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Just Posted: Canon EOS 5D Mark III review

By dpreview staff on May 23, 2012 at 00:09 GMT
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Just Posted: Our Canon EOS 5D Mark III review. The 22.3MP 5D Mark III appears to offer similar specifications to 2008's 5D Mark II. However, sensor and processing developments, along with a host of user-interface revisions mean the Mark III is a much more capable camera. It also gains a greatly-improved autofocus system. So do these changes justify the considerably higher price tag? Read our full review to find out.

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Total comments: 706
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topstuff
By topstuff (May 23, 2012)

Why do people care so much about a rating of a mass produced, inanimate piece of consumer electronics?

It does not define who you are. No pride or egos are at stake.

Yet people act as if they want validation over which "tribe" they feel they belong to. Its nuts and really quite pathetic.

And there are people here who spend a great deal of their time on this world collating and manipulating data to influence opinions. As if they are trying to cure cancer or something (sdyue -i'm thinking of you..!)

Maybe they are paid to this - in which case I advise you to look in a mirror, ask yourself why. Get a better job.

It does not matter if two different cameras get the same score. DPR has delivered the verdict that they are both very good and worthy of your cash, whichever on you choose. So they have done their job.

Are you all out of your minds !?

It is sunny outside. Take a walk. Get a life. Get some perspective !

21 upvotes
Ben Raven
By Ben Raven (May 23, 2012)

Many points very well-taken topstuff,

But, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

There are also many people (not the fanboys bickering over a silly score, or knee-jerk defending turf) who read tech reviews in order to get preliminary, professionally conducted test evaluations of performance, in order to intelligently weigh that in determining the appropriate choice of the camera most suited for their desires and performance requirements, before laying down their hard earned money. (in fact, sometimes it is essential to their very livelihood, that is especially true of cams at this level)

And many of those people require SPECIFIC (NOT final score) test result information in order to make their personal judgement, and thus it is not enough for them that two same-tier cameras are OVERALL, IN GENERAL, very good and worthy - which these two obviously are.

Good as they both are (I would love to own either) they have many differences that may be critical to a potential buyer.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 7 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
rfsIII
By rfsIII (May 23, 2012)

Agreed. DPReview was what I used several years ago to decide between the original 5D and the Nikon D200. The site definitely guided me to the right choice based on what MY needs were at the time and I've never regretted the purchase. If you read the reviews carefully, they articulate the best use cases for each camera. What's not to love about this site?

1 upvote
SDPharm
By SDPharm (May 23, 2012)

> Why do people care so much about a rating of a mass produced, inanimate piece of consumer electronics?

Because it's easier to comprehend than some amorphous description of an impression.

> Yet people act as if they want validation over which "tribe" they feel they belong to.

Absolutely. Most people want to belong to a tribe, it's a natural part of people. Nothing wrong with that. Many companies spend a lot of money trying to make their employees feel that way.

What's difficult for people to understand is that 36 MP is not necessarily that much 'better' than 22 MP in the real world.

1 upvote
mgblack74
By mgblack74 (May 23, 2012)

"What's difficult for people to understand is that 36 MP is not necessarily that much 'better' than 22 MP in the real world."

Yet for the last 5 years 21 mp was so much better than 12, or was it?

1 upvote
Zerg2905
By Zerg2905 (May 23, 2012)

D800 = Rolls Royce (any model - it is the"limousine" DSLR of them all)
5DMkIII = Aston Martin (DB series = "heavy" sports car)
Luxury cars. Pricey toys. Which one will get the (a) "higher" score? Which one you will actually like to drive? Cheers! :)
P. S.: you see, some people will prefer the "Aventador" DSLR (1D-X); unfortunately, the "Veyron" DSLR was not invented, yet. A matter of taste/preferences.

1 upvote
SDPharm
By SDPharm (May 23, 2012)

+1

Personally, I can't afford either, that's why I'm only driving a bimmer (Panasonic GX1). Not too shabby, but it ain't no Aston Martin.

While we are on cars, maybe the OM-D is a Porsche?

1 upvote
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"D800 = Rolls Royce (any model - it is the"limousine" DSLR of them all)
5DMkIII = Aston Martin"

More like Ford F350 vs Chevy 3500. There is nothing luxurious or fun about them, just big and heavy machinery for hard work.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
3 upvotes
Jimmy jang Boo
By Jimmy jang Boo (May 23, 2012)

Perhaps instead of ascribing an absolute value, dpreview reviews should simply state the facts as they see them and let people form their own conclusions.

2 upvotes
mick232
By mick232 (May 23, 2012)

Canon EOS-1D Mark IV and Nikon D3S also got 89% each in Feb. 2010.

2 upvotes
Ernest M Aquilio
By Ernest M Aquilio (May 23, 2012)

I am really starting to worry about the mental state of a lot of DPR posters. Some of you need to go outside for a while.

14 upvotes
Amadou Diallo
By Amadou Diallo (May 23, 2012)

Ladies and gentlemen,
As the gnashing of teeth rage on over which is the 'better' camera, just a reminder that posts which include offensive language, personal attacks or accusations that we are being paid off by a camera company will be deleted.

19 upvotes
mick232
By mick232 (May 23, 2012)

82% just like the D800. That's what I call politically correct. No frustrated fanboys, dpreview's user base is saved!

12 upvotes
marike6
By marike6 (May 23, 2012)

Yes, and it would seem they proceeded to invalidate every future review in the process.

Have been a reader since early Phil Askey days, and this is a sad, but illuminating day.

4 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

Dear Barney, isn't it a great idea to implement a 'scoring poll' on everything a camera has to offer? This way we can all give a rating to it (1-5) and you can see online how many points a camera scores JUST FOR YOU.

DPR will generate even more visitors this way, it's nice to see your own score and other people find it interesting what the average score is. Compare all these voting polls. People just love them.

Hey, I just thought I should mention it. You've got to keep innovating online or else....

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 1 minute after posting
2 upvotes
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

They already have these, they're called "User Reviews". Look in each camera's page here. Here is the 5D3's:
http://www.dpreview.com/products/canon/slrs/canon_eos5dmkiii/user-reviews/list

Frankly I think they're almost useless. There are some honest reviews, but mostly it is people who either have an axe to grind, or people who have an inferiority complex and want other people to buy the same camera as they did.

0 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

Thanks, didn't know that but frankly it's not what I had in mind. Only clicking stars 1-5 or percentages, no comments and much more to choose from. At the end a total score and then some nice statistics about the whole thing. Now it's a hidden feature, it must be on the same page as the review. Much more people will fill it in as they read the review. Even better if you can rate features as you read the review and receive the end score as your finished.

Comment edited 29 seconds after posting
2 upvotes
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

It would be meaningless. There is no way to verify the validity or sincerity of the votes nor the skill level or credibility of the voters. Given the fact that the forums are overrun by pixel peepers and gear heads, we can be sure such a system would be worthless. At least with dpr's reviews, they have credibility and accountability.

3 upvotes
JPMontez
By JPMontez (May 23, 2012)

I also think that would be the best way to present a quantitative result for a camera. DPReview would present the scores separately for each parameter (i.e. Build quality, Ergonomics & handling, etc) and each user would define the weight to be applied to each parameter, according to his own preferences or camera requirements. The resulting score would then be a user-customized score that would give more weight to the parameters that are more important to that user.

1 upvote
Gary Leland
By Gary Leland (May 23, 2012)

I design software but I also use it. Rubenski's idea would be really great if implemented properly, (not an easy task - quite difficult actually) but for me as a user, it's benefit would not be to see what others think, but see what I think as I evaluate the short list of cameras that I am considering for a purchase. I think it would be a great asset to the review process. You could tick your own boxes as to how you work and what's important to you, and some statistical analysis could really help in your final decision.
Nice thought Rubenski.

1 upvote
JPMontez
By JPMontez (May 23, 2012)

@JackM: I think what Rubenski is proposing is not a voting system. I believe he is referring to a tool that could be made available in the conclusions page, where you would have the opportunity to calculate you personalized score giving different weights to the different parameters in the bars graphic. It would not record any information from the users or make it available to others.

1 upvote
JPMontez
By JPMontez (May 23, 2012)

@Gary Leland: I actually think it could be made pretty easily. You could just need individual scores for each evaluated parameter (provided by DPReview analysis) and a field in from of it to define the weight to give to that paramater. At the bottom you would have resulting score, which would simply be the weighted average. I have seen this very often in reviews made in car magazines.

