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Photojournalist unexpectedly documents domestic violence

By dpreview staff on Mar 1, 2013 at 20:51 GMT

While documenting the lives of a young Ohio couple for a project about, 'the stigma associated with being an ex-convict', freelance photojournalist Sara Naomi Lewkowicz found herself witnessing a heated argument among her subjects that escalated into violence. The harrowing and emotionally raw images that she captured follow a long tradition of documentary photography. Yet, she's also had to answer detractors who question whether she should have intervened.

Below we've shared a few of Lewkowicz's images documenting the conflict between Shane (the former convict) and Maggie, a couple whose late night argument escalated into a scene of domestic abuse. We've deliberately omitted images of the physical violence. To view the portfolio in its entirety, please visit Lewkowicz's web site. We've included Lewkowicz's own captions from the Time Lightbox blog to provide some context to the encounter.

After a night out at a local bar, Maggie left after becoming jealous of when another woman flirted with Shane. Upon arriving home, Shane flew into a rage, angry that Maggie had "abandoned him" at the bar and then drove home with his friend, whose house they were staying at for the week. Maggie told him to get out of the house, that he was too angry and that he would wake the children. Rather than subsiding, Shane's anger began to grow, and he screamed that Maggie had betrayed him, at one point accusing his friend (not pictured) of trying to pursue her sexually.
Around half past midnight, the police arrived after receiving a call from a resident in the house (pictured at right). Maggie cried and smoked a cigarette as an officer from the Lancaster Police Department tried to keep her separated from Shane and coax out the truth about the assault. Shane pled with Maggie not to let the police take him into custody, crying out, "Please, Maggie, I love you, don't let them take me, tell them I didn't do this!"

In describing details of the eventLewkowicz notes that once the situation turned physically violent, she confirmed that another witness had called the police before she continued shooting. In addition, she has been told by law enforcement officers that physically intervening, 'would have likely only made the situation worse, endangering me, and further endangering [the victim]'. It's also worth noting that Lewkowicz received approval to move forward with publishing these images from the victim herself, 'because she feels the photographs might be able to help someone else.'

The goal of documentary photography is to bring personal stories into public view, often with the aim of affecting societal change. What would have been your response in such a situation?

Comments

Total comments: 269
12
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 19, 2013)

I dont buy the "unexpectedly", either it was completely staged, or the photographer influenced the situation, in whatever direction, by pointing a camera at the man.
Domestic violence is a serious problem, if this report brought it to more attention, kudos for that.
But with regard to human beings in media, we always should keep in mind that there is no such thing as an objective view.

0 upvotes
Jettatore
By Jettatore (Mar 12, 2013)

The real intervention that is needed here is a set of photography lessons. There is one good photo in this entire set, and that's the photo of the baby girl in her booster seat as seen through a car's passenger window, you can find it if you go to the full gallery linked in the article.

0 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

Haha. I know what you mean - but I think the images are consistent with that particular style of work. I thought they were pretty good for what they are.

0 upvotes
unlearny
By unlearny (Mar 8, 2013)

Yeah that female photographer should have chucked some lenses at him. He seems like a perfectly reasonable guy... She knew that the cops were being called.
Taking pictures probably helped as much as anything else she could've done to limit the violence. The dude had enough self awareness to get shirtless for the camera whenever possible, it probably kept them all safer than if she had jumped in. That is extremely dangerous territory, and if the guy's friend wasn't jumping in, that is a good cue. I think the entire sequence could be helpful for women to help recognize the menacing behavior that becomes more and more prevalent in the series. I think it would have been exploitative if she had brought a full light kit, and kept making them redo shots until it was just right. I think that photographer is incredibly brave, and she is doing something very daring and evokative, but not exploitative.

Comment edited 12 minutes after posting
1 upvote
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

No - taking the pictures increased the tension. Cameras often make a tense situation even more tense. I mean really - you go looking to document domestic violence and low and behold, you find it in progress...wow surprise. You can't treat people like lions on National Geographic. No one expects you to call the ranger when lions start fighting.

These are people and there are things you can do to PREVENT the violence instead escalating it with a camera. Cameras DO affect situations. People WILL perform for a camera.

0 upvotes
Zeppyled
By Zeppyled (Mar 7, 2013)

Really??? The goal of a photographer should not surpass the obligation to protecting or taking care of one's fellow man. Put the camera down and call 911, stupid.

1 upvote
jderrico
By jderrico (Mar 7, 2013)

So, the victim approved the publication of those photos because "the photographs might be able to help someone else." Is that what Lewkowicz told her?

0 upvotes
Greg Henry
By Greg Henry (Mar 4, 2013)

I see the value of this type of documentary simply to bring to light what type of stuff goes on out there, but what you're seeing here isn't any different than what is going on with probably half a billion people (literally) across the globe as I type this. There is nothing "unique" about this situation - it's actually more tame than many others.

My Sister is involved in a marriage that involves a certain level of abuse, as she was FOUR times before. It is not usually the woman's fault when she is abused, but it is her fault when she stays with the person who is the abuser, and, continues to have children with that person. We can go into all of the psychological babble about why some do this, but it boils down to this - if you're with someone who's brain doesn't function correctly due to how much ink they've had injected into their bodies - leave.

Will it help others? Maybe. Will it help this victim? Doubtful, or she would have helped herself by now.

3 upvotes
Greg Henry
By Greg Henry (Mar 4, 2013)

ADDED: In terms of whether or not the photographer should have intervened or not, I agree that at that moment, she would only risk getting herself hurt, and causing the scene to escalate further. But then, I wouldn't have been there to have to make that decision, myself.

4 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 4, 2013)

Ink? That's too funny. My guess in this case is meth - and a good reason to avoid this guy is meth.

1 upvote
Vlad S
By Vlad S (Mar 5, 2013)

I agree that it looks horrifying to people in nurturing relationships, but for those in the abusive relationships this is all quite justifiable. I knew two women, one left an abusive relationship, the other is still in it. They always have an explanation why they can't or should not leave. It's like a mental disorder - they just seem to lack control over their thought process. I doubt very much that this will help the victims, although it is possible the series will help to raise funds for shelters and counseling.

Comment edited 13 seconds after posting
1 upvote
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 4, 2013)

He's eating up the camera folks! Totally getting into the performance.

This whole sequence is very disturbing. My response? Put down my camera and get a big stick. I can't justify the hand's off approach. Coming to someone's rescue implies risk to one's self, so the argument that you would only be endangering yourself or others is very weak. I personally feel that the camera was part of the cause in this situation. I feel that he's performing for the camera.

There is one aspect where it might be important to document events for later needs like a trial. But that doesn't excuse not trying to help.

And there are times when there's a larger crowd and a photographer is just one more body out of many, so I get that one. But not this one.

