xiod_crlx: Low DR, lack of Flash, really outdated AF system, no second card option, impossible to use EF-S for upgrading users (e.g. no "cropped mode") - nice move Canon!
D600 with the same price has everything plus all of features 6D doesn't have.Still, army of Canon followers WILL buy it (good experience about existing gear, not to betray old good friend, etc...). And in most cases nice Canon lenses will "do the rest" to produce excellent results!
As for 2013 it is "OKAY".
What will be in 2014 when D800's matrix will fall into new Nikon's budget FF model with the same price as D600? :)
Currently Nikon has a number of nice FF sensors for different tasks - it means it can make cheaper versions of FF cameras out of PROs very quickly and inexpensively (12-16-24-36Mp) = total line up, in a long run it seems Nikon is way far ahead and those upgrading to FF (from Canon, Sony, - whatever) should think carefully about it
As mainly a Canon user I have to agree with your comments regarding the half baked 6D - HOWEVER the D600 images have a green cast, the video is poor (Canon still lead the pack here) and as yet no problems with muck on brand new sensors. Both Nikon & Canon have failed to deliver the ideal camera and as BOTH a Canon & Nikon user (I prefer Canon overall) I feel let down by BOTH brands.
Rbrt: Those 6D test images look sharper than the D600 to me. Am I the only one who thinks so?
Its more than sharpness - Canon's may not have the 'best' sensors on test but they DO have the best colours...
Well, as expected what the 6d does it does well, but the AF system is the massive let down we all knew it would be. Buying a FF camera even one at a reduced price sticks in my guts knowing that the AF system from much cheaper APS-C cameras are much better. Canon should be thankful that Nikon have cocked up their new FF camera just as badly - the D600 has images with a green cast on images and dirt/ muck on the sensor.....seems that despite waiting most of us hard pressed camera users will keep their hands deeply inside their pockets. 6D MK2 anyone?
Love my S90 which is simply brilliant (yes I know it has a Sony sensor) if it was lost I'd get another quick as (or its updated replacement) it's just so quick and direct - it puts my Canon & Nikon DSLR's to shame...
bblam88: I would love to put a digital back on an F3HP!!! Already have two of those at home. =D
Never gonna happen - as likely as Sony reintroducing the Sony Walkman with digital guts... mind you....
salvofoto: Back in the 90's when I used to sell a lot of Nikons, I asked my colleagues what the two round terminals by the film canisters were for. No one seemed to know. I told them probably Nikon is thinking ahead and will make a digital back for film cameras. A company from Irvine, CA did this with a low MP sensor for $700 then moved to the midwest and disappeared from the map. I'm so glad Nikon is finally going to be doing this approach since the price of the FX sensor will go down and a lot of people can simply buy digital back for existing 35mm SLR's. Although I think this will be good at first for Nikon cameras with the capability of easily removing the back with a simple lever (17c) as with the pro F series. I hope Nikon won't take so long before putting this out on the market. Also, can you imagine there probably won't be any problem with oil on your sensors?
Funny ! But sadly it will never happen with or without oil patches !
Aleo Veuliah: Loved the picture of the old Nikon F. Just great.
I loved the way the Nikon f2AS handled - sheer class (used to retail such) when the F3 came out we had pro's desperate the buy up the last of our stocks. How the world has moved on...
Sadly never gonna happen, the nearest we can hope for are cameras such as the Olympus OM-D (nice) however longer term ALL normal cameras are dead - can you see many people dragging a big bag of kit around with them in say 10 years when they have grown up with the speed and access of a smart phone ? No, nor can I.
CameraLabTester: Canon has sadly written the death sentence of it's EF-S lenses... with this affordable Full Frame EF lens mount camera.
While Nikon DX lenses CAN mount Nikon FF cameras... Canon EF-S CANNOT do it on Canon FF cameras!
The EF-S plot has now been dug up beside the FD mount in the family burial lawn...
As a committed Canon APS-C user I have to agree (that shocked you) the future belongs to the EOS -M system (but Canon please get the AF to work) and ever cheaper FF cameras (but Canon please get the AF to work) - frankly if I were starting over again I'd go NIKON (but Nikon please ditch the c**p CX based 1Series) in a heart beat, Canon are losing the market.....
walnist: I don't understand all the disappointment for this camera.
For me it'll all boil down to the street price, which hopefully will quickly drop below 2000.Concerning auto-focus, we can't really judge it from the number of points alone, the tracking algorithms are even more important, and the center point is supposed to work down to -3EV.
I'm not action photographer and 99% of the time i focus using the center point only.
What's really a bummer instead is the maximum shutter speed of 1/4000, although that could be compensated by ND filters, and the slow flash synch speed.
If the price becomes competitive with a 5DmkII (they can still be bought new for around $1700) then this camera could find its market among enthusiast amateurs or as a compact second body for pros.
The 6D will provide great image and video quality and the price will drop over time. But for just a few bucks more Canon could have included a decent AF system - I'll be holding out for the MK2 version - about 18 mths...of course by the the Nikon D600 MK2 will smoke it even more....I'm a SAD Canon fanboy....
