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Canon update for EOS 5D Mark III to offer uncompressed HDMI output

By dpreview staff on Oct 23, 2012 at 15:16 GMT
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Canon has announced it will be releasing a firmware update for the EOS 5D Mark III that will provide uncompressed HDMI output for videographers. It will also enable autofocus using lens / teleconverter combinations with an effective aperture of f/8, using the camera's central cross-type AF points in a similar fashion to the recently-released EOS-1D X Firmware 1.1.1. However EOS 5D Mark III owners will have to wait until April 2013 before the new firmware becomes available.


Press release:

NEW FIRMWARE UPDATE FOR CANON EOS 5D MARK III DIGITAL SLR CAMERA PROVIDES UNCOMPRESSED HDMI OUTPUT SUPPORT AND IMPROVED AF PERFORMANCE

LAKE SUCCESS, N.Y., October 23, 2012—Canon U.S.A., Inc., a leader in digital imaging solutions, today announced a new firmware update for the EOS 5D Mark III Digital SLR camera that significantly improves the camera’s performance and usability. In response to requests from professionals working in the fields of cinema and television production, the firmware update enables the use of uncompressed HDMI Output support, making possible more efficient video editing and monitoring procedures. Additionally, the upgrade supports the advanced needs of photographers through improved AF performance when capturing still images.

Uncompressed HDMI Output Support

When shooting video, HDMI Output makes possible the recording of high-definition uncompressed video data (YCbCr 4:2:2, 8 bit) from the EOS 5D Mark III to an external recorder via the camera’s HDMI terminal. This, in turn, facilitates the editing of video data with minimal image degradation for greater on-site workflow efficiency during motion picture and video productions. Additionally, video being captured can be displayed on an external monitor, enabling real-time, on-site monitoring of high-definition video during shooting.

Improved AF Functionality

Even when the EOS 5D Mark III is equipped with an extender and lens making possible a maximum aperture of f/8, the firmware update supports AF employing the camera’s central cross-type points (currently compatible with maximum apertures up to f/5.6). Accordingly, the update will allow users to take advantage of AF when shooting distant subjects, benefitting sports and nature photographers, particularly when using telephoto lenses.

The new firmware update will be available, at no charge, in April 2013 from the Canon U.S.A. website and can be downloaded by end users or through Canon Factory Service Centers.

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Comments

Total comments: 127
5DMkIII Shooter
By 5DMkIII Shooter (Feb 22, 2013)

I wonder id Canon will release a similar Firmware update for the 7D to enable it to AF with a converter at apertures smaller than 5.6. I mean the 7D also has a more updated and sophisticated AF sensor than the 5DMkII had.
I wonder where one can put such a request to Canon JP

0 upvotes
Aperture Creations
By Aperture Creations (Oct 27, 2012)

If Canon was WISE they would NOT wait so long for this software update. The changes are not that paramount that it takes 6+ months.

Side Note:
Bring the W-T MA adj. to the 7d !!!! They should have done with it with the big 2.0.X update.

I just say'n.

0 upvotes
Kodachrome200
By Kodachrome200 (Oct 26, 2012)

my question is if the hardware is capable of uncompressed hdmi why didnt it do that to begin with

3 upvotes
nikhilnh
By nikhilnh (Oct 29, 2012)

That exactly is my question too. They like to nickle and dime for everything. Even now, I think Canon hasn't willingly promised these new features. They have done this just because the competition has these features. If these features weren't available on Nikon cameras in the same category I don't think Canon would have added these features.

Comment edited 11 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

The video that these line-skipping Canikon DSLRs produce is pretty bad, with beaucoup of moire. And even if you output a clean HD signal via HDMI with them, it will still be a line-skipped video that you are recording externally. I would think a $600 Panasonic G3 will record superior video to what one of these Canon or Nikon DSLRs can deliver.

0 upvotes
franciscan
By franciscan (Oct 25, 2012)

That's what I'd like to see. I've seen lots of tests about these cameras. But I haven't seen any video showing the result of a clean HDMI output.

0 upvotes
BeanyPic
By BeanyPic (Oct 26, 2012)

Are you completely bonkers. I've used the 5D MkIII for video and the Pana G3. There is no comparison to make as the MkIII trashes the G3.

0 upvotes
John Koch
By John Koch (Oct 25, 2012)

Uncompressed = huge files, additional (and heavy) capture device, and zero net advantage after compression to 5mbps for Youtube. Most people (even enthusiasts) need uncompressed video about as much as they need an F-18 instead of a Corolla, to raise their own carrots, make their own tissue paper, or to write assembler code. The additional work and requisite ancillary tools far outweigh the advantage. Several software products allow import and edit of h.254 MOV or AVCHD files without intermediate transcoding. Decompressed video editing is really only relevant to Madmen: the people who edit 10 second ads that require complex overlays and effects, use advanced work stations, and have numerous other people to handle the 10 other post production steps.

1 upvote
NDT0001
By NDT0001 (Oct 25, 2012)

Clearly, you are an amateur photographer, which means that these features will be of no use to you. However there is an entire industry which uses this camera for making films, and they will find 4:2:2 an indispensable feature.

Comment edited 11 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

@ NDT0001: People who find 4:2:2 chroma subsampling in video "indispensable" are probably already shooting 4:4:4 video in the first place. 4:2:2 chroma and 8-bit color video is really not all that good for image quality, you know. Add to this the fact that there is some wretched line-skipping going on to arrive at the HD resolution in the first place, and with our without the firmware upgrade promised for sometime next year, a Canon 5D Mark III or similar DSLR might not be your ideal tool in the first place for video. It's not even marketed as a video camera, after all.