Oh - and do we need to document this thing? We're all already aware of and disgusted by it. This is nothing more than voyeurism to me.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 8 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
Spunjji
By Spunjji (Mar 5, 2013)

"I personally feel that the camera was part of the cause in this situation. I feel that he's performing for the camera."

"Feelings" are useful, because they are unaccountable and don't have to make any sense. I *think* that you're talking complete nonsense. There's no evidence here to support your assertions - you are projecting your opinions into a place where they do not belong.

2 upvotes
liveagain
By liveagain (Mar 5, 2013)

It is a tough decision and is one subjective to many factors. You mentioned a situation where the photographer being just one in a big crowd, yet number alone does not tell the whole story. For example, if you are 170lb, whether the offender is 150lb or 280lb and physically fit are two completely different scenarios. Confronting violence with violence is a very crucial decision to make. Picking up a stick, or even a knife, to confront this guy creates an extremely dangerous situation. The point being, it is hard to make a decision at the moment. It was not a bad decision for the photographer to wait for the cops to arrive in this case IMO.

1 upvote
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 5, 2013)

stevo23 said: "This is nothing more than voyeurism to me."

That's what it is because that sort of offense as been tens (or hundreds) of times documented, meanwhile there is almost no nowadays "action movie" that includes one or two scenes of "domestic violence". Everybody knows it, far better than, said, the Ark of the Covenant that is - according to some people - kept in Ethiopia (cf: http://youtu.be/UHatEHJ4nmA ). Something that is never shown, and where is its documentation ?

There is another thing that is disturbing: the agenda. This "unprepared" serie is everywhere avaible on the internet (bravo to the TIME which published it first : http://lightbox.time.com/2013/02/27/photographer-as-witness-a-portrait-of-domestic-violence/#1 ) just some days after a big political fail at the U.S senate (cf: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/26/violence-against-women-act-house_n_2769624.html ).

Just a coincidence ? Or shady coincidence !

1 upvote
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

@ Spunji - I feel you're being an ass and an idiot - I can support that. Why does anyone need to "support" their opinions here? "I feel" in this case is a signal for non-dogmatic expression of opinion, a way of expressing opinion without being combative. EVERYTHING in this discussion is opinion - that's what it's all about.

@liveagain - You do have a point. I doubt the photographer was any match for this guy. Once the situation escalated, I'm not sure what she should have done. But the problem is that she did something that was capable of escalating the violence - shoot pictures.

The telling fact in this case is that the guy didn't seem to turn on the photographer - never turned and said, "put that camera down". That tells me that he was performing for the camera. I think the camera was a catalyst.

0 upvotes
hiro_pro
By hiro_pro (Mar 4, 2013)

Based on the most of the comments it is clear that most of you do not understand domestic violence. this is particularly true of those that said they would have stopped this incident. it is called a cycle of violence for a reason. yeah sure, you could have stopped it that night and that would have changed the world. this coupled would continue to face the same life stressors (job, kids, bills), responded in the same ways that they see people in their world respond and eventually ended up in the same drunken situation in a short period. My wife works nights and weekends in an ER in an undeserved community. most people on this site would be shocked by what others do not know or think is acceptable.

This to me is real journalism (which is different from studio work). i applaud this photographer for showing us what the world outside of our cozy existence looks like.

11 upvotes
frenchie1
By frenchie1 (Mar 4, 2013)

Unfortunately domestic violence happens every day all other the world.

0 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 7, 2013)

Correct. And that's leading to the big question: WHY should we need a documentation about a so widely known phenomenon ?

Second question if needed: WHO can find a documentation about a well known problem hugely interesting like if it was something "never shown", "never seen" and "unheard" ?

0 upvotes
RC
By RC (Mar 4, 2013)

So many comments here, some controversial, one or two even disturbing.
One thing needs to be clear though: As a man, you do not hit a woman. Just don't. I had arguments with my wife too in the past, kids were small, money was tight but I never laid a finger on her, neither did she throw stuff at me or whatever some nutjobs do. Real men do not hit women. Hitting a woman is a weakness, not a strength. Just don't hit a woman, even if she hits you (unless of course you need to defend yourself). Lewkowicz's images make me sad, I feel sorry for the kids but also for that woman but I just don't get this guy at all. So many mean looking tatoos, such a "tough" guy and he...hits a woman, also in front of their kids? Oh boy.

2 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

Now THIS is part of the attitude I don't understand. Surely as a WOMAN you do not hit anybody either. This is the way things escalate. NO ONE should ever think they have the right to turn verbal conflict into physical conflict. Not ever. Not with kids, old people, or women. I know men who have been the victims of DV, and then people say to them "Why did you not hit back?"

Too many people think if a woman hits a guy he deserves it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlFAd4YdQks

Comment edited 11 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

Good point!

0 upvotes
vlad259
By vlad259 (Mar 4, 2013)

I think reading the comments on this story has cured me of ever reading below the 'Comments' line again. It is really sad. "It's staged", "she made bad choices", "just run on the TV to see this", "poor technical quality" - I feel shocked.

(Kudos to the many posters countering the points above, you are much more eloquent than I.)

5 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

It's a photo site, and people are discussing the photos and the ethics of taking them. Why does that surprise you? If it were a social workers' site the comments would likely be different.

1 upvote
vlad259
By vlad259 (Mar 5, 2013)

No, it's the idiocy of some of the comments that shocked me, not the discussion itself.

0 upvotes
Potemkin_Photo
By Potemkin_Photo (Mar 4, 2013)

What lense was used for this?

2 upvotes
magneto shot
By magneto shot (Mar 4, 2013)

the images are real and touching.

4 upvotes
Halstatt
By Halstatt (Mar 4, 2013)

I'd rather question whether or not these snapshots rise to the level of what we call photojournalism?

Living in our tabloid "Oprah Land", we see shots like this every day.

Comment edited 27 seconds after posting
8 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 4, 2013)

Right ! And that's precisely what is praised as "good journalism" by people who like that sort of show. The bootmaker doesn't judge higher than the boot (according to a french proverb).

1 upvote
vlad259
By vlad259 (Mar 4, 2013)

This wasn't about the technical quality of the photos it was more about being there to document it.

0 upvotes
snegron2
By snegron2 (Mar 4, 2013)

I wonder if she used a flash or not? I can imagine that a flash would have distracted the couple from their argument and could possibly have caused the anger to be re-directed toward the photographer.

2 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 4, 2013)

Well said. I'm really delighted that somebody use his (or her ?) brain and question the picture on a technical ground.

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

Why? Haven't questioned it because it's kind of obvious no flash is used in those photos.

0 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 5, 2013)

First, in document analysis any question is more welcome than none at all, because any technical leads to another.

Second, I won't be so affirmative than you are when seeing the picture 25 (cf: http://saranaomiphoto.com/Shane-and-Maggie/25/ ) and 26 (cf: http://saranaomiphoto.com/Shane-and-Maggie/26/ ).

