Canon EOS 650D preview updated with studio and real-world samples: Digital Photography Review

Has anyone on this forum used both the t2i and t4i, side by side? I bought the t4i as an upgrade to the t2i. And while I've only had the t4i for literally 3 days, my first impressions compared to the t2i are favorable:

- the ergonomics are better,
- clearly the firmware and speed have advanced,
- IMHO the image quality of the T4i is better then the T2i. Since I have both cameras, I plan on doing a more rigorous comparison of picture quality, both jpeg and raw.

For me, the t4i was a worthwhile upgrade from the T3i and, IMHO it's a better picture taker than the 60D, although if you want/need the extra "fullness" of the 60D you have only the 60D or 7D.

IMO, the t4i was worth the price and overall Canon hit a solid home run with it. I plan on doing my own "image" review of the t2i vs. t4i in a more controlled fashion.

However, my first impression is the t4i bests the t2i in image qualigy.

Comment edited 18 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

A family member now has one of these on order as his very first DSLR. Needless to say, it can be discouraging to read so many negative comments. It makes one wonder if the wrong decision has been made ... now that it's too late. This is also the first Canon in our family. I use Olympus, myself, and hope to get ahold of an OMD - EM5. So why was it "purchased"? Well, it wasn't really. It was offered through Air Miles! And it sounded like a pleasant all-around camera to start off a new photographer, as well as being a more user-friendly choice than the others on the Air Miles list.

I don't think it pays to read most of these comments unless they've been made by someone who has actually used the camera. First-hand experience trumps everything else. I'd be interested in knowing how many posters are basing their reactions on their own observations rather than just going by sample images or specs on a website.

Comment edited 54 seconds after posting

1 upvote

I don't own the camera yet, but nothing I have read here on this site - or elsewhere - has yet swayed me from my plans to buy one. Canon has issued two advisories on this camera (one issue with the black had grip turning white from some sort of chemical reaction, and the other about the wrong camera ID showing up in EXIF data ... both of which should be resolved very quickly). It seems that (according to many here) the camera may not represent a quantum leap of image quality output over the previous model(s); some suggest even less so. That said, from samples posted on this site, and others, it is clear (to me) that the camera is capable of producing excellent images and - apparently - very smooth video. It also feels great in my hands (can't speak to your family member) and is both conventional and creative feature rich. I suspect your family member is going to love it. Please post again when you get some feedback.

0 upvotes

I've been tracking the comments here for severals days... lots of statements such as "the 550 image quality is clearly better than the 650" as well as "Nikon D3200 image quality is clearly better than the 650."

After looking at the samples a lot (JPG and RAW), I've found examples where, to my eye, any one of the three cameras is the winner (yes, even the 650). Though, speaking as a totally unbiased 550 owner, I do think the 550 won most often, then followed by the Nikon D3200.

But seriously, I don't see that the IQ of any of these three cameras is notably better than the others, such that it ought to drive a purchase decision. Among these cameras, I'd make my choice on features rather than IQ.

0 upvotes

This discussion has made me wonder about the precision of the testing procedure. This is not meant to indict DPReview's process... rather, I question whether the variation we are seeing in the samples (especially among the Canon devices) is simply random noise due to the limits of testing (pardon the pun). In other words, if we had ten sample runs of the 650 images, would we see the same amount of variation as between the 650 and 550? If so, it argues even more strongly that we ought to be looking at features, not IQ.

0 upvotes

davidgp: "But seriously, I don't see that the IQ of any of these three cameras is notably better than the others, such that it ought to drive a purchase decision."

I'm relieved to hear that. That's what my eyes told me. But I have no experience with such evaluations.

0 upvotes

Don't mean to be redundant to previous post, but if you take a few minutes and carefully review full size photo comparisons on the Imaging Resource site, the 650D shots - to me - appear "better" (i.e. sharper, clearer, better color rendering) than most of its peers (except 600D) and even higher range cameras, though it does not appear that way - to me - on DPRs widget.

0 upvotes

I read your earlier post and compared their ISO 1600 and 3200 images from the 550 and 650... seemed almost identical to me. And any differences I might have noticed would be totally irrelevant in any real-life shots.

Like I said before, at this point it's all about the features (and price, of course).

0 upvotes

I agree, but whereas the D3200 and the 550D were clearly evolutionary steps from their predecessors, what exactly is the 650D? And, should we really be comparing with the 600D? (although I agree the 550D is possibly going to be cheaper, but here in switzerland it's there's only $25 difference between the 550d body and the 600D body or $50 for the kit (18-55)

The moment I saw the 650d specs I wondered who this was trying to please, clearly no really significant improvement in photography "features" but clearly some improvment in the video area (but I don't care). Also, the new sensor type (like with the new S100..) is arguably a step back in some ways..