Also, consumers will soon demand to watch everything in Ultra-HD 4K resolution, so for now and particularly for the near future, there is precious little reason any more to shoot old fashioned 1080p HD video any more. Once Canon upgrades its firmware to permit the 5D Mark III to shoot true 4K video (without line-skipping), it will be really something.

0 upvotes
Roberto Mettifogo
By Roberto Mettifogo (Oct 24, 2012)

This is a very good news, I hope they change the date to xmas 2012, it would be a nice gift under the tree...

0 upvotes
chriscotec
By chriscotec (Oct 24, 2012)

Sorry if this has already been covered. I have been off the grid for a few days and haven't had time to read all about this.

I have seen no mention to whether or not this is a "clean" video output. That was the huge issue before, and the reason I use the Panasonic GH2 to record to a field recorder. Please tell me the signal will have no viewfinder info on it.

My theory on the 6 month delay is that Canon will be trying to sell us something different by then but wants to keep us loyal with a promise in the mean time.

Actions, not words please Canon. We are not suckers. We have legs. We just might walk.

I have a lot of money invested in my Canon system and a smaller but growing amount in my Panasonic system. They both have their strengths and weaknesses but I am pretty sure the next camera I invest in will be a Panasonic GH3, not anything from Canon.

1 upvote
thenold
By thenold (Oct 24, 2012)

Well, for me, uncompressed is clean...

0 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

chrisotec, even if it will be a totally clean stream -- and Canon is not saying that it will be, keep in mind that the chroma is going to be 4:2:2 (not 4:4:4) and color fidelity is going to be only 8bit (and not 10-bit or 12-bit) And also, that the camera's CPU has to do old-school type "line skipping" just to patch together a 1080p resolution image. This practice leads to the notorious moire effect.

For quality video, you might want to stick with Lumix DMC-GH2 and of course GH3, or something better. Watch for the new F-series Sony 4K video camera announcement coming out on October 30th.

0 upvotes
dagos
By dagos (Dec 20, 2012)

There is no line-skipping in 5D mk III. Please get your facts straight before posting misleading information on this forum.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (Oct 24, 2012)

"However EOS 5D Mark III owners will have to wait until April 2013 before the new firmware becomes available."

That timing for porting of the small changes already available in another camera of the same generation (i.e. having very similar hardware) cannot be explained by anything except artificial slowdown. Canon has become really arrogant in the recent years.

4 upvotes
Cyberman
By Cyberman (Oct 29, 2012)

Cannot be explained? How about Canon has just seen the features of the Sony A99 competition, and decided they must keep up. So they announce they're going to catch up (so people don't rush off and buy the A99). The problem is they have to get the programmers to work - and those programmers can't finish the work overnight.

0 upvotes
Superka
By Superka (Oct 24, 2012)

HDMI or not HDMI - Canon 5Dm3 video is much better than Nikon or Sony DSLR. Panasonic video is the best, though.

Comment edited 23 seconds after posting
4 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

I'm just curious.... why is Canon 5D's line-skipped video "better" than what is being recorded and comes out via HDMI for something like the Sony SLT Alpha 99?

No arguments re. the Panasonic cameras though, their M4/3 sensor cameras just love video.

BTW, since Canon is not releasing codec details and recording bitrate data details for most of their camera, it is very hard to know what exactly their cameras record when it comes to video. Highest recording bitrate Canon admits to is 50Mbit/sec, and it is an old-fashioned Motion JPEG codec at that.

0 upvotes
AndreeMarkefors
By AndreeMarkefors (Oct 29, 2012)

You DO know that the mk3 doesn't line skip, right?

Because for a guy knowing, you're nagging about it quite a lot.

0 upvotes
dagos
By dagos (Dec 20, 2012)

Francis Carver: there is no line-skipping in 5d Mk III. Get your facts straight.

0 upvotes
spiderhunter
By spiderhunter (Oct 24, 2012)

Absolutely preposterous. Update available six months from now? They should do it immediately - together with the announcement.

WHAT EXACTLY IS CANON UP?

Time to jump ship!!!

Comment edited 23 seconds after posting
6 upvotes
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 24, 2012)

Jumpship? to what? d600? are you joking.. d600 handling sucks, bottons are shared... dynamic range is good but focusing sucks.. its too centered. a dedicated botton would be much nicer . at least canon added stuff even with old camera, nikon didnt update d300s at all .

Comment edited 28 seconds after posting
5 upvotes
hiipolarbear
By hiipolarbear (Oct 24, 2012)

that is because, feature by feature, Nikon doesn't need to do any update! And you should compare 5DIII to D800 instead of D600. Surely there is no update fro Canon 6D in this context.

And why 6 months?? well, just to make people who own Canon C100, C300 or even C500 feel a bit better; who would need C100 if 5DIII has HDMI out?

Canon is just so good in sucking blood out of video-player as they thought people who do "video" in general much are richer than photographer, but the truth is...

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
4 upvotes
shleed
By shleed (Oct 24, 2012)

Jumping ship... OVER AN UPDATE?

Jesus you people are bloody stupid.

4 upvotes
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 24, 2012)

Ok, Lets comapre 5d iii and 800 ... its a given d800 has better dynamic range but iso level, AF, FPS, better screen for live view, and white balance without greenish tone 5d III got the upperhand. 5d iii is better in handling. I hope Nikon can update its AF, FPS, or even the greenish tone... and stop denying about the oild and spots on d600 sensor .

1 upvote
sglewis
By sglewis (Oct 25, 2012)

Jump ship? The camera was good enough to buy. But now that it's going to be updated to get better, it's not good enough to keep?

1 upvote
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

For video, best you forget the line-skipping Canikon DSLRs and look at Panasonic sand Sony instead. Seriously.

0 upvotes
shleed
By shleed (Oct 26, 2012)

Do you want to marry line skipping?