0 upvotes
Barney Britton
By Barney Britton (May 23, 2012)

@Rubenski

Allowing readers to interact with the way in which we score cameras is something that we're experimenting with, but remember as some other readers have pointed out, you can also create your own 'user reviews', the ratings from which are displayed alongside our own, on the product's page in our database.

http://www.dpreview.com/products/canon/slrs/canon_eos5dmkiii

bb

2 upvotes
Gary Leland
By Gary Leland (May 23, 2012)

Barney,
I am excited to hear that you guys are experimenting with this. You have given me a good idea as well. I'll start my spreadsheet today, but I'll keep checkin' back for yours! :)
Thanks for all of the hard work. Your reviews are unmatched on the web. IMHO.

0 upvotes
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

JPMontez, oh I see. That would be pretty cool. But we can gain this level of understanding already by just reading the review and weighting each section in our heads. For me I basically just wanted a 5D2 with pro AF, so for me the camera scores 98%!

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

It seems to me you "borrowed" my idea from the comments earlier...
And no, user scores for individual cameras are not necessary, user-assigned weights to features (or penalties for lack of them) or even categories of features are. For example, for me it would be -10% for every fps below 10, +30% for weather sealing, -1% (sic!) for each megapixel above 8 and -20% each below 5, -1% for every mm of total length with a travel zoom, -1% for every 20g of weight above 500g (with travel zoom), -3% for every 1/3EV of DR below 7 at ISO 25,600...

0 upvotes
JPMontez
By JPMontez (May 23, 2012)

@JackM: Wow... That's a good score. You definitely should get one!:-) I agree when you say we can make the "weighted score" in our heads. That's what I usually do. The tool in dpreview's conclusion page would just make it easier (e.g. for those who struggle to decide between two cameras and need some kind of criteria to break the draw ;-)). Replacing the overall score / ranking with feature specific scores would also avoid these never-ending discussions about dpreview giving one camera a better overall ranking than another...

1 upvote
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

I have one. It's almost everything I wished my 5D2 was and more. I would give it 100% if it did 8 fps.

1 upvote
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

DPR, comparing 5D3 with D800... D800 has got lower score on "features". What features does D800 miss in comparison to 5D3?

3 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

Let's see, from the specs alone:
D800 many more resolution options.
D800 has 5:4 ratio, 5D3 does not.
D800 has 12 WB presets, 5D3 only 6.
D800 has 5 custom WB sets, 5D3 only 1.
D800 has "basic" JPEG and TIFF support, 5D3 does not.
D800 has AF assist lamp, 5D3 does not.
D800 has built-in flash, 5D3 does not.
D800 has DX crop, 5D3 does not.
D800 has up to 9 frames WB bracketing, 5D3 only 3.
D800 has MPEG-4 support, 5D3 does not.
D800 has USB 3.0, 5D3 does not.

Seems to me you pulled Canon's "features" score up by a lot, making the whole picture look very unnatural. :)

Comment edited 14 seconds after posting
21 upvotes
delete
By delete (May 23, 2012)

Probably the lightning fast fps rate of the 5DIII? :)

Comment edited 14 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
Pedro Moreira
By Pedro Moreira (May 23, 2012)

i Could also make up a list where 5d III has 11 features or more that the D800 doesnt have! :) Do you wanna bet?

7 upvotes
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

peevee, most of those items are insignificant, or useless, or both. I'd take a built-in flash though. Seems like you are not confident in your D800 purchase.

2 upvotes
mick232
By mick232 (May 23, 2012)

That was the only way they could justify the politically correct identical scores for both cameras.

1 upvote
DarkShift
By DarkShift (May 23, 2012)

You forgot also faster Flash X-sync speed 1/250s vs. 1/200s on Canon.

2 upvotes
drissised
By drissised (May 23, 2012)

ok don't buy the 5d III ...

1 upvote
Taikonaut
By Taikonaut (May 23, 2012)

Guest what they score LCD screen the same for 5DIII and D800 even though the 5DIII has better resolution and more accurate colours.

Comment edited 13 seconds after posting
2 upvotes
Stollen1234
By Stollen1234 (May 23, 2012)

these foolish tech comparsion..get out and shoot..oh i bet they never had these cameras to begin with...if they do they might use the automatic mode and jpg

Comment edited 26 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

hard to say, but the problem is that clearly they had to pad the 5DmkIII score otherwise canon fanboys would burn this place down.

2 upvotes
Mr Fartleberry
By Mr Fartleberry (May 23, 2012)

- where does that Canon GP-E1 fit on the 5DMK2.5? It doesn't? Imagine that. And a new camera too.
D800 - 2 axis level
D800 - most MP EVER in 24x36
D800 - reduced AA option
D800 - and you don't need an adapter for the 14-24 LOL.

For 500 bucks more what was it this camera did better again? Face it, this was cooked.

2 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"Probably the lightning fast fps rate of the 5DIII? :)"

This is a part of the "performance" category, which is rightfully higher for 5D3, not the "features" category, where higher score for 5D3 does not seem right.

1 upvote
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"Could also make up a list where 5d III has 11 features or more that the D800 doesnt have! :) Do you wanna bet?"

That is what I am asking for. Please go ahead. Also it would be interesting to see your personal weights for these features vs the features I listed.
P.S. I personally do not have a horse in the race. Just interested how the politically correct scoring works. :)

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"Seems like you are not confident in your D800 purchase."

I would not purchase either. For MY PERSONAL needs and weights of features (which are obviously as individual to me as to anybody), both are just terrible, although 5D3 is a little bit better.
Yet the question is not about MY preferences, the question is about DPRs scoring methodology of their "features" category.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

By Mr Fartleberry:
"D800 - 2 axis level "

Are you sure 5D3 does not have this feature? That would be strange, even $500 cameras have it.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"For 500 bucks more what was it this camera did better again? "

6 fps without crop AND battery holder AND D4's battery in it. It is significant for some (although not enough anyway for shooting sports for review, for example). Yet it is not in the "features" category, it is in "performance" category, which 5D3 rightfully won.

0 upvotes
Digitall
By Digitall (May 23, 2012)

Same score for both 5D3 and D800!? Uhmmmmmmmmmmmmm....!!!!!

2 upvotes
VJVIS
By VJVIS (May 23, 2012)

I just don't think both cameras should get the gold award. They are competing against each other and one of them has to be picked as a winner. This whole euphemistic politically correct scoring is bulls**t. DPReview needs to grow a pair of balls.

3 upvotes
JackM
By JackM (May 23, 2012)

5D3 has a 2 axis level. RTFM.

1 upvote
unknown member
By (unknown member) (May 23, 2012)

Don't know about the rest of it, but the various crop modes, resolution, and dynamic range pretty much trump everything else. But the 5DIII has an old sensor, and Canon did a good job programming a JPEG engine that could compensate to some degree. Credit where credit due. ;)

0 upvotes
marike6
By marike6 (May 23, 2012)

And you didn't even mention Uncompressed video recording via HDMI out, which is a feature that is only found on 15,000 video cameras.

2 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"And you didn't even mention Uncompressed video recording"

I think this contributes to higher "video" score (where D800 already wins), so it should not be in the "features" score I am talking about.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

Oops, I forgot UHS-I support. This is not excusable in 2012, even compacts have it. SD slot is pretty much unusable for continuous shooting without it.

0 upvotes
wwwaaronegrotk
By wwwaaronegrotk (May 23, 2012)

You are stating features wrong:

D800 has up to 9 frames WB bracketing, 5D3 only 3.

5D3 can do up to 7 frames, while it is not 9, it is good enough for almost everything.
5D3 has the 2 axis level...

DX crop...well, I do this in post when needed, not useful for me at all.

I do not know why some people just don't get their facts right.

I will get the 5DIII solely for the AF and the 22MP "small" size. BTW, someone saying about using 14-24 with no adapter...can you use my Canon 85 1.2 with no surgery?

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"You are stating features wrong:

D800 has up to 9 frames WB bracketing, 5D3 only 3.

5D3 can do up to 7 frames, while it is not 9, it is good enough for almost everything."

That is what DPRs spec page says - 3. Write them to fix it.

"DX crop...well, I do this in post when needed, not useful for me at all."

What is not useful for you is irrelevant to the discussion of DPR's "feature" rating, a feature is a feature, any feature might be useful for somebody and must be added to the rating of a camera which has it or subtracted from the rating of the camera which does not.

Comment edited 55 seconds after posting
1 upvote
BaldCol
By BaldCol (May 23, 2012)

Would it be better if reviews were posted without 'scores'? I cannot see how the scores can be consistent between even cameras in the same group let alone across different groups and cameras released at different times. Surely for anyone seriously wanting to know about the camera it is the review itself that is important, not the score.

