Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?

Started 7 months ago | Discussions
Daedalus2000
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Toccata47, 7 months ago

Toccata47 wrote:

Irakly Shanidze wrote:

I don't know about Minox, but Contax T I owned and used. The main difference is that Contax T had a viewfinder, while this camera does not. Shooting at slow speeds while holding the camera in midair isn't going to give you acceptable results. An external EVF defeats the purpose. I'd rather have a larger camera with a viewfinder built in.

Of course, in order to make a fashion statement, Leica T is an ideal choice. Photography, however, is not about fashion statements. It is about pictures, and it is not just my humble opinion

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Anyone that says fashion wasn't at least partially a consideration in purchasing a leica is incapable of telling the whole truth.

Do you really believe that this forum is full of fashionistas? Did not think so...

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jeff hladun
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Daedalus2000, 7 months ago

Daedalus2000 wrote:

Do you really believe that this forum is full of fashionistas? Did not think so...

Hear, hear! It's always puzzling to see this sort of comment about Leica "bling" on the forum. I don't know anyone here who feels that way, and everyone I've met on the streets of Toronto who were carrying a (Leica) rangefinder, were certainly not the fashionista type.

Where did this strawman come from, anyway? Are there countries somewhere in the world where a person would hang a rangefinder around their neck as a fashion statement? Are there medical conventions where doctors walk around with M-bodies?

If there are, I'd really like to know.

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Toccata47
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to jeff hladun, 7 months ago

jeff hladun wrote:

Daedalus2000 wrote:

Do you really believe that this forum is full of fashionistas? Did not think so...

Hear, hear! It's always puzzling to see this sort of comment about Leica "bling" on the forum. I don't know anyone here who feels that way, and everyone I've met on the streets of Toronto who were carrying a (Leica) rangefinder, were certainly not the fashionista type.

Where did this strawman come from, anyway? Are there countries somewhere in the world where a person would hang a rangefinder around their neck as a fashion statement? Are there medical conventions where doctors walk around with M-bodies?

If there are, I'd really like to know.

Oh please. Artist and artisan, luigi cases, soft releases. There's an entire industry that caters to this.

There's a world of difference between someone that buys something because it is desirable (fashionable) and someone that buys something for the sake of being desirable (fashionista).

I don't see this as polemic at all.

I have no idea if orange and yellow are fashionable this season, but both cases are coming with my silver T.

Edit: Oh and Jeff, I thought you might get a chuckle out of this:

what happens when fashion, leica and Toronto come together-

http://torontostreetfashion.blogspot.com/2013_05_01_archive.html

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Fogsville
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Toccata47, 7 months ago

Toccata47 wrote:

Edit: Oh and Jeff, I thought you might get a chuckle out of this:

what happens when fashion, leica and Toronto come together-

http://torontostreetfashion.blogspot.com/2013_05_01_archive.html

I'm not quite sure what a woman who is interested in fashion and clothing and is a PhD candidate in mechanical engineering, and who just so happens to use a Leica M6 film camera, a Hasselblad, and a Minolta X-7A film camera, has to do with Leica and fashion?  She says she's always been interested in mechanical film cameras (um, she is studying mechanical engineering.) Her sister is a designer and both of them are into clothing and design.  These are images of a fashion event (something she's obviously interested in) and fashion on the streets, and nothing to do with Leica.  I don't see any Leica cameras in those images.  If you really want 'trendy and Leica' then this is a better example: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/20/fashion/leica-cameras-favored-by-celebrities.html?_r=0  On the other hand, maybe they just so happen to like well-made cameras (?)

I have been using Leica film cameras for decades and bought them because they were the smallest and most durable 35mm cameras available and with the best interchangeable optics.  Now if I decide that I'm interested in how people dress on the streets of LA and become a 'street fashion' photographer, does that make me 'fashionable?'  Or does it make me a 'fashionista?' 