0 upvotes
riknash
By riknash (Oct 24, 2012)

It's really nice to see Canon stepping up and listening to the users of the camera. I was wrong. I didn't think Canon would add f/8 AF capability in a 5D model so its quite refreshing to learn today that this feature will be added, uhmm, next year. I suspect the delay addresses the usual reasons (stop users switching brands, allow other yet to be announced products to catch up). Unfortunately that's a long time in the professional video world. No pro is going to wait for April fools next year to show up but rather acquire another brand in order to meet present production needs.

Maybe they can up the frame rate from 6fps to 8 fps along with a deeper buffer? The 5D3 must keep up with at least a 7D, a three year old camera. The 6fps is way to slow for action photography. Ideally it would go faster as then it would be the one the rest of us could more afford than a 1DX with some of the same benefits. That would make the $3400 price tag more palatable.

4 upvotes
pacc
By pacc (Oct 24, 2012)

You are comparing apples and pears, 7D is not a full frame camera so the shutter and mirror can be smaller, lighter and travel a shorter distance. Another limiting factor is the number of pixels to push for each frame, 1DX and 7D are blessed with dual processors and datapaths - 5D3 is not.

3 upvotes
Donnie G
By Donnie G (Oct 24, 2012)

Could it be that this firmware upgrade is being delayed due to patent issues or even international tax class issues? No camera manufacturer wants to wind up on the wrong side of a law suit like the one that killed Minolta. Also, these cameras are heavily regulated by international treaties, so what we may consider to be a simple feature upgrade just might place the camera into a different product/tax category. Maybe it takes a few months to get an official resolution of any potential conflicts. Whatever the reasons, it's nice to know that the fix will be available and that it will definitely add value to the product. Thanks Canon!

5 upvotes
garyknrd
By garyknrd (Oct 23, 2012)

Actually as a birder I could care less. I am waiting on the 7D mark ll. Or what Nikon has to offer. Both are neglecting that market. What will be interesting is if Pentax or one of the others make a pro-body crop sensor camera. I would be all over it. Even though I have Canon glass. This glass holds its value. So i really loose nothing to switch.

1 upvote
AJC Photography
By AJC Photography (Oct 23, 2012)

Please ... listen to what this guy says:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/video/2010/may/20/language-usa

8 upvotes
Kagetsu
By Kagetsu (Oct 23, 2012)

First thing I saw too. Reminds me of 'irregardless'.

0 upvotes
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (Oct 24, 2012)

I'm just waitin' on a friend but seriously, it is a rare lens that holds its full value over time. You almost always lose money unless you are Ken Rockwell. Of course, it's true that the bodies drop in value more quickly.

0 upvotes
garyknrd
By garyknrd (Oct 24, 2012)

I don't know. I just sold my 300mm f2.8 IS for 600 dollars more than I paid for it. I bought an almost new 500 F4 for 5600 dollars and it might as well be new. Looking at the prices I will make money on that too. The only glass I loose on is Sigma. I completely quit buying that glass for that reason. Picked up the new 300mm f2.8 ll internationally and got the VAT refund for about 6400. That one I will break even on. But won't loose any.
That is the only glass I have for Canon. I am strickly a birder. No interest in any other photography. So I am in a good position to start over if need be.
www.flickr.com/photos/avianphotos

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
turretless
By turretless (Oct 23, 2012)

Hmmm.... Interesting... I've been using 5D3 with 70-300 f/4-5.6L sitting on Kenko Teleplus Pro C-AF 1.4 for several months. And I haven't noticed any problem with auto focus, though the maximum aperture of the combination is f/8 at 300 (i.e. 420) mm. Am I missing something?

0 upvotes
pacc
By pacc (Oct 24, 2012)

Some third party teleconverters do not report the actual aperture but will just pass along the values provided by the lens. This would not have been possible with a Canon TC.

0 upvotes
turretless
By turretless (Oct 24, 2012)

@pacc,
I.e. they will wait for half a year to release an update, which just removes an artificial limitation in software preventing auto focusing with native f/8 glass? How generous of them! :)

Comment edited 41 seconds after posting
1 upvote
Octane
By Octane (Oct 23, 2012)

This is awesome! Wait, ... what? April next year??? LOL

1 upvote
jm67
By jm67 (Oct 23, 2012)

Firstly, it's interesting that they'd announce an update so far in advance. Will it take them that long to ensure it's stable? Of course, I will probably be the only person not to implement it. I couldn't care less about video (and I'm not saying Canon shouldn't improve it for those who do, I don't use it). And I don't need to focus at F8. I'm sure those who do will be happy. Hopefully they will include something else that may be of use to me. Or I'll just continue to use the camera as is and meh to that.

1 upvote
beautyintheeyes
By beautyintheeyes (Oct 23, 2012)

April fool's joke?

0 upvotes
RXVGS
By RXVGS (Oct 23, 2012)

It must be! because a 6 month wait is a total joke!

8 upvotes
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 24, 2012)

Nikon dont update at all LOL

1 upvote
kevin_r
By kevin_r (Oct 24, 2012)

Maybe it's because they don't have to....?

0 upvotes
Sad Joe
By Sad Joe (Oct 23, 2012)

Pleased to see that Canon have been FORCED by Nikon to improve the 5D3 (in certain areas) but why oh why will this software update take so many months? This all smacks of Canon becoming worried about what Nikon are doing and what Nikon have in the pipeline. As a Canon user hoping to go FF I'd love a 5D3 ( I have used one - fab) but even so I feel that Nikon must be laughing to Canon AGAIN.

6 upvotes
raincoat
By raincoat (Oct 23, 2012)

More importantly why didn't they do it to begin with if the hardware is capable?
It's like my DVD player getting a firmware update to play BD. It doesn't make sense it can be done with software.