The final review is going to be very interesting..

0 upvotes

To me the 650D studio test images on DPR look noticeably softer than the rest of canons 18 MP crop cameras. I don't think they are really representative of the camera. It almost looks like they are slightly out of focus.

Comment edited 15 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

This isn't the ONLY compar-o-meter out there. Imaging Resource has one, too.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

The T4i fares better there, IMO. One more thing, in case you didn't know, but you CAN move the marque rectangle around on the test image in the Studio Comparison Tool. The T4i does better on other sections of the image...just sayin'.

2 upvotes

Sorry mate, I disagree.

If you look at the red leaf patches at ISO 1600, it will be noticable that T4i is worse at resolving the pattern compared to T2i.

Myself as an owner of 2 pcs of T2i, felt very dissapointed for the result.

0 upvotes

Are you telling me that you're NOT aware that the DEFAULT settings of these two cameras are clearly DIFFERENT? Is that what YOU'RE telling me? Are you NOT aware that the settings can be CHANGED once you get the camera in-hand, mate?

0 upvotes

No need to get irritated, as far as I'm concerned, whatever the default setting difference between these two cameras, T4i doesn't bring significant improvement in the high ISO department.

I just couldn't justify the price increase for the other improvement like the LCD screen, faster shooting rate, new image processor, etc.

0 upvotes

sorry, but who needs this camera?
the good old 550D is at least as good

0 upvotes

There are always people in the market for a new camera. Many people are upgrading from much older Rebels. Many people are getting their first DSLR. Many people just want a second DSLR. Besides, does the 550D have an articulating screen? Touchscreen LCD? 5fps shooting speed? Hybrid AF? Nine cross-type AF sensors?

0 upvotes

You are forgetting about many feature upgrades. I agree the sensor is no improvement, but the camera body is in many way.

0 upvotes

I tend to agree with @rusticus
In the same price bracket, what compelling reason is there for an existing Canon user to choose this over say a 60D ?

There may be a handful of existing users who have been screaming for a touch screen LCD but who else?

0 upvotes

T3 - This 650D has obvious upgrades to the 550D, but if a first time DSLR buyer was asking for my advice, i'd send them to Ebay for a used 550D every time, and buy a great lens for it with the pocket change..

1 upvote

Personally, I'm in the market for a DSLR right now; my Olympus XZ-1 - along with my VF-2 and 64Gb Extreme card (not to mention my favorite broke-in Lowepro bag) - were stolen and I have the bug again. This new 650D has caught my attention and am incredibly grateful to DPR for their expedient publishing of as much info as they can as quickly as they can. Am really anxious for them to post some video samples taken with the new STM lenses. The studio samples and comparison tools (with so many other cameras) are a fabulous resource! Was looking at the Nikon d5100, but the 650D feels so much better in my hands and (at least in the aisle at best buy) feels faster. Also, thanks to the studio comparison tool, contrary to some things I've read, the 650D seems to maintain more detail than the D5100 at higher ISO's. Thanks DPR!

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 10 minutes after posting

3 upvotes

I find it ironic that so many tactless forum members are bashing these sample shots. Yet, when ever a new model comes out the forums are flooded with samples of canned goods, cats and boring planter boxes as "test images".

2 upvotes

So what do you feel the point of dpreview posting these images was? Make the Canon look as bad as possible? Or did Canon do it all by themselves? All the negative comments are completely justified. dpreview sets an expectation when they post first shots from a prosumer camera and the result was FAIL.

1 upvote

I agree. I need YOU to send me to Hawaii (or some other equally exotic locale) to take proper pictures to Wow the socks off everyone properly.

5 upvotes

Wow, these are truly unremarkable.

0 upvotes

Ok?

0 upvotes

I can't figure out what all the sensor comments are about. I'm looking at the Studio Comparison Tool with RAW crops and the 650D and the D3200 and the NEX 5N and all the other APS-C DSLR sensors look virtually identical at all ISOs. They all look clean at base ISO, get a little noisy at ISO 1600 and get pretty bad at ISO 6400. None are head and shoulders above the rest and none are significantly different outside the margin of error or confirmation bias.

3 upvotes

i think u need a better glass sweet heart ;) even no need to look closer. it is really noisier than the rest

1 upvote

Most people don't shoot above ISO 3200. Those who do know enough to go for a higher-end model like 7D or 5D. High-ISO performance is actually not that important, after all you need *some* light to shoot. Otherwise you use a strobe, or don't shoot at all.

