DXO Optics Pro and E-M1

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Dave Thompson
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DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
2 months ago

Is anyone out there using DXO Optics Pro on E-M1 files. To me it seems to really bring out the detail when compared to Lightroom. I'm on a trial at the moment....

Any comments would be really welcome.

Thanks

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Enir4
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

Dave Thompson wrote:

Is anyone out there using DXO Optics Pro on E-M1 files. To me it seems to really bring out the detail when compared to Lightroom. I'm on a trial at the moment....

Any comments would be really welcome.

Thanks

DxO does well for the Gx7, but with the EM1 it gives a strong red cast that sent me back to ACR.

Enrique

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Kweide
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Enir4, 2 months ago

I use it as well and think it is far better in RAW developing than LR. And it brings all the sweet details...
If you do not use Windows as OS, try DARKTABLE. It is excellent and free for MAC and Linux

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Wilki
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

Is anyone out there using DXO Optics Pro on E-M1 files. To me it seems to really bring out the detail when compared to Lightroom. I'm on a trial at the moment....

Any comments would be really welcome.

Thanks

I have been wondering exactly the same thing.
I recently took a LOT of photos at the F1 and was really disappointed when opening them in LR that they were not massively sharp and appeared "grainy" even at low ISO.
I looked back and realised that actually, pics with the E-M1 looked that way, especially when compared with the E-M5
So I took a look at DXO and there were my photos - clear, sharp and with much less grain than I was seeing in LR.
Maybe it's "opening shot" is much better than LR and if I played more with LR I would get the same - but it feels a lot closer to the Oly JPEG and what I would expect from the camera.

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JeanPierre Martel
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

Dave Thompson wrote:

Is anyone out there using DXO Optics Pro on E-M1 files. To me it seems to really bring out the detail when compared to Lightroom. I'm on a trial at the moment....

I'm mostly using Photoshop for my post-processing. On e-m5 RAW files, DxO Optics does a better job on high ISO pictures; more detail, less noise, and not that magenta/green cast on the darkest parts of the images that I get when the image is opened with Adobe Camera RAW module (used by both Photoshop and Lightroom).

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Bob Tullis
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

It very good for supported hardware.   I don't use it routinely, as I don't routinely use supported lenses.   I am pleased that this latest version has a better relationship with LR, though I feel LR is better with highlight/shadow manipulation.   Maybe I just don't use DXO enough to be as adept in that area as I am with LR. . .

The 12-40 is cracking crisp on its own. One of the few lenses where I question the need for additional sharpening.   But with a lens like the 9-18 that can use a little help to refine details (to bring it more in line with the 7-14 or 12-40, for example) is where I find DXO useful.   IMO, naturally [g]   I've had a love/hate relationship with DXO ever since it appeared on the scene.   This latest version doesn't frustrate, so I may be turning to it more often.

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Photo Pete
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

Personally I find Lightroom every bit as good as DXO provided you take the time to set up the default conversion settings as you like them. The camera profile / clarity / sharpening and noise reduction relationships are critical to getting initial settings that you like.

I also find DXO painfully slow for conversions when using their 'PRIME' technology.
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Kweide
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

... and do not forget to chose the E-M1 profile in the Exposure menu ...

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markymark101
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

I don't own tthe em-1 but as I said in a thread a week ago, I find DxO produces better results by default.  The images are cleaner and sharper, more pop.   I can get there with LR, but it takes more manipulation.  As someone else  said, LR seems to give me a grain or noise, that DxO does not - even with images shot in good light.

However, as Bob noted, I think LR is better at manual highlight recovery.  If I don't like what the "Smart Lighting" is doing in DxO, and I turn it off and go into full bore manual mode, it doesn't seem to recover the highlights as well - but more often then not, I'm pleased with what Smart Lighting is doing.

Overall, though, I find I'm liking the images I'm producing through DxO better than what I'm getting through LR.

I probably would have never tried DxO if it had not been for Adobe's new pricing strategy.   My attitude has become screw-em there are other options out there.   It's nice to have options isn't it!  A little competition keeps everyone on their toes.

For the person who said the Prime noise reduction is slow, we'll yes, they even tell you that.   That's why you only use if for images that really need it.   I've only used it a couple of times.