2 upvotes
Mike Griffin
By Mike Griffin (Oct 23, 2012)

My thoughts exactly. I wonder what else Canon cameras are capable of if only Canon would give you access. It appears that they cripple their products while they can get away with it to protect sales of higher priced products.

4 upvotes
WhiteBalance
By WhiteBalance (Oct 24, 2012)

Magic Lantern is giving us the access to the capabilities that Canon refuses to (Alpha 2 just released):
http://www.magiclantern.fm/whats-new/104-releases/143-second-alpha-for-5d-mark-iii
I can't wait until it becomes stable and I finally get focus peaking!

4 upvotes
Gary Dean Mercer Clark
By Gary Dean Mercer Clark (Oct 24, 2012)

I can't believe that Canon's can't focus peak yet? GEESH. My Sony A77 focus peaks. I love it.

1 upvote
Superka
By Superka (Oct 23, 2012)

Canon, you are the best! I cannot afford 5Dm3, but it fantastic camera
Dave Dugdale nice review.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuozUxh_tOU

Comment edited 31 seconds after posting
1 upvote
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (Oct 23, 2012)

I'll be the first to admit the 5D3 seems overpriced for what you get. But switching brands and lenses as you chase each new feature isn't going to save money even if the body is cheaper.

3 upvotes
Sad Joe
By Sad Joe (Oct 23, 2012)

I think it depends if you see the future with Nikon who seem to be moving ahead all the time or Canon who seem to have no plan, be totally reactive and have a very confused range (the lame 6D AF being the latest stupid thing they have done) I moved from Nikon to Canon several years ago for better AF & high ISO, today there are plenty of reasons to move back. I just think Canon have lost it.

2 upvotes
thx1138
By thx1138 (Oct 23, 2012)

I've thought about changing at times, but apart from the cost of glass, IMO the Canon lens lineup is much better with few exceptions than Nikon's.

FW update is good news but 6 months to wait. They could release the AF update now and the HDMI update in April; why tie them together other than to give 1D X owners a chance to feel good that they have AF at f/8 now.

0 upvotes
Mike Griffin
By Mike Griffin (Oct 23, 2012)

You should check Camera Lens Ratings at dxomark.com

0 upvotes
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 24, 2012)

6d Af is a joke . But canon 5d III AF and ISO is way better than nikon counterpart. IQ is also very good. I have no problem shooting with 5d3 at all.

0 upvotes
EDWARD ARTISTE
By EDWARD ARTISTE (Oct 25, 2012)

no one trusts those, so no one looks

0 upvotes
Lucas_
By Lucas_ (Oct 23, 2012)

Why wait if you can have it all with an A99 in a couple of weeks and for a lower price?
I know, it comes from a house appliance and Pro video manufacturer..., which coincidentally is making the best image sensors in the world and most camera manufacturers ( but Canon... ) are buying them! Also, you have lots invested in other mounts' lenses. Well, good luck then!

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 2 minutes after posting
1 upvote
russbarnes
By russbarnes (Oct 23, 2012)

You can't have it all though. No OVF, no great lens choices, these are the things that matter to most photographers at present.

10 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

yeah and there is no MF real Zeiss in Sony's poor lens line , I think Nikon is still a way much better choice than the lousy A99v,which is a noise box.

I compared the A99v vs my Nikon D600 , the D600 is at least a full stop better at any ISO higher than ISO400.

The A99v , in terms of pure image making tool , is like something from the last decade , it is that noisy and as all of us know it is because of the extremely stupid SLT design.

I love the EVF and AFD but well, it is not for me , I need at least 3 Zeiss MF primes and a bit faster operation speed , its menu and general operation speed is really slow , as slow as my A77v.

the Sony A99v is really signficantly overpriced , it has only 19 points AF taken from the old A77v but it is more expensive than my D800(at least in Japan and in Thailand).

Oly extremely Sony fanboys buy that crap.

0 upvotes
ryansholl
By ryansholl (Oct 23, 2012)

A stop of ISO performance here, stabilized AF Zeiss primes there. You don't want it. I do. Case closed.

Comment edited 6 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
Evildogofdoom
By Evildogofdoom (Oct 23, 2012)

How sad people are so insecure, that they feel threatened by another product.

1 upvote
ryansholl
By ryansholl (Oct 24, 2012)

Some just need to prop themselves up. If he is dead set on using MF Zeiss lenses, why does he care about AF points? [slow waist-level jerking motion]

2 upvotes
Preternatural Stuff
By Preternatural Stuff (Oct 24, 2012)

@3systermuser

Plain ridiculous - u really expect 2 cameras, the A99 and the D600, using the same Sony sensor to have drastically different noise characteristics?

You are outright lying or you are just dumb enough to believe that the people here are dumb enough to believe you.

RAW image comparisons show negligible, if perceptible differences at all between the two.

You are very clearly a dinosaur who does not know what an EVF is - its the future and is already here.

People seem to be giving Nikon all the credit when they haven't really done much. Read a very telling interview with a Sony top brass... "the camera follows the device". By that he meant components like the sensor advancements. Nikon's pulled ahead purely because Sony came up with the winning sensors that just about all other camera manufacturers, (except Canon) are buying.

As a Canon user, I am fed up with Canikon, especially with such 6 month firmware shenanigans, and I am willing Sony on to flip the Canikon boat.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
HenryTt
By HenryTt (Oct 23, 2012)

My wife purchased a 5D3 over the D800. They are obviously both top notch cameras. However, she felt the 5D3 was a more functional camera for use outside the studio (and not landscape). However, the D600 has given her pause and made us feel like we made a mistake in going with Canon. Here's why:
First, the D600 is a lot of camera for the money. I think the sensor is slightly better, and otherwise, the camera is 95% as good as the 5D3 for a lot less money.
Second, Nikon seems to have upped its game. One reason why my wife chose Canon was that they have a history of being at the leading edge while Nikon always played it safe. (Example, that 12MP is enough cr@p)
Third, Canon seems to be really bad at playing catchup. This firmware is an example of a half-ass attempt at rectifying some of their errors.

