Fujifilm harnesses silver for new touch-screen technology: Digital Photography Review

It's kind of amusing to see people are worrying about touch-screen cameras here. Touch-screen on camera is lame, but in many other areas, it shines. smart phones, tablet PCs, car's console, ATMs, POS machines. I went to a local medical center a few days ago, they have huge touch screens near every entrance -- for you to navigate inside the building, find you doctor, etc. I have also seen touch screens in book stores, libraries, subways, etc.

Touch screen forces UI designers to design simpler UI, software developers to hide details and only expose the essential APIs. It frees the user from overly complex menu systems. It only makes our life easier, faster. Of course, touch screens cannot replace buttons on a DSLR, or keyboard/mouse for a PC -- for complicated tasks.

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2 upvotes

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0 upvotes

Pretty soon will have Gold award for Tablet cameras, where touch screen rules, touch screen cameras belong in Wal-Mart

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And I'm remembering a line from one of the Star Trek movies where Scotty mentions "Transparent Aluminum". Innovation is fun to watch.

0 upvotes

Please make cheap oil substitute next.

1 upvote

There already is one, hydrogen fuel cells. The problem is that car manufacturers aren't making cars to use it.

0 upvotes

Hydrogen fuel cells aren't turning out to be very practical. I wish they were, but the cost and energy density even at theoretical maximum efficiency is difficult to justify at best.

2 upvotes

so they dump their silver expertise into touchscreens after dumping their gelantine expertise into cosmetics, what will be next, will fuji find out that processing chemicals may be re-used as a soy sauce substitute?

cheers, martin

0 upvotes

touch screen for newbs; buttons for pros....period

5 upvotes

Hmm... many don't like touch screens. Everyone uses some, though.
Manufacturers find the products with no moving parts cheaper and simpler to develop, so like it or not, we'll have touch-sensitive devices in ever more aspects.
But there will also always be some button- or dial-activated versions of devices, at least when it is an advantage to operate something without having to look.
As to the costs... I still can't understand how it is cheaper to have piezo spark instead of a flint & wheel on throw-away lighters... and also how come the end user pays next to nothing for a thing like that, considering materials, labor, energy and transport around the World. Even more stupefying, sometimes the printing of ads on these lighters might cost you more than the lighter itself.
There are many products like that. So, if the new silver halide based touch screen manages to lower the production costs, even your next washing machine and fridge will have one...

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0 upvotes

never liked touch screens, especially for small handheld devices, whether a smartphone or dcam. nothing worse than looking at an image captured that would never be appreciated on such tiny handheld sized screens (including larger tablet pc screens, that really aren't breathtaking to view at all).

for me, the viewing size of any image from close to far, especially at arms reach (monitors) and beyond to projection or light displays, are more enjoyable to view if the imagery/motion imagery spans the entire field of view (that easily fills the entire breadth of one's eyeglasses/viewing goggles/sunglasses/3D glasses/etc)

if a screen is intended strictly for viewing, and is relatively 'hi-res monitor' size (24"-36"), i don't want to stretch out my hands/arms all the way to the screen to manipulate images/controls, and block the full view of any image, no hand/finger intrusions please

prefer much more controls that are 'touch/actuated' outside the frame of the image screen itself

sdyue

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0 upvotes

Indium is one of those rare metals found in places where child labor is common.
Every touchscreen means that a 7-10 years old child is working in inhuman places and they die like flies. And Dpreview discusses about proper grammatics!

2 upvotes

No it isn't. Indium is most abundant in Canada which as far as I'm aware isn't into Child labour. You're thinking of Tantalum which is also in every smartphone.

