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GaryJP
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TV Production, Directing, Shooting, Editing
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sebastian huvenaars: I'm pretty confident Adobe is getting the underlaying message in this article.
Cudos to DPR for making such a statement :)
"Stu is right this time. The anger is fading fast." You are both wrong. Many have taken it to other venues, such as Adobe's own Facebook page and Forums. Some are now deciding that WHATEVER Adobe does it has screwed the pooch regarding trust. Others are already paying for and downloading alternatives to try. Once one has stated one will NOT rent software, it's time to wait and see what happens to Adobe and meanwhile make other plans. I have just bought three Adobe alternatives and the total bill does not amount to seven months of hiring Photoshop. I am also glad to put my money to supporting anyone BUT Adobe. Stu meanwhile seems to have his life savings in Adobe stock.
And with regard to MarcLee's point, I can tell you that even many large companies will look for alternatives to open-ended, unilaterally-changeable, subscription services that leave an entire company's files vulnerable at the whim of Adobe. Even if the art department wants it, the accounts department often will not.
lightnfast: What I see is a War....it is between the ones who bootleg, and the companies who try to curb it. But in that process they see away to sure up the bottom line. They use the excuse of what Adobe is doing, and it will slightly hamper the bootleggers and hackers for a while, but will not work. And they found out a way to increase their profits under this blackmail. So their Greed is one of the biggest driving forces behind their changing things around. Instead of making a smaller profit and selling oodles more of this software, make it more cost 'friendly', they would in turn sell a lot of products, and in affect curb the bootlegging and hacking some. But it is human nature to unlock the lock...
Quit with the "piracy" myth. Adobe have admitted this will do nothing to curb piracy. In fact, it will not only boost it, it will make the pirates look like Robin Hood.
madeinlisboa: Dpreview do you have something against Nikon's brilliant tool CaptureNX?
" if Adobe increase the prices a lot as soon as people get to the end of their 12 month subscriptions they will go elsewhere so that is a good enough reason for Adobe to be careful with any price increase." Dream on Stu. If a 200% increase does not result in a 50% loss in user base, then it is a bargain for Adobe. And results in less strain on the servers. And subscribers are locked in.
Photomonkey: For all the anger directed at Adobe there are precious few real full featured alternatives to PS.
The GIMP might be the best but as it STILL does not have 16 bit support it falls short as a pro app for me.
I use a number of features in PS that may be available in other apps but it took me years to get my skills honed in PS and I have little enthusiasm for starting all over in some app that may not have what I need.
As a working pro I need PS but at the moment I don't need to upgrade. If I had been cutting corners by hanging on to CS3 I may be a bit peeved.
When a major upgrade comes to PS I will move to the subscription model because I will have to. BUT the upgrade will have to be magical.
Which of course is supposed to be one of the benefits of the cloud for team projects. But keep cheering Adobe on Stu.
Photomonkey: For all the anger directed at Adobe there are precious few real full featured alternatives to PS.
The GIMP might be the best but as it STILL does not have 16 bit support it falls short as a pro app for me.
I use a number of features in PS that may be available in other apps but it took me years to get my skills honed in PS and I have little enthusiasm for starting all over in some app that may not have what I need.
As a working pro I need PS but at the moment I don't need to upgrade. If I had been cutting corners by hanging on to CS3 I may be a bit peeved.
When a major upgrade comes to PS I will move to the subscription model because I will have to. BUT the upgrade will have to be magical.
Stu5, "Switching to another editor like Serif as you say will have a learning curve and that learning curve cost time and that time equals lost earnings which will amount to lost dollars"
Like the earnings lost and the deadlines possibly missed because the Creative Cloud just has NOT been functioning for many users over the past week or so?
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/17/adobe_creative_cloud_problem/
If you are not happy with where a company is going ANY time spent making your business rely on them more is wasted.
Photomonkey: For all the anger directed at Adobe there are precious few real full featured alternatives to PS.