0 upvotes

"Most people don't shoot above ISO 3200. Those who do know enough to go for a higher-end model like 7D or 5D"

Except that the 7D isn't going to improve things much if any.

2 upvotes

Who are these people taking photos? Horrible

1 upvote

What do you think the purpose of this quick gallery is? To give you a first look at the camera's image quality or to showcase the photographer's artistry? Is there anything in the news story above to give you a hint? This stuff is about the camera/lens, not the photographer.

9 upvotes

this is the first time i see people criticizing "test shots".....he should change his ID to ID10T

1 upvote

How are you supposed to judge image quality with oof shots, camera shake, poor exposures? Who would want to study a photo that has poor composure, little to no interest, and boring perspectives?

1 upvote

oof shots, camera shake, poor exposures - yes this would be a problem. Composition has little relevance to this conversation.

7 upvotes

marketing. not because they cant but they dont want to!
because they sensor was ahead of its time

BUT!! since they still owned the the DSLR video market with that same SENSOR! they still have less jello and noise than nikon's sub $1K cameras. and no over heat issue compare to sony's. bigger sensor than m43 cameras for shallower depth of field.

now they added stereo mics to the T4i! and touch screen for fun shoots

so if you want something better you better buy 5d2 or 5d3.

you want something even better you get 1dX or the C300 C500.

2 upvotes

I went thru DPR lab samples. It seems that 650D RAW is not as good as 600D in all ISO range (except 650D has the highest 25600). That is surprised. I am thinking to trade my 60D with 650D for a light/smaller package for travelling. But after seeing DPR samples I think I will hold off. I think 60D is still overall faster than 650D.

0 upvotes

60D also has shoulder LCD, which 650D doesn't have. Very handy.

0 upvotes

You are looking too hard for insignificant differences. The difference you see is within the margin of error and could be down to the difference between one being shot at 1/640 and the other at 1/1000.

0 upvotes

Yawn... 5th usage of the same old sensor. Canon obviously has nothing new to offer and continues to milk old technology. This is dissapointing especially after the lackluster 5D3 got spanked by Nikon, but it's exactly what I expected. I would have bet money that the T4i would have the same old sensor as the T2i, T3i, 60D and 7D. I have some of these cameras, and a significant investment in Canon glass, but I'm worried about the future of the company in which I am so heavily invested...

5 upvotes

@KatManDont

Lackluster 5D3...huh? Got spanked by Nikon...huh? Where do you get this crap--oh DxO...where machines measure other MACHINES and we're just supposed to ignore what our eyes tell us? And it's not the same old sensor. Can you read? THIS sensor has hybrid A/F built in. Oh, you're about pixel count only...gotcha!

You're worried about Canon...'cause of what their ENTRY level body can or cannot do? Wow.

4 upvotes

The t4i is not Canon "entry" level DSLR, actually it is sitting above the T3 and T3i. It's actually the same price as a Sony A65, Pentax K5 and Canon own 60D.

0 upvotes

Since you open your paragraph with a lie - that this is the same old sensor - the rest of your post is irrelevant.

0 upvotes

But 5D3 is available in stock at retailers, unlike Nikon's newer models. Nikon's paper launch means buyers will go to Canon instead of waiting for Nikon to produce enough cameras.

0 upvotes

you can always swtich to Nikon, seriously......not sure what you mean by invested heavily though but i am sure Nikon would love you better. Go ahead!

0 upvotes

I seriously doubt one SLR can spank another but it sounds like an interesting theme for a DPR contest.

1 upvote

@not-sauce

The T4i is a REBEL, hello? The REBEL is Canon's ENTRY LEVEL DSLR. The fact that there are downgrades does NOT change that fact.

0 upvotes

Interesting - modern APS-C sensor losing to an MFT sensor! Based on RAW studio samples, Olympus E-M5 has cleaner output with similar amount of detail at ISO 3200! Considering this is only modern APS-C sensor E-M5 beats, Canon really seems to have failed to improve last few years at the same pace as others.

Maybe the Hybrid AF can skew things to Canon's side for some?

2 upvotes

Yes, it would seem that Canon may have gone to the well too many times with this 18 mp sensor (t2i, t3i, t4i) when you consider the more modern D3200 sensor which pulled down a fantastic overall score on DxOMark, amazingly beating the D7000's overall performance by one point.

