Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?

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Russell Evans
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Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
4 months ago

I was reading the selling FA thread, and was thinking that a number of people think there might be a FF this year. That's nothing new of coarse, but it seems like Pentax not announcing a FF this year will pretty much kill any thought of Pentax ever coming out with a FF for me, and I am wondering if that is universal?

It's been such a slow year for new Pentax products, that if all Pentax has to show at the next trade show is a new entry level DSLR, I'm sure I won't be the only one pretty disappointed with the brand. About the only thing I can think of that would or might counter that for some people, would be the announcement of immediate availability of the long zoom or a surprise announcement of a 400mm f5.6 telephoto.

I have to admit that Pentax just having an entry level camera to announce would be pretty jarring to me and it would definitely shake my commitment to the brand in a big way, even with a 400mm announcement. I don't do telephoto all that much, and definitely not enough to want to spend a lot of money on it, even if it was WR. I'd rather risk an older body with a non-sealed lens as the cost of that risk is going to be a lot less than a new Pentax WR long telephoto. I also have to admit my faith in Pentax coming out with lens that outperforms the rest of the field has taken a beating as well over the last few years.

I also expect Sigma to come out with an Art version of their 24mm and if it is priced in the same ballpark as their other Art lenses, then there is going to be a path for me to take into FF in another mount. That might be next year even, but I expect it to come sooner or later.

I can't say I'm really hopeful about the Pentax brand at this point. I have most of the kit I want, but the K-3 isn't really the type of APS-C camera I want from Pentax. My worry is that without a FF announcement, that the K-3 style is the direction Pentax will take going forward. The body would be fine with a FF sensor in it, but for APS-C, I really want something more like the K-5 series cameras. I definitely don't want something heavier than the equivalent Nikon body.

Thank you
Russell

Pentax K-3 Pentax K-5
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Gary Martin
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago
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Giklab
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Don't know, don't care.

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sfa1966
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

I never have had a "FF dream". But I'll agree that the lack of announcement of new K-mount products (after the excellent 1.4xTC and the rather lukewarm 20-40 limited zoom) is a bit of a concern. I hope not, but I would not be shocked at this point if Ricoh knocked the K-mount on the head altogether.

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sfa

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Phixer323
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Gary Martin, 4 months ago

I wouldn't hold my breath. I don't know how deep Ricoh's pockets are, but I question the economic feasibility of developing a FF camera to compete with Canikon. The last figure I saw is that only 5% of cameras sold are FF. I'm making a large leap here, but I bet I would get pretty good odds in Vegas that the majority of that number are professionals. If you want to compete with Canikon in the professional arena, then an infrastructure would also have to be built to support the Pro. Example: At the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, Canon has a large presence and they clean, free of charge, and inspect the Pro's Canon cameras. Now, I'm only speaking for me, but I would like to see them develop more lenses to support those of us that shoot sports. I would love to see a 24-70 f2.8 and a 70-200 f2.8 with high speed focusing motors. I use Sigma lenses to cover this now and I also have the 100-300 f4, which is usable however, just a little slow for focusing on high speed sports. If they could develop a FF with the lenses and support for the pros, it would be good thing, but I see that as a hard market to crack. Just my thoughts, no arguments!

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MightyMike
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Based on everything i've heard and seen, don't expect a FF camera... at all.

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debo
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

I started that FA thread and I think I am almost convinced to try a Sony A7 body (almost the same price as a K3 body). If the lenses don't perform, then sell, else keep the A7+FAltds for experiments/learning with MF and a X100 for travel, sell the rest of the gear (maybe still keep my $20 M50/1.7)

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Jim Beverlin
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to MightyMike, 4 months ago

+1....................I would agree with Mike.

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DAVID MANZE
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to MightyMike, 4 months ago

With what for lenses? for it to work they would need to bring out 4-6 lenses, and even that couldn't even begin to compete with Canikon and for only 5% of the market, I don't see it!

Their ploy is the MF market, Canikon aren't there, and all that is there Pentax "can" compete with, on price as well as a new approach to MF, ending the "shoebox" camera format. The range of lenses in that market is a lot less demanding and they have now called on the range that previously only sold in Japan.

In short they have cut the price of an MF body by 2/3rds. I'd say that's sharp business!

Why would they risk to enter in the FF market which only has a 5% share?  To do so I would say is very risky.

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Russell Evans
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to sfa1966, 4 months ago

sfa1966 wrote:

I never have had a "FF dream".

Conveying the broad idea of what I tried to say with "FF dream" in a few characters in the title stymied me. I'm not a wordsmith.

