mholdef: I am just baffled about the wildly negative reactions about this camera
@Blue Swan Media Nikon is not about to put the D4 AF system in other classes of cameras. They remember what happened with the D700/D3.
@Teru Kage It's hard to be "style over substance" with that sensor performance, which amazingly edged out the legendary D3s on DxOMark in Low-Light score. But Nikon users for years were asking for this type of camera (i.e. FM Digital). Its hard to fault Nikon who listened to users and delivered.
Lots of the negativity in these boards comes from mirrorless fans. And some comes from our friends abroad in European countries where Nikon's pricing is unfortunately high.
But the Df negativity started right out of the gate, not only on the forums but from so-called professional reviewers. Language like "silly" and "eye-watering price" started early on in the Df Preview in spite of the fact that the Df offers D3s level high ISO performance for a little over 1/3 of the price of the D3s/D4, a price that sits between the affordable D610 and D800 in most regions. Honestly don't remember such a negative camera Preview in all the years I've been reading this website since early Phil Askey days.
And I'd bet the farm that the negativity will continue straight through the actual review in spite of the fact that the Df is turning out to be an extremely capable camera that is easily in the upper echelon of cameras released in 2013. Is it a Fujifilm X? Thankfully, no.
Jogger: Still waiting for the D700 replacement.. i.e. the 16mp chip in a D800 body. I prefer the modern SLR controls because i can operate them without taking my eye away from the OVF.
> but you are forced to use the locking exposure comp dial on the left shoulder of the camera.
Yes the EV comp dial is locking, a GOOD thing. I can't tell you how many time I accidentally move the EV comp on my X-E1, not realizing it until after I've made an image.
Some reviewers are making a big deal about the Df locks on the exposure dials but in actuality the EV comp and ISO dial can be operated with one hand and changed quite easily. The same for the shutter speed dial.
D1N0: low light champ (just)
> I guess sensor tech has hit a bit of a barrier, they've milked the Sony's for all they can?
The D4/Df sensor is not made by Sony, it's designed in-house by Nikon and fabricated by Renesas.
I can't understand news organizations laying off photographers. Such a powerful media!
Not simple economics, that's just corporate doublespeak for slashing jobs. Just like moving manufacturing to factories overseas while getting huge government bailouts and tax shelters are justified as "simple economics".
Expat Nomad: But there ARE differences to the design (e.g., mode dial, AF assist, port locations). Edit: I presume the menus are different too.
If this was the music industry, we'd be talking about the remix/tribute/cover.
This case is more like the music industry equivalent of a sample. Maybe an artist will speed the sample up changing the pitch a la Kayne West, but it's still a copy of an original work.
CameraLabTester: This sentence is a justified punishment for Sucker... or rather, Sakar for stupidly trying to imitate what is already a very poor, ugly, horrible and forgetful design devoid of beauty. They should have at least tried a more poorer, uglier, more horrible and oblivious design like Leica Lunatic or Leica Lambroast or something...
Never thought a random dot could be so interesting, kind of like a pin prick letting out hot air.
The D5200, with its articulated LCD and outstanding video quality seems the good choice over the D3200. For more experienced users the lack of 1/3 EV ISO adjustments on the D3200 could be a minor annoyance.
The D5200 kit with the really good 18-140 comes in at 946 USD here in the States, although this may be a temporary promotion. But it's a good deal considering that zoom is a $600 lens.
The D5300 which removes the OLPF and adds 1080p60, a first for any Canikon DSLR, looks like a good upgrade. I haven't tried one yet but it tested well on DxOMark, and images I've seen look great.
The K-50 is quite a lot of camera for the money with its 100% Pentaprism finder, and weather sealing. Like the K-30 before it, its has some of the best specs out of any DSLR maker. With the right lenses its a great choice.
And Canon, as usual, offers some really well done, versatile cameras in this range. Thanks guys.
DMJones: Sorry but I'm not impressed with the underwater shots. From 2004 - 2010 I used a Canon IXUS500 in an underwater housing & that 5MP camera was producing images that look just as good on my 27" monitor. It was just a point and shoot not a dedicated all weather / underwater creature.