4 upvotes
Lea5
By Lea5 (May 23, 2012)

sdyue....do us a favor and go out and take pictures!

btw you should change your forum name to ExpSim LV.

1 upvote
MP Cevat
By MP Cevat (May 23, 2012)

After spending now over 12k on glass of one system I think the which-is-better-discussion is useless with two cameras that are so close. There still seem to be people that have an 18-55 kit lens and then think they need to involve themselves with this kind of irrelevant discussions.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 7 minutes after posting
4 upvotes
String
By String (May 23, 2012)

Well said! I don't know how many threads I see that go like... Help, I just bought a D800/5D and wondering what the best WA for under $500 is?

1 upvote
panoviews
By panoviews (May 23, 2012)

The 5DMKIII and the D800 are made for different purposes. Both cameras are fine cameras, it depends which kind of photography you are doing. In my opinion the whole discussion about which camera is better is a useless discussion.

4 upvotes
zerlings
By zerlings (May 23, 2012)

I'm a 5D2 user planning to upgrade to 5D3.

I'm an amateur photographer so to me the small difference in image quality between 5D3 and D800 doesn't really matter to me.

However, there are 2 features in the D800 that I sorely miss in the Canon.

1) Built-in flash. To many professional it is under-powered and useless. But when I go to vacation and hiking I use fill-flash a lot. It is just a pain to have to bring a separate flash unit.

2) Crop factor change. D800 and D700 allows user to switch to DX mode (1.5x crop). I shoot a lot of birds and wildlife so this feature is very useful to me.

4 upvotes
unknown member
By (unknown member) (May 23, 2012)

If you do go Nikon you might find the 1.2 crop mode better for BIF. It is easier to keep the bird framed when it is close in, particularly large birds like pelicans and herons. And you still get a much smaller file to work with. Only about 24mp.

0 upvotes
AdventureRob
By AdventureRob (May 23, 2012)

The final score was a bit unexpected for me. I know you have to please the Canon boys, but the D800 is a real effort from Nikon and they should be rewarded as such. The 82% seemed fair until Canon got their 82% for taking 4 years to do minor upgrades to this.

The mk2 was a fine camera (and still is), which makes the slightly upgraded mk3 a fine camera too. But even people here who are rooting for Canon recognise it loses out in a lot of ways to Nikon this time round. It seems like Canon treated this as an annually updated camera like a rebel/xxxd series camera as opposed to the full frame flagship.

I think 82% is a fair score on balance for the mk3. But 82% on the D800 seems unjustified now.

Just to clarify I used to own Canon and Nikon dSLRs and am much more happier with my OM-D now, so my view is a balanced one. I've certainly never been a Nikon fan boy.

30 upvotes
Barney Britton
By Barney Britton (May 23, 2012)

They score the same overall because their performance and feature sets are so close. The D800 offers higher resolution, but it isn't as fast. It has a more versatile movie mode but its handling in video mode isn't as fluid as the Canon. In terms of features they're almost neck-and-neck but some of the 5D Mark III's features are more customizable/capable (HDR springs to mind).

Don't focus on the one single final number - focus on how we got there.

11 upvotes
JohnMatrix
By JohnMatrix (May 23, 2012)

Barney

Many people are surprised with the scoring because:

1) The D800 appears to score higher in 5 categories (inc jpeg IQ and RAW IQ)

2) The 5DIII appears to score higher in 2 categories (Performance and, to a lessor extent, Features)

If I look at this page we see that IQ is given the most weighting:

http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Guides/dpreview_scores_and_ratings_01.htm

This is why the "tie" score doesn't make sense.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
11 upvotes
Kane Joseph
By Kane Joseph (May 23, 2012)

@ Mr. Britton,

I've said it before but I'll say it again here: People are putting too much weight on the percentage number used in Dpreview's scoring method. This is a good reason why a review site that goes as in depth about products as Dpreview does shouldn't have the bottom line of their reviews adhere to a numerical standard. It only sets off dissidence from those who wish to dissect the minutia Dpreview's reviews are known for. Dpreview needs to revamp their chosen scoring system because of the furor we are seeing from the dissident audience who follow the logic, "I have clear evidence that one camera is better than the other, therefore anyone who disagrees with that evidence is utterly wrong, including Dpreview."

To Dpreview, I say ditch the percentage numbers all together and stick with the Gold, Silver and Bronze awards if you want a more reputable bottom line in reviews.

1 upvote
wkay
By wkay (May 23, 2012)

let's face, it the scores are completely subjective.. dpreview hasnt shown any generally accepted numerical database to quantify their results.

0 upvotes
unknown member
By (unknown member) (May 23, 2012)

Tell the truth, Barney. You didn't put numerical weights on features and coincidentally come up with 82 on both cameras. The customizable thing? Three crop modes, all kinds of bracketing. Come on. A lower res sensor that doesn't perform as well as a high res sensor. A sensor that is warmed over with software. You guys are trying not to alienate a large portion of your membership. I suppose your largest forum is Canon, so I don't blame you. But if you can't tell it like it is, better to say nothing at all.

5 upvotes
marike6
By marike6 (May 23, 2012)

@ Mr. Britton How is their feature set so close when the IQ of the D800 (DR, high ISO, color depth) is dramatically better? 3 EV DR is a huge difference. That's not close performance.

AdventureRob is correct in that Nikon releases a game changing DSLR, pulls out all the stops even offering a version with no AA-filter while Canon offers a refresh of the 5D2 with it's long in the tooth, fairly average performing sensor, and DPR contends the two cameras are equal. What does Nikon have to do, make a camera that also makes you breakfast, and does the makeup for your model?

3 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"What does Nikon have to do, make a camera that also makes you breakfast, and does the makeup for your model?"

If it can shoot 4 fps at 36 mpix, it should easily be able to shoot 10 fps in the 15 mpix DX crop. Limiting it to 6 fps and only with the additional grip+D4's battery was a dickish move.

0 upvotes
marike6
By marike6 (May 23, 2012)

@peevee1 Nikon has to leave something for the D4. They are running a business after all.

Everybody praising Canon for 6 fps on the 5D3, but nobody mentions the sensor. Is spray and pray so important?

2 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

for those unfamiliar with 'extreme low light'... or nearly so...

try starry skies and scenery lit by it alone (zero artificial light)... that's extreme

add moonlit alone to the above... that's less extreme, but still extreme

and the 'brighter' the output is of a MOONLIT STARRY NIGHT SKY and LANDSCAPE, practically matching the LOOK of a 'full sunny clear blue sky day', the longer the exposure for STILLS... the more unwanted noise (even hot pixels) creeps in... so any improvement to minimize such unwanted effects is welcome, yet RETAIN HI-DETAILS.

here is an example of 'moonlit' starry skied scenery:

Yosemite Range of Light [Shawn Reeder] 2012: 5DMkII & 5DMkIII 5K RAW - vimeo

http://player.vimeo.com/video/40802206?autoplay=1&loop=1&width=1920&height=1440&frameborder=0

(Shot at 5k in Canon RAW)
Canon 5D Mark II
Canon 5D Mark III
Canon 14L II & 16-35L II
Canon 17-40L, 24-105L, 50L, 70-200L IS

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

Others too:
The Aurora - [Terje Sorgjerd] - on older 5DMkII
http://player.vimeo.com/video/21294655?autoplay=1&loop=1&width=1920&height=1440&frameborder=0

all are time lapse STILLS combined to produce video.

if you don't have great hi-res still in such conditions, you are less flexible on creative crop-ability too.

doing strictly time lapse drawn from lower res (say 12Mp) has its limits, but can 'look pretty good' for 1080p video, but hardly breathtaking:

e.g.

Earth | Time Lapse View from Space, Fly Over (Aug-Oct 2011) | NASA, ISS - Michael König (using an older lower-res Nikon):

http://player.vimeo.com/video/32001208?autoplay=1&loop=1&quality=high&frameborder=0

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

PLUS

i PREFER also adding to the above 'extreme' low light, higher DOF, and faster shutter speeds (shorter times), for LESS BLUR for any moving subjects (including self/group portraiture within such moonlit (or just starry) NIGHT landscapes... (so stars do not 'streak' so much or at all)

now that's... pushing the limits.

Comment edited 35 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
ZAnton
By ZAnton (May 23, 2012)

Can you please stop writing/spamming?

21 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

No seriously, are you an astronaut or something? Are you really making a case for the 5D Mark III because it is better in these kind of conditions? And are you sure you're not a journalist? You surely write faster than I can take pictures.