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Bob Tullis
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Photo Pete, 2 months ago

Photo Pete wrote:

Personally I find Lightroom every bit as good as DXO provided you take the time to set up the default conversion settings as you like them. The camera profile / clarity / sharpening and noise reduction relationships are critical to getting initial settings that you like.

I also find DXO painfully slow for conversions when using their 'PRIME' technology.

Everyone does - that's why DXO offers it as an option with that very precaution.

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mrollins
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to markymark101, 2 months ago

markymark101 wrote:

I probably would have never tried DxO if it had not been for Adobe's new pricing strategy. My attitude has become screw-em there are other options out there. It's nice to have options isn't it! A little competition keeps everyone on their toes.

As a related question, I wonder how many people are rethinking their workflow strategy due to Adobe's new pricing strategy. I am a long time user of Photoshop and Lightroom. I really like these tools, but Adobe has gotten so big, they are difficult to deal with.  My consulting business requires a subscription to the Adobe CC to gain access to many of it's publishing and illustration tools. Photoshop, Lightroom, Premiere Pro, and other tools come as a side benefit, but I can envision a time when I probably won't need a full CC subscription at $50+/month. Will I then want or be able to afford to pay Adobe's rental fees, even if it's just for Photoshop and Lightroom?

I currently keep a backup copy of all my RAW files, but use DNG format for the files in the Lightroom database. Even with it's new Lightroom plug-in, DxO does not read DNG files. Of course it wants the original RAW file so it understands what settings to apply. This makes me think I might have better long term flexibility if I used my RAW files for the Lightroom database as well. I just recently picked up a copy of DxO to try it out and start reconsidering my longer term options. I do like what I see so far with DxO. Its tools are pretty intuitive; and if you are familiar with similar tools in Lightroom or Photoshop, they are not much trouble to use.

I'm also starting to consider how I should keep the files that I have altered for printing or Web use. In the past, I didn't give it much consideration, and generally just kept files worked on in Photoshop, particularly layered files, in PDS format. Now I'm thinking that perhaps I should be saving these files as layered TIFFs.

There are probably other things I should be considering. I am curious as to what other photographers might be doing to preserve their files for future use, perhaps without the use of Adobe products.

Regards,
Mike

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Gregm61
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

As good as the auto features and camera/lens modules work, DXO is closer to an improved version of Olympus Viewer than anything as good as Adobe's raw converter in Lightroom and Photoshop.

I've owned DXO over the last two versions and really want to like it. The default colors are great and the auto distortion correction is fantastic, but it lags the Adobe product big-time in overall features and ability to maximize file potential. There are no ways to manipulate areas within the image like the targeted adjustment tool or adjustment brush, no option for applying a gradient filter, no limiting the application of sharpening to only certain areas of the scene, and highlight recovery is limited at best. I recall a comparison of 3-4 raw converters on this site some time ago and DXO was the least effective in terms of highlight recovery.

I think there must be way too many users of Lightroom who have not used, or do not know or understand all the options in the raw processor window and DXO is a good fallback for automatic, no frills processing to get very good results, IF the files are well exposed and not in need of extra work. As I said, just like Olympus Viewer.

Operationally, when I open DXO and go to a folder with lots of images, even if it's one where I have used DXO before, it seems to take FOREVER, because it has to reload all the profiles to the previews each and every time you go back to that folder again, and again, and again, and again. It's maddening how long the program takes from the time you open it until you are allowed to do anything if the active folder has more than just a few image files, and it's not like I'm using a Windows XP machine with 1GB of RAM. I have a fairly well updated computer running Windows 7 with an i7 processor and 12 GB of RAM. DXO is just slow any way you look at it.

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Gregm61
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to mrollins, 2 months ago

mrollins wrote:


There are probably other things I should be considering. I am curious as to what other photographers might be doing to preserve their files for future use, perhaps without the use of Adobe products.

$10 a month for access to Photoshop and Lightroom is one hamburger, fries and chocolate shake. The day I cannot afford that, I'm going to have a whole lot of other problems much worse than not having access to Photoshop.

Did you shoot film for a period of time before moving to the digital side? If so, how well organized are your negatives/slides?

I have bunches and bunches of prints from my film shooting days, but negatives? Very, very few.

