I moderate the GH4 User Group on Facebook and we have been looking forward to a profile dynamic range test like DPReview published for the GH2.
Unfortunately, this entire dynamic range page is only about iDynamic- which we have found creates a speckled blue noise in the image, especially in 4K, and we don't use it.
It would be far more useful to see how CineD compared to CineV, Standard, Natural, etc. And when you say, "You should choose CineLikeD for heavier grading and colour work on the GH4 ... The upside is that dynamic range is actually still very good and comparable to the dynamic range offered by raw video on the 5D Mark III..." you should SHOW thy dynamic range tests to back that up.
As 4K is the key factor for the GH4. Can we see dynamic range tests in video mode, just to see if the DR tests in still mode apply to video.
The compression engines for video and stills are different and the GH series has always suffered when it came to retaining dark detail (separation of those steps) in HD. It does considerably better in 4K meaning that within the video side itself, the camera offers different results, let alone the difference between stills and video.
So a test of still capability may not apply at all to what the camera does in 4K video. Dynamic range tests for video please!
Kwick1: Absolutely hate this "comparative review" format. If you want to have a set of common pages for video in each in-depth review, then fine, but the rest of the camera feature sets are apples and oranges.
Could you please break them apart?
I like the comparison as these two cameras are being discussed hand in hand in the forums I manage.
mrcultureshock: I really dislike this combo review. The review for the Sony A6000 is 13 pages long and yet the combo review for GH4 and A7s, which are 2 of the most important hybrid camera releases ever, only gets 14 pages?
Please review the GH4 and the A7s separately.
Please rent a Blackmagic Design HDMI to SDI Ultra HD converter and HyperDeck Studio Pro to record the A7s' 4K output for an accurate 4K to 4K comparison. Even a few hours of tests can answer a bazillion reader questions. Mine included. :)
SmilerGrogan: You guys are wasting your time arguing about 4K because after seeing the new releases of Guardians of the Galaxy and Dawn of Planet of the Apes, I predict the real action is going to be in 3D... "Dawn" was shot in ARRIRAW 2.8K dual-strip 3-D...
The tech has come a LONG way in the last 5 years and well-shot 3D is mind blowing in its ability to tell a story. And these little cameras might be just the ticket because shooting actual 3D requires two cameras...
So, get over yourselves and stop worrying about pixel dimensions because there's a much bigger revolution just outside the gates of DPR...
Heh heh, that was good. :)
IEBA1: "In terms of video features, the GH4 looks slightly better equipped, whether in terms of a handful of pro-orientated features or the provision of more, and higher quality, output options. ... a7S look more attractive as a camera if your workflow is expected to include significant post-processing. The addition of a (currently expensive) external recorder also allows the a7S to close the gap ...
Beginner videographers are likely to find the a7S's Auto ISO in manual exposure extremely useful, ... We'll look into what a more experienced user can do with the cameras"
PLEASE decide who your review is for before writing it. Paragraph 1- Pro features, significant post processing, expensive external recorder.Paragraph 2- Beginner videographers.
These cameras are designed (and priced) for people who use them professionally to earn an income. An A7s + a separate, external 4K recorder is not something the beginner typically goes for. Write your article for pro users.
I agree that it can be useful. Video cameras (not canon) would let you toggle each item in and out of auto. So I could be shooting with my Sony HDV camera and tap iris from manual to auto, and back again to hold that setting. AFAIK, no DSLR is set up like this. It's all about being in a "mode" and Canon camcorders were like that for years with a big dial that you had to rotate (like a DSLR) to pick the mode you operated in. I hated that.
But that's the way it is with DSLRs.
The problem with PASIM is that it still doesn't specify a manual mode that's all manual, or a manual mode with auto iris. Using the camcorder method, where each parameter can be "manualized" individually, like on Sony pro camcorders. So you have a Full Auto mode, and then a "manual" mode were everything you don't make manual is still on auto, but every parameter is individually changeable back and forth.
First DSLR that does that will be a game changer.
And stop with the "no Auto ISO in manual mode."It's manual mode.Everything is _supposed_ to be manual.
Want auto, use full Auto or Program.
"In terms of video features, the GH4 looks slightly better equipped, whether in terms of a handful of pro-orientated features or the provision of more, and higher quality, output options. ... a7S look more attractive as a camera if your workflow is expected to include significant post-processing. The addition of a (currently expensive) external recorder also allows the a7S to close the gap ...
Low noise tests:http://bkmeditor.wordpress.com/2014/07/16/panasonic-gh4-iso-noise-tests/
Also, I'd like to see what the Sony offers when NOT using slog- which requires a high ISO which is very challenging when shooting outdoors, in bright sunlight, when you would most need the greatest dynamic range. You can't just slap an ND on there because most ND's do not stop IR, so then you need an ND with an integrated IR filter, or a "hot mirror" Which makes using the A7s a lot more comples for day shots when trying to leverage slog for the most dynamic range.