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miro3
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to barjohn, 7 months ago

barjohn wrote:

Several credible reviewers are pointing to issues with the T's performance that are troubling, especially in this price range. David Pogue's review (NY Times), The Camera Store's review and several others have identified several issues such as inaccurate AF, slow AF, inability to turn off review, inability to select RAW only, sluggish touch screen performance, etc. Has anyone seen the released version of the software and whether these issues have been addressed?

It would seem to me that Leica should be working on optimizing the code to get the best possible performance during this period prior to release. Perhaps beta testers are seeing improvements that haven't been reported yet (I hope so). If these issues are not addressed, Leica is likely to see a lot of returns once the newness wears off and users become frustrated by the lack of performance.

don't expect too much from Leica, as far as firmware fixes.

Unfortunately, Leica is not known for its speed at getting firmware updates out to address issues identified by users.

exactly

They need to do better. The camera is certainly beautiful and one that will sell well IMHO if these things are addressed.

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Irakly Shanidze
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Toccata47, 7 months ago

My first Leica was an old used double-stroke M3 when I lived in USSR and had no idea that Leica is a fetish for some. I just knew that for some reason this little camera took pictures that looked better than those coming from my Salut-C medium format beast. I came back to Leica 20 years later here in the US after going through Minolta, Canon, Contax C/Y and Contax ND just to see that look again.

So, what fashion were you talking about?

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Joe Pineapples
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Irakly Shanidze, 7 months ago

Irakly Shanidze wrote:

Joe, you have no idea how wrong your statement is
I've been using Leica M for commercial assignments (advertising mostly) exclusively since 2007. Just recently I had to use Sony a7R (because Sony paid for it), and couldn't wait to go back to Leica M9 both in terms of ergonomics and image quality. Leica M9 pretty much made my medium format rig obsolete, as it gives me the same image quality in a much smaller package. I do not come to shoots with a roller suitcase anymore.

It's an old joke - I'll give you that...

About gear on shoots, I've never felt the slightest desire to try to earn a living with a camera so I wouldn't know; but the professional photogs I know seem to have such a large assortment of assistants, models, props, and general photographic impedimenta with them on a project that the size and weight of the actual cameras they use is in the noise...

J.

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Wetzlarkid
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Joe Pineapples, 7 months ago

Guys it's all about location and task.
Yes my trunk is pretty much full of equipment,
on a professional shoot' the motto is belts N braces.
Or as the saying goes "Be Prepared"
How would your local electrician fare with just a cross head screwdriver in his toolbox?
Pro's know the pitfalls and are therefore always prepared
for the unexpected.
After the initial excitement the T will become just another
tool in the search for that "Image" Eventually the T"
will be superseded by the T-Super X22,
a new thread will start and so it goes....

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Joe Pineapples
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Wetzlarkid, 7 months ago

Wetzlarkid wrote:

Guys it's all about location and task.
Yes my trunk is pretty much full of equipment,
on a professional shoot' the motto is belts N braces.
Or as the saying goes "Be Prepared"
How would your local electrician fare with just a cross head screwdriver in his toolbox?
Pro's know the pitfalls and are therefore always prepared
for the unexpected.
After the initial excitement the T will become just another
tool in the search for that "Image" Eventually the T"
will be superseded by the T-Super X22,
a new thread will start and so it goes....

Man, I can't wait 'til that T-Super X22 comes out. That is one kick-ass camera...

J.

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Toccata47
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Fogsville, 7 months ago

Fogsville wrote:

Toccata47 wrote:

Edit: Oh and Jeff, I thought you might get a chuckle out of this:

what happens when fashion, leica and Toronto come together-

http://torontostreetfashion.blogspot.com/2013_05_01_archive.html

I'm not quite sure what a woman who is interested in fashion and clothing and is a PhD candidate in mechanical engineering, and who just so happens to use a Leica M6 film camera, a Hasselblad, and a Minolta X-7A film camera, has to do with Leica and fashion? She says she's always been interested in mechanical film cameras (um, she is studying mechanical engineering.) Her sister is a designer and both of them are into clothing and design. These are images of a fashion event (something she's obviously interested in) and fashion on the streets, and nothing to do with Leica. I don't see any Leica cameras in those images. If you really want 'trendy and Leica' then this is a better example: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/20/fashion/leica-cameras-favored-by-celebrities.html?_r=0 On the other hand, maybe they just so happen to like well-made cameras (?)