3 upvotes

Yeah the 3200 really pushes the iso boundaries....... oh wait it doesn't. Still 24mp's eh wow just what i need...

Personally would put my money somewhere else, and given the rate in which the MFT's are improving time will tell.

Canon's mirrorless must use another sensor..... mustn't it?

0 upvotes

@marike6: Apparently you missed the part where the 24MP D3200 did not provide images any better than the 18MP Canon sensor. Did that slip by ya? Don't get hung up on MP size. it's about quality, not quantity. But if you want to overpay...

Edit: Check out the D3200 review at CameraLabs. It's somewhat comprehensive.

Comment edited 7 minutes after posting

1 upvote

If you want to compare it to a mirrorless camera, you should just wait until Canon comes out with their own mirrorless body. People who like a DSLR will get a DSLR. People who like a MILC will get a MILC.

0 upvotes

I always wanted to upgrade my old Coolpix 5400 to a Rebel. After spend hours reviewing samples, I know now that my next camera will be the Nikon 3200 with Sigma 1.4.

0 upvotes

Hope you don't mean the 30/1.4, it's a poor lens by today's standards. You are far better off getting the Nikon 35/1.8 it's cheaper, smaller and sharper.

2 upvotes

+1 for Nikon 35mm DX.
Can't say for the Sigma 30mm.

0 upvotes

There goes another person getting hung up on MP count. The 24MP did not provide images any better than the 18MP Canon. Save some money and get a Rebel T2i.

2 upvotes

I'm generalizing here but with few exceptions, the words upgrade and Sigma should not be used together.

3 upvotes

I spent hours in Ligtroom using raw samples from http://www.imaging-resource.com/ and Nikon 3200 outperform in everything. Perhaps T4i offer better jpeg because the new DIGIC 5. But I never shoot jpeg.

0 upvotes

Will keep my "old" T2i/550D as nothing justify to move to this latest Rebel body...
Might invest in the coming Canon mirrorless system as a 2nd camera if specs are good ( you never know with Canon....)
Keep in touch !

1 upvote

Nothing except for 5fps and ALL cross type AF points like the 40/50/60D cameras along with better video AF along with a swivel screen and wireless flash control.

Of course, your 550D is a nice camera but the implication that this camera is not an upgrade is a bit dubious.

0 upvotes

What's up with the color from this camera? Why is everything so blue with awful white balance? None of these colors are remotely popping and the contrast looks all washed out too. I would expect results like this from a P&S sensor, not a DSLR. The raw files from my pentax don't need a whole lot for pop and sizzle to occur. If I was getting results like that straight off the camera, I'd be pretty disappointed. Anyone else feel this way? Oh and some of those portraits exhibit a lot of harsh noise even at a reduced resolution on screen. I'd be real afraid to look at them @ 100%. With awesome cameras like the k-5 and d7000 out there, this looks pretty sad in comparison imo. Canon really needs to step up their game.

0 upvotes

Well...nothing new, why isn't there any ISO 3200-6400 shots. It seems that the shooting done in haste and under very taxing lighting conditions ie. very strong back light, white clouds against dimly lit landscape. As if someone was deliberately trying to get un-flattering pictures.

0 upvotes

Don't blame the camera, blame the newbie photog. It's almost as if they recruited kids from the local high school and told them to take some pictures around town. The Canon takes much better pictures than this, I assure you.

0 upvotes

This is a quick *samples* gallery, intended to demonstrate how the camera performs in different conditions, with different subject matter using a typical bundled lens. I am very very far from a 'newbie' photographer, thanks very much. But I have been assessing cameras professionally for a very long time. If I were trying to create a portfolio I'd stick to base ISO settings, shoot only in Raw mode, hire some models, put some better glass on the front of the camera, and spend a lot longer doing it.

Arguably though that wouldn't be a very useful way of introducing you to a sub-$1000 DSLR...

0 upvotes

So will we now see thousands of these Rebels equipped with the low-cost high-f-stop zoom at resorts in Mexico, kid' softball games, the high school musical, JoeJoe's birthday party, and Buffy's wedding?

0 upvotes

Buffy's getting married???

8 upvotes

That damn JoeJoe didn't invite me again... ?

4 upvotes

Canon makes good cameras that appeal to a wide variety of people. So I am sure you will see them all over.

0 upvotes

You mean Canon won't go out of business by the end of the week because their camera is too noisy at 6400?

1 upvote

the majority of these pictures basically stink, why do I need this camera? maybe half the problem is the poster playing around with camera raw with no idea what he's doing

0 upvotes

I don't think the samles are that bad.

