Peiasdf: If all you plan to do is use the kit lens RX100 and G7X are far better choices. In fact, my G7X with the "slow" option under auto-ISO amazes me with its IQ and IS.
Yeah, the super-compacts won't beat m4/3 or APS-C with fast primes or good zooms but those lenses are $500+ and requires an enthusiast to use.
The 14mm f2.5, 20mm f1.7, 25mm f1.8, and 45mm f1.8, can all be had for $250-350... Hardly $500/per. The 12/2, 15/1.7, and 17/1.8 are a little pricier but can still brr found under $500 during sales or returb. There's also the Sigma f2.8 primes, the 60mm in particular is quite a bargain. There's third party fisheyes for $200-250 too...
Impulses: Looks like a technical step forward but an ergonomic step back... It gained the current gen sensor and all that entails (e-shutter etc), but lost the more articulated screen of the GF6 along with the exposure compensation toggle and the more traditional (read: less limited) shutter mechanism.
Ironically, the GM shutter is probably why it went up in price, seems the design was largely driven by aesthetics/size, if it were just a little thicker but cheaper it'd make a more appealing entry level model IMO. The smaller kit lens is probably contributing to the price bump too.
Not knocking it btw, target market won't care about the shutter/exp comp and probably won't even notice the more limited screen movement (might even be more rugged which is an upgrade), they might even really like the electronic shutter, I know I would like the on my GF6.
Price isn't terrible in light of the competition but it's not very aggressive either, pretty sure the GF6 was cheaper at launch, tho it did come with a cheaper kit lens. Several Sony Alphas were way cheaper during the holidays but Panasonic prices always plummet quickly.
Looks like they're using the eyelet strap lugs across the range now, I thought the old DSLR like horizontal ones were more secure but again, something the target market won't care about. I'm using Peak QDs myself so the eyelet just makes them easier to thread (after dumping the split triangle).
Now, where art thou GX8? (with DFD/4K)
straylightrun: I don't understand why the retro like has spilled over into their mainstream entry camera line. That's kind of Fujis thing. They also already have the GM5 for that. They should have stuck with the modern look of the rest of the GF line.
Eh, the GF3/5 were too curvy, and the GF6 was like half retro half modern. I'm 32 and even tho I know the retro design is totally gimmicky I still dig it... /shrug
And it comes with a $375 lens. Not a bad deal, if you ask me.
Ehh, the 12-32 has been selling for $250-350... The MSRP was $350 IIRC. I paid a little under that before it was even released stateside and the flood of dekitted lenses started lowering the street price. I'd say the pricey or more complicated GM shutter probably contributed as much to the high price as the kit zoom...
The latter is an upgrade but the former is a downgrade, and there's several more ergonomic downgrades compared to the GF6 which was cheaper at launch. At least it does have the current gen sensor, would've been ridiculous otherwise. I think the price is fair, not a great deal, not terrible either.
If it drops quick it'll be better, the GF6 took like a year to drop by $100... It's a good thing Sony ended their holiday discounts or it'd look overpriced next to an A5100. Nothing against Panasonic btw, I like my GF6.
Markol: This sensor was anounced with the E-M5 almost exactly 3 years ago if I'm not mistaken. Isn't it time for something new?The camera is pqthetic, selfie-display or not. What's new about it? 4k would habe been at least something new and for a 600$ camera in 2015 isn't too much to ask, I think.Really disappointed.
It's not thy EM5 sensor, nor the first gen 16MP Pana sensor, it's their second/current gen 16MP sensor, the department of misinformation thanks you for your services tho.
elkhidir: Both Sony a5100 and Olympus E-PL7 are selling (quite well it seems) for that price. Both have "selfie" screens and lack viewfinders. If there's a market for it, there's nothing wrong with Panasonic getting in. For us consumers it will add to competition and push prices down.
Current displays are actually much more visible in sunlight than older ones... Older cameras had resistive touchscreen (if they had one) with more layers and lower quality displays, newer ones (at least the Panasonic I've handled) have displays more akin to a smartphone... They go way brighter and there's less of an air gap between the display and the outer layer, plus the touchscreen are capacitive.
