent. The 'Ultimate' version includes Nik's Color Efex Pro all for $69 CAD.

1 upvote

I still use Jasc PSP 9. Covers all my photo editing needs. Great bit of software , not memory intensive and paid for itself years ago.

1 upvote

To this i have to add something. This is pure greed.

I think 9 out of 10 of us would pay will be willing to pay 10-20 dollars/euros per month. The problem is, after the first year, I have to more than 60 euros/month... and thats $80.45 dollars/month, which is €965 euros a year!

And now for the positive note:

Too "she who must be obeyed": Can I have one of those brand new Nikkor lens instead?

3 upvotes

This might have side effects to camera manufacturers, if consumers delay upgrading their cameras for months.

0 upvotes

you mean:
until RAW update is available...oh no! for CC only !!!
switch to Corel or other
IF easy and up to date RAW conv is available
maybe the camera manufacturers offer their own RAW Conv SW?

1 upvote

Here's my guess on how this is going to play out:

1) Within a couple of months hackers will make all the CC apps freely available on the Internet.

2) Everyone who used the illegal copies of the apps will continue to do so. Nothing will change

3) The big change comes from the paying customers. ADBE has become one of the most hated companies overnight. Loyal customers, who have always paid for the software, will start using the illegal copies.

4) Within a year ADBE top and bottom line growth will be lower than what Wall Street was promised due to significantly increased piracy. Part of this will be mitigated by the higher prices from the remaining paying customers.

5) CEO will be asked to step down (with golden parachute).

6) New CEO comes in and will announce a round of layoffs. A company that throws loyal customers under the bus won't hesitate to fire rank and file employees if it increases profits

7) ADBE will go into damage control mode and offer perpetual licenses

17 upvotes

My thoughts exactly, I think it's gonna play out more or less like you said.

3 upvotes

First three will happen 100%... the 3rd one is the saddest one.

Why, Adobe, why? This is like putting nails in your own coffin.

2 upvotes

I don't think is going to take a year. No Silicon Valley company can afford growth rates below 15% without seeing their stock tank. No CEO can stand 2 bad Quarters in a row. No sales people can survive 3 bad quarters... in 9 months we will have redemption.

2 upvotes

Agreed

1 upvote

too optimistic..

Comment edited 17 seconds after posting

1 upvote

I hope Adobe will suffer severe losses and the consumers will bide their time for an alternative which will be coming since there is money to me made in the void that Adobe leaves behind. I will stick with my current LR version and so on and not hope onto their extortion train.

8 upvotes

Guess I will stick with my current version as long as it works and then look for alternatives. May be Adobe management should talk with Microsoft management about their Windows 8 experience.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

5 upvotes

Total comments: 1899


Poll: What concerns you most about Adobe's move to subscription software? May 8, 2013	Photoshop CC: Adobe responds to reaction May 8, 2013	Adobe updates Creative Cloud with exclusive tools for Photoshop CC May 6, 2013	Adobe announces updates exclusive to Creative Cloud members Dec 11, 2012

	Samsung NX2000 May 1, 2013
	Sony Cyber-shot DSC-HX50V Apr 24, 2013
	Panasonic Lumix DMC-G6 Apr 24, 2013
	Panasonic Lumix DMC-LF1 Apr 24, 2013
	Ricoh GR Apr 17, 2013
	Samsung NX1100 Apr 11, 2013
	Panasonic Lumix DMC-GF6 Apr 9, 2013
	Fujifilm FinePix S8400W Mar 22, 2013
	Fujifilm FinePix XP200 Mar 22, 2013
	Canon EOS 100D (EOS Rebel SL1) Mar 21, 2013
	Canon EOS 700D (EOS Rebel T5i) Mar 21, 2013
	Canon PowerShot SX270 HS Mar 21, 2013
	Canon PowerShot SX280 HS Mar 21, 2013

Poll: who plans to pay for Adobe cloud software ?	150
Adobe Goes All-In on Subscription Pricing - ...	139
Recommended Photoshop Alternatives?	95
Adobe is WRONG!	86
Are we fooling ourselves?	69
Not completely satisfied with my X100S	57
Sold my RX100 - this is why	52
Lenses, sharpness, and image quality	51
From first effort at street.	50
All this Adobe flaming	49
M43 and DOF with a fast lens	44
24mp sensor for m43? 3.2micron pixel pitch!	44
When I increase the aperture my screen goes ...	42
Primes vs Zooms	38
Anybody out there who does not use Photoshop ...	37
Nikon 1 lens road map...anyone?	37
Alternative to Adobe software	35
A99 Short Film "Survival of the Fittest" Hi-ISO	32
Tempted by the price of the SAMYANG 14mm f2.8 ...	31
Nikor 24-120 F4	28