These firmware changes are a welcome update. But Canon needs to: A) lower the price to $3000. B) Put out the firmware sooner. C) I'd like to see better auto ISO handling.

4 upvotes
russbarnes
By russbarnes (Oct 23, 2012)

I can't argue with much of what you've written, except for the 12MP part. I recently had to get a 3rd party to produce a one-off 3m x 2m print at 240dpi from a 12MP D700 file which I interpolated myself and the result was staggering. I mean really incredible. So despite choosing to shoot with the D800 these days myself, actually Nikon's line all long was spot on in my view - 12MP on a full frame camera is enough to produce incredible results even beyond 120 x 80 inches in print, you don't need more - it's the marketing spiel of manufacturers like Canon that pushed the MP race and now they are behind they are claiming the sweet spot is 20MP. What a surprise.

4 upvotes
d3xmeister
By d3xmeister (Oct 23, 2012)

I agree. i saw some huge prints that looked stunning and they were made from a Nikon D700.

1 upvote
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

just get the D800E , which is the best camera you can buy for your money now.
and all its minor AF issues and dust on the sensor issue are fixed , if possible avoid the D600 for now because it has sensor dust issue(this is very annoying).

0 upvotes
Tazz93
By Tazz93 (Oct 23, 2012)

I agree with... Canon being a little slow to react to market shifts, Nikon upp'ing their game, and the D600 being 95% of the camera (if not more) the 5D3 is for a lot less money.

The main factor and inclusive of all three you mentioned is price point. It seems Canon is a little stuck on the original 5D pricing and they feel its still an accurate price point today. At that time, it fit, mostly because there was no other choices (except an $8,000 1DSII). That is far from the case now. It appears they have recognized this by introducing the 6D, but are possibly stuck to play out the financial game plan that was laid down previously for the 5D3. Just my 2 cents.

1 upvote
Kinematic Digit
By Kinematic Digit (Oct 23, 2012)

I'm currently running a 2 month exhibit with $10K in prints from my 5Dmk3, 5Dmk2, D800E, D700, Olympus E-P3 and Fuji X-Pro1. My prints range from sizes of 13x19 to 60x40 and I can tell ya, that for the most part, the MP BS that always come back into these forums is a bit redundant and honestly pointless. My 5 foot prints from my lowest resolution D700 files look as great as my 5Dmk2/3 prints. The D800E prints are nice, but there is no extra benefits with them in my landscape subjects (which many seem convinced that it is) over the others.

Canon did the right thing to not up the MP with the 5Dmk3. Focus on the other issues, which they did. For event shooting alone it now is a superior system.

To me the D600 is a budget camera to get people into the FF market. It is what it is, and will sell well. Personally, spend time photographing rather than worry if my prints will look good on the wall (which they do) no matter what camera I used to take them.

Time to go out and make art...

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 3 minutes after posting
9 upvotes
Sad Joe
By Sad Joe (Oct 23, 2012)

As a keen Canon owner I have to agree - I'd go further Nikon seem to have better cameras at each price point - if I was starting over again I'd go D600 over the 6D if only for a decent AF system, the 5D3 is a fab camera but expensive - I'd love one - but the D600 seems to offer almost everything for a lot less cash whereas the 6D simply offers less !

6 months to get a software update > What planet are Canon on????

0 upvotes
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 23, 2012)

@ Henry,

To be honest Canon really beat d800 and d600....

1. Yup The dynamic range mabye better but just a tad which is barely noticeable.. To be honest if you look at the raw image comparison with d600 to 5diii on this site, youll see the difference ( canon is sharper ). Check out the queens face of poker card every iso level in RAW . In Jpeg theres no question canon wins

2. The new AF system 5diii got is way better than those nikon counterparts... its kinda intricate but amazingly fast. d600 focus is chopped from dx sensor and d800 got the same old AF .
3. i dont know what better ISO you can asked for than this. D3s is better but thats 5k +
4. white balance is better than nikon with greenish tone.
5. Live view is really great , which is way better than nikon. (AF suck with LV but I dont use AF on LV for better composition. )

If you have bad photos, then thats you =o

0 upvotes
sandy b
By sandy b (Oct 23, 2012)

dod, read about the D600 resolution on the front page. DPR nails it. And the dynamic range is way more than just a 'tad'.

The queens face is miss focused on the shot, its sharper than the 5D3 in other spots, like the watch face. D600 has better IQ for 1200 cheaper. Nikon win, IMO.

1 upvote
dod713n
By dod713n (Oct 24, 2012)

Well thats not out of focus because it a board and on the same plane , Even d800 has the same issue and its actually good at lower iso. ( dynamic range no question its better but not that much , check it again or comapare it with your friends or youtube it . DXO exagerates stuff ) Even with ISO 5d iii is better.

IQ between d600 and 5d3 just on par or i may say 5d3is better ... IQ means image quality ( it includes the white balance, tone, low light capabilities, details, noise ... ect. )

One problem with d600 is the focus points which is too centered . In taking photos you need to have a better success rate. then bottons are shared because of the small body which is awkward . the screen is not that great and its not smooth with live view.

overall 5d3 is better to in handling, better with higher iso , very decent IQ,faster FPS with solid body and AF that can kill even d4.

