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Sigma announces details of support program for full-price SD1 buyers

Mar 9, 2012 at 02:04:28 GMT

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Sigma has announced details of the promised support scheme for customers who bought the company's SD1 DSLR prior to the price cut. Buyers of the SD1 at the original price of $6,899 can claim 40 'points' that can be redeemed against other Sigma products. The points are worth up to around ¥400,000 (roughly $4800) when used against Sigma products at their MSRP on the day the SD1 price cut was announced. Customers have until May 31st to register for the offer.

The offer is valid irrespective of where the camera was bought. SD1 Merrill buyers are not eligible for the program.

Click here for more details from Sigma USA

Click here for details from Sigma UK

Comments

Total comments: 87

I don't think Sigma's own DSLR-lenses are capable of yielding good images on the SD1. Almost every image I have seen from the SD1 have been soft and blurry in the corners. I think the DP1 and DP2 Merill cameras will be a completely different story. My DP2 is razor sharp all over.

0 upvotes

Now that is what I call extensive customer support. Shows that Sigma does indeed care for people that buy their products. Some other companies should really take Sigma as an exmaple consideriung such issues.

0 upvotes

you guys are daft to sink a bunch of money into sigma lenses. they could stop this experiment in a 3rd part lens producer building cameras any day and you will never get an upgraded body again

1 upvote

Look up Sigma SA-300, SA-5, SA-7 and SA-9. It's not like the Sigma CEO woke up one day and thought: "Hey, let's make a DSLR!"

They seem to be doing quite well for themselves, and it also seems that when they decided to make SD-9, they made a conscious decision to choose a unique sensor rather than the commonly used Sony ICX413AQ or anything else.

They seem to be doing well enough to have been able to buy Foveon, after all.

1 upvote

Just bought a D3s second hand in top shape for just €900. How does that compare to a almost six times more expensive Sigma? Even if the latter is brand new (27.000 shuttercounts on a D3s is nothing).

0 upvotes

I got a used Canon EOS-1 Ds from my uncle for free! How does that compare to your Nikon???
Such comparisons do not hold water. Sigma management apparently made a serious blunder. However, the SD1 is what it is and if you want that specific sensor you will pay the price.

0 upvotes

Any rebates on the D3X?

1 upvote

Dang it!!
Can Sigma go back to the original price for a day so I can buy one and get the $4,800 worth of more Sigma stuff?

I guess not. Too late for me. I'll just have to go to a corner and pout.

OK, seriously, I think it is an unusual kind of support to the customer. Thumbs up to such an initiative.

I agree that a lens adapter would be a great idea. Many people already have the expensive Canon or Nikon lenses (and a dozen people or less have Leica's, j/k).

Good job, Sigma. Now go make the adapter & watch the SD1 sales graph shooting up rapidly!!

1 upvote

given sigma's msrps this is more like 2500 bucks

1 upvote

It's not technically possible to create an adapter for Canon (same flange distance) unless it also contained a teleconverter, Other DSLRs may be possible but the adapter would be extremely thin and be manual operation only.

FYI the Sigma mount is actually physically identical to the Canon EF mount, but uses a different electronic protocol so isn't compatible.

0 upvotes

@Andy: You got it the wrong way around. The Mount is similar to Pentax K, the Protocol is the Canon EOS protocol...

0 upvotes

I still think the dumbest move they made was not releasing this camera with the option of Nikon or Canon mounts.

Many more people might have considered it if they had been able to do so without needing to buy Sigma lenses just to put on it - and the Nikon and Canon glass would usually outperform the Sigma glass so the results might have been even better.

0 upvotes

I couldn't agree more. If it came with an optional Nikon or Leica R-mount, I would have bought it instantly.

0 upvotes

Leica R? You really think the five users of that system would buy a reduced frame Sigma?

I agree about Nikon and Canon mounts, though. Heck, it would be great if Sigma made a slightly shorter flange distance mount and supplied adapters for any lens (or sold them as accessories).

1 upvote

I doubt that Nikon and Canon would allow Sigma to take such a move. F-mounts and EF-mounts aren't 'open' systems.

Comment edited 27 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

They're not open systems, yet Sigma freely makes lenses compatible with them.

BTW, remember Kodak DSLR/c? That one wasn't made by Canon or in any collaboration with them.

There's nothing preventing Sigma from making cameras like these, it just depends on market acceptance.