I have been using Leica film cameras for decades and bought them because they were the smallest and most durable 35mm cameras available and with the best interchangeable optics. Now if I decide that I'm interested in how people dress on the streets of LA and become a 'street fashion' photographer, does that make me 'fashionable?' Or does it make me a 'fashionista?'

Holy cow! It's possible that in the course of your creepy and invasive background check (way beyond the about me tab) you missed the irony of using an m6 to shoot an event celebrating bespoke suits in toronto and it's place in a thread about what is fashionable. PS: didn't realize you were Jeff.

Who cares what hollywood celebrities do at a film fest? Do the represent the culture of the city they are visiting?

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Irakly Shanidze
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Joe Pineapples, 7 months ago

Joe Pineapples wrote:

It's an old joke - I'll give you that...

About gear on shoots, I've never felt the slightest desire to try to earn a living with a camera so I wouldn't know; but the professional photogs I know seem to have such a large assortment of assistants, models, props, and general photographic impedimenta with them on a project that the size and weight of the actual cameras they use is in the noise...

J.

In so many years of doing this I figured that a large team is indispensable if one wants to shot a client how effectively his money is spent. This is not my style of work. Usually my crew is no more than 3 people. Honestly, when I see Leibovitz shooting with 25 people on a set, and everybody seems to be doing something super-useful, it is ridiculous

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richygm
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to barjohn, 7 months ago

Firmware update for the 701 released.

"By installing the firmware 1.1 on your Leica T (Typ 701) you will get the complete scope of functions and performance as described in the manual of your camera..."

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AlanG
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Irakly Shanidze, 7 months ago

Irakly Shanidze wrote:

In so many years of doing this I figured that a large team is indispensable if one wants to shot a client how effectively his money is spent. This is not my style of work. Usually my crew is no more than 3 people. Honestly, when I see Leibovitz shooting with 25 people on a set, and everybody seems to be doing something super-useful, it is ridiculous

No offense to you but are we not way off topic? Are people planning to use the T for commercial jobs? If so is it because it is so much smaller than other cameras that are available?  Of course not because plenty of other APS cameras are smaller. And there are only two lenses for it.
Considering you can't use the EVF and a radio flash trigger at the same time, it won't be the choice for many commercial shooters.

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Irakly Shanidze
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to AlanG, 7 months ago

The essence of Leica historically has been a level of quality and usability sufficient for producing images of highest quality, regardless of whether it is for commercial use, or just own pleasure.
Commercially I would use whatever equipment suitable for a particular job. If I needed to be discreet, I would shoot it with an iPhone. If I needed to look like a pompous @sshole, I would rend a yellow hasselblad. If I had a situation requiring use of Leica T for whatever reason it might be, I would not hesitate to use it. So, I really do not understand why would you want to discriminate between amateur and professional categories in this context.

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barjohn
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Irakly Shanidze, 7 months ago

I'm still waiting to hear what version 1.1 did for the user.  To say it impliments the features in the user manual is to imply that they were not all functional in the 1.0 release.  That being the case what changed or improved or is working now that was not working then?  The lack of information is defeaning.  Since the user manual references version 1.2, it must mean that this is a step toward the actual release that matches the manual, though it may be no more than a performance improvement.  Some information from those that received the upgrade would be beneficial and more relevant to the topic of this thread than a discussion about whether this camera is "bling" or suitable for profesional use.

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AlanG
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Irakly Shanidze, 7 months ago

Irakly Shanidze wrote:

The essence of Leica historically has been a level of quality and usability sufficient for producing images of highest quality, regardless of whether it is for commercial use, or just own pleasure.
Commercially I would use whatever equipment suitable for a particular job. If I needed to be discreet, I would shoot it with an iPhone...

What firmware is on your iPhone?

You were the one who brought up commercial use and I was simply saying the T won't likely be used for too many commercial shoots. Not that it is impossible to do so.