Comment edited 53 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
EDWARD ARTISTE
By EDWARD ARTISTE (Oct 25, 2012)

d600? oh, you guys maybe want to check all the sensor dust reports....

disclaimer- im a canon guy but ill one day use both. Canons middle ground cameras are crap to me because the 7d- low iso noise sucks, and the 6d is so last gen its no even funny. there is nothing else in the segment for semi pro's to even buy.

And now canons playing up the 6D to the landscape travel crowd...wonder if its because the awesome Af...

0 upvotes
chrisfromalaska
By chrisfromalaska (Oct 23, 2012)

Really Canon? Announcing a firmware update 5 months before its out. Hopefully that doesn't take resources away from your next camera with the 4-year-old 18mp sensor or 5d4 development with another 22mp sensor.

Nice try to keep me away from the A99, not going to happen.

19 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Oct 23, 2012)

Oh stop it ! Canon doesn't owe you anything and Canon expects nothing from you. Do what you want, buy the camera that fits your skill, but stop pretending you have been somehow heroic resisting the Canon attraction.

15 upvotes
chrisfromalaska
By chrisfromalaska (Oct 23, 2012)

Canon's lethargic development pace and lack of innovation has turned me off. I sold my 5d2 to get a 5d3, but was underwhelmed by its specs for the hefty price vs. competitors. Nothing heroic about my intentions, just disappointment in Canon's lack of innovation.

Maybe Canon can shoot for July 2014 to add 1080/60p and focus peaking?

Comment edited 10 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
Emopunk
By Emopunk (Oct 23, 2012)

My thought too. They're worried of A99, more than D800.

0 upvotes
Ionian
By Ionian (Oct 23, 2012)

Which is funny because the A99 seems more frightened of the D800.

6 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

the A99v is a crappy camera , it is so noisy , jsut try it at Sony store or something around you.

LR4 already can process its RAW files , it is really noisy although it may share the same sensor as in the D600.

The Sony has nice video and nice EVF but that is it , its AF is poor , its sensor is good but the SLT design mars it .

I think Sony should have made it just simple mirrorless with PDAF on the sensor, no Translucent crap needed there any more.

1 upvote
Amateur Sony Shooter
By Amateur Sony Shooter (Oct 23, 2012)

In real life A99 is on pair with D600 in terms of noise. There are numeric RAW/jpeg samples posted. You should check the fact first.

0 upvotes
Preternatural Stuff
By Preternatural Stuff (Oct 24, 2012)

@ Ionian
Which is funny because the A99 isn't afraid of anyone... it was specc'ed to scare the daylights out of Canikon. Where did you get that from? Of course, on the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.

@SMV78
Are people here totally missing the point? AF at f8 is a big yawn...hardly a critical matter to most.

However uncompressed HDMI output - that's a huge video thing. D800 and D600 suck at video. Canon & Sony are the main video players.

The Canon firmware update is clearly targeted at the threat of the A99, which also is the only one in the market that can do FF 1080 @ 60p.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 6 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
SMV78
By SMV78 (Oct 23, 2012)

Translation: "Please, wait, don't buy a D800"

23 upvotes
Zerg2905
By Zerg2905 (Oct 23, 2012)

Wow, you are so right. And now, tadaaa, (my) patience has paid off. Anyway, someone in the Canon marketing department is very dumb or very "short sighted" - when these "head to head" features are part of your competitive advantage against the (arguably) your biggest rival, you must have all of them ready at product launch time, all "on top offs" must come later, and not the viceversa... But now what, is D800 a "better" camera? Of course not. The rest is "public" (forums included) perception. Cheers! :)

0 upvotes
Emopunk
By Emopunk (Oct 23, 2012)

It could also mean "don't buy A99", in case you missed something.

1 upvote
kelpdiver
By kelpdiver (Oct 23, 2012)

the A99 is an afterthought...people are buying Canon and Nikon and then everyone else. This announcement is entirely about Nikon and those two features that differentiated them from Canon. f/8 used to be reserved for the 1 series and now that pressure mean (maybe, probably?) that the 5 will now get it as well. Uncompressed video is all about the videographers that made the 5dII a big success, keeping them from running to the D600.

4 upvotes
Marek Rucinski
By Marek Rucinski (Oct 23, 2012)

This demonstrates how much more could have been squeezed out of currently available hardware if only we managed to hack the firmware (and I'm sure this applies to all manufacturers).
April 2013 :-))) In your face, customer...

10 upvotes
Kinematic Digit
By Kinematic Digit (Oct 23, 2012)

Magic Lantern released the alpha version of their software last month for the 5Dmk3. Hackers will always squeeze more out of the current systems.

http://www.magiclantern.fm/whats-new/104-releases/143-second-alpha-for-5d-mark-iii

I suspect that most manufacturers like to play it safe rather than push it to the maximum. Giving room for error systems and checks to give maximum performance. These things are so complicated these days, but as long as they can be hacked like the Magic Lantern team has done, there's always room for improvement.

The latest alpha works great with my 5Dmk3 and gives me extra features like: HDR Video, Focus Peaking, display gain, Clean HDMI out (so no need to wait for Canon), inverted displays, etc...

1 upvote
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

that is very true , I think the A99v could have shot 9f/s but Sony intentionally crippled it

and Magiclantern the alpha version is great and I think it has forced Canon to announce this new FW update plan.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
1 upvote
bronxbombers4
By bronxbombers4 (Oct 23, 2012)

ML just released clean HDMI out, enables zoom during filimg, zebras, peaking, and tons of other video features for the 5D3. It's been clear for years that they never come close to taking advantage of the hardware they provide, especially for video (but even for stills when you look at how AutoISO is STILL crippled below 1 series level after a decade, despite all other manufacturers making it work at all levels for years).