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@jorepuusa

Where is your source for your claim? As Zdman says, Indium is produced in Canada. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indium

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Wikipedia is how one reads it.
--------
China is a leading producer of indium. The Teck Cominco refinery in Trail, British Columbia, is a large single source indium producer, with production of 32.5 tonnes in 2005, 41.8 tonnes in 2004 and 36.1 tonnes in 2003. South American Silver Corporation's Malku Khota property in Bolivia is a large resource of indium with an indicated resource of 1,481 tonnes and inferred resource of 935 tonnes.[30] Adex Mining Inc.’s Mount Pleasant Mine in New Brunswick, Canada, holds some of the world’s total known indium resources.[31]
---------
China and Bolivia are places where child labor is common.
So, Yeas I am right here.

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While you're certainly not wrong in that there is also Indium production in China, your logic in determining that it is produced with child labour is flawed and a logical fallacy.

That is the same logic as saying:
- Irish people drink beer
- Person X is irish
- Therefore, X drinks beer

Obviously X doesn't necessarily drink beer as not every irish person drinks beer. Same as in China: while child labour does exist (and it is likely that Indium is indeed in some way also produced with child labour), it is a logical fallacy to assume that the entire production of Indium is produced with child labour.

That does not take away from the fact that Child Labour - no matter in how low percentages - is wrong, of course. I just don't think flawed logic helps either.

1 upvote

Based on current estimates there's only 25-35 years left in the ground but less than 1% is recycled each year. How ever many countries have adopted a policy of sending their rubbish to poor nations where many children do earn a living by finding our valuable rubbish for recycling.

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I find touch screens to be not particularly useful myself, at least on the small screens of digital cameras. I find it faster and more consistently accurate to just turn a dial or press a button to navigate rather than touching or dragging my finger across the screen.

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Indium tin oxide, ITO. It's transparent and conducts electricity. The search for a cheaper, non-indium alternative that works as well has been going on for years with surprisingly little success. If Fuji can crack it more power to them, but this is not a simple problem...

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Am I the only one not to like touch-screen ? I think I am doomed regarding mobile devices and camera. I should try to get use to it... ;)

3 upvotes

In any case, Indium is used in ALL LCDs, not just touch screens.

2 upvotes

No, you're not the only one. I've been feeling "doomed" since years because of all sorts of developments I'm not happy about ... from wide-screen displays (no choice!) to the dumbing-down of the general public and the resulting conformism, fanboyism and infantilism of large numbers of people ... too much to get into here.

1 upvote

I am with you(doomed, hehehe). But my case is about cell phone though. It's faster to type using the usual keypad. On the bright side, I like the large display.

0 upvotes

A $21 billion revenue company. Go Fuji.

1 upvote

Fanboy? Sucker for anything "corporate"? Capitalist stooge? Any personal integrity left?

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I think it's more of a reflection on how a film based company continues to reinvent itself unlike others cough*Kodak*cough who are in bankruptcy.

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[Off-topic] question about language :)

I am a non-native English speaker, and the sentence

a) "Currently these screens utilize the fairly rare metal, indium"

caught my attention. Is it grammatically correct or should it read either

b) "Currently these screens utilize the fairly rare metal indium"

or

c) "Currently these screens utilize a fairly rare metal, indium"

? Both version b) and version c) would have an exact correspondent for the use of the comma in Italian, my native language, but the use of the comma as in a) would be unusual/wrong in Italian, hence the question.

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Nothing wrong with the original sentence. It's a structure often used for emphasis of the object as opposed to the subject.

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i'm going to reply because i have a masters degree in applied linguistics and 10 years of teaching english grammar to foreign students. technically you're right, there shouldn't be a comma. but 99% of native speakers won't "feel" like it's wrong when they read this sentence. comma usage in english is fluid, similar to fashion. at this point the sentence in question might actually be acceptable, even if the logic isn't there.
and finally, there are lots of examples where english comma rules differ from romance languages. giving a list is the first one that comes to mind. reporting speech is another one.

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3 upvotes

"Currently, these screens utilize a fairly rare metal-indium"

.. ?

0 upvotes

I think C would be the most correct because "the" would be more appropriate if used with a name rather than an ordinary noun (indium). But I would replace the comma with a semicolon (;) to be technically correct. http://theoatmeal.com/comics/semicolon

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Grammar aside, what makes Indium "rare" anyway? From what I recall, Indium is about 3 time more abundant in the Earth's crust than the silver Fuji is talking about using. But if the silver is effective, it's got to be in concentrations that allows for monetary savings.