0 upvotes

Well you could always look at the untouched originals which are also posted.

Pro Tip: Having both touched/untouched samples shows what you can expect out of the camera and also what you can expect after fixing the cameras errors.

0 upvotes

delete

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 15 minutes after posting

1 upvote

If I had purchased 550d two years ago, I would be lucky user for at least 3 years, knowing that nothing significant is changed. :-)

6 upvotes

I recently bought my Rebel T2i. I couldn't justify spending more on the updated models with basically the same 18mp sensor.

2 upvotes

Ignoring all the other upgrades, the AF is extremely significant. You normally have to jump a whole model line to get better AF.

1 upvote

Sorry, but I think Pentax K-30 will bury the T4i, at least on photography area.

6 upvotes

Alas, it will have very little impact on the sales numbers of the K-30. Until Pentax can figure out what they want to do, until QA and AF issues are resolved, until their lens prices come back down to Earth, and until an upgrade path to FF is open, Pentax will continue to linger in obscurity. Pity, really.

12 upvotes

I do not understand how a enthusiasts crop camera is in any way dependent on the existence of a full frame model? If you want a full frame, then buy one, if you want a crop, you do that. The limited number of people that do actually change from crop to full frame are (1) unlikely to bring their lenses which makes jumping ship rather uneventful, and (2) do not 'upgrade', but simply change; there is a trade-off for both formats. In some situations going from a D800 to a V1 (what a silly name btw) can be considered an upgrade.

3 upvotes

^^ I don't think thats based on any hard facts. I have seen a lot of my friends upgrade to FF from APS-C and most (if not all) had quite a few lenses that they carried over from their APS-C days.

Personally I currently have an APS-C body and while I do have a few APS-C only lenses I do have a Tamron 70-200mm f2.8, 24-70mm f2.8, 85mm f1.4 and a Tamron 90mm f2.8 that I can safely use on a FF camera if I wish to upgrade (I hope to upgrade when Sony makes a FF camera I like !).

If I am a Pentax user and wish to go FF I have to compulsory sell off ALL my Pentax lenses (which could mean a significant loss considering a lot of Pentax lenses actually work fine on 35mm film cameras).

1 upvote

To onlooker : Pentax will be so happy if you do not buy a Pentax.
:)

0 upvotes

judging from Dpreviw studio shots 550D has the best high ISO IQ from all Canon APS-C DSLRs to my eyes
now that's odd

3 upvotes

You are wrong. The best image quality on Canon APS-C sensor is from 7d. It's very very clear.
But when you're talking about image quality, I think that all other canon camera models between 550d to a 7d are thatch.

0 upvotes

According to DxO graphs above 800 ISO 550d has identical SNR (actually bit better at max ISO) identical tonal range and color range but better DR so 550D does have better IQ than 7D at high ISOs

0 upvotes

Perhaps it's only better white balance or better autofocus, but I'm convinced that 7d images are considerably better than 550d images.

0 upvotes

I have both.nope. T2i beats it. Remember 7d leans towards the highs, so u will always see a nice range. But shadows suck. And it's noisy as hell.

I just bought a used t2i. Guess which one Is my go to body now?

1 upvote

Is this still using the same sensor found on the 7D, 60D, t2i(550D), t3i(600D)???

0 upvotes

Yeah, they reached the limits of what they are capable of for now, or they didn't want to usher in the new generation of sensors until the 70D/7D is ready.

4 upvotes

What do you think the 70D resolution will be?

0 upvotes

I don't shoot Canon but after all my research I've concluded that I'd buy a T2i for best bangforthebuck. IOW, I agree with the reply below me.

2 upvotes

Even after two model updates, it appears the Canon T2i STILL provides the most bang for your buck.

5 upvotes

Especially if you can find a decent used one for a good price.

2 upvotes

I got one with a slightly loose grip for 400 from adorama. The regular cost was 499, but the visual discrepancy made it a hard sell. I did a shoot with it and my trusty 24-105 two weeks ago because I don't trust my spotty 7d. It's great ;) I also bought a new one to compare it against, but ended up returning that one.

I'm enjoying the heck out of it. :)

0 upvotes

I can't beleive this. Even the 1100d images have better IQ and noise performance.

2 upvotes

Canon 7D, 60D, 650D...They have never better than 1100d either. Everything was just marketing trick that you all fooled by the marginal noise improvement over well respected 1000d, 1100, 30D or 40D models.

3 upvotes

@BobYIL - since the NEX-5N have a (marginally) larger sensor than all of your mentioned cameras, then why not also a better IQ performance?
Size isn't everything, but NEX got's it's surprises. The sensor is bigger than the one in my 7D etc....!