0 upvotes

R&D for the new sensor is a sunk cost, but manufacturing costs do affect the final price. SD1 had to have razor-thin margins. It now finally makes sense.
Sigma sells thousands, not millions, of cameras. Note that they didn't make 15 megapixel versions of DP1 or DP2 until now -- they wouldn't sell at all.
Time passed, development went on, and now Sigma is finally able to sell SD1 at sensible prices.
Arguing for lower price of the original SD1 is simply daft. Especially if by a factor of ten. Maybe that's what it's worth to the mass market. But lowering the price would cause them to lose thousands on every camera sold, and if more people bought them, the sooner would Sigma go under.
Sigma released the original SD1 as a matter of pride and ongoing support to those few photographers that have already heavily invested in Sigma gear.
In that way, SD1 has fulfilled its role and I for one applaud Sigma for releasing it, more so now that they really show their support to long-time Sigma users.

2 upvotes

Sigma have to be applauded for this offer, it is a genuine gesture of good faith to their customers......it is a pity more companies do not show the same level of commitment to their customers.

8 upvotes

They can afford to do this because...frankly, very few bought the body at $10k or $6.9k.

2 upvotes

Unusual of any major brand name manufacturer to do this, but at least it is a welcome gesture to those who purchased in good faith.

2 upvotes

It needs a canon mount so you can seamlessly use the much better L lenses with this excellent sensor. Sigma already uses a modified canon architecture for their firmware, I doubt that it'd be hard to get EF lenses to talk to it.

1 upvote

I had the opportunity to shoot with an SD1 for a month on loan. I shoot with a Canon 5D MK II and am very happy with it. However as a result of my experience with the SD1---I'm going to purchase one. Here is one of the images I shot with the SD1. http://www.pbase.com/garydmercer/image/141835496. It is one of many test shot images I posted from the SD1. It performed wonderfully with a prime 50mm prime lens. I love the build and the camera has one of the quietest silkiest shutters I've ever experienced in a DSLR.
The SD1 is a success and the price drop was a good move by Sigma in addition to the support program for buyers who paid the higher price. Smart move Sigma!

1 upvote

Gary, all your SD1-images are only sharp in the center. The corners are all soft and out of focus and full of CA. Why is that? I suspect Sigma lenses are not able to do the SD1's sensor justice. Have you tried Leica R-lenses via an adapter?

0 upvotes

I think its great that they are doing that. Nikon and Canon wouldn't have done that, They would have just said too bad so sad. I could easily find $4800 dollars worth of Sigma products to use it on.

1 upvote

Who is running this company, Moe, Larry, or Curly?

2 upvotes

I think it's Curly.
...so it was a "lets see who is dumb enough to buy it at this price" campaign.
Curly: 1 Customers: 0

Comment edited 24 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

Sigma is never going to be a success.

1 upvote

Sigma has been around since 1961, I'd hardly say they are not a success.

5 upvotes

Sigma is the largest privately owned third party lens manufacturer in the world. They sell over 40 different lenses including two DSLR cameras. Sounds successful to me.

2 upvotes

What I meant was Sigma SD1 is never going to be a success because the company screwed up everything from the start with the ridiculous high price. In the mean time things have evolved a lot with so many new and professional options at a sane price.

1 upvote

This is way too late. Other new FF cameras, real FF cameras, are here. What was Sigma thinking when they released a camera at that price in the first place. and what is it thinking now? I don't know how much they researched market conditions, the economic climate, and photographers' needs and affordability. I am sure of just one thing, what it thinks of photographers' intelligence.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Given that the brand loyalists were the ones buying at the highest price it is a stand up move by Sigma--and nececessary one so as to not alienate these people. No move by Sigma is going to make everyone happy or feel 'whole' for the price drop, however, it is done. For me, I am interested in the new use of the sensor in the compact camera...but I will be wary of the price at release.

0 upvotes

I think Sigma should do the really honest thing and refund the money they ripped off people IN CASH. None of this "as long as you buy more of our products" rubbish! This is dispicable. My opinion of Sigma has just hit rock bottom.

1 upvote

Those who purchased the camera at the original price were aware of what they were buying and of what the features were, and decided it was worth it. All electronics devalue, and a rapid price drop like this seems extreme, but is really no different. Getting a bonus of $4800 worth of lenses, accessories, cameras, whatever, is a pretty good deal for someone who bought this camera because they were satisfied with what they were getting at the original price.

5 upvotes

If the people who bought the SD1 at the original price wanted their dollars more than that camera, then they would have kept them and not bought the camera. I don't think Sigma owes them anything, but since people will "feel" ripped off by it, it makes sense for them to offer something.

2 upvotes

I think it's commendable that Sigma does this.
You now have credit towards more Simga products and as a SD owner it has true value......very good move on Sigmas part overall.
A ff Foveon would truly be impressive and I'm sure it's being considered.....good luck to Simga.