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 5, 2013)

I would. There is a low angle light in the room and that's clearly seen in many photographs.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 5, 2013)

Right ! You have well examined the picture and know well the light texture. Then, it leads to the next question: what one would need to take such pictures of quickly moving persons in that poor lighting while wanting to reach such a smooth result without flash ?

A big camera - full frame, not less - and a fast lens, not less. If we search a little, we find that Ms Lewkowicz used a 5D mark II, which is already a big gun, and that she shot around f2-f2.8. It's to say a big gun with a huge barrel on it. Do we think a said violent man who "spent half his life in jail" would agree to be repeatidly shot with such an "aggressive" device at point-blank range as to say ?

Do we think he would find acceptable to be "documented" from every angle by an until-the-eve unknown photographer who did not stop to change of position to catch the best scene these acts of violence could offer ?

Not sure...

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 6, 2013)

In the tradition of fly-on=the=wall documentary, documentary film makers have managed to capture much more intimate and even violent moments than these, witness the Middletown series and the works of Fred Wiseman, or the series called "Family" going way back to the eighties I think. There are tricks to this. You establish familiarity in peaceful times. In some cases the crew or camera person wears nondescript colours, enters into no interaction with the subject during shooting, and even shoots for days or weeks without turning the camera on, until the subjects accept them as part of the scenery. It's an established tradition, and has had long practice. I don't doubt people can do it because people HAVE done it.

0 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 6, 2013)

1/2
Well, that's a lot to comment, and to begin with, I assure you I'm not trying some pilpul on you (cf: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilpul ) or if it is actually pilpul, it's just the way I think naturally. No offence intended.

1) The man pictured hitting his wife could have refused these photos to be published normally, as they have been taken at his home (private place) and because they accuse him before a court of law (right of image, right of defence). If he didn't oppose to the publishing of such documents, it is in itself highly shady.

0 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 6, 2013)

2/2

2) it's clear you WANT to believe what is said in this serie. Then, you justify what the photographer has maybe achieved - becoming "invisible" to the eyes of this couple - without knowing for sure what this person has actually made or if she is just able to. Moreover as a foundation to this belief, you tell that it's possible because other people did it. First question, did they really ? Second question: french Philippe Petit succeeded in walking on a rope through the air between the World Trade Center (cf: http://tinyurl.com/algeohl ). HE did it, does that prove that you, me or Ms Lewkowicz can do it ?

And the problem of the super-fast&wide-spreading of this yet-common story on the internet, translated in several languages in no time, just less than a week after a political fail to pass a new law concerning the domestic violences doesn't ask you if there is not any agenda, any manipulation behind all of that ?

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Apr 20, 2013)

I simply tell you, with examples, how documentary film-makers have worked for more than three decades with much larger equipment. You are free to retain your scepticism.

1 upvote
doady
By doady (Mar 4, 2013)

These pictures remind me of my own parents, before they separated when I was a kid.

2 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

Was your dad in prison? I can't imagine what that's like.

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

While I can perhaps understand not intervening between the parents, who are adults and responsible for themselves, I am not so sure I can understand photographing the naked and scared child rather than removing her from the scene.

3 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 12, 2013)

That's perhaps the most insightful response yet. Truly, the photographer should have grabbed those kids up and whisked them to safety.

0 upvotes
solarsky
By solarsky (Mar 3, 2013)

These folks (and alike!) should be prescribed SIGMA-cameras. That'd bring them down from their frenzies...

3 upvotes
Vetteran
By Vetteran (Mar 3, 2013)

Many, many photographers never intervene when any "normal" person would think that they should. Photographers who do not intervene or act think they have a higher calling to "bear witness" and spread the truth; which is B.S. I've seen it for myself at car accidents, a drowning, and at other situations where any person would feel morally and ethically compelled to do something. Instead the "photographer" just takes pictures instead of helping.

Owning a camera does not obviate the responsibility to do the right thing at the right time. Photographers are not exempt or special, although, in many cases, they think they are. A disgrace; really.

13 upvotes
Eleson
By Eleson (Mar 4, 2013)

+1 !

2 upvotes
anthonyGR
By anthonyGR (Mar 4, 2013)

While I am a person with a history of intervening to help/save people in trouble, I will have to disagree with you.

I do not know if you are aware of the "Bloody Saturday" picture, but it's an extreme case that demonstrates the point. Any normal person thinks "why on earth was he taking pictures instead of helping this baby?" However, documenting the atrocities of war resulted in the West providing significant aid to China.

I personally would have put my camera down and run for the child, because I don't have the heart to do otherwise, but I'm not sure it really is the better choice in the long run.

3 upvotes
Vetteran
By Vetteran (Mar 4, 2013)

She could have put here camera down and helped without losing any of the impact of her total body of work.

Put the camera down and do something.

5 upvotes
Spunjji
By Spunjji (Mar 5, 2013)

"She could have put here camera down and helped without losing any of the impact of her total body of work."

Helped how? I do not think this man would listen to reason and I certainly do not think he would have responded well to physical intimidation, either. You made a reasonable case at first but I'm not sure it applies well in this specific instance.

0 upvotes
Tlipp
By Tlipp (Mar 3, 2013)

You give us those nice bright colors
You give us the greens of summers
Makes you think all the world's a sunny day, oh yeah!

2 upvotes
3DSimmon
By 3DSimmon (Mar 3, 2013)

Can't be easy taking Pictures like these, I Guess documenting this type of behaviour is a weapon in itself. Not sure how i would have responded though. I think lewkowicz has done a good job.

1 upvote
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 4, 2013)

Naive one !

1 upvote
TomHudsonPhoto
By TomHudsonPhoto (Mar 3, 2013)

The selected photos above are a poor representation of Sara Lewkowicz's photo essay, which is actually pretty good.

Kudos to Sara for her bravery in sticking around. That event was what we call in tornado alley a PDS (particularly dangerous situation), and she, likely no match for the US male prison physique and temperament, made the right choice not to intervene or involve herself more than she already has (at her own risk) with this body of work.

The work itself will go a lot farther toward preventing domestic abuse than if she had physically put herself in the middle of it.

For a bunch of so-called photographers, you people are too easily distracted from the purpose and power of the photographic image.

Comment edited 13 minutes after posting
9 upvotes
TomHudsonPhoto
By TomHudsonPhoto (Mar 3, 2013)

Please allow me to retract the last sentence, for preference of the following:

May we so-called photographers not be so easily distracted from the potential use and power of the photographic image.

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

And if the woman had died?

0 upvotes
xMichaelx
By xMichaelx (Mar 4, 2013)

You hit a woman in front of me, you're about to get f-ed up. You do it in front of a kid and you might not be walking away.

My apologies for being a human above all else.

Edit: I should also add: You date a violent a-hole, you have zero sympathy from me and are utterly unfit to raise a child. But you (and the child) still get my protection.