Thank you
Russell

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fakuryu
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I personally asked during a huge photography event here
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Russell Evans wrote:

I was reading the selling FA thread, and was thinking that a number of people think there might be a FF this year. That's nothing new of coarse, but it seems like Pentax not announcing a FF this year will pretty much kill any thought of Pentax ever coming out with a FF for me, and I am wondering if that is universal?

It's been such a slow year for new Pentax products, that if all Pentax has to show at the next trade show is a new entry level DSLR, I'm sure I won't be the only one pretty disappointed with the brand. About the only thing I can think of that would or might counter that for some people, would be the announcement of immediate availability of the long zoom or a surprise announcement of a 400mm f5.6 telephoto.

I have to admit that Pentax just having an entry level camera to announce would be pretty jarring to me and it would definitely shake my commitment to the brand in a big way, even with a 400mm announcement. I don't do telephoto all that much, and definitely not enough to want to spend a lot of money on it, even if it was WR. I'd rather risk an older body with a non-sealed lens as the cost of that risk is going to be a lot less than a new Pentax WR long telephoto. I also have to admit my faith in Pentax coming out with lens that outperforms the rest of the field has taken a beating as well over the last few years.

I also expect Sigma to come out with an Art version of their 24mm and if it is priced in the same ballpark as their other Art lenses, then there is going to be a path for me to take into FF in another mount. That might be next year even, but I expect it to come sooner or later.

I can't say I'm really hopeful about the Pentax brand at this point. I have most of the kit I want, but the K-3 isn't really the type of APS-C camera I want from Pentax. My worry is that without a FF announcement, that the K-3 style is the direction Pentax will take going forward. The body would be fine with a FF sensor in it, but for APS-C, I really want something more like the K-5 series cameras. I definitely don't want something heavier than the equivalent Nikon body.

Thank you
Russell

And the Japanese Pentax/Ricoh official that was there jokingly shushed me saying that the K3 is a better camera.

So I honestly think that there won't be a FF from Pentax this year or the next. The K3 is an excellent camera, hopefully they'll introduce very quick focusing lenses for it.

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LDBOK
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Like some of the others, I don't and have never had a FF dream. My K-3 and K-5 are all I need or presently want for the type of photography I do.

http://larrydbrown.com

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Chris Mak
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Russell Evans wrote:

I was reading the selling FA thread, and was thinking that a number of people think there might be a FF this year. That's nothing new of coarse, but it seems like Pentax not announcing a FF this year will pretty much kill any thought of Pentax ever coming out with a FF for me, and I am wondering if that is universal?

It's been such a slow year for new Pentax products, that if all Pentax has to show at the next trade show is a new entry level DSLR, I'm sure I won't be the only one pretty disappointed with the brand. About the only thing I can think of that would or might counter that for some people, would be the announcement of immediate availability of the long zoom or a surprise announcement of a 400mm f5.6 telephoto.

I have to admit that Pentax just having an entry level camera to announce would be pretty jarring to me and it would definitely shake my commitment to the brand in a big way, even with a 400mm announcement. I don't do telephoto all that much, and definitely not enough to want to spend a lot of money on it, even if it was WR. I'd rather risk an older body with a non-sealed lens as the cost of that risk is going to be a lot less than a new Pentax WR long telephoto. I also have to admit my faith in Pentax coming out with lens that outperforms the rest of the field has taken a beating as well over the last few years.

I also expect Sigma to come out with an Art version of their 24mm and if it is priced in the same ballpark as their other Art lenses, then there is going to be a path for me to take into FF in another mount. That might be next year even, but I expect it to come sooner or later.

I can't say I'm really hopeful about the Pentax brand at this point. I have most of the kit I want, but the K-3 isn't really the type of APS-C camera I want from Pentax. My worry is that without a FF announcement, that the K-3 style is the direction Pentax will take going forward. The body would be fine with a FF sensor in it, but for APS-C, I really want something more like the K-5 series cameras. I definitely don't want something heavier than the equivalent Nikon body.

Thank you
Russell

If a Pentax FF camera was nearing announcement, let's say Photokina, we would have had at least sóme rumors by now. Instead of rumors there is an absolute silence on all fronts. My guess, alas, is that the successful release of the 645Z is currently killing off all plans for a FF camera. Ricoh/Pentax are onto something with this groundbreaking camera, and Canon, Nikon or even the unpredictable Sony are not active in the MF segment. So even though I really pity it, I fear the Pentax FF will solidly remain a prototype for some time to come. I have a weak spot for FF and a good deal of quality FF lenses, so I got a Sony A7r. It's all I will need for the coming years. Let's hope Pentax will grow strong on their high end Apsc and affordable MF offerings in the next year, and then will be bold enough to also go for the FF segment.