My GF6 doesn't seem terribly hard to use in sunlight, yeah sometimes it's a little harder but it's never completely drowned out... That display does tilt up as well as down tho so it's a little more flexible. I can definitely live without an EVF tho, I use it way more at night or during indoor social occasions anyway. I've got an LF1 with an EVF and the only time I use it is to further steady long tele shots.
PeterTom: I do not shoot (many) selfies, but the flipping screen may be useful also for other purposes. It would be twice more useful (IMO) if it would not only flip but also rotate (swivel is the right word? the descriptions on DPReview name it "fully articulated").I shot many pictures in portrait orientation and many times I would like to have them shot easily from waist level or ground level without the need of doing additional gymnastics (with my current Canon Rebel).
But many m4/3 cameras have only flip screen.Actually, it seems that there the only m/4 cameras with "fully articulated" screen are the SLR-sized GH4 and G6 (and when I look for m4/3 I want to downsize my equipment).Why m4/3 cameras tend ignore the portrait orientation (how many of the current)?Would it be so much more complicated to make, for example, this screen fully articulated?
The G6 isn't exactly DSLR sized... Only DSLR as small as it is Canon's SL1, and that one doesn't have any kind of articulated screen. A G6 with a 14-140 is still smaller (or on par at worst) than the smartest DSLR with a 3x kit zoom. The GH4 is far bigger tho. The EM5 was even smaller than the G6 and rumor is it's successor will have a fully articulated screen tho.
Oh, forgot battery life too, another big ergo step back there... GF6 used the same pack as the GX7.
John van Stralen: Oh my oh my, what a lot of negatives I read here.To me it looks like a very nice camera that could be a nice addition to my Panasonic GF 6 which I liked using very much over the past few years.
So you don't like selfies, well ok but many do and when I see so many people, especially in Asian countries, enjoying so much to make them and more fun in posting them, well it brings a big smile to my face. And though I am not so young anymore I do enjoy making a selfie or so with friends once in a while, why not………But other than that a tilting screen for me is almost a must have on a modern camera, once you get used to it, it can become quite handy as the tilting screens on the GF6 and the Sony A7R showed me; to be honest I wouldn't buy a camera without it anymore………
Yes the GF 1 was also in my opinion the best they made, so if they bring a remake with a tilting screen I will buy it also, and it would not be so bad on the G7 also, if it might appear.
So that's my 2 eurocents for today.
You're been happy with your GF6 for yearS? It's only been out like a year and a half tops... :p I'm happy with mine too, tho I waffled between it and the GX7. I also only paid like $400 for it in Nov of 2013 tho, had I been forced to decide between a $600 GF and an $800-900 GX I probably would've just gone for the latter. Looking forward to a GX8 with 4K and DFD personally...
Looks like a technical step forward but an ergonomic step back... It gained the current gen sensor and all that entails (e-shutter etc), but lost the more articulated screen of the GF6 along with the exposure compensation toggle and the more traditional (read: less limited) shutter mechanism.
blue hour: Nice but it lacks 4K, therefore i'd rather choose the LX 100, which has also got a viewfinder.
Panasonic, where is the G 7, by the way ?
They didn't exactly disable 4K, if that really is the crux of your argument... Neither the GX7 nor any of the GMs had it, the GH4 does but that surely has a different processing engine. Plus, it's not like anyone else has an entry level ILC with 4K yet (maybe Samsung? I know Sony doesn't). Now, if they were to announce a GX8 without 4K, or the Sony A3xxx/A5xxx had 4K, I'd be raising my pitchfork with ya. I have a Nexus 5 too and it's video isn't that impressive, happy with it tho but I couldn't care less about it's camera.
.Sam.: Hmmm... the GM1 proved impossibly hard to use without the rear wheel, and it was corrected with the subsequent model, GM5. Now Panasonic comes out with a NEW camera, repeating the problem ?