Edit: IQ added before 'performance'.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

0 upvotes

Han's - I do believe that the Nikon D3200 is 24MP APS-C
Canon APS-C IS a little smaller, but not enough to matter.
Is that's wnat you mean by bigger?

0 upvotes

Something is weird (maybe not) with the Studio tests: JPEG or RAW, @ISO 3200 the Nex-5N is better than the 650D, 600D and Nikon D3200 (colors and noise..)

1 upvote

Well because the Nex 5n has fewer pixels.

So not weird--but normal.

0 upvotes

I think that photo tests must be done with same lens and same F number and same focus point. If not, this tests are not a real thing.
Example: look at the Queen of Hearts head. Canon 7d photo is more in focus than Canon 600d, and Canon 600d is more in focus than a Canon 5dmk2!!! Yes, I know that 5d is full-frame, but if this photo are not a full focus in all photo, that is not comparable.
Anyway, the thing that I can't understand is why at the he heart of the Queen of Hearts there are so noise in canon 600d and 650d while the canon 550 has lower noise and is more similar to canon 7d.

5 upvotes

In this part of the market canon needs to add a little hip factor to the camera, for it to stand out. Specs are outstanding but looks to much like earlier models. Make coloured versions like Pentax, or go retro like Olympus. The rebel isn't much of a rebel any more. People will feel a bit old an boring, walking around with this camera. It doesn't have to be this way.

0 upvotes

From a marketing point of view, i agree with you. And in their Ixus line, Canon seems to show a talent of smart designs.

As a photographer, i'd say if this 650D has a side-hinging monitor with well improved live view and live view-AF, that's quite a difference to all Canon DSLRs before (not the articulating monitor, but the improved live view and live view-AF). For me, as an articulating monitor fundamentalist, it's the first Canon system camera that vaguely interests me (of course Canon's upcoming mirrorless system might be much more interesting).

0 upvotes

They reduced banding? I saw it in the coastline shot in RAW where the shadows were obviously pulled vs SOOC, and I see it in the dpstudio RAW when I import it into LR and pull shadows + 100. At the cost of reducing banding I do think either there is a discrepancy in lighting or lens/body calibration or there is something causing more noise at high ISO by default.

On more examination of the ISO 100 shot, it is interesting to note the 650D is exposed differently with faster shutter speed...it actually is brighter *with* a faster shutter speed using the 50mm 1.4. Again maybe variation in lens or lighting...or sensor.

Actually I'll have to look further at RAW files, I don't think the 600D at ISO 100 had much banding either in the shadows.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 11 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

Well, I disagree. Without looking at the circuitry and noise patterns, we can't simply conclude that whether there is an improvement or not. The two mentioned cameras might share the same sensor but might have different, cheaper or better IC design.

0 upvotes

I'll let someone more experienced examine the RAWs...to me it looked like the 650D has the higher shutter speed for the same ISO and aperture but ended up with a better exposed shot as well. In addition the coastline picture is noisy, but I don't see banding...I've seen it rear its head plenty of times on my 600D and can get it to show up on the 5DMK II, but I'm not 100% sure what conditions make it appear easily...usually I would think a +100 shadow pull does it, but it didn't for either on the RAWs I just looked at.

0 upvotes

let's be honest
I don't see any improvement regarding the image quality or noise in 650D over the 600D!!!! even i noticed the noise is higher and IQ iis lower than 600D, so we can conclude that the sensor on both devices is same or at least nothing has changed regarding the ISO or noise or IQ

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting

2 upvotes

Look like the RAW image from 650D in studio comparison is out of focus. It is blurry if we move to the dog's nose.

I believe DPreview will confirm it soon!!

2 upvotes

I was thinking the same thing. I could not find a place on the studio comparison image for the 650D that look like it was sharp.

0 upvotes

Actually the one spot that I thought it looked sharper than the 600D was the watch face. "Paul Smith" looks marginally sharper to my eyes anyway, although I prefer the color rendering of the 600D better.

0 upvotes

I hope DPreview is smart enough to test the Continous focus of the camera.( in video mode )
Sometimes it seems DPreview forgot whats the KEY technology of the camera being reviewed.

Just because in the past they didn't test for something, they seem to forget that they need to review the key feature for a certain camera.....

0 upvotes

I don't get why people think this camera is "pointless" or "irrelevant". The multiple cross-type AF points and the main-sensor PDAF make it far more appealing than any previous camera in the series, and a more than competitive offering from Canon. Nothing is really wrong with this camera, except for those into pixel peeping rather than photography.