1 upvote
mpgxsvcd
By mpgxsvcd (Oct 23, 2012)

I have a feeling we are going to see a lot of cameras that are not complete come out in the near future. Then the companies will just wait to see what people complain about and add it with new firmware the next year.

15 upvotes
Nishi Drew
By Nishi Drew (Oct 23, 2012)

At least it's not like the video game industry, where half baked games are released at full price and the users pay for the "updates" and extra features that should have been apart of the original, or are already in the game but need a key to unlock.

4 upvotes
kelpdiver
By kelpdiver (Oct 23, 2012)

f/8 AF had never been on the 5 series before. Raw HDMI out didn't exist on the II either.

Consider how long people had been waiting for the III...for it to be "complete" as suggested by you and Marek would have meant seeing it in 2013.

No matter what the product is, you have to put a line in the sand on features and say, 'this is what we will deliver.' Hopefully without some stray light issues (III) or apparent uneven autofocus woes (D800) or weird banding or ...

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (Oct 23, 2012)

my thanks goes to D800, great job Nikon!

16 upvotes
onlooker
By onlooker (Oct 23, 2012)

Competition is good for the customers.

4 upvotes
WilliamJ
By WilliamJ (Oct 23, 2012)

Well, I wouldn't grant such a nice laurel crown to Nikon as a lot of D800 had a lot of hard issues (LCD panel green cast, decentered focusing etc. ) as well as so many D600 (dust/oil on sensor) that had to be returned the very day they have been bought.

We have to be as cautious with our praises than with our reproaches.

1 upvote
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

no, you must thank for Magic Lantern people for thier Alpha version.

2 upvotes
Kinematic Digit
By Kinematic Digit (Oct 23, 2012)

I wonder if this will include the illumination firmware update that the 1Dx now has.

Great news but wow, that's a long wait from this announcement. I'm a bit confused as why it's that long. They obviously know it can be done, and it's just a matter of coding and testing. At the most 2 months tops? Why do we need to even know about this if they can't get it to market in a shorter time frame.

2 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 23, 2012)

"that's a long wait from this announcement. I'm a bit confused as why it's that long. They obviously know it can be done, and it's just a matter of coding and testing."

Oh, that's easy. They likely have to reverse-engineer a Nikon DSLR first, and that takes time, you know.

2 upvotes
howardroark
By howardroark (Oct 23, 2012)

Programming isn't as easy as puking out an idiotic opinion, Frank.

22 upvotes
mikiev
By mikiev (Oct 23, 2012)

"Why do we need to even know about this if they can't get it to market in a shorter time frame."

1. To keep some 5D3 owners - any who think this is a critical feature for their workflow - from jumping-ship to a camera which provides it.

2. "In response to requests from professionals working in the fields of cinema and television production,..." To let those pros know that their current cameras -will- be updated, and any pros on the fence for buying a new camera will know the feature -will- be available in a few months.

1 upvote
Kinematic Digit
By Kinematic Digit (Oct 23, 2012)

I work with cinematographers everyday and none of them really care too much about what minor upgrades are coming or worry about changing systems. Ironically most in that industry care really little about all the banter that happens in this dSLR community. All they care about is the next shoot.

I've been alpha and beta testing software from the Magic Lantern team, which gives lots of great features and functions that none of the other brands are offering (with some exception to Sony). ML itself is why no one is planning on jumping ship anytime soon and is already available in alpha form for the 5Dmk3 with focus peaking, zebra strips, vector and waveform monitoring and much more...

To also suggest that a pro cine shooter would not want electronic aperture control would suggest that the high end electronic focus pullers that have aperture control as one of the KEY selling points as being a benign feature. Having the lack of that aperture control irritates all my associates.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting
5 upvotes
DavesMan
By DavesMan (Oct 23, 2012)

Maybe the AF illumination will come sooner that this huge upgrade.

0 upvotes
kelpdiver
By kelpdiver (Oct 23, 2012)

There were enough issues with bad updates on the 7d firmware that you wouldn't want a 2 month rush job.

0 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 23, 2012)

Who cares what Canon does with its $3,500 list Price EOS 5D Mark III? Especially since these "improvements" won't even happen until sometime next year.

If you need uncompressed video from your DSLR in 4:2:2 chroma and 8-bit color quality, just get a Nikon D600 for $2,100. The Nikon already has what the Canon promises via a firmware upgrade.

After Nikon, Sony, Panasonic all came out with cameras outputting uncompressed video via HDMI, at dead last Canon is also thinking about it? Hah! Too little too late, Canon.

22 upvotes
Kinematic Digit
By Kinematic Digit (Oct 23, 2012)

Enjoy that lack of aperture control with the D600 during video.

24 upvotes
Spoonboy
By Spoonboy (Oct 23, 2012)

Oh look, it's Francis Carver- anti canon extraordinaire- dead on cue.

Did Canon take your children away from you or something? Christ, get a life.

I look forward to these additions as a 5D3 owner, particularly the AF upgrades.

Comment edited 52 seconds after posting
18 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 23, 2012)

Set your camera in "P" mode, the camera will control your aperture. Or in "S" mode for that matter. Or set iris in "M" mode before you start recording, like they do on professional film sets. Why on Earth would you want to change your aperture manually DURING a video clip?

@ Spoonboy: I feel your pain, Brother. Should have gotten a Nikon D600 instead, then you would not have to wait for another 6 months or so for this so-called "upgrade" from Canon. You would be right about US$1,400 richer, too, hmmm? Just sayin....

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
15 upvotes
howardroark
By howardroark (Oct 23, 2012)

Frank, you don't comprehend. The true question is who cares what your uninformed, ignorant opinion is? You don't even understand how to use quotation marks. These are unquestionably improvements in functionality, and using sarcastic quotation marks make you appear even more angry and foolish than you already do.