What I was specifically pointing out is that nothing in many of theses posts has anything to do with the firmware discussion and I had to read several digressions.

So maybe a different thread is in order if you and others wish to discuss the commercial or personal advantages of shooting with a T or the fashionista stuff.

On the other hand, maybe nobody has much to say about the firmware. Although there is some speculation that Leica can or will change things in firmware such as the lack of peer to peer wifi, and the forced image review. So I thought the development of a list of what people would like to see changed was the goal of this thread.

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Fogsville
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Toccata47, 7 months ago

Toccata47 wrote:

Fogsville wrote:

Toccata47 wrote:

Edit: Oh and Jeff, I thought you might get a chuckle out of this:

what happens when fashion, leica and Toronto come together-

http://torontostreetfashion.blogspot.com/2013_05_01_archive.html

I'm not quite sure what a woman who is interested in fashion and clothing and is a PhD candidate in mechanical engineering, and who just so happens to use a Leica M6 film camera, a Hasselblad, and a Minolta X-7A film camera, has to do with Leica and fashion? She says she's always been interested in mechanical film cameras (um, she is studying mechanical engineering.) Her sister is a designer and both of them are into clothing and design. These are images of a fashion event (something she's obviously interested in) and fashion on the streets, and nothing to do with Leica. I don't see any Leica cameras in those images. If you really want 'trendy and Leica' then this is a better example: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/20/fashion/leica-cameras-favored-by-celebrities.html?_r=0 On the other hand, maybe they just so happen to like well-made cameras (?)

I have been using Leica film cameras for decades and bought them because they were the smallest and most durable 35mm cameras available and with the best interchangeable optics. Now if I decide that I'm interested in how people dress on the streets of LA and become a 'street fashion' photographer, does that make me 'fashionable?' Or does it make me a 'fashionista?'

Holy cow! It's possible that in the course of your creepy and invasive background check (way beyond the about me tab) you missed the irony of using an m6 to shoot an event celebrating bespoke suits in toronto and it's place in a thread about what is fashionable. PS: didn't realize you were Jeff.

Who cares what hollywood celebrities do at a film fest? Do the represent the culture of the city they are visiting?

Creepy and invasive? I got interested in the website and simply read the 'about me' section. I assumed that was why it was there, for people to read. It's all there, nothing I mentioned was part of any 'background check.' And sorry, but there is no 'irony' in using an M6 to photograph a fashion event in Toronto. It happens to be a useful camera, and that person just so happens to use it. So what. Look how Leicas have been used over history; from news, to fashion, to movie sets, to documentary, to commercial, to art, to you-name-it. It happens to be a camera first and whatever you feel compelled to label it as, last.

And the gist of the NYT article unfortunately flew past you (and my apologies if English is your second language.) It's not about 'celebrities at a film fest' it's about Leica being interpreted by some as a "restrained fashion statement" and while using celebrities simply as one example. And I honestly don't know what "do the (sic) represent the culture of the city they are visiting" means, so I can't answer that one.

The point is that Leica can certainly be a 'fashion statement.' However, that simply depends on a particular individual labeling it as such. But it can also be labeled as a serious tool. And by itself it is simply a device that produces images.

And no, I'm not Jeff. But if you want to only address a single person, then don't post your thoughts publicly to everyone.

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Skipper494
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to barjohn, 7 months ago

It would appear that the lenses are not worth the money, compared to my Sony lenses on the NEX 7, no better than the 'Leica' lenses on my Panasonics.

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PSCL1
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to Skipper494, 7 months ago

With respect to Leica making a virtue out of fewer features, the "less is more" strategy, let me quote the late, great photography writer David Vestal:  "Actually, less is less, more is more, and enough is always enough."

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Irakly Shanidze
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Re: Will Leica T Issues Identified by Reviewers be Fixed in Released Firmware?
In reply to AlanG, 7 months ago

My point is, if you put a saddle on a fish, it's not going to gallop no matter how hard you spike it. If you prefer a more literal response, firmware isn't going to change much. In my opinion, this camera is just as ill-conceived as digilux-2. Let's just forget about it and keep shooting M.

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