5 upvotes
SheikYerbouti
By SheikYerbouti (May 23, 2012)

The animated time-lapse clips are amazing, especially the ones where the moonlight steeps the landscape in something that looks like cool early morning daylight with a starry sky above ... beautiful, unreal, dreamlike. I wonder if such pictures can be produced with auto-exposure on? Or is it a matter of trial & error to get the exposure right for such night photography?

0 upvotes
seta666
By seta666 (May 23, 2012)

Get a life!! ;-) Your quest to deffend the undeffendable is admirable but; do not you think it would help canon users more to tell canon to WAKE UP and do something about their sensor technology?

I also remember you defending those first whased up JPG with lots of NR on them

D800 and 5D mkII have same noise and tonal range at all iso settings, but D800 has 3 more stops DR at base ISO, more color depth all the time and 16mpx more

5D mkIII has 1/5 better DR from ISO 6400, that is what I call a low light beast

For me the sensor is one of the most important parts of a camera, same as having good film in film days.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
benipres
By benipres (May 23, 2012)

wow..sdyue..this really shows under what kind of pressure Canon is after the D800(or maybe only Canon fans!),,, are you hired also to do some Canon slides or only writing scientific articles on the forums chat...better support your articles with some pictures and stop spamming,,,,

7 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

cool, but for that work, it would be better to have an IR converted D3s/1DX as those are the real low light champions. the D800/5DmkIII are in between and not really suited for this type of thing.

0 upvotes
SheikYerbouti
By SheikYerbouti (May 23, 2012)

I guess the majority of those commenting here have never handled or used, let alone owned the Canon EOS 5D Mark III or the Nikon D800. This makes it all the more astonishing that many are voicing such strong opinions about cameras they have no personal experience with. Why do people have to get so combative and tribal over such issues? It's ok for 8 year old boys to have arguments about the fastest car. But in a grown-up (wannabe-) photographer such behavior comes across as rather childish and immature ...

17 upvotes
SheikYerbouti
By SheikYerbouti (May 23, 2012)

... contd.

Camera reviews on this web site are among the best (if not THE best) anywhere on the Internet because they are standardized and very detailed and because they are carried out by competent people. But there seem to be some who have difficulties with the complicated results of such reviews. Maybe for those who get hung up on "scores" and "percentages" a less objective but more practical review/comparison is more useful? Have a look at this 5DIII/D800 field report ...

http://www.fredmiranda.com/5DIII-D800/

... very recommended reading.

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

Except those who have hit the IQ limits of an older model, like 5DMkII, under 'extreme low light' where higher ISOs alone can address properly, a clearcut improvement in such exposure-sensitivity parameters for those shooting scenario is OBVIOUS in even preliminary, meaning, limited, testing and reviews.

Those who know and have seen the limits on the older models, are the ones who know what an improvement would look like, if improvements are clearly there 'big time' beyond the older limits, as shared by all the online tests and reviews.

a lot of us want the best of both worlds

and that also now includes both FF Cine video, as well as stills

if you don't shoot at the limits of low light, but confine yourself to relatively common 'easy moderate low light'... you will think all cameras are nearly the same, and that only Mp has improved alone.

both mfr are pushing the limits... but clearly Canon has hit the optimal sweetspot, and Nikon has opted to compromise at the 'fringes'.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

Except those who have hit the IQ limits of an older model, like 5DMkII, under 'extreme low light' where higher ISOs alone can address properly, a clearcut improvement in such exposure-sensitivity parameters for those shooting scenario is OBVIOUS in even preliminary, meaning, limited, testing and reviews.

Those who know and have seen the limits on the older models, are the ones who know what an improvement would look like, if improvements are clearly there 'big time' beyond the older limits, as shared by all the online tests and reviews.

a lot of us want the best of both worlds,

higher res 22Mp with great low noise under extreme low light at high ISOs (5DMkIII), not 'so-so' noise under semi-low light (D800)

moderately high res 18Mp (not just 16 or 12) with great low noise under extreme low light at high ISOs (1Dx), not 'so-so' low noise excessive detail obliterating NR (D4)

Ditto for Cine video not just stills combined under Xtreme lo-light

not just the best of one aspect

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

here is a 'low light' comparison of several 'leader' dSLRs... for FF Cine:

no doubt, it isn't really 'extreme low light', but the more common 'low light' that's familiar to many. note some observers commenting in the blog, totally miss the fact the lighting conditions varied due to quickly shifting light from a bar HDTV glaring on the subject off from view.

philip bloom shows strengths of 5DMkIII vs all others.
http://vimeo.com/42065372

he has also discovered 'no mods' need to output stunningly sharp FF Cine video, via a simple 'sharpening filter' applied in post (which does NOT work for the older 5DMkII). (unlike EOSHD who remove the anti-aliasing filter with zero gains over pp 'sharpening filter')

5DMkIII stunningly sharp FF Cine level video, with no physical removal of any anti-aliasing filter (which EOSHD resorted to without better results):

philip bloom (5DMkIII vs 5DMkII):
http://vimeo.com/39292404

not included is the 1Dx, which is not released yet, if not widely.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

@SheikYerbouti: thanks for the link. It simply confirms what you can read in most of the reviews. I've never owned a camera before reading a lot about it and I must say the experience in real life is exactly as I imagined when reading about it. And, the experiences are all very personal, I rather stick with facts and then decide myself what would be the best investment. DR of D800 is just amazing, high ISO performance as well, combined with loads of resolution, crop modes
etc, what else would a Canon shooter like myself want?

Comment edited 38 seconds after posting
2 upvotes
Cy Cheze
By Cy Cheze (May 23, 2012)

Nothing new. Gulliver also saw the people of Lilliput and Brobdingnag bicker over absurdities.

People often have rigid views about things they never saw or touched. Their staunchest opinions are about things they know about only by third hand hearsay or rumors. Tradition and habit overwhelm observation too.

Here's some heresy: based on pure efficiency and utility, nothing beats a dinky camera in a cell phone. Yet folks here will praise $2k beer cans attached to $3k bricks because of how the hyper-ISO photos compare blown up to pixel size, or because of how some shadowy recess in the corner of the picture appears.

Oh, the indignation...

3 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

yes well said. the soft video output isn't really fixable in post with sharpening contrary to all the above comments. you create ugly sharpening artifacts and also sharpen the bokeh which is extremelly unpleasing. you can off course mask it and add hours in post...just to achieve what comes out of the camera with the D800...the best choice fo the 5DmkIII who wants a sharp video is to remove the OLP period.

0 upvotes
Apewithacamera
By Apewithacamera (May 23, 2012)

In a nutshell, the Canon 5D III blows the D800 out of the water!!!!!

1 upvote
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

and that's why they gave it the same score :) because it is so good it didn't beat the D800 in most categories (5 wins vs 2)

I say your definition blows me out of the water too!

2 upvotes
chopsteeks
By chopsteeks (May 23, 2012)

So a $3,500 body plus mega $$$ for a prime lens is only 1% better than Oly OMD which goes for $1,650 with lens included ? Hmmm...help me with math here...

3 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

Look deep into nature,
and then you will understand everything better.
~ Albert Einstein ~

0 upvotes
Ivanaker
By Ivanaker (May 23, 2012)

Funny thing is that
D700 successor is 5Dmk3
and
5Dmk2 successor is D800

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
16 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

true enough. except off course the D700 is faster than the 5DmkIII so that would be a downgrade technically speaking.

1 upvote
wwwaaronegrotk
By wwwaaronegrotk (May 23, 2012)

Faster in what? Sorry, it is an honest question.

0 upvotes
chopsteeks
By chopsteeks (May 23, 2012)

So a $3,500 body plus mega $$$ for a prime lens is only 1% better than Oly OMD which goes for $1,650 with lens included ? Hmmm...help me with math here...

1 upvote
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

"OMD which goes for $1,650 with lens included"

$1300.
At least there is some difference at 12,800 and up visible on a picture with a human eye. Unlike between 5D3 and D800. People are totally losing perspective and sense of reality here, in this race for technical specs which are already well beyond anything practically useful.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
String
By String (May 23, 2012)

Not at all. It's a sliding scale and has to be. It's like car reviews; a Honda Civic is a fine car that may score 9/10 while a Porche 911, at 10X the price may also get a 9/10. Does that mean a Civic is as good as a 911? Probably is if all you do is pick up groceries (or take snaps of your cat).

0 upvotes
tkbslc
By tkbslc (May 23, 2012)

How many percent better is an OM-D than my $99 cell phone (which also included a prime lens)

0 upvotes
jenbenn
By jenbenn (May 23, 2012)

I have been a Canon shooter (currently 5d Mark II) all the way back to the analoge days. Still I am baffled by this rating. The Mark III has less dynamic range, worse shadow noise at low iso and similar high iso performance as the Nikon d800. Stilll it recieves the the same 82 % rating. Considering that feature wise both cameras are very close and the 5d mark III is about 500 Euros more expensive, I am truly lost. In particular since the d800 manages to achieve the samer or higher IQ as the Mark III with 14 additional MP.