Never had an issue pressing/turning the wheel on my GF6 inadvertently... Haven't had the pleasure of handling either GM unfortunately.
photo perzon: Does the flash tilt up to the ceiling for bounce?
I'd be surprised if not, my GF6's cab be tilted back...
Ben O Connor: Not looks as good as my GM1, but I wish I would have a svivel screen too!
Its brilliantly designed Fn button also will be 2nd shutter! Ergonomically, SUPERB.
Should've been $500 at release IMO, the last GF wasn't any higher than that, not totally unexpected given that they're using the 12-32 tho. With the GM1 selling as low as $400 it's a tough sell tho.
Seems kinda backwards they released it for phones before tablets (you cab side load it but it's buggy and crashes, go figure).
HowaboutRAW: Samsung needs to provide free software (say for download) that will convert the H265 videos this camera shoots, at all resolutions, into the more editor/playback friendly H264 format.
Yes, I realize that GOM, LightAlloy and VLC will play this H265 format, but for some time editing is going to be real difficult sans conversion to H264.
And even the new 5K Mac struggles to play video from this Samsung camera--using VLC for Mac. The Panasonic LX100 4K files play without trouble on the same Mac.
It matters not that Samsung would be giving this software away free for use by any competitor which also chooses to use the H265 format to record MP4 video, since for more than a few months people will ignore the video features on this camera, if the video can be edited.
Windows 10 Beta plays H265 natively in Windows Media Player.
Must've not searched very well (no offense), Handbrake is like the most popular open source tool for this, has been for ages... I wouldn't know whether it fully meets your needs since I haven't dabbled much with 4K but I use it for lots of other things and it's where I would've looked first.
mpgxsvcd: Samsung has the exact opposite strategy as Canon. Samsung knows that if they build a quality product with lots of features their customers will still be willing to spend the same amount of money and not ask for rock bottom prices.
They also know that if they are not leading the industry then there will be no catching up. It is lead or simply get out of the way and die by the roadside.
Canon on the other hand believes that its customers are for life. They believe that as long as they don’t change things too much their customers won’t want to change too much. Canon’s market share will be drastically reduced by the end of this year thanks to innovations by Sony, Olympus, Samsung, Panasonic, and even Nikon.
@Cheng True, but while Sony is seemingly backing away from mirrorless, Samsung seems more committed to it than ever and the company is bigger now than ever. Four years ago Samsung wasn't dominating mobile etc. I'm just hoping someone, anyone, puts mirrorless in the limelight. M4/3 user here so I'm not any fonder of Samsung than Sony.
@Vlad Not many, I didn't mean it in a disparaging way, but there's still only a handful of MILC with decent C-AF and only two under a grand, whereas plenty of cheaper DSLR nail that and become automatic recommendations for soccer moms etc. My skepticism in general doesn't have anything to do with the technical merits of one vs the other.
coldcut: I like the bold tone from Samsung. No overconfidence, just self assurance leaning towards innovation and a firm belief that there is a lot of technical improvements left to implement. Others just rest on their laurels, waiting to see what the next big thing will be, hoping somone else will do the heavy lifting.I really hope Samsung will drive this home.
M4/3 is pretty close, there isn't an uber cheap nifty fifty that has been in production for over a decade but outside of that the price gap for different kinds of lenses is never too large and it tilts in either favor. DSLR bodies can still go lower tho, unless you're a savvy shopper looking for older models ($200 GX1, $350 GF6, $300 E-PM2, etc).
Actually there's one other exception but it's pretty recent, that new APS-C UWA Canon launched is like the cheapest UWA zoom in any system (mirrorless or otherwise), by a couple hundred at least. Dunno if it's any good but I'm sure it's a hot seller at that price. When you start looking at mid range bodies things get much fuzzier tho.
Cheng Bao: Should it be called CES 2015?
What do brits call them? And what's Barney's punishment after Jan 31?
Seems pretty comparable to Olympus' FL-300R, right down to the price.