0 upvotes

Sigma, did you forget to do market research? If yes, we are telling you we need an affordable FF.

2 upvotes

Im impressed by Sigma. Thats new..

0 upvotes

Sigma, try tu put on the market a affordable FF, and maybe you win the race at a affordable FF camera.Canon and Nikon have pretty nose prancing to take this step. Anyway, who buy a Sigma SD1 at this price tag of $6,899, when Nikon put a D4 for 6k, and a D800 for 3k, and Canon with 3.3k?

3 upvotes

I'm sure both buyers will be very pleased.

8 upvotes

totally embarrassing for Sigma imo, those SD1s must be in a warehouse collecting layers of dust for them to slash prices like this, the original price was beyond wacko and so is this price cut totally beyond wacko again

0 upvotes

nope. companies large enough as Sigma knows what they're doing such as setting a ridiculous price. the original price and price cut is going according to plan.

0 upvotes

Sigma is not large and as for the price, they simply could not miss by this much and have had some elaborate, clever plan. They goofed, plain and simple. They are also hobbled by their name (reputation) which, fairly or unfairly is not the best.

1 upvote

no way they knew. the price drop is because they werent selling. and they are not selling because the sensor is to small. a dx sensor at this price point is fu-cking nuts

0 upvotes

I wonder how many people actually bought the camera at its original price. I reckon not too many, because sales were so bad that they had to slash the price. The Foveon sensor is simply too small to be competitive. This camera has the biggest sensor Sigma has ever put in a DSLR, but it is still too small at 1.5x crop. Perhaps Sigma should explore the idea of a full frame Bayer sensor instead of sticking with the Foveon only strategy.

0 upvotes

Yes, it is the biggest sensor Sigma ever had. You're probably right, Foveon sensor weakness is ISO performance. To be competitive to what Sony produces now and the future, Sigma really need FF sensor size to increase pixel sensitivity.

0 upvotes

Amazing.

A camera company fixes a problem, really fixes a problem, and many people bad mouth Sigma.

This will help all of us because now Sigma set a precedent.

Thank you Sigma.

7 upvotes

Does this cam run out at ISO 200 also?

0 upvotes

Congratulation early adopters. You now have a the possibility to get some quality glass and one more SD1 for free. And congratulations Sigma for a wise move.

1 upvote

i admire foveon cos' which reproduce the colour pretty much like slide photo. i'm using leica m6, dp1 and dp2, i don't have any nikon and canon lenses, so i'm considering to buy this new sd1 while it's now drop to a reasonable price.

0 upvotes

This camera has been discontinued...? Surely was not a huge success...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/736546-REG/Sigma_SD1_Digital_SLR_Camera.html

0 upvotes

It's being replaced by the same camera with a different name without the stupid price: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/846208-REG/Sigma_C26900_SD1_Merrill_Digital_SLR.html

1 upvote

What's so special about Sigma anyway?

0 upvotes

The special about Sigma is that they use Foveon sensors. The special about Foveon sensor is that they have full resolution for chrominance.

2 upvotes

Simply put.

You dont need Bayer interpolation, you dont need AA filter. You just need freakishly good lens. :D

And some color profiling would help.

0 upvotes

Sigma's following HP path: no buyers - offer a deep discount, still no buyers - start a fire sale and liquidate the stock. Next announcement will be $1000 per body.

3 upvotes

Sigma sd14 was like 2500 camera and I bought it new at $350 on one of those fire sales. Still pretty lousy camera.

0 upvotes

$120 per point.

0 upvotes

Posted here,,,,,as found below.. http://www.sigma-sd.com/SD1/sample-photo/index.html

0 upvotes

These images posted are very FINE. The only question I have ,,, WHY IS THIS CAMERA NOT FULL FRAME?????? The IQ is OUT STANDING !!!! Make it full frame Please. The horse is just - WOW... My SD14 Camera I Q is better than any half frame camera I have ever used, and this one looks better than most full frame cameras I have seen. Now if it was full frame >it would be the leader of the pack in IQ with out any equal..

0 upvotes

If it was a full-frame, the body would be 1.5 times bigger, and the glass twice as big. List price would probably top 10 grand. No one would buy such a product.

0 upvotes

I think they will....to keep up with the competition.

0 upvotes

Cause creating these sensors is hard even at APS-C size. I guess they would need to use sensor stitching for full-frame. Which is possible, so eventually we might see some 32-36 mpix FF from Sigma.

1 upvote

Except Sigma MSRP prices are the worst! Its worth more like $2500 street dollars.