Of course I will get the Mark III as an upgrade over my 5D Mark II but only because I am used to the canon user interface and I can continue using my lenses.

17 upvotes
Barney Britton
By Barney Britton (May 23, 2012)

For very good reasons we don't weight 'value' very highly in the overall score so it has little effect on the overall % figure. As far as features and performance are concerned, you're quite right that there are differences, but the 5D Mark III and D800 are very close overall - one has strengths in one area, another has strengths somewhere else.

2 upvotes
645D
By 645D (May 23, 2012)

Barney, why don't you tell us what the formula and sectional scores were to reach the final score for the two cameras? So all questions about unfair scoring will stop.

4 upvotes
MattiD80
By MattiD80 (May 23, 2012)

In past every MP leap was listed as pro (even super minor leaps of 2MP) If you get same/better Iso performance, with higher MP, it was stated multiple times in review how good it is.

Now COUNT THE D800 MP. Compare it to it's Iso performance. It's way better then my D80, 4 times as much pixels! Many reviewers seem to have come to a point to ignore megapixel/iso ratio performance. 5 years ago, if the D800 came then, you would have given is 98% result because of the tremendous leap forward. But now, what happened Dpr, why ignore this at all?

Remember the rumors of d800? Nobody believed it could give good Iso performance. Yet it does deliver greatly. But since release all of the reviewers seem to accept 'good Iso performance with high MP' as a formality these days.

TL:DR Nikon's 36MP sensor is a superior achievement (pixel/iso wise) (wich isnt stated enough imo because of the 'the pixels are there but we don't feel we need them'-hype.)

4 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

I have hit the limits on my 5DMkII for extreme low light shooting (moonlit or not at night) to which ONLY the 5DMkIII is up to the task.

All other rivals, fall short, either in resolution in such conditions (D4), or poor high ISO noise in such conditions (D800); so neither could meet my requirements of 'improvement' over my 5DMkII as the 5DMkIII solely has.

There is no other, and the closest to exceed for less noise in extreme low light at high ISOs is Canon's own 1Dx, but it has less resolution.

Canon has clearly hit the 'max' technical development for sensor 'sweetspots'.

see below

1 upvote
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

Canon has clearly hit the 'max' technical development for sensor 'sweetspots' of ANY Mfr:

D4: FF MAJOR compromise for 'low-res' 16.2Mp only; but 'good' low noise low light hi-ISO; smaller Mp allowing for 'fast-but-not-fastest' hi-cont fps.

1Dx: FF MINOR compromise for 'low-res' 18.1Mp; but 'great' low noise low light hi-ISO; AND a low enough Mp allowing for 'fastest' (peerless) hi-cont fps... imagine 18Mp fps (1Dx) being faster than 16Mp fps (D4)!!!

5DMkIII: FF Optimal 22.3Mp; 'great' low noise low light hi-ISO; and Mp allowing for 'fastest' hi-cont fps at 20+Mp, there isn't another. Any others, sacrifice something... IQ at extreme low and hi-ISOs light FOR SURE.

D800: FF 'super-high-res' 36.3Mp only; but MAJOR compromise low noise low light hi-ISO; AND compromise with so high Mp restricting hi-cont fps to unremarkable rates, even in DX crop 25Mp modes. Yes, the D800 is better, than ONLY the D700, really.

Canon hit the optimal 'sweetspot', Nikon has to settle for the 'fringes'.

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

and yes, the 1Dx, having a lower Mp (a minor compromise on resolution), allows it to have even a better low noise low light hi ISO IQ than the 5DMkIII.

and that's it.

both stand alone in the 'sweetspot' of offering what folks want depending on which is more important, higher resolution or faster fps, while still offering the best low noise low light hi ISO available by any mfr COMBINED.

those who don't mind compromising quite a bit more on one, to gain the other, can settle for 'fringe' options (D4 or D800).

never mind the fact rivals cannot match rapid ExpSim LV control for EXPOSURE DETERMINATION because Canon alone has EOS-1 dual controls.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

Dear Sdyue, you seem to be a very tech minded person. That's great because I do not now the slightest bit about what you're talking about most of the time. Can you explain me:

1. at wich ISO level the 5D Mark III is outperforming the D800 IQ wise?
2. why it is that several reviews come to different conclusions about that.
3. how do you define IQ anyway?

Thanks in advande and please keep it simple because I barely made it out of Kindergarten.

0 upvotes
Ivanaker
By Ivanaker (May 23, 2012)

Its just that D800 has better low light capabilities then 5dmk3, all the tests have confirmed it. You can post process gain ISO to match cheating that canon made in mk3.
Two great cameras, but funny thing is that d700 successor id 5dmk3, and 5dmk successor is D800

2 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

@ Rubenskit:

The question is not merely 'which ISO', but a COMBINATION of 'hi ISO' in the lowest of lighting situations, to which low ISOs couldn't be 'pp fixed' anywhere as clean and noise free.

every example of low-ISO poorly chosen and under-exposed in relatively GOOD LIGHT (none have ever shown otherwise), turn out actually worse, and quite noisy; noisier oddly, than higher ISOs.

the examples of D800 that do well, are strictly well lit conditions, even if moderately low light, hardly 'extreme' low light.

GREAT IQ in EXTREME LOW LIGHT at high ISOs, high DOF, and short shutter times, is what matters to me.

if you don't shoot like i do, you won't hit the limits, and therefore, never venture into a zone where IQ falls short SOONER (D800 or D4).

0 upvotes
TrojMacReady
By TrojMacReady (May 23, 2012)

Are you trying to make people believe that you actually tested the MkIII directly against the D800 and D4 under such conditions?
Because most people have figured out by now that you haven't.

Comment edited 38 seconds after posting
1 upvote
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

the performance of the 5DmkIII for low light is mediocre compared to the D4/1Dx. 16 vs 22MP is really splitting peanuts and non an issue. if your goals is extreme low light, you wouldn't even consider a 5DIII.

1 upvote
Makkara
By Makkara (May 23, 2012)

Hah, you really can't find camera doing better what d800 does in low light and pitch black. You can under expose 5ev and still get your scene in pp.

1 upvote
unknown member
By (unknown member) (May 23, 2012)

sdyue
You cannot be serious. If you are right, the rest of the photographic community is wrong.

1 upvote
Rubenski
By Rubenski (May 23, 2012)

The 5D Mark III makes:
1. my 7D only look better.
2. the 5D Mark II look like an absolute steal.
3. the D800 look like the upgrade we in fact needed over the 5D Mark II.
4. the D800E look like a 'medium format like' wonder machine I can only dream off.

Especially the cropping modes makes the D800 a very versatile machine, beautiful. But if you're already dedicated to a system it's too expensive to switch and the 5D Mark III is ofcourse a very good camera. (I wish I could say excellent).

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting
20 upvotes
ZAnton
By ZAnton (May 23, 2012)

Agreed.
Thanks God I bought 5dmk2 last October for half the price of mk3. For portraits, landscapes, architecture it is just the same IQ as mk3, but almost €1800 cheaper.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Josh152
By Josh152 (May 23, 2012)

The 5DIII is really baffling. Canon had to know with the success of the 5DII Nikon was going to try to give them a run for their money with the D800. Yet the 5DIII seems like it was designed to compete with the 5DII not the next generation from Nikon.

It's like canon has just given up competing with Nikon both on features and on price. As if they are saying "Hey we're Canon we don't have to try."

2 upvotes
MattiD80
By MattiD80 (May 23, 2012)

Biased review. Old reviews like the D80 clearly stated facts and comparisons nicely so a decision (consumer) is easy to make. The Mk III is barely better then the Mk II. Quite some years have passed, and yet it cost 1000$ more? And you guys give D800/5D similar price score? fail. If there's one point where 5d should be heavely discounted it's price. Here in belgium, i need to pay 700€ more for 5d. If 5d was same price as d800 i would immediatley consider it. But with this diff, it's a no go for me. Fail DP.

Also stuff like low DR on 5d (should be a con), not listed, fail. Better white balance? is this a joke? RAW = right WB since you can PP it. And jpegs canon have downsides. this this is a status quo for both.