You must have only looked at the 2-3 underwater images in the article which the author explained had reduced contrast and were taken on a cloudy day. The actual AW1 gallery has lots of images that look very good, significantly better than any 1/2.3" sensor compact could do. Not to mention the fact that this camera shoots RAW for even better IQ vs JPEGs from your IXUS.
I neither own nor use a Canon 5D. Canikon lenses aren't optically good enough for my purposes and I don't care about shooting sports so don't need fast AF. Then none of the 5D bodies can match the best Nikon's best high ISO DSLRs.
However the Canon 5D bodies are still a big deal.
> I've used the Nikon 1.4 85mm it's optically crap compared to the Zeiss 85mm 1.4.
Sure you have. Photos?
Check DxOMark, Photozone, or Lenstip. You'll see that the Nikon 85 f/1.4G is a much better lens than the Zeiss ZF 85 f/1.4. The ZF 85 softer corners and center than the Nikkor and doesn't get sharp across the frame until f/2.8. Photozone MTFs tell it all.
> Olympus 4/3 and m4/3 lenses corrected?
Olympus m43 lenses use software correction. Fact. They are also designed for the significantly smaller m43 sensor. How hard is it to get sharp borders and corners with that tiny sensor? Let them try designing some optically corrected FF lens. They don't even compete with Canikon with their software corrected lenses for the smaller m43 sensor. They aren't shaming anybody.
> So I believe my eyes, and my results.What results? Where's your gear list, your gallery photos? If Samsung, Olympus images are embarrassing Canikon, let's see your photos to prove it.
> Zeiss lenses are a good bit optically better than anything from Canikon--say the 85mm 1.4.
1) Zeiss 85 1.4 is one of their weaker lenses, not nearly as good as the Nikon 85 f/1.4G. Don't believe me, look in DxOMark and Photozone.
2) Second, Canon and Nikon makes every focal lens from UWA zooms, standard zooms, large aperture primes, telephoto zoms and super telephotos. Cosina/Zeiss makes a few overpriced manual focus primes.
3) Samsung, Olympus, Fuji better than anything Canikon?? Now you've gone off your rocker. Software corrected lenses designed for tiny crop sensor better than optically corrected pro-grade Nikkors or L FF lenses? Sure. And I'm going to be the next President of the United States.
4) Where are all these photos of your for which Canikon lenses are not good enough? I can't find photo from you on DPR, but you sure do say a lot. :-)
> High ISO on Nikon, lol.
He's kind of right about high ISO, it's the part about the lenses that sounds so funny considering there are no vendors in all of photography who have as many high-quality, high-grade modern SLR lenses as Canikon.
> Canikon lenses aren't optically good enough for my purposes
Hilarious. Let me guess, only the Zeiss Atus deserves a place in your camera bag. lol.
pdelux: canon have ridden the wave of their reputation for a long time. but how will it last when they keep releasing lack luster products.....
> I guess I shouldn't have expected Canon fanboys
Pulling out the "fanboy" card because you have no answers aside, I'm not a Canon user but it's just foolish to think that they make lack luster gear when they are a market leader. You cannot name one vendor other than Nikon who has anywhere near the SLR system that Canon offers. Their sensor technology is far from obsolete, in fact it's good enough to have a number of cameras near the top of DxOMark's sensor ratings. Sensor technology does not make us better photographer or help us book more weddings or portraits. Professionals and amateurs all over the world use Canon gear to create all kinds of award winning work. Who is kidding who?
> marike6, there is nothing special about any of those products either
I'm not a Canon user, but "lack luster"? How ridiculous. Who's kidding who? You are talking about Gold Award cameras in the 5DIII, 70D, 100D, and outstanding, class leading optics in above the lenses. The EOS Cinema line, not only did it beat Sony to the punch for offering 4K RAW, but it's one of THE premier run and gun documentary or high end wedding cinema camera systems available.
As far as other manufacturers, no other vendor but Nikon offers anywhere near as complete as SLR system as Canon does.