1 upvote

I guess nobody bought it at $6900 price, that's why they did it.

0 upvotes

Some actually did. But your point is still valid - it was probably not many. So - this gesture costs less than its value for the company. It was a clever move. ---- You also have to understand that those that bought the cameras at full price was die hard fans and probably personally knows some at Sigma. Not giving this refund would maybe hav lost some faithful friends.

0 upvotes

Good move by Sigma. They are putting their money where their mouth is. A lot of other companies should do this. As to who would buy this camera for $7000 well depends on what you wanted. Some people buy cameras for a specific output not a gazilion FPS and MP and being able to say ‘Me to.”

1 upvote

ok, somebody find out how many SD1 were sold!

1 upvote

Both people who bought at MSRP will receive a discount and a memorial plaque.

4 upvotes

Thats a sensitive question. Some bought it a full price, but some probably got it at reduced price or even for free. And, for some reason, people are so silly that this fact matters. So - it is very hard to find out who really bought it. Several people that have an SD1 has fled the Sigma SLR forum. No posts and no images. Its a pity really. I wish the world was different.

1 upvote

who would buy a SD1 for $7000???? bunch of morons.

5 upvotes

The value of a dollar is relative to the number of dollars you have, so to some people $7,000 is like a cup of coffee. If you're rich, paying $7,000 for a unique piece of technology doesn't make you a moron. On the other hand, if you mortgaged your house to get an SD1, yes — you may be a moron.

6 upvotes

If one wants photos to have that look and gets paid for that look.

0 upvotes

Whoever wanted it more than $7000. There might be several reasons. Who are we to call people morons because they do what we would not do?

2 upvotes

Good photographer needs just few weddings/portrait/studio sessions to get that amount of money.

Its not affordable for lower end of market, but then its not intended for that end.

There are ppl with S2 and they have that cause their work can pay it. Same goes with Phase One backs etc.

Comment edited 15 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

nah superhokie was right,,if anyone bought it for the RRP..they were morons

0 upvotes

that's really good. i thought you would only be able to buy a couple of sigma pens and coffee cups with 40 points.

Comment edited 14 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

I'd imagine that this announcement is primarily PR fodder to show how much of a good company that they are.

The total loss from this is going to be quite minimal since, I'm sure, almost no one bought the camera at its original price.

6 upvotes

you will be surprised by the number of people who actually did buy SD1 at its original price.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

I was actually surprised ot see the image qualtiy of samples at http://www.sigma-sd.com/SD1/sample-photo/index.html

0 upvotes

@ Khizer, thanks for posting that link for SD1 sample images. WOW! the details is incredible and it's in MF territory.

0 upvotes

You better have a look at MF samples. The Sigma is nowhere near those levels of detail. Just wishful thinking.

0 upvotes

Sigma is actually better. MF backs are using regular Bayer, which means colors cant be that good and per-pixel sharpness neither.

And then theres problem with what you can do with MF back and what you cant. What Sigma and MF backs share is dependancy on really good lens.

There it ends, cause with MF backs you will constantly fight with focusing and you need to have sensor perfectly in plane of focus. Which leads to some really special solutions - like ALPA products to achieve desired results. MF photography is not easy, quite opposite of it, its much harder than using full-frames or APS-C dSLRs.

SD-1 in theory is much easier to handle, and you probably just need to have good enough lens. Sensor is smaller and hopefully calibrated to be in plane of focus (should be much easier cause of size). You can take it anywhere and shoot just from hand without need of tripod.

Only thing you wont get with Sigma is MF look, cause sensor is small. But I think its worth it.

1 upvote

@Mescalamba
great points and just to add a bit, the cost of the SD1 is now in the affordable area compared even to the cheapest MF.The lenses for the SD1 are way cheaper than anything from the MF cameras so the Sigma really represents great value for those who want image quality that is close to MF quality without breaking the bank

0 upvotes

Yea price/image quality ratio will be probably main selling point, only "bad" thing is that SD1 shares same weaknes as most MF back, which is pretty bad high ISO capability.

But maybe it wont be that bad, cause if they are capable of producing more SD1s at lower price, then they probably improved process which might end in real SD-1 being better than those samples.

Tho it wont change that tiny fact, that it will be mostly base ISO and manual focus camera, cause Sigma lens simply cant handle this, unless they will release some SD1 ready lens..

Still very tempting camera as I like to shoot landscapes..

0 upvotes

no this makes them look like fools in alot of ways. they did this to quell the anger of there most ardent followers who bought one

0 upvotes

That sounds pretty good for their customers and their business. Not bad.

0 upvotes

Total comments: 87


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