Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner? Locked

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josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
4 months ago

GH4 with 14-140 mm 3.5-5.6

Nikon with 24-70 mm 2.8

GH4-autofocus speed 28 mm 0,015 shutter speed 0,08

NikonD4S  autofocus speed 24 mm  0,019 shutter speed 0.05

GH4-autofocus speed 280 mm 0,021 shutter speed 0,07

Nikon D4S autofocus speed 70 mm  0,023 shutter speed 0.05

Live-view speed GH4 0,21

Live-view speed Nikon D4S 0,93-097

PLEASE:-|

Source : digitalkamera.de

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Chas2
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Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

i don't know what the numbers were bear out, nor do I care that much, except from an academic viewpoint, but why not at least compare the bodies with two similar lenses?  The Panasonic 12-35 is directly equivalent to the Nikon 24-70.

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josbiker
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Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to Chas2, 4 months ago

Chas2 wrote:

i don't know what the numbers were bear out, nor do I care that much, except from an academic viewpoint, but why not at least compare the bodies with two similar lenses? The Panasonic 12-35 is directly equivalent to the Nikon 24-70.

I have no facts but i think that the GH4 will be much better with the 12-35 (i have one)

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G1Houston
Senior MemberPosts: 2,166Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to Chas2, 4 months ago

Chas2 wrote:

i don't know what the numbers were bear out, nor do I care that much, except from an academic viewpoint, but why not at least compare the bodies with two similar lenses? The Panasonic 12-35 is directly equivalent to the Nikon 24-70.

Yes, I agree. One has to keep in mind  that it is harder to focus on a FF camera at a wider aperture due to the much shallower DOF.

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Fredrik Glckner
Senior MemberPosts: 2,604
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

AF for still images of non moving objects is no issue at all longer with M4/3 cameras. It is more than fast enough.

The next problem is continuous AF with moving objects. In this areas, I would expect that the D4S is still faster. Even if the GH4 has taken a big leap.

http://m43photo.blogspot.com

Martin.au
Senior MemberPosts: 5,913
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

This doesn't surprise me.

I did some S-AF testing with the E-M5 against (IIRC) a D800 and 5DIII and for S-AF there really wasn't much in it In my handful of very unscientific tests E-M5 was faster. Most of that comes down to the fact that the DSLR lenses are very fast, but if they have to go through a decent chunk of their focal range they have to move a fair bit of glass and mechanics (eg: cool moving rings while focussing). The M4/3s lenses focus groups seem to be able to pulse from end to end much faster.

I think it's inevitable that mirrorless will be able to focus faster and better than DSLR one day.

josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to Fredrik Glckner, 4 months ago

Fredrik Glckner wrote:

AF for still images of non moving objects is no issue at all longer with M4/3 cameras. It is more than fast enough.

The next problem is continuous AF with moving objects. In this areas, I would expect that the D4S is still faster. Even if the GH4 has taken a big leap.

http://m43photo.blogspot.com

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

And how do you measure that?

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

PLEASE

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josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to Martin.au, 4 months ago

Martin.au wrote:

This doesn't surprise me.

I did some S-AF testing with the E-M5 against (IIRC) a D800 and 5DIII and for S-AF there really wasn't much in it In my handful of very unscientific tests E-M5 was faster. Most of that comes down to the fact that the DSLR lenses are very fast, but if they have to go through a decent chunk of their focal range they have to move a fair bit of glass and mechanics (eg: cool moving rings while focussing). The M4/3s lenses focus groups seem to be able to pulse from end to end much faster.

I think it's inevitable that mirrorless will be able to focus faster and better than DSLR one day.

Is that a bad thing?

PLEASE

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Bill Wallace
Veteran MemberPosts: 6,236Gear list
Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

I guess this is all well and good, never been into the numbers game me self as I tend to realize the limitations of my gear  and shoot accordingly, but what does this matter....

why not post or cross post this over on the appropriate Nikon forum and see what happens. I guess if I could see the point......

And believe me I'm not the forum police but this all has an antagonistic tone to it and you know how it will all turn out....

Have at it Jos...but put your helmet on....

Bill

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Bill Wallace
http://bwallace.zenfolio.com/
"Mister I ain't a boy no I'm a man
And I believe in a promised land"....

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jim stirling
Veteran MemberPosts: 5,759Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

GH4 with 14-140 mm 3.5-5.6

Nikon with 24-70 mm 2.8

GH4-autofocus speed 28 mm 0,015 shutter speed 0,08

NikonD4S autofocus speed 24 mm 0,019 shutter speed 0.05

GH4-autofocus speed 280 mm 0,021 shutter speed 0,07

Nikon D4S autofocus speed 70 mm 0,023 shutter speed 0.05

Live-view speed GH4 0,21

Live-view speed Nikon D4S 0,93-097

PLEASE:-|

Source : digitalkamera.de

As a user of higher end Nikon FF gear { D2x,D3s,D3x} and with mFT { GF1,GH2,GH3,E-M1 * GX7}.The S-AF speed of mFT bodies is spectacular, where better DSLR's outperform mFT is in C-AF/ tracking and in lower light.When you see the pro photography pits at the biog sporting events filled with mFT gear that is when mFT will outperform DSLRs

Though if slow moving or static shooting in decent light are your priority then , honestly what camera modern  is not fast enough