The 7d beats the d300. (Wich makes me actually consider buying 7d). you guys are right about that. Why can't you admit the same right now, and just say the D800 (if slightly) is better. And don't give that bull 'but few people actually need 36MP'. In past you didnt use that BS

15 upvotes
MattiD80
By MattiD80 (May 23, 2012)

Yep the D800 is an incredible leap forward. Many people were surprised. So it scored! To bad the reviewers are to afraid, to 'give up on canon'. Canon aint bad, but Finally they lost ground, and nikon is on lead now. To bad they can't admit it. And why not admit it? We all know in a few years Canon might be on top again. But nikon deserves full credit this time.

9 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (May 23, 2012)

Some people want high resolution, and 36mpx vs 22 mpx is significant to them (well, a human eye has only 7 mpx and it is not possible to use all of them to look at a rectangular picture at once while keeping it in focus).
Some people want high DR, and 12EV vs 14 EV is not good enough for them (while human eye has only 6.5EV static range, so the difference will not be visible without PP so heavy as to render the pictures completely unnatural).
Some people shoot moving objects, like, you know, jumping athletes/children, and 6 fps, let alone 4 fps, is totally inadequate to capture all stages of the jumps etc.
(BTW, if Sony can get 10 fps at 24mpix in their tiny NEX-7, the 6 fps in the huge 22 mpix 5D3 is totally artificial to protect their 1D business. Not cool.)
The different priorities of different people just cannot be captured by a single number. DPR should probably add the feature to let users enter their own weights for different features of cameras and calc personal scores.

0 upvotes
armandino
By armandino (May 25, 2012)

Flipping up and down a full frame mirror has technological challenges and costs not to be underestimated. There is for sure some level of protection of the higher end cameras, but hey, it is still the only 22 MP FF @ 6fps on the market now. And still almost @ half of pro bodies price.

0 upvotes
Mr Fartleberry
By Mr Fartleberry (May 23, 2012)

Exactly the same rating as Nikon? In spite of being 500 bucks higher priced? I call BS on this.

Third Generation 5D and they're still having to improve build? Was the first 5D a Rebel? LOL Canon. Go figure.

5 upvotes
renault5
By renault5 (May 23, 2012)

Did I miss something? Sorry, I was out taking pictures

7 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

"The 'During DOF preview' option is new on the EOS 5D Mark III."

No it's not new, 5DMkIII has always had at the outset.

This works in M/Tv/Av/P; anything that alters Aperture, whether Manually or Automatically, will offer a shift in DOF, thus if opting to press the DOF Preview button, DOF is shown while ExpSim is also shown (an 'exp sim' in 'stop-down' position), albeit more accurately (real aperture diameter affects not just light, but contrast too).

What folks don't realize, is that ExpSim LV normally w/o stop-down of Aperture diameters chosen, shows the 'what if' ExpSim if the Aperture were stopped down even if not stopped down.

Thus, there are actually TWO modes of ExpSim LV in effect, on where:

1) Aperture IS NOT stopped down (default)
and
2) Aperture IS stopped down (DOF preview)

'Stopped down' mode actually has less to 'sim' since incoming light already covered by aperture all that's left is ISO and speed to 'sim'. The latter mode 2 is what PowerShots always had, or ES-LV.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Ivanaker
By Ivanaker (May 23, 2012)

sdyue honey, whats with you and ExpSim? That is a nice thing, but who really shoots DSLR or SLR in live view? 1% of the photographers? less?

2 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

This explains why so many, like DPReview, have tended to downplay Canon's ExpSim LV (EOS dSLRs) and ES-LV (PowerShots)... they have a bias against it... or so oblivious to it, they don't really look at it nor understand it, or... worse not use it.

They had thought even PowerShots didn't offer 'exposure simulation' live view (ES-LV) for over 6 years (2000-2006), when they had it the whole time, and only listed 'Yes' for mere LV in the last 5-6 years.

Even now, 2007-2012, they STILL don't make any distinctions between 'exp sim' and totally non-simmed 'autogain' versions of LV, or modes on their 'database' listing of 'LiveView', and relegate the distinctions only to 'Yes/No'; which hardly does justice to it; after all, it's been around as long as the 20Da (ExpSim LV), if not 1DMkIII/1DsMkIII/5DMkII/40D, and at least PowerShot G1 (2000 for ES-LV).

Most 'digicams/dSLRs' do not offer ES-LV/ExpSim LV whatsoever even when they DO have mere 'LV'.

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

Most over-emphasize older film era TTL metering, which is hilariously inefficient, and less accurate, and slower.

Yet, most neglect ExpSim LV for exposure determination (in case you don't know what its for).

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

@ Ivanaker...
what's with you???
Who STILL determines EXPOSURE with TTL metering sensors?

Easy, film SLR users, and NON-LV users, and non-ExpSim LV users... the ones that LACK it altogether. This includes those who ONLY have 'hand light meters', too.

Who said ANYTHING about 'Exposure Determination' (old TTL light meter reading film era version or newer ExpSim LV digital era version) being a SHOOTING mode? Not me. Only you presume it.

I shoot 100% with an OVF (light permitting).

For 'exposure determination' (this isn't 'shooting' y'know... in case you don't know):

1) I use TTL light metering sensor reading 0% of the time even in Full M.

2) I use ExpSim LV full image sensor real-time evaluative 'metering' 100% of the time especially in Full M/M-ISO.

I only resort to ExpSim LV or 'Autogain' LV for SHOOTING, if light is IMPOSSIBLY TOO LOW for OVF. (that's a given) If you can't see in the dark optically... LV does it for you.

0 upvotes
Sdaniella
By Sdaniella (May 23, 2012)

This explains why so many Canon shooters spend 99-100% shooting (yes, OVF, like me), and nearly 1-0% doing 'any' light metering determinations... why spend 'any' time if EXPOSURE DETERMINATION which is the EASIEST aspect of DIGITAL PHOTOGRAPHY to GET PERFECT FIRST TIME RIGHT INSTANTLY?

The only folks even 'discussing exposure issues'... are those STILL fiddling with TTL meter sensor readings... seriously. Look at their forums where ExpSim LV isn't available, or unutilized at all (if having it).

In case you do not know... Canon's R-G-B/Luminance LIVEVIEW Histograms are a mere 'subset' translation directly from the IMAGE SENSOR.

ExpSim SHOWS you the IMAGE 'actual look' PREVIEW which is MORE info in real time than a mere 'real time' Histogram can, which is confined to strictly a 'graph'.

And in case you don't know... Digital CInematographers also RELY exclusively on ExpSim LV far more than mere R-G-B histogram graphic displays.

Anyone can 'ETTR' using ExpSim LV w/o histograms, too.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
DarkShift
By DarkShift (May 23, 2012)

@Ivanaker

Landscape, buildings, interior, products are so much easier to focus and compose with the help of live view.

Especially accurate focusing with manual focusing wide angle lenses is pain through an OVF. In dark lighting it gets really dark too. LV is much more accurate, which is like electronic ground glass for me.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Ivanaker
By Ivanaker (May 23, 2012)

So, you go to live view, set exposure manual depending on what you see on that lcd, then you go back to VF, frame, focus shoot?
Or i get something wrong?

0 upvotes
DELETED88781
By DELETED88781 (May 23, 2012)

sdyue: You need to buy a dog

Comment edited 26 seconds after posting
11 upvotes
BillFe
By BillFe (May 23, 2012)

sambomax: Too funny.

0 upvotes
Zerblatt
By Zerblatt (May 23, 2012)

ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV ExpSim LV

4 upvotes
Visualiza
By Visualiza (May 23, 2012)

How about we just get rid of scores, numbers, and bars altogether? The content of the review is whats important anyway, yet here we have over 200 comments of people bickering over what camera got a higher number in a given category. Scores, stars, percentages...we need to give up the ghost on this stuff. All it does it cause commotion.

3 upvotes
cgarrard
By cgarrard (May 23, 2012)

How about people act like adults and be confident in their purchases instead? DPR should have an opinion and a final score is an opinion- otherwise they ought to change their name. :)

1 upvote
Stollen1234
By Stollen1234 (May 23, 2012)

nothing wrong with bars..scores and numbers..it gives you an idea about a product...

these things should be done by independant testers and reviewers.

Dpreview is a commercial website with a commercial agenda..

i would just read the content of this review..take a look at fotos...test the camera at a store..and make my own decision

0 upvotes
tkbslc
By tkbslc (May 23, 2012)

The scores are a good way to keep all of us bickering all day and generating massive page views for advertising. It's a conspiracy, man....

0 upvotes
cgarrard
By cgarrard (May 23, 2012)

Almost all DSLR's since 2006 have been awesome photographic tools. 5D MkIII is yet another example of progressive development that works well and keeps up with increasing demands (even though the leaps are smaller and smaller). The D800/E are the same thing for Nikon shooters. Great review as always boys, time for a pint since this one is published now :).