Chris

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Petroglyph
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

Pentax just announced the XG-1 super zoom and, IMO, that is completely in line with what the Ricoh executive said about their future plans. (To capture the entry level camera market in India and Asia.) This camera might sell for equivalent of 150-250$ in those markets. Once they capture a significant portion of this market they'll try to move users (who like the products) up stream toward the higher end aps/c cameras. The Ricoh exec said something to the effect that aps/c will be 80% of the world camera market and this fact isn't lost on their staff.

Also looking at other manufacturers, even Canon, there has been a large fall off in new product releases. Canon had something like 12 lenses planned for 2014 release and the 7D was brought out in 2009? So far it is only 2-3 new lenses from them. Sony had big plans for new FE lenses but one clunker release (IMO 24-70 FE) and users seem to start pausing when asked to shell out big bucks for more new ones. I've even noticed a slow down with Sony (might pick back up by Photokina though).

With all the slow down in the big camera market what do I think we might see this fall:

Sony = 16-35FE and maybe a new ILCE

Canon new 7D and 100-400 L II

Pentax might see a new lens from the road map

Nikon D7200 and a lens or 2.

Actually, I'd be pretty happy to read about some of those if they turn out.

Cheers.

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fotobert
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to DAVID MANZE, 4 months ago

Hi David,

I think they could start. Imagine the following:

DA 1.4 / 55, 5.6/ 560 (is the 4/300 FF capable?)

re-badged 2.8 / 24-70 and 2.8 / 70-200 from Tamron

re-badged or not 1.4 / 35, 1.4 / 85 from Sigma

I do not know if they really introduce a FF. But this could be an option. Tamron, Sigma and Samyang have some other interesting lenses in their lineup. Enough for me to start with.

Have a nice day

Albert

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dick eduard
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Hi Larry
In reply to LDBOK, 4 months ago

LDBOK wrote:

Like some of the others, I don't and have never had a FF dream. My K-3 and K-5 are all I need or presently want for the type of photography I do.

http://larrydbrown.com

I love you'r photo's very nice !

Cheers

Dick

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Petroglyph
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to fotobert, 4 months ago

fotobert wrote:

Hi David,

I think they could start. Imagine the following:

DA 1.4 / 55, 5.6/ 560 (is the 4/300 FF capable?)

Yes 300 is.  Maybe 60-250 I can check that.

re-badged 2.8 / 24-70 and 2.8 / 70-200 from Tamron

Not likely, Tamron don't seem to like them anymore.

re-badged or not 1.4 / 35, 1.4 / 85 from Sigma

Already available in K but I bet Sigma would release the 50 f/1.4 Art in K if there was a FF.  Sweet!

I do not know if they really introduce a FF. But this could be an option. Tamron, Sigma and Samyang have some other interesting lenses in their lineup. Enough for me to start with.

Me to.

Have a nice day

Albert

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gaddigad
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

I don't see a definite long term advantage to FF. Yes, FF sensor will (potentially) always be a step ahead in IQ, but nowdays even m4/3 are nearly as capable as aps-c, and the smaller sensors will always keep the crop-factor advantage. Imagine Sony producing an APS-c equivalent of the A7s 12Mp sensor A fast-backwards return to 6/8 Mp sensors with improved IQ, enhanced video and high iso performance..

Or just get a k100d

The question is what body and mount they'd be putting those sensors in..

I think they should keep supporting the k-mount, but they finally might be forced to add a modern, compact mirrorless mount to the pack.

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fotobert
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Petroglyph, 4 months ago

As the Pentax 18-270 is a re-badged Tammy, I would not bet that they don't like each other

Anyway, this is a fine selection of glass. Just add a wide angle prime and zoom...

Albert

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klavrack
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Re: Is this the year Pentax makes or breaks your FF dream?
In reply to Russell Evans, 4 months ago

From what I read on dpreview, the main factor holding down Pentax sales is the perception that the selection, quality and performance of their lenses is subpar, not the lack of a FF body.  A lot of possible Canikon converts like the K-3 body, but not what they hear about Pentax zoom lenses.  When the consensus here with brand loyalists is that many Pentax zooms are inferior to Sigmas, that's not a selling point.

Personally, I'm fine using Sigmas on my K-5, but if I wanted to upgrade my gear, I'd probably consider Canikon for the lens offerings.  If I wanted to go FF, I'd have already switched systems, since the Pentax lens deficiencies are even more of an issue for FF.

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