spencerberus: Uh, did most of you read 'the unique, Ive-designed M rangefinder will be auctioned in summer 2013'? That means there will be 1. This is not a consumer product, or a real product at all for that matter, its because they know they can combine Leica and Apple and got a ton of money from some rich person and put that money to charitable use rather than sitting in someone's stock portfolio, good for them - sure, it's probably a PR gimmick too, the end result is the same.
This will not destroy Leica design, revolutionize Leica design, revolutionize the industry, destroy the industry, or otherwise have much of an impact at all on Leica, Apple, the industry or the world in general. Quite complaining and go take some pictures.
Sadly there's this trend on the web that is on the rise: people reading and thinking less but spewing more crap.
mosc: Soo many comments about f2.5 being better than f4.9 comparing this to an RX100 at tele. Wow, do the math!
This camera is f11.8 equivalent at 112. The Sony is f13.4 at 100. Complain all you want about it but at least do the math correctly people.
or realize the real difference here is that one has a hot shoe, an option for an externa viewfinder, and is intended as a general purpose camera where the other is a carry anywhere compact designed for indoor shooting without an external flash at wide. The user who picks the Olympus and uses it without anything in the hot shoe probably made the wrong purchasing decision. Similarly, the user who never brings the sony with him because it doesn't have a viewfinder or external flash probably should have gotten the olympus.
Doing math is one thing, but you need to check your logic. So do try to keep up...
It is true that even though XZ-2 has a much faster tele end (f/2.5) than the RX-100 (f/4.9), actual amount of light gathered by both sensor is about the same (provided that the shutterspeed and ISO are the same). But this fact remains: for the same unit of area at the above f-stops, the XZ-2 is getting more light; almost 4x in fact. Therefore, the RX-100 will require a much higher ISO or slower shutter speed to properly expose the same scene at the tele end.
The RX-100 being better at higher ISOs (like 800+) is the result of its pixel having a much larger area than XZ-2's, which yields a better SNR. So, the RX-100 can use a higher ISO with acceptable noise levels to compensate for the slow tele.
That said, I won't be zooming in with these P&S in low-light often, so I would actually pick the the LX-7 over the RX-100 and XZ-2; it goes wider, brighter and is cheaper.
iudex: So downgrading from 1/1,63" sensor to 1/1,7" sensor and asking 600 bucks for it? Hmmm, what a progress...
One word, "fractions".
marike6: Everybody seems to think that RX100 has obsoleted all P&S. Having used the RX100, it's f4.9 at the long end aren't great for subject separation nor is the slippery, grip-less body great ergonomically. For this reason, compacts like the XZ-2, LX7 and X10 are not obsolete at all.
I always loved my XZ-1 when I had it and some of my favorite images came from this camera. Whether or not buying a small m43 or APS-C camera is better may be determined by needs. Many DSLR users aren't interested in investing in yet another ILC, but just want a compact camera with raw, and great IQ. The XZ-2, LX7, RX100, x10, or GRD IV are such cameras.
"You ever hear Olympus refer to this lens as a 6-24mm?"
It's stamped on the lens.
"They should all specify in 35mm equivalent f-stops like they do for their equivalent lens ranges"
That's stupid. The equivalent FL in 35mm is a useful reference for FoV. The equivalent f-stop in 35mm partially gives you an idea of DoF ONLY! It's useless otherwise. Also, I said partially as DoF is affected by subject distance.
Red G8R: There must be a new body in the works to go with these expensive lenses.
Saw a dude w/ the 12-35/2.8 on an E-M5 at some festival last weekend, he loves that combo. Some day, I'll get both; if only I can find it locally.
It's interesting that there is no Samnsung NX version. Could be a technical reason as the flange distance of Samsung NX is much longer than other mirrorless and image won't focus. That said, I'm surprised that there is no Canon EF-M version.
Flange distances:Fujifilm X-mount - 17.7 mmSony E-mount / Canon EF-M - 18 mmMicro Four Thirds System - 19.25 mmSamsung NX mount - 25.50 mm
EDWARD ARTISTE: Must be a real looney to trust this brand. Sounds suspect to say the least.