-C

p.s. I just went out and bought a like new original old moldy 5D yesterday, back into FF digital photography again. Sold my A900 years back. Couldn't be more excited. Adopters of the 5D MK III and D800/E should be much more excited than me it would seem...

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
Dimitris Mitrovgenis
By Dimitris Mitrovgenis (May 23, 2012)

The thing that caught my attention was the reaction of some Nikon shooters,they act like the world disappeared under their feet.
One question for them.Ok Nikon is better,are you know a better photographer?Can you sleep better at nights?Will you visit the DPreview forums now that they decided that the cameras are equal?

This is waste of time and time is so valuable these days!!!!!!

Either camera will not make anyone better photographer.

Do you want a camera that will take frames without the photographer?
That will be the ultimate camera for gear heads.

I don't want the perfect camera.I enjoy the limitations because I like challenges.(think of that again)
Regards Dimitris

2 upvotes
cgarrard
By cgarrard (May 23, 2012)

"I enjoy the limitations because I like challenges."

Well said,you're a glass is half full kind of guy :).

C

1 upvote
Dimitris Mitrovgenis
By Dimitris Mitrovgenis (May 23, 2012)

Thanks :)

0 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

I have seen no nikon shooter react like that? why would they? for 2200 dollars they can get a 8fps capable full frame body with D3 AF system. and if they don't care about MP, 22 vs 12 ain't going to matter. :/ just saying. the world still there.

0 upvotes
Stollen1234
By Stollen1234 (May 23, 2012)

numbers are of course meaningless..but still the final score 82% will have an immense psychological effect..especially because this is a very expensive camera.

0 upvotes
jackpro
By jackpro (May 23, 2012)

thanks for the review. i would love it if you shot different skin tone under diff lighting conditions for wedding & portrait shooters that would be interesting!

0 upvotes
Superka
By Superka (May 23, 2012)

I don''t understand why Canon 5D M3 is compared to Nikon D800. They are really different cameras. Canon 5D is better for people, Nikon D800 for landscapes.

3 upvotes
tkbslc
By tkbslc (May 23, 2012)

You truly don't understand why two full frame cameras in the same price category from competing brands are compared to one another?

1 upvote
Zyankarlo
By Zyankarlo (May 23, 2012)

...never interested in the CANONs because there are more excellent lenses from NIKON - the NIKKOR 14-24mm alone is a good example!
BUT: When does the NIKON D4 review appear here? I guess the D4 will get a score of 90% because the D3s got 89% ;-)

0 upvotes
zuohong
By zuohong (May 23, 2012)

how about EF135f2 and 70-200f2.8 MII?

0 upvotes
George Veltchev
By George Veltchev (May 23, 2012)

D4...90% ...

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
George Veltchev
By George Veltchev (May 23, 2012)

Well...yes indeed ....the top of the range Nikon D4 ...it will be quite interesting especially after its main competitor the Canon EOS-1D X has been awarded as the BEST DIGITAL SLR PROFESSIONAL for this year :)
Have a look here: http://www.tipa.com/english/award-details.php?iId=3045&sAward=Best%20Digital+SLR+Professional

1 upvote
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

"how about EF135f2 and 70-200f2.8 MII?"
nikon has both. :|

0 upvotes
tkbslc
By tkbslc (May 23, 2012)

Both brands have some unique lenses, but overall the kits are nearly identical.

Can has the MP-E macro, f1.2L primes, 8-15mmL that are unique.

0 upvotes
dannyboy5400
By dannyboy5400 (May 23, 2012)

We are at the point of diminishing returns. These differences are fairly minor and not that noticeable. All this bickering is silly. Starting to remember why I stopped posting on photo forums. Once my cameras get shipped I will not be here posting for a while.

8 upvotes
Stollen1234
By Stollen1234 (May 23, 2012)

its a good idea to go out shooting.

1 upvote
dannyboy5400
By dannyboy5400 (May 23, 2012)

I love my Nikon and Canon gear but here is how it breaks down for me. I plan on getting a D800 for landscape, nature, product shots. 5D Mark 3 will do the portrait, fashion, wedding and video work. Why? Because Nikon tonality for skin takes me way to long to make look acceptable. I am willing to pay the price to have my gear be more specialized. If you can't afford it, pick one or the other and I am sure if you are any good then you can shoot great shots.

2 upvotes
Superka
By Superka (May 23, 2012)

Nikon always had problems with colors.

2 upvotes
Caleido
By Caleido (May 23, 2012)

I don't understand "Nikon has a problem with skintones".

You only shoot JPEG?

2 upvotes
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (May 23, 2012)

I own both. Nikon does not have a problem with colors. Canon colors are more punchy, which a lot of people prefer.

0 upvotes
LSE
By LSE (May 23, 2012)

actually the D800 has more tonal range, but if you can afford both, more power to you :)

0 upvotes
tkbslc
By tkbslc (May 23, 2012)

Money aside, logistically that's a bad plan. You are going to have to have backup gear for both brands, all kinds of spare batteries, different flashes, two full sets of glass. Not too mention working out different kinds of post processing for the different sensors. People can make more money, but they only get 24 hours in a day.

1 upvote
Nikonworks
By Nikonworks (May 23, 2012)

82%?

With all those 'Cons"?

Where are the reviewers?

We don't need publicists.

A real disappointment.

Now I have to take the time to read in-between the lines.

2 upvotes
Javier CR
By Javier CR (May 23, 2012)

All those Cons? Did you see the list in D800?

2 upvotes
dgc4rter
By dgc4rter (May 23, 2012)

Hmmm! The exact same score as the D800? That's rather convenient isn't it? DPR can avoid all the fall-out from the CaNikon fanboys if they'd scored one above the other now.

3 upvotes
Barney Britton
By Barney Britton (May 23, 2012)

We don't scare that easily...

2 upvotes
Louis_Dobson
By Louis_Dobson (May 23, 2012)

Well, I have no dog in the fight - I got rid of the D3 for an OM-D.

But I'm baffled by the review. Look at page 23 - feeble sensor DR (as picked up by DxOMark). So this camera is a one trick pony - low noise at high ISO. Who wants to carry around a brick to get that? Wedding shooters. And a very high proportion of wedding shooters want their shots out and paid for with minimal PP, which means JPG. The camera's other weakness? The JPG engine.

So it's not really terribly good, is it? It's only good at one thing, and in the end it isn't very good at THAT either.

Nonetheless it will sell well, because people are foolishly obsessed with using "what the pros use". If they bought their cars the same way they'd have delivery vans and taxis.

Me, I'd like a D800, but the OM-D is too good to justify having both. This, I'd not touch thanks, unless I decided I wanted to shoot weddings and couldn't afford a D4.

14 upvotes
Plastek
By Plastek (May 23, 2012)

None of the wedding photographers I know shoot JPG.

10 upvotes
iBuzz
By iBuzz (May 23, 2012)

Mmmm!!! I never saw pro racing driver using vans and taxi at NASCAR or F1...

0 upvotes
carrigman
By carrigman (May 23, 2012)

Wedding photographers shoot jpegs? Not in my neck of the woods.

0 upvotes
Superka
By Superka (May 23, 2012)

OM-D?????? Ha-ha-haa!

1 upvote
Louis_Dobson
By Louis_Dobson (May 23, 2012)

Assuming one does not need high ISO (and I don't - I've no interest in weddings on any level), what is it that the OM-D doesn't do you'd miss so much?

I'm very pleased with it myself - so pleased I'll be selling all my Nikkors because another Nikon FF just seems an expensive indulgence.

Anyway, back on topic, I find the game-changing D800 and this dull one trick pony getting the same score remarkable.

Seems nice for wedding photographers who use RAW, great. Now back to proper photography...

No, F1 and NASCAR drivers don't drive taxis. But they are a tiny proportion of professional drivers. Just as people creating great art are a tiny proportion of professional photographers. The great mass of photographers turn up on a Saturday to record dull people lying to each other in bad light - a perfectly honourable and respectable way of making a living, but certainly not what most of us want to do with a camera, and it requires a rather different camera to anything I'd want to own.

7 upvotes
R Vaquero
By R Vaquero (May 23, 2012)

Many of the best wedding photographers shoot JPG. In fact shooting RAW in a wedding has little sense, unless your technique is not that solid...

4 upvotes
rjjr
By rjjr (May 23, 2012)

My son works for one of the premier wedding photographers in the Mid-Alantic states...they shoot only raw. He shot 2 last weekend and is booked solid for weekends through December.

He's also worked free-lance as a second shooter for a couple of other wedding photographers in past two years, all they want is raw.