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
Mafoo
By Mafoo (Mar 4, 2013)

"The work itself will go a lot farther toward preventing domestic abuse than if she had physically put herself in the middle of it."

Lots of documented cases of domestic abuse. Zero research that it has done anything to prevent it.

4 upvotes
Doug Frost
By Doug Frost (Mar 3, 2013)

I don't care what your job is, whether you're a photojournalist, a truck driver or a housewife. If someone is being harmed by another and you're in a position to do something about it, you do something about it. I'm not saying that she should have physically intervened, but she could at least have called the police. She could have acted as a moral human being instead of some artiste jerk with a camera whose only interest was fetishizing an act of criminal violence. She crossed a line and betrayed her basic humanity.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
7 upvotes
TomHudsonPhoto
By TomHudsonPhoto (Mar 3, 2013)

I disagree. Her work is the most effective weapon against domestic abuse she likely has to offer. Check out the entire essay.

4 upvotes
mister_roboto
By mister_roboto (Mar 3, 2013)

I agree with TomHudson 100%.

It's also not all about getting fame either, like Kevin Carter, of the infamous Sudan African baby being stalked by a vulture photo, was so haunted by what he had seen, that he eventually committed suicide. In his note: "... I am haunted by the vivid memories of killings and corpses and anger and pain ... of starving or wounded children, of trigger-happy madmen, often police, of killer executioners."

1 upvote
Doug Frost
By Doug Frost (Mar 3, 2013)

Lewkowicz's work hasn't told us anything we didn't already know about domestic violence. Nothing at all. It's not like it wasn't a crime and people weren't locked up for it before she came along. She hasn't revealed any deeper understanding of its causes, either. Her work has made no difference whatsoever. In fact, she failed to make a difference the one time she had a real opportunity to do so. She should not have simply stood by and taken pictures while it happened.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting
7 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

And other photographers have been focusino on, and documenting it, for a long time, such as Donna Ferrato.Apart from the ethical issues, what frustrates me is people talking as if this is a pioneering set of images. It isn't.

2 upvotes
mandophoto
By mandophoto (Mar 3, 2013)

Doug Frost, you are wrong and you need to read the whole post. First off, the police had already been called by the time the guy became physical. Second, many women will see these images and recognize themselves in the victim. Understanding that domestic violence is not unique to their situation is a big step in knowing there is help. Your view point completely ignores the victim's side. Furthermore, the police agreed with the photographer's decisions. It is surprising how many posters(men) here are attacking the female photographer without once considering her resolve in doing real photojournalism rather than innocuous and benign sunset, flower, baby, etc., photography, which most of us guys do.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
7 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

However, I remain interested in why she felt she needed the woman's permission to publish the photographs, and not the man's. It's arguable there are two victims here. As far as following up on the woman AFTER the abusive relationship was over, yes, there's that Ferrato deja vu again. Sure, there's more than one photographer able to shoot a subject, but the lack of acknowledgement sucks.

And, Ferrato's work has also been published in Time Lightbox. Just last year.

http://lightbox.time.com/2012/06/27/i-am-unbeatable-donna-ferratos-commitment-to-abused-women/#1

0 upvotes
WellyNZ
By WellyNZ (Mar 4, 2013)

Can't agree enough with Doug Frost. This story has no more made me aware of domestic violence than I was previously.

2 upvotes
Eleson
By Eleson (Mar 4, 2013)

"Her work is the most ..."
That's just it. It's work.
Either which way you put it, she makes a living of other peoples misfortune, making no effort in helping them.
(Some) photographers have take themself the right to not have to act. For a job.

2 upvotes
stevo23
By stevo23 (Mar 4, 2013)

I would replace "fetishizing" with "voyeurizing". There is no good argument for not intervening in some other way. It's been proven that cameras have a direct affect on the level of tension and can make situations more unpredictable and violent. To think otherwise is problematic for me.

1 upvote
williewood
By williewood (Mar 3, 2013)

Ms. Lewkowicz, thanks for getting this important and tragic topic out there.

5 upvotes
WellyNZ
By WellyNZ (Mar 4, 2013)

Yeah, because we weren't fully aware that this happens previously...

5 upvotes
skyrunr
By skyrunr (Mar 3, 2013)

Something is pretty clear to me that hasn't been mentioned yet. The photographer clearly knew what they were getting into. They should have been more prepared. Perhaps with pepper spray, a taser, knowledge of self defense, or some sort of protection. Not to mention video being a much better form of documentation for legal purposes.

Putting a camera on someone who obviously wants more attention, and is not worthy of it, only fuels the fire.

3 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

"Do you mind if I photograph your lives. What's this? Just my taser in case you get violent." She doesn't carry a taser for the same reason most war photographers don't carry guns.

Comment edited 14 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 4, 2013)

@skyrunr

I don't think it's a good idea for documentary photographers/photo journos, call them what you will, to be gathering video or anything for evidence for legal purposes as they are supposed to be merely observing.

Once they are seen to be doing that, they then create a notion that this is what journos do (i.e. become police informers) and that leads to suspicion and hostility; and in some parts of the world, journalists are now targeted directly and shot at and killed because they are seen as being not much different from the combatants the shooter is fighting against.

Just imagine if this guy goes to jail based on testimony and photos from this photo journo, other cons in jail will get the message that journos aren't to be trusted. So when the next journo wants to do a study of ex-cons they are gonna be met with rejection. Some of the best studies of criminality have come about because of the trust in and integrity of the journo (i.e. they don't reveal sources and evidence)

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
montoni
By montoni (Mar 3, 2013)

photos are not so good too

1 upvote
luigibozi
By luigibozi (Mar 3, 2013)

So nobody asks about the camera, aperture, shutter speed, HDR and things when it comes to RealityDP, eh?!
just kidding...

8 upvotes
MarcLee
By MarcLee (Mar 3, 2013)

Well, I did notice her white balance is not matching, shot to shot. And that would not have been hard to fix.

4 upvotes
mister_roboto
By mister_roboto (Mar 3, 2013)

Unfortunately, a sizable percentage of photographers/camera people are jerk faces.

Not too far from reality:
http://xkcd.com/1014/

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

Well, if he had been showing the car instead of the photo ...

The representation is not the object, and is judge-able on its own merits or lack of them. Particularly when the representation is precisely what we are discussing on a PHOTOGRAPHY forum.

Comment edited 39 seconds after posting
1 upvote
what_i_saw
By what_i_saw (Mar 3, 2013)

"In addition, she has been told by law enforcement officers that physically intervening, 'would have likely only made the situation worse, endangering me, and further endangering [the victim]'.

She might have taken the little girl away from the scene. Or would that have endangered someone in some way? Honestly I have very little respect for such photographers. Hope she enjoys her little "Sunshine" of attention.

I shudder to think what negative effect this will have on the little one. Why people have kids when they can't provide a proper home environment for them?