11 upvotes

That'S what I think too.
I am a Nikon user right now but if I'd get a new camera now it'd propably be this one. There has been little progress in the last couple of years compared to say 2004-2010 but still, the 650 looks pretty interesting, especially if the 18-135 lens is good, would make for a nice kit.

2 upvotes

Agreed
This is one of the best value camera from Canon right now.

Its silly to pass out on this bargain.
All those great features at such a price is NEVER heard off before.

I have the 60D and I am thinking, maybe I should have this as a backup camera

1 upvote

@Prognathous

Fair enough if you're only comparing it to previous Canon cameras but as you likely know, 9 cross type AF points were available from entry level DSLR's way back in 2004. We either congratulate Canon on catching up with 2004 entry level cameras, (in terms of AF points), or note that Canon's overcrowded APS-C line up means that many features that have been available for a long time on other systems, get held back to provide differentiation.

Canon's point of difference in recent years has been all about video. And if you don't care too much for video then there's very little of interest from this and other recent APS-C bodies.

5 upvotes

LOL, it's too expensive. Look at the Pentax K-30, that's a semi-pro APS-C DSLR that costs less than this cheap-o-plastic Canon with sh*tty ergonomics.

8 upvotes

1000 dollars for this is no bargain, to call it so is silly.

2 upvotes

While Nikon is releasing the D3200 and Pentax the K30, is it really yet another Rebel pointless iteration the best Canon can come up with?

2 upvotes

Have you looked at the spec? It's actually a pretty impressive little camera. Far from 'pointless', anyway.

8 upvotes

It IS pointless looking at the price.

2 upvotes

Wow. Nice defending the brand. Would say the same thing about any Pentax cameras. I don't think so.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

1 upvote

@fisherman - what are you talking about? I'm not defending the brand, I'm trying to bring some perspective to this discussion. The 650D is a very interesting little camera with some nice technology, that I'm looking forward to using more. Same goes for the K-30 (which is also in the reviews queue). Relax...

4 upvotes

Another irrelevant DSLR from Canon.

Won't stop it from being a top seller though.

13 upvotes

Truer words have never been spoken.

0 upvotes

Exactly my feelings

0 upvotes

Surely if it is a top seller that makes it very relevant...

I think you have your definition of relevance backwards.

7 upvotes

@Thorbard

If you consider popularity relevant to purchasing then I take your point. Personally I don't though.

But back to the 650D.....examine the IQ in the sample images, look at the specifications sheet, and now imagine for a few moments that this camera was actually released by Olympus or Pentax or Samsung.

Does it still look relevant to you?

0 upvotes

@Thorbard

Quite the opposite. My definition of relevance points in the direction I want it to point, which is that of the consumer I am.

I don't care if it makes Canon truckloads of money. I understand they may see things from a different perspective, but to me, this camera brings nothing I want at that pricepoint.

Comment edited 45 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

:) then it is "IMHO" , don't throw big word, since no one care about where you are pointing at :)

0 upvotes

What's happening to Canon... I hope this doesn't end up as "just another Rebel so they can replace the older one"

4 upvotes

In the RAW comparison, from ISO 1600 on up, the 650D image is noticeably worse than the 600D.

Comment edited 17 seconds after posting

7 upvotes

Am I not the only One to see it? :))

2 upvotes

yes, exactly! it is supposed to have the same quality at least..

2 upvotes

Yes I agree, it's worse than 600D, 60D and 7D. Yikes, what's going on Canon? We had expected much more from digic V and 5D III sensor is better at high ISO than 5D II and 1D X is even better again.

All I can hope is that 650D ISO is accurate and 600D ISO is overstating it's true value, which is the case for most Canon cameras. Need to look at RAW images and check exposure data

3 upvotes

I've never seen so many blurry and noisy pics! I'm surprised DPR posted them. I was ready to pull the trigger as a back up to my 60D but now I'm in doubt. Maybe I'd better wait before I make my final decision.

Katy

0 upvotes

I honestly think the 650D shots might be out of focus. DPR should re-shoot them just to make sure. I can't believe the 650D is really that bad compared to the 600D.

Comment edited 9 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

another so so camera. Anyway, canon just prepare massive advertisement to gain huge money from beginners and loyalist who have no idea about camera.

10 upvotes

The "real world studio comparisons" certainly are disappointing.
The older 600D looks like it gets better results.

1 upvote

There's no such thing. We've published real-world samples and studio comparisons.