The GIMP might be the best but as it STILL does not have 16 bit support it falls short as a pro app for me.
I use a number of features in PS that may be available in other apps but it took me years to get my skills honed in PS and I have little enthusiasm for starting all over in some app that may not have what I need.
As a working pro I need PS but at the moment I don't need to upgrade. If I had been cutting corners by hanging on to CS3 I may be a bit peeved.
When a major upgrade comes to PS I will move to the subscription model because I will have to. BUT the upgrade will have to be magical.
It must be wonderfully reassuring to believe the sun shines out of the nether regions of Adobe executives.
MarcLee: To the people whining about "the competition does not have this", or "the competition does not have that", get real. Unless you buy a high end camera, your camera does not have a bunch of functions that owners of a 1DX for example have. Sometimes not spending so much has a small disadvantage. Taking a stand against greed may involve a little sacrifice. It's this attitude that has made Adobe the monster it is. Let the suckers pay Adobe's overheads for less innovation. There is plenty of software out there to do MOST of what MOST people need. Support it and it will do more. Find out what you need. And buy it. I would like a 5D MK III to cost no more than my point and shoot. Guess what? It ain't going to happen.
I am afraid Americans have only limited knowledge of Adobe's greed. See how much you have to pay for their products in Europe or - until recently - Australia.
MarcLee: Looking at the zeal with which some here defend Adobe's rights to restrict the choices of its longtime customers, and basically tell them to FOAD, it is hardly surprising Adobe uses the term "evangelists".
Josh, I think wee'll see where "sense" falls out in all this. People are NOT signing Adobe's new lopsided agreement and voicing their opinions. And you seem to think that because people may have accepted unfair terms in the past, they have no reason to complain about even more unethical terms now. It's a unique twist on logic.
The joys of the "Cloud".
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/17/adobe_creative_cloud_problem/
Missing a deadline for a big client or a broadcast time due to something like this could shut down a small company.
MarcLee: To the people whining about "the competition does not have this", or "the competition does not have that", get real. Unless you buy a high end camera, your camera does not have a bunch of functions that owners of a 1DX for example have. Sometimes not spending so much has a small disadvantage. Taking a stand against greed may involve a little sacrifice. It's this attitude that has made Adobe the monster it is. Let the suckers pay Adobe's overheads for less innovation. There is plenty of software out there to do MOST of what MOST people need. Support it and it will do more. Find out what you need. And buy it. I would like a 5D MK III to cost no more than my point and shoot. Guess what? It ain't going to happen.
Exactly. And also, any company's behaviour and sense of ethics has to be one important consideration in a buying assessment. No less for large companies than for individuals. No software can offer 100% future proofing, but Adobe isn't offering you future proofing you can believe in beyond a year or so. They have shown how they will screw us if given the chance.
Maybe we should have a software forum called "Anything but Adobe."
Brubaker: Corel are an appalling company!!!
I got the original AfterShot and found it would not open DNG files so I got a refund. The reason being that I use Olympus, Nikon and Fuji cameras - all shot in RAW so I convert and archive all to DNG's.
I was convinced a few weeks ago that Corel had fixed this and indeed their advert says it processes DNG's - so like an idiot I bought it - I had to as I'd previously used it (12 months ago) it would not let me have another trial (see someone else's comment). What do you know - it won't open DNG files at all. Corel suppor just keep saying "your camera is not listed" - they have no comprehension of their own product or it seems UK consumer law - which is where this is going.
Not as appalling as Adobe.
Nigel Wilkins: One benefit to Adobe for creating the subscription model that hasn't been mentioned as far as I've read so far, is the added attraction to corporate users of improved cash flow. If they only have to pay say $50 a month rather than the full price all in one go, they get to keep their cash for longer. They can also pay only when they need it for specific projects. This is a massive incentive for a company to invest in the software.