4 upvotes
Joe Shaffer
By Joe Shaffer (Mar 3, 2013)

She's a journalist, ethically speaking it's her job to remain a dispassionate observer.

2 upvotes
Tom Goodman
By Tom Goodman (Mar 3, 2013)

Ethically speaking? Which code is this? It may be a journalist's professional responsibility to remain a dispassionate observer but no code exists that exempts humanity. There may be a code that protects journalists from divulging sources and there may be a code that requires honesty if not dispassion when disseminating images or reports, but no code precludes acting decently.

1 upvote
TomHudsonPhoto
By TomHudsonPhoto (Mar 3, 2013)

Her work is likely the most effective weapon against domestic abuse she has to offer, and it puts her at risk. I think she was brave to stick around and keep shooting. Check out the entire photo essay.

2 upvotes
Alizarine
By Alizarine (Mar 4, 2013)

I still think proactive education on violence against women with the support of good laws is the most effective weapon against domestic abuse, not tons of "documentation," which probably has been done for almost half a century already.

And of course, if men can keep their fists from flying. But of course, jobs are jobs and for a journo documenting stuff, this is a "job."

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

"And of course, if men can keep their fists from flying."

What misandrist excrement. Can you think of any similar collective negative comment one could make about women and not be called a misogynistic pig?

0 upvotes
jj74e
By jj74e (Mar 3, 2013)

People comment from such an egocentric view these days, sure opinions and all. Some say the woman knows how to manipulate the man, others say the man was clearly a prior convict with anger issues.

How many people even looked at the full portfolio before commenting such certain speculations? Personally, it looked like they were one of those couples who had their happy moments, but ultimately couldn't stick it out because of instability.

But that's just my opinion- who's to know where the instability comes from, if it's one sided or a mutual instability. And regarding this instance specifically from the article, who knows went down at the bar, who said what and etc.?

To judge either of these people without recognizing that your thoughts are speculations and nothing more is to welcome such judgments on yourself, which I'm sure no one wants. The Internet has attracted so many bystander critics on everything.

1 upvote
jj74e
By jj74e (Mar 3, 2013)

As for the photographer, who knows. Physically intervening probably would not have benefited anyway, given the emotional state and strength of the strongest person there. Especially with children on the scene (if you look at the portfolio).

The article says she made sure that police were already on the way before intervening- if she could have verbally tried to calm the situation, and if she did try, again who knows. But even if she didn't, what would you do in such a situation? You came there to photograph and suddenly these turn foreign, tense and dangerous and your camera brain is the only part that was really alert.

1 upvote
B1ackhat
By B1ackhat (Mar 3, 2013)

So it's ok for him to hit her under certain circumstances?

0 upvotes
jj74e
By jj74e (Mar 4, 2013)

...yes, cause that's exactly what I said.

1 upvote
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

Erin Pizzey, who opened the world's first refuge in London for battered women wrote that she gradually came to realise that in many cases it wasn't about violent MEN but violent symbiotic relationships. She realised this after seeing them fight in her shelter and after one of the women bit another's finger off. For some COUPLES violence is the language of the marriage.

1 upvote
Alizarine
By Alizarine (Mar 4, 2013)

"For some COUPLES violence is the language of the marriage."

And so "50 shades of grey" was born... or something like that, :)

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 4, 2013)

I've so far seen two court cases built around "Yeah, but when I said I wanted to do "fifty shades of grey" I didn't want it to actually HURT".

0 upvotes
tonybrockett
By tonybrockett (Mar 3, 2013)

As a retired police officer, 'domestics' were the most worrying to deal with, as you could easily end up as the common target for the hyped couple, especially when you turn up single manned.

2 upvotes
beckmarc
By beckmarc (Mar 3, 2013)

Although controversial at least these photographs provoke strong feelings & thoughtful discussions. I agree with the poster below, from my professional work alcohol &/or drugs (esp speed and ice) play a big role in DV. They are great "enablers". I hope this spot light on DV helps raise awareness of DV issues - its the kids I really worry about.

2 upvotes
mpgxsvcd
By mpgxsvcd (Mar 3, 2013)

There are times when you put the job and the camera down. This is one of those times. You call the police and try to at least take the kids to the other room. If you fear for your life then you flee.

You don't stand there and take pictures of innocent and naked children in what will become the worst day of their life.

4 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

A wannabe Donna Ferrato, and hardly the first time domestic violence has been captured on camera despite all the hype. Ferrato's made a career of it. http://donnaferrato.com/domestic-violence/

Her famous sequence of Garth and Lisa dates back to 1982.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
1 upvote
MarcLee
By MarcLee (Mar 3, 2013)

I am concerned by how women hitting men is rom-com or sit-com fodder and men hitting women is "movie of the week" issue movie. Both are wrong, and once it escalates to the physical, the woman loses out and the man goes to prison. I've never hit a woman in my life, but I have had a knife pulled on me by one as were were breaking up.

Incidentally, rates of domestic violence in same sex relationships, both gay and lesbian are identical to those in hetero relationships. It's about PEOPLE not genders. The old "patriarchy" bs is just unhelpful sexist propaganda.

Comment edited 27 seconds after posting
9 upvotes
Amadou Diallo
By Amadou Diallo (Mar 3, 2013)

Some interesting comments around the choice between intervention and documentation. Arguments for both sides, obviously. But the comments about the scene being staged have somehow evolved from "Was it staged?" to "It was staged", with no basis in fact. This is a documentary project from a freelance photojournalist.

4 upvotes
FreedomLover
By FreedomLover (Mar 3, 2013)

"This essay looks at the recent re-emergence of the use of strategies of the staged photograph within the domain of documentary practices. With reference to John Grierson’s promotion of documentary as ‘the creative treatment of actuality’, and Jeff Wall’s analysis of photo-conceptualism’s reworking of ‘art-photography-as-reportage’, it is argued that the repositioning of documentary photography into the domain of art has brought with it a new set of possibilities for new kinds of documentary practices specific to the gallery. In this context, the staged photograph, deemed illegitimate or inappropriate within the traditional confines of documentary, nonetheless offers itself as a suitable vehicle for documentary’s claims to address the world in which we live and to act as a prelude to forms of social agency."
http://eprints.brighton.ac.uk/6506/

0 upvotes
FreedomLover
By FreedomLover (Mar 3, 2013)

Fakery in Wildlife Documentaries
http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/cruelcamera/fakery.html
"For instance, much of the battle footage from the early 20th century was staged"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Documentary

0 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

This guy did NOT go back to prison for "faking" it. Maybe some commenters should actually try reading the articles.

0 upvotes
FreedomLover
By FreedomLover (Mar 4, 2013)

You better believe what she writes, and think the same,
because otherwise "the problem is probably with you."
Sara Naomi Lewkowicz, feministing.com

I'm sure the career criminal volunteered to commit his crime in front of the camera just so he can go back to prison as soon as possible.