You probably should try or read more about some of their lenses before making such baseless statements. FYI, the 12/1.6 is pretty good.
In the mean time, mind these two quotes:
"What's in a name? That which we call a roseBy any other name would smell as sweet."
"Don't judge a book by its cover"
ianimal: The old Sony DSLR A850 was $1999 when released some years ago, so the Nikon D600 is not the cheapest ever I would say. Ok price but I would like to see FF cameras well below $2000. Possible?
The A850 has a sensor with higher resolution, has an LCD with more dots, has IBIS, has 1/8000, and etc. So considering all of that (spec, price, year released), the A850 is/was the better value.
That said, hopefully the street price of the D600 will be below $2000 and more FF camera will follow suite.
Edmond Leung: It seems full frame is already the trend...Yesterday was Sony...Today is Nikon...Where is the low-priced "full frame" for Canon and Pentax?I'm doubt how long can 4/3 stay in the market.4/3 and APSC may be faded out very quickly.
"I'm doubt how long can 4/3 stay in the market.4/3 and APSC may be faded out very quickly."
For DSLRs maybe, but $2100 is still expensive, especially if you can get a D7000 for half of that and the D7000 is more than sufficient for many. Even if the DSLRs using those formats are gone, the formats themselves will stay around longer as mirrorless, particularly m4/3, is still much smaller and that's important to some.
dark goob: All my DX lenses will crop on this camera! My 10.5 fisheye will only get a part of the pixels...! When will they finally make a camera that will be full-frame with my DX lenses?! I'm tired of waiting
Even IF you get your DX lenses to not crop on an FX body, there will be heavy vignetting; image circle just isn't big enough. Best to just stick to DX bodies if you don't want to get FX lenses.
Low Budget Dave: Could you do us a favor and let us know your opinion of the test results? I have been reading through the comments, and different people seem to interpret the results differently.
Basically, Canon's liveview still sucks when compared to the competition, even with the help of on sensor PDAF.
Some possible causes: - Canon's CDAF algorithm is behind - the stepper motor in the STM lenses aren't as quick as others in mirrorless lenses - connections between sensor, processing and lens is slow
That said, there's potential here. When (and not if) Canon improves their CDAF to the same level as others, this hybrid would be their trump card. It can solve the remaining issue with CDAF: continuous AF.
Gotta admin, max shutter speed of 1/16000s is impressive, but still not interested. Still no real hotshoe, expected more from the on sensor PDAF, no touchscreen, still expensive, and so on.
alexpaynter: Micro 4/3 cameras of today have better resolution than the full frame cameras at the last Olympics. They are also much better in low light situations.
The SLR fanboys would have told you how amazing those cameras were at the last Olympics, but now they are saying cameras with better performance are not up to the job.
SLRs still focus more quickly but the gap is narrowing.
The only area of significant difference would be the depth of field. I don't understand the theory but apparently f1.8 on a micro 4/3 is equivalent to f3.6 on a full frame as far as DOF is concerned. In some cases this would benefit the smaller camera and sometimes the larger.
a) Low-light is important because the stadiums are poorly lit.
b) Backgrounds like a track, sand, grass field, water, other athletes, etc. are too distracting. Photos must have no discernible background so that the subject (like athletes) are taken out of context.
Barry Fitzgerald: Very poorly featured model lacking even the most basic functionality. It's shameful to have a DSLR in 2012 that can't even do exposure bracketing, or HSS. Has almost nothing a new user will need to get into photography, no DOF preview, poorly implemented live view, no wireless flash.
Yet the 24mp sensor seems to "cure all complaints" for some reason. Marketing over substance it is quite obvious that a new users will have no need for 24mp or anywhere near that. It's a sensor and nothing else.
Shame DPR could not give a critical review and dismissed all those points above.
The E-PL1 has all these. I know it's not a DSLR but entry level none the less. There are other ones, but the E-PL1 is perhaps the cheapest.
It has +/-3 ev bracketing, wireless flash, high speed flash sync,, obviously better liveview and DoF preview.