7 upvotes
AlanG
By AlanG (Oct 23, 2012)

Francis, maybe you should consider that most of us actually know why we chose a 5DIII.

In my mind people who keep posting "my camera is better than your camera" have some kind of insecurity issues.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
13 upvotes
Nishi Drew
By Nishi Drew (Oct 23, 2012)

"You would be right about US$1,400 richer, too, hmmm? Just sayin...."

Right, because how much do external recorders for clean HDMI cost exactly? Yeah, about that much, and all those fancy rigs, lights, mounts, sliders....
And all with a D600 that doesn't allow for as much control over the video?

And aperture control during video is very much helpful, you might want more control over changing light, or point of focus for a dreamy effect. But for D600 users there's the good 'ol lenses with manual aperture rings, or even Samyang lenses.

1 upvote
Henry M. Hertz
By Henry M. Hertz (Oct 23, 2012)

why has francis carver to prove with every posting he is such a moron?

4 upvotes
Mike99999
By Mike99999 (Oct 23, 2012)

Who cares considering that a simple Panasonic MFT camera smokes both Nikon and Canon. What's the point of a full frame sensor if it uses line skipping to produce 1080p video?

1 upvote
Spoonboy
By Spoonboy (Oct 23, 2012)

I don't know. He just trolls comments to stir things up. I imagine he is a lonely man in RL.

I'm surprised DPR don't take a bit more effort to moderate such blatant trolling.

2 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

for video and LV , the D600 is useless because it does not allow us to control f number in LV or video mode.

for me Nikons are strictly still cameras, dont get the D600 or D800 for video, they are great STILL cameras , though.

0 upvotes
balios
By balios (Oct 23, 2012)

DPR staff: please allow ignore settings to work with news article postings. The quality of the conversation for many readers would be greatly enhanced. There's a segment of DPR readers who think the field of photography is about fanboyish inter-company name calling and I'd rather not waste my time having to glance over it.

2 upvotes
kimvette
By kimvette (Oct 24, 2012)

Francis Carver - haven't you ever noticed that depth of field sometimes changes (with no other changes with focus or field of view) during a movie? That's because they adjusted aperture while filming.

Customers demand it. Isn't that justification for a feature?

0 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

@ howardroark: Who is "Frank," Francis? Re. opinions.... at least I have one. But YOU -- apparently nothing.

@ AlanG: "most of us actually know why we chose a 5DIII." I am sure that you do, and that it probably had not much to do with shooting video. If you were into that, you would probably have gotten another make/model camera that outputs clean, uncompressed video in the first place. No can't do with the factory firmware Canon EOS 5Ds, see? There is always hope for tomorrow and next year, of course. Thus the Canon firmware upgrade teaser press release.

@ Nishi: "a D600 that doesn't allow for as much control over the video?" Come again? What controls in video will the D600 not allow you to execute?

0 upvotes
Francis Carver
By Francis Carver (Oct 25, 2012)

@ Mike99999: "Who cares considering that a simple Panasonic MFT camera smokes both Nikon and Canon. What's the point of a full frame sensor if it uses line skipping to produce 1080p video?"

You are exactly right, Mike. The video that these line-skipping Canikon DSLRs produce is pretty much abhorrent. Moire galore. And even if you output an HD signal via HDMI with them, it will be a line-skipped mess. Canikon DSLRs for videography? Not a particularly good idea, frankly. It never has been, actually.

And compared to a Sony SLT Alpha 99, a Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH3, a Nikon D800, or a Nikon D600, a US$3,500 Canon EOS 5D Mark III has the least impressive features when it comes to video.

0 upvotes
dagos
By dagos (Mar 4, 2013)

Mike99999: there is no line skipping in 5D MK III. Don't waist people's time posting wrong information on this forum.

0 upvotes
mpgxsvcd
By mpgxsvcd (Oct 23, 2012)

I can only assume that this will be "clean" output (no icons). April 2013 is still a long time away. Did they just figure out that this is useful and it will take them that long to complete it?

2 upvotes
AlanG
By AlanG (Oct 23, 2012)

Who knows what the reason is. But Canon has quite a range of cameras that target video so they initially might not have wanted to put so many video features into the 5DIII as this might take away sales from other models. Perhaps competition made them change their minds.

0 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (Oct 23, 2012)

any way, I am glad I sold out all EOS craps last year.
Canon is still not catching up with Panasonic and Sony in video SLR game.

but this may be a sign that Canon may be waking up slowly.
btw, I think the BMCC is the most interesting camera we've seen in this year, it has RAW video for just 2.4 k., it is amazing.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
AlanG
By AlanG (Oct 24, 2012)

Yes these lower end DSLR cameras are getting more and more video features. But Canon has another line of pro quality cinema video gear... EOS 1DC and the EOSC 100-500 series cameras. And they have a line of cine lenses too. So it is not as if they aren't innovating in video. They are simply targeting a different market.

I am an architectural shooter and the video function is pretty much irrelevant to me. So however long it takes them to add uncompressed HDMI doesn't matter to me. I don't see Nikon with a 17mm TSE lens and it is my understanding that Canon's 24mm TSE is better than Nikon's 24 tilt shift. The 5D III is not just an updated Mark II. It is an entirely new camera (viewfinder, sensor, AF, shutter, processor, dual cards, better sealing, 6 fps, etc.) and pretty much is a heavy duty pro body in a smaller form factor than the 1Dx or D4.

I use live view a lot. Consider this comparison test:

http://www.ronmartblog.com/2012/05/fail-nikon-d800-live-view-vs-canon-5d.html

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
dagos
By dagos (Mar 4, 2013)

3systermuser: why is EOS craps? You can take excellent pictures and videos with Canon EOS cameras. It all boils down to creativity.

0 upvotes
Total comments: 127