How much media interest could she have generated for this story if she hadn't managed to capture such an event ?

With The Troops: Saving Private Jessica Lynch
Another Time Magazine fraud
By Jodie Morse Monday, Apr. 14, 2003
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1004635,00.html
http://www.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,1004635,00.html
"Mission Accomplished", Four Years Later
http://www.prwatch.org/node/6005

Maybe we don't need to believe everything we read ?

0 upvotes
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 4, 2013)

There is no way a person taking pictures in this situation could not have an effect on the people.
So either it's staged or implicitly influenced.

1 upvote
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Mar 5, 2013)

FreedomLover is right in at least one very important point: we should always keep a distance between what is shown and writen, and us as homo sapiens sapiens. Never get things as given, never believe "on word"... or be ready to be dupped.

In the case of Ms Lewkowicz serie, I find strongly weird if not shady that a man known to be violent (Ms Lewkowicz described him as a fellow who spent half his life in jail) agreed to be heavily pictured committing a crime, and gave his agreement to publish these evidences at point-blank range against him too.

There is a strong possibility that WE have been manipulated (by the photographer) or SHE has been (by the pair for any reason we won't ever know).

2 upvotes
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 5, 2013)

Good point, WilliamJ.
In that very picture showing him angry one wonders why his anger should ignore the photographer.

1 upvote
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 6, 2013)

He did not give permission for the woman to publish the photographs. He did not get asked. Only the wife was.

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (Mar 3, 2013)

intervention isn't possible if one thinks one is documenting an angry discourse between a couple only to find oneself caught recording elevated conflict materializing as outright violence right in one's face. it compels one to 'complete the record' (video/photos) for sake of 'evidence', where any intervention was already too late.

such unexpected scenario demonstrates the kind of tricky rage men go through even in the face of mixed observing company that includes ridiculous machismo violence in front of others.

this is much like what is known as the 'sucker punch' (inflicted on anyone, including even an observer, not just of others; youtube is replete with such things)

sucker punch: violence you can't/don't see coming; when it happens, it's already too late (i'm sure professional paparazzi could attest to this, too)

sdyue

Comment edited 5 times, last edit 5 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Alizarine
By Alizarine (Mar 4, 2013)

there are probably lots also of girls lashing out at guys even when observers are present but it isn't considered by society as "abuse" because well, the guy can tolerate the act; he's not that "hurt," and society considers it a laughing matter.

compared to a woman getting a jab from a man. It will hurt a lot more than vice versa in most cases.

personally I think violence is violence no matter who or what gender does it.

1 upvote
Franka T.L.
By Franka T.L. (Mar 3, 2013)

Its long debated with such matters and issues. There are time and occasions where I can understand why a journalist would choose to stand on the sideline , say in war or disaster situations. But its also long held that for the part, its just pure decency for any individual who are able to effort a try to stop any harm to another individual. The photographer in this case choose a way which might be professionally sound, but humanely speaking , much questionable. Especially after the fact that there is likely chance for stopping the fury just at that. Fury but not violence. Would it effect less with the documentation, I doubt it, but surely the violence is more dramatic. So for the price of the drama we have somebodies getting beat up and another waste of police resource.

Is it worth it for somebody to get hurt ( literally and then some ) just so we can have some photo of something we dearly do not need but yet we all know about quite alright.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Gionni Dorelli
By Gionni Dorelli (Mar 3, 2013)

I ear you! But the photographer was "so nobody" before the violence. After the violence she got the chance of her life to become somebody for a few days!
You cannot stop that....!

1 upvote
PhotoKhan
By PhotoKhan (Mar 3, 2013)

A photographer joins a young couple's life to document on "the stigma associated with being an ex-convict".
She enters their life. She interacts with both the couple and their kids.
One night things turn south and violence issues, violence directly witnessed by the children, now an intimate presence, together with their parents, in the photographer's life.
It is food for thought that she favored her camera over a direct intervention with the humans she bonded with, both the offending and the small innocent ones.
I know I wouldn't.
PK

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 2 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
B1ackhat
By B1ackhat (Mar 2, 2013)

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." ~ Edmund Burke

3 upvotes
Lea5
By Lea5 (Mar 2, 2013)

I don't understand those photographers who love to shoot dramas and want to get famous with it. I had intervened, trying to cool down the guy. Doing nothing and shooting the whole drama and releasing the images would make me a fu...ng a..hole! That's my opinion.

8 upvotes
Przemyslaw
By Przemyslaw (Mar 2, 2013)

I agree.

2 upvotes
Edgar Matias
By Edgar Matias (Mar 2, 2013)

As we all know, Internet chat board posters are always the first to intervene in a fight. :-)

7 upvotes
Nate0Raid
By Nate0Raid (Mar 2, 2013)

If you intervene then you're just a friend, journalism goes out he window the second you're a factor in any situation.

0 upvotes
FreedomLover
By FreedomLover (Mar 3, 2013)

That's quite naive, Nate0Raid, most journalists get paid to propagate a certain agenda, and as many pointed out here already, this scene was likely staged.

House Approves Violence Against Women Act With Protections for Immigrants
House Democrats joined with some Republicans to reauthorize the $650 million Violence Against Women Act on Thursday. It will now go to President Barack Obama who is expected to sign it into law.
ABCnews, Emily Deruy, Feb. 28, 2013

1 upvote
Sideswiped
By Sideswiped (Mar 3, 2013)

"After I confirmed one of the housemates had called the police, I then continued to document the abuse — my instincts as a photojournalist began kicking in. If Maggie couldn’t leave, neither could I."

"The incident raised a number of ethical questions. I’ve been castigated by a number of anonymous internet commenters who have said that I should have somehow physically intervened between the two. Their criticism counters what actual law enforcement officers have told me — that physically intervening would have likely only made the situation worse, endangering me, and further endangering Maggie."

Did you even read the write of the events? They (she wasn't the only adult present) probably handled it in the best possible way.

3 upvotes
tonybrockett
By tonybrockett (Mar 3, 2013)

"Their criticism counters what actual law enforcement officers have told me — that physically intervening would have likely only made the situation worse, endangering me, " Spot on, even though natural instincts say get involved and stop them.

0 upvotes
Jay Kim
By Jay Kim (Mar 4, 2013)

I would also. But if I was 5'2" and a female as she was, I am not so sure. Also, she called the police when he started getting violent. (which is 100% right thing to do) So I think she did the best she could in such high stress moment.

Comment edited 46 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
Darby
By Darby (Mar 2, 2013)

After 30+ years as a cop in California I believe that booze, or booze & drugs, is the common denominator in such disfunction & violence. Economics, education, race, age, sex, locale are minor components.

The photographer was making an effort at objectively documenting something that 'innocents' are usually exposed to through exaggerated fiction, or second-hand recounting.