2 upvotes

Is this camera really this bad?

3 upvotes

I'd wait for final reviews and firsthand experience at shops before judging....

0 upvotes

I don't know... for $100 more the weather sealed 60D is starting to look like a real bargain.

Unless you absolutely need to have a camera with a smartphone screen.

2 upvotes

The 60D is not weather sealed. In fact, no Canon camera other than the 1 series is weather sealed. The 7 and 5 series have enhanced environmental sealing which helps a great deal, but are not fully weather sealed.

Another misconception is that all L lenses are weather sealed, they are not. Only some are and then not fully.

3 upvotes

60d has weather sealing - I just bought one after comparing it to the newest rebel - i can see it.
Does that mean water proof? no,
And yes, the more upmarket bodies have more sealing.
But Marty's comment is generally valid in that he's getting more body quality and durability in the 60D than the rebel.

0 upvotes

The 60D has some weather sealing thus the enhanced environmental sealing that is claimed (compared to older models), but is not weather sealed. It cannot be considered a weather sealed camera. Anyway, no SLR is water proof, but some are sealed far better than others. The 60D simply is not weather sealed, it has just a few seals with the rest being tighter seams to help keep out nature.

Marty's comment is indeed invalid when the 60D is claimed to be weather sealed. If however as you say, his comment is about the 60D being a better camera due to construction, then yes his comment is valid. However, your interpretation was not the comment he made. His comment was incorrect which is why I gave my reply. Nothing against the 60D. I think it's an excellent camera. I just wanted to correct the misinformation.

0 upvotes

Here in Japan at least, the 650D is more expensive than the 60D.
What's going on? It's like XXD series is getting phased out for a Rebel or 7D option.

0 upvotes

That's probably because the 60D is now discounted, and the 650D is "hot off the presses" and selling for full list price.

But I agree.... it's almost like Canon is trying to make their XXD series redundant by beefing up their XXD series.

Unless... the 70D is a killer camera, there may be no need for one.

0 upvotes

Maybe "introductory price" premiums?

0 upvotes

The 60D wasn't selling good at all until Canon discounted it, and then they expect people to pay more for the next Rebel, X6i.
They already took out the micro focus adjust and both cameras share so much alike now.
Yes, I'm interested in whatever the 70D will look like

0 upvotes

Lets remember that "Real World" photo opportunities are in reality bland and mediocre.

.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting

3 upvotes

Sometimes, when I've spent a weekend of my own time fitting sample images around other plans, I get the feeling that I may as well just not bother...

These are *sample images* designed to show how the camera copes with different lighting environments and subject choices. Low contrast, high-contrast, low light, bright light, etc.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting

12 upvotes

Barney, I'm not seeing what others are seeing but the concerns have to do with the camera's capability, not the photographer's, if i am reading this right.

4 upvotes

Barney, thanks very much for your efforts. I appreciate the samples and I'm sure I'm not alone. They accurately reflect how most cameras are used.

6 upvotes

Barney, this posters comment is a throw away insult that ingores the purpose of the samples. I wonder why you even post it or don't delete it.

1 upvote

Thanks Barney!!!!!

0 upvotes

one word - TERRIBLE !

6 upvotes

make that two words, ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE !

5 upvotes

Whenever I use the Studio Comparison Tool the first thing I do is drag the preview box over to the Queen of Hearts head and the heart. This usually tells me a lot. Here it's telling me that the 600D is sharper and the colors cleaner vs the 650D.

4 upvotes

It's like i'm wearing a bad pair of prescription glasses, everything is soft but my eyes are trying to pull in the clarity, it's annoying. PASS!!!

2 upvotes

It could be sample variation, but I also thought the 650D looks worse than the 600D at both low and high ISOs. Not by much, but noticeable. I wonder if the pixels stolen to do the hybrid autofocus are reducing quality?

4 upvotes

Despite much needed features (especially autofocus during video), 600D seems to look better than 650D. I wonder why.

2 upvotes


Video tests of the Canon EOS 650D / Rebel T4i's Hybrid autofocus system Aug 15, 2012	Canon issues allergy warning for EOS 650D/Rebel T4i Jul 10, 2012	Just Posted: Canon Rebel T4i / EOS 650D preview with real-world samples Jun 8, 2012	Canon announces EOS 650D / Rebel T4i 18MP touch-screen DSLR with Hybrid AF Jun 8, 2012

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Canon EOS 650D preview updated with studio and real-world samples

Canon EOS 650D (EOS Rebel T4i / EOS Kiss X6i)

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