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There's about 50% more silver than indium; somewhat more, but not a huge difference. There's still about as much indium as there is mercury. The real problem is that it's very widely scattered in tiny quantities, rather than occurring in veins of specific ores that can be readily targeted and mined.

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1 upvote

On the original topic, Pythagoras has it exactly right. Both of the OP's sentences are technically more correct, but most native speakers would not notice the slight incongruity.

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Actually, I thought the correct way to write this sentence is:

"Currently, these screens utilize the fairly rare metal, indium."

Notice the first comma after "Currently", and the last comma after "metal".

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I think you're point is correct. But I think many of us have resorted to using a dash in situations like this. "Currently these screens utilize the fairly rare metal - indium." The reason for the separation, whether comma or dash, is to highlight the object of the sentence.

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Current screens utilize indium,a rare metal.

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"By Pythagoras

i'm going to reply because i have a masters degree in applied linguistics and 10 years of teaching english grammar to foreign students. technically you're right, there shouldn't be a comma. but 99% of native speakers won't "feel" like it's wrong when they read this sentence. comma usage in english is fluid, similar to fashion. at this point the sentence in question might actually be acceptable, even if the logic isn't there.
and finally, there are lots of examples where english comma rules differ from romance languages. giving a list is the first one that comes to mind. reporting speech is another one."

I fear for your students. Your own grammar isn't exactly great. Lucky for you most foreign students are unlikely to pick up on your mistakes.

Playing fast and lose with commas has become endemic to modern English. That doesn't mean it is right to throw them around without a care in the world.

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Next I'd like to see a screen that touches you back.

3 upvotes

Where you want it to touch first? lol
I don't like touch screens...

1 upvote

That thought grabs me ! Still thinking about it !

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Good!
More inventions, more business... Good for everyone.
Did we overpay your smartphones?

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SILVER??? On the short, but not on the long run. Here's why:
http://www.visualcapitalist.com/portfolio/the-silver-series-the-history-of-silver-part-1
http://www.visualcapitalist.com/portfolio/the-silver-series-supply-and-demand-part-2
http://www.visualcapitalist.com/the-silver-series-investment-part-3

1 upvote

This is why Fujifilm is still in business and Kodak is not. From cosmetics to medical equipment, they've done a pretty good job of evolving. At least better than Kodak.

3 upvotes

"At least better than Kodak."

That isn't setting the bar very high...

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Funny that Fuji is the company talking about cost of the touchscreens when they are NOT using them that much...:D

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Thanks ! I was just about to write something about that paradox. That said, I'm a Canon and Fujifilm user and never felt the need to use a touch-screen. I find that device distracting and I hate seeing fingerprints on screens. That's why I'm not a pad user nor a touch-screen monitor either. But maybe am I already a man of the past who doesn't understand the modern pleasures ? Fortunately, I think I'm not the only one to feel this way...

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technology, shmenology, learn how to make a decent camera first, Fuji!

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What like the XP1, XE1, X100, X100s or the X20? Can't get much better than those in my opinion...

19 upvotes

Yes, they're decent cameras. However, these cameras (at least the released ones) all have focusing issues. If the cameras could focus consistently, they would be MUCH better.

0 upvotes

slower to focus using CDAF is not really 'focusing issues'

They're good cameras.

2 upvotes

@chexmixing

Focusing issues on the newer X100S and X20? 0.08 seconds not fast enough for you?

1 upvote

I can only laugh on that polemnism.
The focus of the X-Series is not the fastest yet, but for sure it works very good, is meanwhile fast enough for the most stuff and is the most accurate I've worked with so far.

I still not get why people like to bash on different brands and writing up such nonsense. If you write something you should be able to at least share substantly experience with these cameras and you should be able to proof it somehow. Otherwise it is just fart in the wind.