These features can help a beginner learn more about photography, more pixels do not.
facedodge: So many here make the mistake of associating the typical camera buyer with the typical DPR reader. These cameras will fly off the shelves of Best Buys and Camera stores everywhere.
Remember that guy/gal asking all those amateur questions at the camera store the last time you were there? The one that was hogging all the employee's attention when you were just trying to buy a new memory card? Yes, that is the person this camera is aimed for.
Also, remember when you tried to get your significant other interested in photography? Remember when you failed because they could never see themselves carrying around a brick to take photos with? Yes, this camera is aimed at that person too.
Remember when you wanted to take shots at your buddy's party, but you didn't want to be a dork lugging around an expensive DLSR? Yes, this camera is aimed at you too.
There are many mirrorless currently available that are targeted the same user (P&S upgrader) and they are cheaper while being better in some ways: smaller, faster focusing, have brighter lenses available, etc.
In addition, a beginner wouldn't have a nice set of EF/EF-S lenses to adapt to this camera anyway, so that 'feature' is moot.
Edmond Leung: This is the most exciting camera in this year. I trust Canon will have great revenue from this new camera.Canon, good job!
Brand loyalty or blind loyalty?
Not a Canon hater (had T2i) but there is nothing appealing here aside from being able to adapt EF(-S) lenses. Oh, the adapter is an extra $200, so $1000?
Might as well get a E-M5 14-42mm kit for $1100, which has IBIS, weather sealing, articulated OLED touchscreen, more physical controls, more native lenses, and etc.
Superka: I already knows what IQ will be. It will be exactly the same as 550D,600D,650D,60D,7D....P.S. I don't mean it will be bad.
In other words, it's behind Fuji, Pentax, Nikon and Sony.
Edmond Leung: This just reflects how poor is the development of the lenses for M43. The reality is lens selection for M43 is very limited, especially the high-end tele lenses.It's a shame to those camera manufacturers who just know assembling cameras but without satisfying the needs of their customers in the demand of lenses.That is the reason why do Canon and Nikon can be so successful in acquiring the majority of the camera market. Because they care their customers' needs; they are not just camera makers, they also produce a complete line of lenses for their customers.Who will buy a camera without the support of lenses? A fool may!
Edmond Leung & itsastickup:Canon and Nikon are great in producing lenses... good if you have an FF body.
Want a fast (f/1.4) normal for your Rebel? Pay $1500 for the 35/1.4 or go to Sigma. But m4/3 has a 25/1.4 and 25/0.95. The slower Canon 28/1.8 is cheaper, but not as cheap or small as the Panasonic 20/1.7.
How about WA lenses for your Rebel? Only choice is the 10-22mm unless you go third party. But m4/3 has 12/1.6, 12/2, 14/2.8, 7-18/4, and 9-18mm.
Need a fast (at least f/1.8) short tele to do portraits with your Rebel? Get a crappy 50/1.8 or spend more for a 50/1.4. But m4/3 has a sharp 45/1.8.
Nikon is better but still makes only 4 f/2.8 or faster DX lenses; Canon only make 2 EF-S f/2.8 lenses and none faster than f/2.8. Even Sony makes more NEX lenses that are f/2.8 or faster than Canon does for EF-S.
Canon's first mirrorless - an entry level with minimal physical controls, no EVF, not even an option for one, no built-in flash and may not even be bundled with one. On top of that, it costs $800 with the pancake, more with the zoom, which isn't small BTW. Doesn't seem appealing especially considering the competition in this price range: G5, E-PM1, NEX-F3, NEX-5N, GF5, etc.
That said, it'll probably sell well because of the brand recognition and the fact that there are so many Canon users out there that can use their lenses on this.
Also, where is this lens for your APS-C DSLR, Canon? How many years has it been and yet there still isn't a relatively fast and affordable primes in the normal range, i.e 35mm to 50mm equiv.
qwertyasdf: This is a living proof that m43 lenses are way overpriced.
"If people insist that the new Oly 75mm 1.8 is the same category as Canon's 135L. I don't see why the lens on EX2 is not comparable to Canon's 24mm 1.4L"
I know you're joking, but that's not even remotely funny.