I have multiple external hard drives. I'm about to fill up a 1TB drive that contains images back to 2009 and have three others stored in a file cabinet with older files. How many times have I reconnected those to my computer to get at a raw or even jpeg file I wanted to redo years later? Zero.

I keep my Smugmug account paid every year and upload the jpeg of any image I want to never lose and trust the Smugmug is going to be around, which seems sensible enough at this point. I should print more than I do, but I don't and some day I might regret it, but one could have a second hobby just archiving digital images and developing redundant backup processes.

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veroman
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Gregm61, 2 months ago

Gregm61 wrote:

As good as the auto features and camera/lens modules work, DXO is closer to an improved version of Olympus Viewer than anything as good as Adobe's raw converter in Lightroom and Photoshop.

I've owned DXO over the last two versions and really want to like it. The default colors are great and the auto distortion correction is fantastic, but it lags the Adobe product big-time in overall features and ability to maximize file potential. There are no ways to manipulate areas within the image like the targeted adjustment tool or adjustment brush, no option for applying a gradient filter, no limiting the application of sharpening to only certain areas of the scene, and highlight recovery is limited at best. I recall a comparison of 3-4 raw converters on this site some time ago and DXO was the least effective in terms of highlight recovery.

I think there must be way too many users of Lightroom who have not used, or do not know or understand all the options in the raw processor window and DXO is a good fallback for automatic, no frills processing to get very good results, IF the files are well exposed and not in need of extra work. As I said, just like Olympus Viewer.

Operationally, when I open DXO and go to a folder with lots of images, even if it's one where I have used DXO before, it seems to take FOREVER, because it has to reload all the profiles to the previews each and every time you go back to that folder again, and again, and again, and again. It's maddening how long the program takes from the time you open it until you are allowed to do anything if the active folder has more than just a few image files, and it's not like I'm using a Windows XP machine with 1GB of RAM. I have a fairly well updated computer running Windows 7 with an i7 processor and 12 GB of RAM. DXO is just slow any way you look at it.

I have to agree with all of the above. I downloaded a trial version and found it clunky, slow, limited and not worth working with.  I use LR5 and Capture One, with a little touching up ... if necessary ... in Photoshop.  I've stopped using Olympus Viewer altogether.  Like DXO Pro, it just isn't worth working with; not when I can get excellent results with LR and CO.

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Bob Tullis
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to mrollins, 2 months ago

mrollins wrote:

markymark101 wrote:

I probably would have never tried DxO if it had not been for Adobe's new pricing strategy. My attitude has become screw-em there are other options out there. It's nice to have options isn't it! A little competition keeps everyone on their toes.

As a related question, I wonder how many people are rethinking their workflow strategy due to Adobe's new pricing strategy. I am a long time user of Photoshop and Lightroom. I really like these tools, but Adobe has gotten so big, they are difficult to deal with. My consulting business requires a subscription to the Adobe CC to gain access to many of it's publishing and illustration tools. Photoshop, Lightroom, Premiere Pro, and other tools come as a side benefit, but I can envision a time when I probably won't need a full CC subscription at $50+/month. Will I then want or be able to afford to pay Adobe's rental fees, even if it's just for Photoshop and Lightroom?

I currently keep a backup copy of all my RAW files, but use DNG format for the files in the Lightroom database. Even with it's new Lightroom plug-in, DxO does not read DNG files. Of course it wants the original RAW file so it understands what settings to apply. This makes me think I might have better long term flexibility if I used my RAW files for the Lightroom database as well. I just recently picked up a copy of DxO to try it out and start reconsidering my longer term options. I do like what I see so far with DxO. Its tools are pretty intuitive; and if you are familiar with similar tools in Lightroom or Photoshop, they are not much trouble to use.

I'm also starting to consider how I should keep the files that I have altered for printing or Web use. In the past, I didn't give it much consideration, and generally just kept files worked on in Photoshop, particularly layered files, in PDS format. Now I'm thinking that perhaps I should be saving these files as layered TIFFs.

There are probably other things I should be considering. I am curious as to what other photographers might be doing to preserve their files for future use, perhaps without the use of Adobe products.