0 upvotes
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (May 23, 2012)

Since you have no dog in the fight why bother reading the review? I ended up getting both. Broke, but I spend no time at all trying to convince myself I made the right choice as you are doing with your new Olympus. Once you've used and examined the results from the D800 and the 5D3 you'll realize they are both excellent cameras.

1 upvote
Louis_Dobson
By Louis_Dobson (May 23, 2012)

Intellectual curiosity. I borrowed a D800 for a few hours and shot some of my trademark seascapes with it. A very impressive camera - I seriously intended to get one to go alongside the OM-D, but the OM-D has much more DR than I expected, so I just can't justify the cost. The D800 is a total game changer though - the resolution with the lens open is amazing - I used my 105 f2 DC on it and was blown away, and there is plenty of latitude for heavy PP. There has never been a non MF camera like the D800, it is truly special. By comparison this is just another clunky Canon wedding cam with good high ISO and flaky DR. Expensive too.

Or so it seems to me...

Comment edited 54 seconds after posting
1 upvote
Dave Oddie
By Dave Oddie (May 23, 2012)

Sony A77 review:

"However, the somewhat mushy JPEG image quality, high noise levels and slightly laggy operation stop the A77 from getting a gold award. "

Silver award.

EOS 5 D MkIII conclusion:

"Destructive noise reduction results in mushy JPEGs, even at base ISO"

Gold award.

Show some consistency DPR or lose credibility.

19 upvotes
Parappaman
By Parappaman (May 23, 2012)

Do you see any mention to laggy operation and high noise levels in the EOS 5D MK III review?

4 upvotes
Plastek
By Plastek (May 23, 2012)

JPG engine isn't everything. Actually: It's one of least important parts of camera.

2 upvotes
TrojMacReady
By TrojMacReady (May 23, 2012)

@Parappaman:
High shadow noise levels at base ISO, see page 23. Which leads to almost a stop and a half less DR than say... an APS-C A77 WITH fixed mirror (extra half a stop light handicap).

4 upvotes
JimmyMelbourne
By JimmyMelbourne (May 23, 2012)

Laggy operations resolved in Firmware 1.05

2 upvotes
Barney Britton
By Barney Britton (May 23, 2012)

@Dave - because it's that simple, obviously. I like to think that our credibility is established through the 30 PAGES of content that lead up to the final % score.

1 upvote
Dianoda
By Dianoda (May 23, 2012)

Barney, it's a shame that you and the rest of the crew have to deal with this garbage slinging contest every single time a review is posted. Thank you for providing said 30 pages of content, it is tremendously useful and much of it unique to DPReview reviews.

2 upvotes
derfla1949
By derfla1949 (May 23, 2012)

Being an amateur I cannot afford to buy into a system end costing me a 5 digit number. So I see reviews of these high end DSLRs in a very relaxed way.
I was impressed by what a Nikon D800 can do, and I am equally impressed by this Canon. Technically, these tools are phantastic. The difference between 82% and 100% are minor quibbles.

But:
Last sunday I was on a celebration (60 yrs married). Some guests shot some photographs with BIG cameras. I a lot with my unobtrusive little one. Guess who will be applauded for a nice album showing naturally looking, merry people.

Measuring changes the object measured, if you know what I mean.

When you pick up your girl for a date, do you appear with nice sports car or with a tank?

FF is sure important for professionals. For me as a poor amateur it is more a source of ideas what would be technically posible even without a large sensor. I am looking forward to more and more of these things being implemented in consumer price level cameras.

1 upvote
BeanyPic
By BeanyPic (May 23, 2012)

Oh Dear Nikon Fan Boys are heart broken that the EOS 5DMkIII did rather well. Just shows size doesn't always matter. I'm sure that the sensor argument will roll on anyway.
At least we have to great DSLR's on the market. Well done Canon & Nikon the D800 and EOS 5DMkIII are great cameras for people who know how to take photographs.

1 upvote
Jahled
By Jahled (May 23, 2012)

Sweet! Nice camera Canon, basically just I wanted from my 5D2s. One might be one if I have penny's left after my 1DX, and I finally whiry of my 1Ds3's horrible LCD screen

0 upvotes
theglovenor
By theglovenor (May 23, 2012)

i own two Nikons and i have to say that Canon make GREAT cameras too.
as do olympus,pentax,sony,etc use what you have got and dont go all technical spec sheets....

3 upvotes
ZAnton
By ZAnton (May 23, 2012)

if everybody makes great cameras what are you doing here? what is the sense of all reviews?

0 upvotes
BobYIL
By BobYIL (May 23, 2012)

Tie despite of the revolutionary state-of-art DR and the MF-class IQ ???

Tie while the Canon users wishing to have something like the D800/E ???

Tie in spite of the waiting lines outside indicate the choice of logic???

These point to where you are "tied" to DPR...

Comment edited 45 seconds after posting
5 upvotes
draculavn
By draculavn (May 23, 2012)

watching the two sample photos, it's clear that 5d mark III beats d800 in terms of color tone, white balance and contrast. These issues make a photo.

The Dpreview call destructive noise reduction doesn't make sense because we never see it or face it at daily photography. Only nikon boys consider it a lifebuoy to catch when drowning

2 upvotes
Roberts_J
By Roberts_J (May 23, 2012)

draculavn: "...5d mark III beats d800 in terms of color tone, white balance and contrast"

The same conclusion here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W9EeDCaVFM&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLABFD708730338F96

0 upvotes
draculavn
By draculavn (May 23, 2012)

No need to go anywhere. We see the sample photos and decide ourselves which is better. In my opinion, 5D mark III is much superior than d800

0 upvotes
Javier CR
By Javier CR (May 23, 2012)

The last part of the video Robert posted before says it all. That's a real action test and when comparing both pictures I was surprised that the absolutely best photo is the Canon's one (I thought at the beginning it was the Nikon's). Good test Roberts_J.

None so blind as those who will not see.

0 upvotes
DarkShift
By DarkShift (May 23, 2012)

RAW samples from DPR and Imaging Resource clearly show that at lower ISO values D800 has higher DR on both ends and much lower shadow noise with superior detail than any Canon camera. It has much more headroom for PP.

Time to say goodbye to Canon, sorry ;)

Comment edited 18 seconds after posting
1 upvote
Danlo
By Danlo (May 23, 2012)

I just wonder where the D800 reviews are with images shot by proffessionals and not by amateurs using jpeg and show "their best" with blown out highlights..

1 upvote
Sirluke
By Sirluke (May 23, 2012)

In the "Noise and Noise reduction" page I've put on the Pentax K-5 (or the Nikon D7000) to see how they compared in raw and I was very surprised to see them in line with the full-frame big brothers or even beating them (K-5).
Is there really the need to carry huge, heavy and expensive equipment to make great photos today? I don't think so!

4 upvotes
ET2
By ET2 (May 23, 2012)

K-5 uses RAW NR at ISO 3200 and up

http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Publications/DxOMark-Reviews/DxOMark-review-for-Pentax-cameras

Also, the full frame cameras all have higher MP. If you down sample them to 16 MP, the noise will be lower than D7000

2 upvotes
photo nuts
By photo nuts (May 23, 2012)

Agreed! The only area where large sensor really wins is depth of field. It is also the only differentiating factor.

2 upvotes
Sirluke
By Sirluke (May 23, 2012)

K-5 noise is lower also below 3200, and the 5D is "only" 22MP, so there's not much to downsample.
The point is if the 3x price justifies the added performance, factoring in also the bulk and the weight.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
ET2
By ET2 (May 23, 2012)

When K-5 and 5D Mark III are both down-sampled to the same size, ISO 1100 on K-5 and ISO 2200 on 5D III has equal noise, according to dxomark. That is, 5D Mark III is exactly one stop better at equal size. I will take dxomark words over yours

0 upvotes
Sirluke
By Sirluke (May 23, 2012)

ET2, read carefully!
I did not say that APSC is better than full frame, but that they are much closer in performance than they are in price and size.
If some camera maker will be able to put full frame tech into a small body than it will make a difference.

0 upvotes
sir_bazz
By sir_bazz (May 23, 2012)

@ET2

The K-5 looks better, (on the DPR graph at least), at all ISO's in all channels.

Agree that both the D800 and 5D MkIII show the advantage of more megapickles.

0 upvotes
Jonathan Lee
By Jonathan Lee (May 23, 2012)

Sirluke,

k5 is a fine camera and I like look of the out of cam jpeg from it. the af speed from k5 is hard to compete w/ 5dm3. it is like on caffeine. :)

0 upvotes
Total comments: 706
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