Homam: I can't believe there is so much negativity about this Canon already. It seems you have all forgotten how the old 5d mii revolutionized the market with an only 9-point AF system and until the introduction of nikon d800 according to dpreview it stood as the highest image quality dslr in the market.
What many amateurs seem to ignore is that huge differences exist between a camera's specs on paper and how it handles in real life. When d800 and 5dmiii were out in the market, i shot both for around a month and i had many more keepers from my 5dmiii in terms of color rendition, contrast, and focus accuracy. I found miii much more fun to shoot with and much more photographer friendly. d800's menu is way to complicated to handle.
I suppose a multi-billion dollar company like Canon knows what it's doing. Let's wait till 6d is in the market then we can actually compare the cameras better.
the 5D2 didn't have to face a Nikon D600 which is cheaper, better made, has a flash gun (system) built in, faster FPS AND a decent AF system. The 6D is second rate - from one Canon fanboy to another Canon could / should have included a decent AF system..... EPIC FAIL.
Well, I've stayed away from this topic for several weeks as it got too heated. My early comments reflected my strong disapointment with the AF system in the 6D. Well, here we are - reviews confirm - my fears have proved to be 100% correct. the 6D has a C**P AF system as does the EOS-M - SHAME ON YOU CANON - the 6D could have been great - now its just OK. Anyone for a Nikon D600 ?
Its a dream machine compact which says more about Sony's intention to become a top end player than simply going on sales figures. Expensive - yes. Interesting - yes Would I buy one - YES (if only I could afford one and that's the whole point). Well done Sony!
Gotta say - just played with my 1st EOS - M and am impressed! I'm off to Warner Studios Harry Potter Tour next week - will take a whole lotta kit.. wish I was taking an ESO-M !
Francis Carver: Wow, this Nikon V2 camera is so butt-ugly, it must have been designed in the German Democratic Republic in the mid-1960s, and then never placed in actual production because even then, it was decided that she was just too butt-ugly. The word "homely" does not begin to describe its sheer vast ugliness.
I'm sure this is based on a Russian Zenit film camera from the 1980's that never quite made the market place - its really ugly and not nice ugly like a T34 tank - JUST UGLY!!
As we all expected the Nikon D600 turns out to be a cracker - the dust problem seems commonplace with FF sensors, remember all the problems with the Canon 5D with dust on the sensor AND within the viewfinder? Sure Nikon will crack this problem. Roll on the Canon 6D - as a Canon user and fanboy I still think Nikon have got it right and Canon have spent all their efforts on GPS & Wi-Fi (thus getting it wrong) whilst most us users want a decent AF system, still, not long to go now.
scoots99: I was very excited about the 6D when it was announced, as a more affordable FF to the 5dIII, and the GPS would come in very handy. But with its mediocre AF and body durability apparently only a slight step up from a Rebel, I am now leaning back toward the 5dIII. I use a very aged 30D and T2i with some L lenses for semi-professional wildlife, landscape, and macro shots, and I just get the feeling that the 6D is too consumer oriented with too many compromises. In fact you can pretty much hear these words straight from the Canon rep's mouth in the cameralabs interview on youtube. And with wifi and GPS the 6D's battery will very likely require a daily recharge, which may be standard routine for professionals but for those of us who shoot only a few days per week tops, and in remote areas at that, constantly recharging will be a major pain.
Or why not wait for the 6D MK2 - about 18 mths away that will address all the problems with the current 6D, Canon are drip feeling us AGAIN whilst Nikon (and Sony) are actively chasing our money.... perhaps time to switch, buy an expensive 5D3 or wait out for the 6D Mk2 ?
Very clever - so others are making it easy to leave Canon and I though that Canon had that covered already since they seem bent on bringing out expensive and naff products... I'm a very unhappy Canon Fanboy...
tcapote: Maybe Canon will hear what you said here and starting with tomorrow or next week you will not find any EF 24-105 L on the shelves anymore.
Don't write off the 24-105 yet ! I believe that Canon will introduce a Mk2 24-105 in 2013/ 2014. Then again since Canon appear to have lost all direction (Naff AF on a brand new FF expensive camera anyone?) so who knows??
Paul T Klenk: Yes, I, too, have a 24-105 L and it's a genuine workhorse. I use it all the time and get great results. So, why would I go to a 24-70mm f/4L? Well, only if the difference is spectacular and the additional macro feature is not going to do that for me. So, as the others have indicated, the actual images will be important. If one buys this lens through Amazon, the return policy is simply spectacular. Buy the lens, try it out, and if it doesn't meet your expectation, it can EASILY be returned. That may be my course to follow.
I like you have found the 24-105 to be a real workhorse, we all know that the 24-105 is not a prefect lens nor is the 24-70 F2.8 either version. As for IQ the 24-105 is great - I think the only people who diss it are those trying to convince themselves that the 24 - 70 F2.8 was better. The future belongs to video and for that IS is vital - so Canon I have to ask again why no IS on your 24-70 f2.8 Mk2 ? At least the F4 version has it (at a price).