Good insight into the miserable circus.

9 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 2, 2013)

Def agree with you on the booze and drugs thing.

0 upvotes
thomasw333
By thomasw333 (Mar 2, 2013)

Yep drugs, and booze, its is true.

0 upvotes
B1ackhat
By B1ackhat (Mar 2, 2013)

Yeah cops are always really valuable sources of insight - when they're not busy bullying everyone around them.

2 upvotes
Alizarine
By Alizarine (Mar 4, 2013)

Actually we can't blame it on the alcohol, but perhaps more on people's ATTITUDE with alcohol.

Because most of the time, people WANT to get drunk and RELEASE their "suppressed emotions" e.g. sadness, frustration and things like that.

Alcohol doesn't choose to make people drunk, people choose to be... and they end up doing things they regret in the end.

0 upvotes
rondhamalam
By rondhamalam (Mar 2, 2013)

All was just an act

2 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

I doubt he went to prison for "an act".

0 upvotes
cplunk
By cplunk (Mar 2, 2013)

"Yet, she's also had to answer detractors who question whether she should have intervened."

What good do those detractors think she could have done?

Someone called the police, they showed up. What else would she have done?

It's a sad situation, but this probably isn't the first time an incident like this has happened in this relationship. And it's likely it won't be the last. He's already an ex-convict, and should be well aware of the penalties for violent behavior (regardless of whether of not he was convicted of a violent crime, he undoubtedly met others who were during his incarceration), yet he continues to behave like this.

What could the photographer possibly do to resolve such a situation? What can anyone really do?

0 upvotes
JayBratcher
By JayBratcher (Mar 3, 2013)

I agree - it's one thing to say she should have intervened, but unless she knows that she could take that guy down if necessary, she probably did the right thing by staying there - mostly out of the way - until the police arrived. Things could have gotten very ugly for all of them had she tried to stop him and failed. Besides - her just being there might have been enough intervention to keep the situation from being worse. I don't think we should be so quick to judge...

1 upvote
atlien991
By atlien991 (Mar 2, 2013)

I like that this story appeared here. It serves as a welcome reminder that while we all (to various degree) share an interest and dare I say love for photography, our views and thoughts on the real world are quite a different thing.

As proven by so many of the comments in this thread. And it also stands as evidence toward a question that has become somewhat common: where are the women photographers?

If I were a woman I might decline hanging out in internet forums of mysogynist a-holes who believe women are the cause of their own oppression.

I appreciate the poster who pointed out that while we understand that most violence is perpetrated by men most victims are also men. That point and perpective really broadens the discussion in a healthy way, I feel. In that same vein, it is important to remember that violence comes in many shapes and forms for us photographers to document and for everyone to think on (and hopefully act on). Striking a person physically is but one manifestation. And it is NOT the most common or most deadly.

Women (and frankly anyone not a white male) are subject to an economic inequality which is deadlier by far and far more prolific and widespread. In fact, it is this inequality that so often coerces women into relations with men that they might avoid if they could ensure their own economic security without the man. While I havent appreciated many of the comments in this thread, I do find the space and willingness to discuss refreshing and encouraging.

0 upvotes
hc44
By hc44 (Mar 2, 2013)

Yeah just look at the economically privileged white male above - Maggie tolerated him because she needed his weekly pay cheque?

3 upvotes
bobbarber
By bobbarber (Mar 2, 2013)

Your point about economic equality is well taken

Nevertheless, I live in a "developing" country (U.S. ex-pat), and the people in the U.S. who I hear demand economic equality for women in the U.S. are often not concerned (at all) with the huge economic inequalities between the U.S. and most of the rest of the world. They want Marissa Mayer to get a fair shake rubbing elbows with the big boys, but they don't care about the millions of people, men and women, who live within a hundred miles of me who sell vegetables and bread for a couple of dollars a day.

If you're concerned about economic equality, you're not pushing for women V.P.'s salaries in the U.S. to equal male salaries. You want both salaries to be redistributed to the rest of the world.

Martin Luther King's vision is still the standard. He wanted everybody to have a place at the table, and he phrased it that way. It wasn't, "Us, this group," etc., which is code for "Me, me, me," or if not, at least it sounds like that.

2 upvotes
atlien991
By atlien991 (Mar 2, 2013)

Wherever it is that you live, I doubt that it is 'developing'. More likely recovering or better yet, simply surviving, from economic assault of the Western world (Europe and the USA, Canada).

If you think I'm shedding tears for white American women, you've got it wrong. White women, for the most part, just want an opportunity to participate equally in white male supremacy. That isn't all of the so-called feminist movement of the USA but that sentiment definitely defines the lion's share.

As for MLK, his vision was one of assimilation into mainstream US society, not a vision I share. Many other non-whites in the US also disagree with that vision and see it as something of a nightmare. Me me me me me is what defines the USA at this point. I want no part.

1 upvote
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

In a third of domestic violence cases in the UK a male is the victim. And that does not include the children. Some research (Strauss and Gelles among others) has shown that in half of ALL cases, the woman strikes the first blow, but the man has more body strength and does more harm if he hits back. Neither gender has a monopoly on domestic violence. And I speak as someone with a male friend who put up with domestic violence for years to protect the woman's child by a previous lover, as men sometimes do. And another man whose wife bisected his liver with a kitchen knife and let their child watch him bleed on the bathroom floor. There are men who put up with a lot for the kids and do not dream of hitting back. These cases often never get to court.It's a crime of strong against weak, which is why female DV often involves children, lesbian partners, or old people. And it's virtually unpublicised.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
hc44
By hc44 (Mar 2, 2013)

Sounds like she did abandon him so why does it need be be quoted as if it's an inaccurate description of his? You don't like that characterization? Well how about when a couple go out and the man choofs off leaving her there, is he treating her well?

Then we see top left photo she's pointing her arm out while addressing him rather sternly. I suppose that is her "telling" him, but when his communication is described that is a "rage".

She is telling him to get out of the house, it's not her house!

From there it turns to crap and his physical violence is inexcusable.

They're two 'Jerry Springer' types (see below) who we laugh at on Jerry Springer, so why should we take them seriously now?

4 upvotes
GaryJP
By GaryJP (Mar 3, 2013)

I'm intrigued that so many assume his idea that the friend who took her home wanted sex with her is "paranoid". Guts do that kind of thing some time and women sometimes know what they are doing. It doesn't excuse the violence, which is ALWAYS inexcusable other than in self-defence, but it may well explain the "rage".

1 upvote
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 2, 2013)

Some caution about the originality of the story is advisable.
If it is for real - was Shane asked for consent to publish the pictures?