In the coming weeks, I hope DPreview can do a dynamic range test like you did with the GH2. The trouble will be all the various settings you can apply, (profiles, curves, pedestal, contrast, recording range, etc) that all affect the quality of the final image.
A word of warning: I am the moderator of the GH4 User Group on Facebook and a couple users have posted already about the "noisy blacks" of the GH4 and what causes them. DON'T use curves. Don't use pedestal. and DO NOT use iDynamic. Turn off iResolution for good measure. These all create more noise in the blacks than is there when they are off. Adjusting the settings in the picture profiles is reported (by several) to deliver clean results. Then you get clean darks at high ISOs.
Use the full recording range of the camera. Use the entire 256 steps available in the digital file. Starting at 16 and not going to 256 means you're not using all the data that's available. Use it all, then in grading you have more to work with.
"Another shortcoming of many 'HDSLR's is that they capture the relatively low resolutions of video by only sampling some horizontal lines of their sensor - a process that's become known as line-skipping. This leads to lower vertical resolution in the video, along with a greater risk of moiré. "
Please. If you're shooting 4K with the GH4, (which is one of the main reasons to get it, otherwise go get the GH3) then the sensor is sampled 1:1. There is no interpolation, no line skipping and this entire paragraph doesn't apply.
jadot: I Appreciate what these cameras are supposed to be used for, but really?; NO pictures of people? Just a couple of headshots would be helpful.
At 1, it was a shiny toy they liked to carry around. At 2, she liked to make the flash pop. At 3, she was taking pictures. By 4, she was framing shots and arranging things to take "still life" photos.
You might not want to give a camera to a 1 year old, but I was more than happy to.
Second that. My first rugged camera was an Olympus before they all figured out to call them Rugged cameras.
My 1 year old loved to slobber on the shiny metal surface. Rinse & return. Then it became a play toy, dropped and kicked numerous times. Then she learned to take pictures with it- really, that means press the shutter button so the flash would fire. THEN she learned how to aim the camera at what she wanted to take a picture of- at 4 years old.
Any other camera would have died 100 deaths before the learning happened.
msolea: This is almost the perfect compact for me feature wise. However, for video, it should have kept the hot shoe and possibly added a microphone jack to it.
I have had both of its predecessors and I can say the are the most comfortable and best compact point and shoots available, at least for me. I have tried the top of the line canon, panasonic, olympus, fuji, nikon, and a few other compacts and they have all disappointed and of the ones I have owned, I did not keep them long. Otherwise, I simply did some testing and did not acquire the other ones.
Exactly. These days a "video" DSLR needs to have both a mic input, and a headphone jack.
Otherwise, it's like a still camera with only an "auto" mode, no manual control at all.
Okay, let's see-Wastes vertical storage space with 4 spinny wheels.Wastes interior cargo space with handle rails tat go in the middle of the case.Weighs a lot.Still doesn't even really qualify as carry on.Costs a lot.
THere's your mission, DPreview... find a case that actually DOESN'T do these things, but is still a good gear case.
IE, find a case where - the wheels take up minimal space in the overall "carry on" space requirements. - the handle is either set to the edges of the case so it takes up minimal interior room AND provides structural rigidity when collapsed. - is light- is carry-on sized, and slightly mooshable for when the bins are tight.- doesn't cost a fortune.
MrTaikitso: No articulating display! Why? Such a good spec.
I'd take a bit more bulk for incredible usefulness of a tilt-swivel display. Like the Nikon P7700, if it were actually decently fast, and had a longer "travel zoom" in it. I had the 7700 and had zero issue with the additional bulk for the screen.
Charlieangel: I like the styling. We'll have to wait for testing to see if the image stabilization is better than other brand compact travel zooms. If so, then the SH-1 could well be the best option for this type camera. But the new Panasonic ZS40 has 40x zoom in roughly the same size camera, with hybrid optical and sensor shift image stabilization, so the Oly SH-1 has some tough competition.
Hey, summer is coming and it's time DPreview gave Jeff Keller some more work putting together a compact travel zoom shootout!
I would love to see a bunch of the 10x + COMPACT travel zooms go head to head with the best image quality coming out on top.
Alexis D: People need to realize that this is a take anywhere travelzooom and so a small size is more important than a big sensor.
A 5-axis IBIS that works with 60p video is nice.
They have that already, it's called the OM-D. Sure, you can take the lens off, but you can also treat it like a fixed lens camera.