> canon have ridden the wave of their reputation for a long time
5D III, 6D, 70D, 100D, 24-70 f/2.8 L, 40 f/2.8, 35 f/2 IS, C100, et al
There is nothing lack luster about any of the above products.
People seeking small MILCs for walking around or travel are but a tiny percentage of the overall camera market. Canon understands this.
marike6: So this is where mirrorless fans come with their unrealistic views of the camera market to laugh at the EOS M.
In the meantime, Canon will continue to dominate the camera industry and they will continue to laugh all the way to the bank. :-)
@TrojMacReady "Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?"
"How about you worry about yourself and your images and less about what I'm up to"
"I don't have any advice for anyone."
Context is everything. If someone I don't know gets personal, I'll call them on it. Wouldn't you?
Don't know anyone who lets gear talk get under their skin, but it is interesting how web interaction is so different from normal interpersonal communication. "Web etiquette" is a misnomer because there is very little that's polite about these boards.
Richard Murdey: Assuming that it is now competitive in the autofocus department (and the original was astonishingly awful in that respect) Canon can now go out compete with the NEX5, various PEN models, the tiny GM1, and the new low end Fuji bodies - which is more than can be said for Nikon.
Nikon chose to walk away from that fight, a decision that may have been the right one: at least there are reasons to chose Nikon 1, tradeoffs that may or may not appeal, whereas what Canon is fielding -while competent - cannot be said to have any originality or unique selling point.
Nikon didn't choose to walk away from anything. At the end of 2012, Nikon was fourth place in the worldwide mirrorless camera sales ahead of Canon, Samsung, and Fujifilm. Since then almost all mirrorless camera sales have been flat at best.
But Canon and Nikon are not like Fuji, Panasonic, Olympus, Samsung, et al. Canikon make the much of their profit from DSLRs so they have to walk a fine line being careful not to cannibalize their DSLR lineups, both of which dominate all the mirrorless vendors in camera sales. Some may want an highly specified APS-C Nikon or Canon mirrorless but such a camera would frankly be bad business for both companies.
As far as the Nikon 1, it's at a disadvantage because of the 1" sensor, but its AF system, solid DSLR level AF tracking and fast processing make it a nice system to shoot with. And with a lens like the 18.5 f/1.8 you can get decent DOF control if you can get close to your subject and IQ is decent.
Timmbits: hmmm, lets see... about the same size as a GM1 (slightly larger, but with larger sensor also), but less lenses available for it. Canon is still on the fence as to whether it's time to allow their whole rage of cameras evolve into mirrorless... until then, EOSM will be nothing but a GM1 equivalent. That's a moot topic though, as the real cameras are the OMD, GX7, NX20, A7, Fuji... for mirrorless.
> Canon is still on the fence as to whether it's time to allow their whole rage of cameras evolve into mirrorless..
Why on earth would Canon turn their awesome SLR system into a mirrorless system? Canon professionals all over the world would leave in droves if Canon changed their big, bright OVFs to EVFs. The DSLT experiment has already been tried by Sony. Seen any DSLT cameras at the weekend football or basketball games?
Other than some new sensors, Canon doesn't need to change a thing. It's all about the system, and the EOS system is superb. If I didn't shoot Nikon I would shoot Canon. Great cameras, excellent glass. Nobody wants mirrorless EOS instead of their DSLRs. Obsoleting EF mount would be a mistake Canon would never recover from. For travel or walking around, there are tons of small cameras including compacts. For work, few photographers sit around worrying about camera size when their DSLRs get the job done better than anything else.
> For someone with so much advice for others not to judge your ways, you (Marike) sure judge a lot yourself.
I don't have any advice for anyone. But when people talk trash, as a New Yorker, it's in my nature to react. And normally I'll be the one defending the gear that's under assault, this EOS M a case in point.
But yes, these front page comments can be unpleasant when brand warriors and cropped format fans come out to talk smack about the latest gear. So much acrimony around here, it gets a bit old, that's all. Canon knows exactly what it's doing.