Regards,
Daniel

3 upvotes

"Otherwise it is just fart in the wind."
Are we talking here of "fartography" ?

0 upvotes

Fuji has and continues to make some very good cameras. They made great view camera lenses and enlarger lenses. And they made some bang up medium format stuff - their glass was always known for sharpness and color rendition. Granted, film was their primary business, but they are no stranger to cameras and glass. I used to lust after this:

http://www.dannyburk.com/images/fuji-680-2.jpg

To say that they have focus problems and therefore don't make a decent camera is also to damn Canon and Nikon as not making decent cameras because they have dust issues or need firmware updates to cure focus issues. (Both Nikon and Canon are guilty here...)

There's no reason for this kind of statement. Any camera maker who's still around making cameras today is doing something right. Notice that Kodak (the other big film company) is going through chapter 11 while Fuji is thriving...

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@Abolit: Please wake up and have a look on FUJIFILM Cameras now. I guess you're still in the 80's. Please go and check FUJIFILM X-Series, HS-Series and F-Series. Compare the specs, price, performance and other key aspects, if you find them lesser than any digital camera in the market in its class, then let me know..!! but commenting without knowing anything is a shame..!!! ''Its almost similar as a Dog barking and running after a car whereas he cant make any difference to it.'' Sorry for my bad English..!!!

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@ Arenas

Yes I forgot that technically the X100S is indeed available... though in much of the world, it is unavailable. I hope that the X100S lives up to the autofocus hype. I was a fan of the X100 (with firmware updates), and even find its autofocus usable.

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Great to hear that Fuji is addressing both cost and availability of a key technology for user interfaces. I hope they are successful with it.

6 upvotes

Touch screens are not tactile. Buttons and dials FTW.

4 upvotes

Did you just use the abbreviation for "for the win?" That's a rather immature expression, but perhaps fitting when one espouses a view that touch screens and buttons and dials are some sort of dichotomy ... take a look at the definitions for "complement" and "augment" ... then grab yourself a Panasonic m4/3 camera to try out ...

1 upvote

I think he meant "For The Wrecord" ;)

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Thanks God ! I thought he meant "(to) Feed The Wombles" (cf: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wombles ) what I felt disrespectful for us.

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@capanikon
Actually Apple is working on getting tactile feel to touch screens. Something about buttons that raises from the screen and deflates otherwise.

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I want some new photo-films and affordable full-colour, high-resolution film scanners. Can we get them, Fujifilm? Please? :)

2 upvotes

I assume that future Fujifilm cameras with 27" touchscreens will be 180 dollars cheaper? Great.

1 upvote

No ! Just 1.8 dollars cheaper, don't forget the price one has to pay for the R&D ! Making things cheaper is expensive...

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Could save $180 on 23"-27 touch screens on" nearly every piece of MOBILE techonlogy!!! strong reporters at lest phisicaly.

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That said, making cheaper items doesn't seem to be in line with the economical politics the Japan's Prime Minister Abe is proceeding, as he calls that sort of trend "deflation" instead of "progress". If "cheaper" is not good of our economies, why bother producing cheaper devices ?

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This is really going to freak out all the old people buying Fuji's for nostalgia sake. LOL. MEDIC!

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I doubt it old people are the ones who run t these companies the younger one are their subordinates

2 upvotes

all those pixels and memory cards and on camera screens have sure been reminding me of the past too

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Touch screens may be quickly becoming the standard interface, however, for touchscreens to replace the more positive physical "touch" of real buttons and dials would be a shame. As a feature you can turn off or customize sure, but don't leave me with only touch screens please!

12 upvotes

I give my ballot paper to buttons and dials !

1 upvote

Wait for the next iPhone-esk breakthrough in camera UI and you will be convinced. There are no buttons and dials cellphone anymore.

0 upvotes

I like the feel of a button.

1 upvote

Anything that can reduce cost and help the enviroment is good news

0 upvotes


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Fujifilm harnesses silver for new touch-screen technology

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