Lightroom on the other hand, is cheap, so there's no reason to think it'll go the same way, unless it grows into something more substantial, which is unlikely since it's only a database & RAW converter.
Anticipate change & all will be ok, rather than having change forced on you.
Love how people keep coming up with the red herring that this is about resisting change. It seems to be an Asobe talking point. No. It is about there being good change and bad change.
Lea5: To STU 5. You CAN run Corel DRAW on a Mac. Read:
http://corelblogs.wordpress.com/2013/05/13/you-can-run-coreldraw-on-a-mac/
And the most important statements:
"We also make sure to test new releases on our design software on Apple computers."
and
"Adobe’s recent announcement will put the discussion back on the table."
Every product gets some one star reviews. What's significant about you Stu, is you only read 5 star reviews of Adobe and only read one star reviews of the competition.
Josh152: As aside note can we please stop calling anyone who isn't' acting like adobe is the next incarnation of Satan and instead is taking a more objective view of the situation a troll or adobe shill? It just makes everyone, even people with legitimate concerns, seem like ignorant children afraid of change.
Sorry, but you are wrong. There is really no evidence that Premiere is making serious inroads in movie production. And I have UK contacts as well as Hong Kong ones. I like Premiere myself, although I will be dropping it now. But the fact is if you are a young editor and you decide to break into the industry by learning Premiere you are not very wise. And even less so after the subscription mode.
And yes, the metaphor applies. When a company is no longer upgrading software its shelf life is limited and you know it too damn well. But keep up the "evangelism".
vin 13: Not exactly a guarantee is it?
"All the people that have already signed up for it which is much greater than the amount of people complaining. " It's also much much smaller than the user base that has NOT signed up for it.
Josh152: As aside note can we please stop calling anyone who isn't' acting like adobe is the next incarnation of Satan and instead is taking a more objective view of the situation a troll or adobe shill? It just makes everyone, even people with legitimate concerns, seem like ignorant children afraid of change.
"Also CS6 will not suddenly stop working. It is not going to be redundant anytime soon." That's like saying your cancer will kill you in two years instead of six months.
Josh152: As aside note can we please stop calling anyone who isn't' acting like adobe is the next incarnation of Satan and instead is taking a more objective view of the situation a troll or adobe shill? It just makes everyone, even people with legitimate concerns, seem like ignorant children afraid of change.
Sorry, but I can tell you Stu that I have spoken to three broadcast stations in my area who say that under no circumstances would they consider subscribing to their primary editing software. Particularly when pricing structure in future will be unilaterally decided. Also, MOST stations do not connect workstations to the web. And if your friend likes Premiere for video editing over Final Cut or Avid he is already part of a very small minority in the industry anyway. In faxct, an irrelevant part, I am amused beyond belief that you claim the "film industry" likes Premiere. Your limited credibility is severely stretched here. It is barely a contender, despite Apple's mess last year, Incidentally, Apple has responded to user concerns about FCP X and fixed many of the issues its customers had. Doesn't mean most are not still preferring FCP studio. More prefer Avid.
Josh152: As aside note can we please stop calling anyone who isn't' acting like adobe is the next incarnation of Satan and instead is taking a more objective view of the situation a troll or adobe shill? It just makes everyone, even people with legitimate concerns, seem like ignorant children afraid of change.
" the hysteric majority" There you go showing your true colours again Josh.
"Stu 5 position seems to be that adobe might actually be telling the truth". However THEY have given the public the reason to distrust them in this area. No one else. You guys are welcome to believe what they say. Just as you were to believe them when you purchased. at full price, software that will soon be rendered redundant.
Want to buy some beachfront property?
Atlasman: As far as I'm concerned, Photoshop and Lightroom are one.
I don't like companies that curtail my choices.
I like the concept of ownership, (license or otherwise).
I just purchased AfterShot Pro!
That's a lie there Stu. Corel have already said porting to Mac is back on the table as an option. And as you can run Windows on Mac everything is multi platform anyway.