DNG: I had gone all DNG at one point in time, but due to some apps like DXO not liking them, I stopped that practice several years ago. No regrets at all.

Adobe: I dropped PS also several years ago for Aperture or LR and a few plugins, mainly due to hardware limitations (but also interested in seeing if there's photographic satisfaction possible w/o PS).  I've since overcome those limitations, I've also found I didn't require PS except for in a few instances. Yet, with the latest offer from Adobe I bought into the LR/PS CC subscription, and I'm enjoying it. I figure this will be the way of things to come in general, and Adobe is just leading the fray. I can opt out if necessary, and the cost not unreasonable compared with the licensing scheme.

Keeping files worked up in PS, there's a size/convenience factor to consider. Something I've worked in PS that's elaborate I might want to save in full, especially if using Smart Objects. Perfection sometimes is only had after working an image, studying it a bit, and going back to refine it further (for me, anyway).  But those are HUGE files, and I'll weigh that consideration and might opt to flatten to single layer TIFF. Why TIFF? Not sure. In the past it seems it was the thing to do for compatibility, but I can't think of a reason why I wouldn't opt it as a flattened PSD at this point in time either (just said in case someone can clear this up for us).

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Gregm61
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Gregm61, 2 months ago

Gregm61 wrote:

I recall a comparison of 3-4 raw converters on this site some time ago and DXO was the least effective in terms of highlight recovery.

I know versions of several of these programs have changed, but I see little improvement from version 8 to 9 with DXO from this review/comparison, and difference between highlight recovery using Adobe camera raw in Photoshop CC and DXO Pro Optics 9 is just as stark today...

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/8219582047/raw-converter-showdown-capture-one-pro-7-dxo-optics-pro-8-and-lightroom-4/3

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Bob Tullis
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Gregm61, 2 months ago

I agree about loading DXO from a RAW in LR, but the latest update to v.9 doesn't do that to me now (so it's usable again as an external converter when it's called for from time to time).

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Gregm61
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Bob Tullis, 2 months ago

Bob Tullis wrote:

I agree about loading DXO from a RAW in LR, but the latest update to v.9 doesn't do that to me now (so it's usable again as an external converter when it's called for from time to time).

I rarely use the Lightroom portion of my Adobe subscription. I'm no fan of the filing system. I just want to load my images where i want them and go, so I'm either processing in ACR with Photoshop CC or times when it's been long enough since I was last frustrated by DXO to open and try it again.

Just the simple act of opening the program and going into a folder with many images and DXO has to re-load the profiles to each and every image file and you sit there and watch it count down from whatever the number of files is until it's finally loaded them all, and if you try and open one in the view panel before they are all loaded it starts twitching and hesitating until all the profiles from that folder are loaded.

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Ben C Davis
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Re: hmmm
In reply to Dave Thompson, 2 months ago

Dave Thompson wrote:

Is anyone out there using DXO Optics Pro on E-M1 files. To me it seems to really bring out the detail when compared to Lightroom. I'm on a trial at the moment....

Any comments would be really welcome.

Thanks

A new version of Raw Therapee [RT 4.1.38 64-bit,  RT 4.1.39 32-bit] is out.

http://rawtherapee.com/downloads

For me it is better then new version of DXO.

Do Not like lr.

8)

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markymark101
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Re: DXO Optics Pro and E-M1
In reply to Gregm61, 2 months ago

Gregm61 wrote:

Just the simple act of opening the program and going into a folder with many images and DXO has to re-load the profiles to each and every image file and you sit there and watch it count down from whatever the number of files is until it's finally loaded them all, and if you try and open one in the view panel before they are all loaded it starts twitching and hesitating until all the profiles from that folder are loaded.

That is a valid criticism.  I'm testing DxO out now on trial and working on a folder with 600 RAW files.   600 is not a huge number, but you do have to wait until the all the thumbnails are built.  It's not hugely frustrating with 600 images, but if it were a few thousand, yep, I could see it as a real pain.   The other frustrating part is if I close the program and then go back to it later, it doesn't start where I left off; it takes me back to pic1.   So I've got to wait for it to load all the pics, then hopefully remember the one I was last working on, and then go find it.  Maybe that import into LR isn't such a bad thing after all

I do still find myself liking the output DxO is giving me though.

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