1 upvote
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 2, 2013)

It is my understanding that for editorial, a person's permission isn't needed. And I guess, dare i say it, he is just a guy so in this politically correct world of ours it's only the women's consent that is required and sought after (and as the woman gave her consent that's all that is required for publication). :o(

0 upvotes
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 4, 2013)

Ok, your understanding conflicts with given law in Austria, Switzerland, Germany and Italy, at least.
Bad to know that in the US and UK anybody can make a portrait of me looking stupid and publish it.

0 upvotes
StanRogers
By StanRogers (Mar 4, 2013)

In addition to the default law regarding news/editorial, you can bet that there was a contract/agreement in place for the entire documentary that would have covered this particular incident. You do *not* need image-by-image permission if there's an agreement regarding a body of work that contains the images.

0 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 5, 2013)

@bb42
To be honest, I regard the continental Europe approach as absurd beyond belief.
Here's an example of the stupidity. A "gay" guy goes on a gay rights march demanding this and demanding that. A photographer was there, and takes shots. Hey, it's a public protest in a public place right, and obviously the protestors want their voices/opinions heard? Anyway, it transpires that this particular guy is actually living a lie ........... because he is married to a woman. Woman sees husband's piccie at this gay march and all hell breaks lose. They divorce. The closet gay guy sues. And stupidly he wins. The court ruled that the image was an infringement of his privacy and that the photographer should have obscured his face (even though the images weren't of the man, it just so happens he was recognizable in amongst the protesters). This is a well known German case (well known to lawyers who specialize in privacy, defamation etc). That's a plain idiotic stance to take but then ....

1 upvote
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 5, 2013)

.......... I feel the other extreme is the U.S. approach to libel which is just nuts and allows the media to publish the most outlandish stories (that was a nice euphemism for damn lies) and get away with it.

1 upvote
bb42
By bb42 (Mar 5, 2013)

Stan, are you saying that Mr. Angry signed this agreement?

0 upvotes
Vegasus
By Vegasus (Mar 2, 2013)

I wish there is a good ending shots! Happily ever after?

Comment edited 45 seconds after posting
1 upvote
bobbarber
By bobbarber (Mar 2, 2013)

Here is data from the U.S. Department of Justice:

"Based on data from 1980 and 2008, males represented 77% of homicide victims and nearly 90% of offenders."

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=pbdetail&iid=2221

What gets lost in discussions of domestic violence is that men are not only more often perpetrators of all types of violence, but also most often the victims of violence as a whole. I imagine that if you were to look at statistics worldwide for violence, which would include war, of course, that the conclusion would be the same. Any man, who grows up pounded on the playground at school, whether he likes it or not, knows this to be true.

I think what is being expressed here, maybe not in the most elegant way, is frustration that the issue of violence in general is broken down this way. The qualifier "domestic" (artfully inserted) is often lost in discussions of violence, where women become victims of "violence", in general, more often than men, which of course is not true.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 13 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 2, 2013)

Well put.
In the U.K. the data shows that males between the ages of 15 and 25 are far more likely to be attacked violently than a female.
Yet because of one incident years ago the AA and other vehicle recovery organisations started adopting an idiotic and discriminatory policy of attending to lone women drivers before attending to males even though the males are paying the same annual fee as the women and may have broken down first and be nearer to the recovery truck.
Then there is the recent case of a bus driver who refused to allow a woman on the bus because she didn't have the money to pay the fare. It was late at night and apparently it was the last bus. As bad luck would have it, the woman was sexually assaulted after the bus left. The male driver of course (wrongly in my opinion) got pilloried by the media, the undercurrent being he should have given the passenger a free ride .............. because she is a woman and it's oh so dangerous for women at night. Rubbish!!

1 upvote
bobbarber
By bobbarber (Mar 2, 2013)

Actually, mandophoto, I'm grateful that I escaped without being indoctrinated. I sympathize with my teachers, though. It's tough when you're presented with a student that does not accept what you say just because you have a degree, or because you're a man, or because you're a woman, or because you are of the same race, socio-economic status, or share certain cultural touchstones.

Call me Joe Friday. Just the facts, Ma'am.

2 upvotes
xoio
By xoio (Mar 2, 2013)

Maggie needs to ditch the meat-head looser and get a restraining order against him.

0 upvotes
Marty4650
By Marty4650 (Mar 2, 2013)

Great photos, and a nice job documenting domestic violence... but this is pretty much like photographing a train wreck.

It will not be popular to say this, but the root cause is pretty easy to spot. When women become attracted to, and even marry defective and violent men, there is never a good outcome in it for them. But there will always be people who make bad decisions in life.

The lesson is "don't let your daughter marry a man who just got out of prison."

3 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (Mar 2, 2013)

Well, that would depend on the reason he went into prison and the country in which he was incarcerated; being incarcerated in say The Netherlands may well result in a reformed ex-con on release, whilst being imprisoned in many a U.S. prison results in a monster being released into society so bad are the U.S. prison regimes.

0 upvotes
MarcLee
By MarcLee (Mar 3, 2013)

A close relative of mine was involved with an abuser. Contrary to what you think, they don't come with a label on their head. He looked nothing like this guy, not even any prison tattoos, and was as charming as hell to her and to everyone else at first. But then his "demons" kicked in.

Comment edited 27 seconds after posting
1 upvote
compay
By compay (Mar 2, 2013)

a typical american family..living in freedom and democracy...and telling the world that a free society and democracy is all you need....to be.....really human...

3 upvotes
itsmeavi
By itsmeavi (Mar 2, 2013)

Well we all tend to forget that this is a photography forum not a social/political forum.

A generic statement about typical american family or freedom or democracy is not right my friend. I think this happens in every part of the world but i think its democracy and freedom that allow her to call police and law taking correct action.

2 upvotes
Richard
By Richard (Mar 2, 2013)

The opposite is to say it is better to live in socialistic/communistic society where there is little freedom, little opportunity, gov taking your money (freedom) away for taxes and spending it on what they want. Freedom does have downsides, it allows people to drink alcohol and get drunk, this is a problem everywhere. More so in America where it is less expensive, lower taxes, cheap gas to drive to the bar.

0 upvotes
aliminator
By aliminator (Mar 2, 2013)

The problem is that while in some other countries people lack social freedom ( society over ego/individual) but they are not afraid of each other. In America there are social freedoms ( ego over society) but people because of constant ego development become extremely competitive to each other. For example, a wife becomes competitive to a husband and treats him as a business partner. She can easily sue him or get rid of him whenever she wants without any moral regrets. This is a consumption society.

This particular case is an example in my opinion of such consumption attitude toward treating each other. I mean how this case is treated in media. It's not just about a husband abusing his wife it's how to show off your personal rights. You can't trust anybody with such egoistic mentality. Your husband or wife, your friends can easily turn into your competitors.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 8 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
MarcLee
By MarcLee (Mar 3, 2013)

"telling the world that a free society and democracy is all you need....to be.....really human..."

They never said it's ALL you need. It's just a minimal starting point.

0 upvotes
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