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josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to jim stirling, 4 months ago

jim stirling wrote:

josbiker wrote:

GH4 with 14-140 mm 3.5-5.6

Nikon with 24-70 mm 2.8

GH4-autofocus speed 28 mm 0,015 shutter speed 0,08

NikonD4S autofocus speed 24 mm 0,019 shutter speed 0.05

GH4-autofocus speed 280 mm 0,021 shutter speed 0,07

Nikon D4S autofocus speed 70 mm 0,023 shutter speed 0.05

Live-view speed GH4 0,21

Live-view speed Nikon D4S 0,93-097

PLEASE:-|

Source : digitalkamera.de

As a user of higher end Nikon FF gear { D2x,D3s,D3x} and with mFT { GF1,GH2,GH3,E-M1 * GX7}.The S-AF speed of mFT bodies is spectacular, where better DSLR's outperform mFT is in C-AF/ tracking and in lower light.When you see the pro photography pits at the biog sporting events filled with mFT gear that is when mFT will outperform DSLRs

Though if slow moving or static shooting in decent light are your priority then , honestly what camera modern is not fast enough

I have not see a sign of the GH4 in your reply, why not?

PLEASE

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josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

Fredrik Glckner wrote:

AF for still images of non moving objects is no issue at all longer with M4/3 cameras. It is more than fast enough.

The next problem is continuous AF with moving objects. In this areas, I would expect that the D4S is still faster. Even if the GH4 has taken a big leap.

http://m43photo.blogspot.com

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

And how do you measure that?

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

PLEASE

Have you answers?

PLEASE

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Eamon Hickey
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,166
S-AF on stationary subjects is not relevant to the D4S
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

There is no single figure.

And how do you measure that?

It's very difficult to quantifiably measure. Perhaps impossible by any reasonable process.

But the issue of how well autofocus works for tracking moving subjects of various kinds, with various lenses, is a real question. There are real differences.

The closest thing we could get to a definitive answer would come from giving a few very experienced professional sports photographers a collection of fast aperture lenses for each tested camera, then send them out for a couple of months to shoot a selection of different professional sports with each camera.

The fact that differences on this performance issue cannot be easily measured by magazines doesn't make them any less real.

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

As regards the D4S, Nikon could not care less about measurements of its S-AF performance on stationary subjects. That's the easy job. It's long since handled on any decent modern camera. Nobody buys a D4S for its S-AF performance.

For autofocus on the D4S, Nikon is competing (with Canon) in the realm of tracking professional athletes, in many different sports, for competitive publication on deadline. If you don't understand what that last part means -- and how it impacts engineering challenges -- then you don't really understand what kind of machines the D4S and the EOS 1DX really are.

josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: S-AF on stationary subjects is not relevant to the D4S
In reply to Eamon Hickey, 4 months ago

Eamon Hickey wrote:

josbiker wrote:

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

There is no single figure.

And how do you measure that?

It's very difficult to quantifiably measure. Perhaps impossible by any reasonable process.

But the issue of how well autofocus works for tracking moving subjects of various kinds, with various lenses, is a real question. There are real differences.

The closest thing we could get to a definitive answer would come from giving a few very experienced professional sports photographers a collection of fast aperture lenses for each tested camera, then send them out for a couple of months to shoot a selection of different professional sports with each camera.

The fact that differences on this performance issue cannot be easily measured by magazines doesn't make them any less real.

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

As regards the D4S, Nikon could not care less about measurements of its S-AF performance on stationary subjects. That's the easy job. It's long since handled on any decent modern camera. Nobody buys a D4S for its S-AF performance.

For autofocus on the D4S, Nikon is competing (with Canon) in the realm of tracking professional athletes, in many different sports, for competitive publication on deadline. If you don't understand what that last part means -- and how it impacts engineering challenges -- then you don't really understand what kind of machines the D4S and the EOS 1DX really are.

Thank you for saying nothing.

I do think that you live in the dark ages with such an answer or you are just a guy that think that Mercedes cars is everything, if you follow me.

I believe in figures rather than in some talk.

PLEASE

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thxbb12
Senior MemberPosts: 1,748Gear list
Re: S-AF on stationary subjects is not relevant to the D4S
In reply to Eamon Hickey, 4 months ago

Eamon Hickey wrote:

josbiker wrote:

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

There is no single figure.

And how do you measure that?

It's very difficult to quantifiably measure. Perhaps impossible by any reasonable process.

But the issue of how well autofocus works for tracking moving subjects of various kinds, with various lenses, is a real question. There are real differences.

The closest thing we could get to a definitive answer would come from giving a few very experienced professional sports photographers a collection of fast aperture lenses for each tested camera, then send them out for a couple of months to shoot a selection of different professional sports with each camera.

The fact that differences on this performance issue cannot be easily measured by magazines doesn't make them any less real.

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

As regards the D4S, Nikon could not care less about measurements of its S-AF performance on stationary subjects. That's the easy job. It's long since handled on any decent modern camera. Nobody buys a D4S for its S-AF performance.

For autofocus on the D4S, Nikon is competing (with Canon) in the realm of tracking professional athletes, in many different sports, for competitive publication on deadline. If you don't understand what that last part means -- and how it impacts engineering challenges -- then you don't really understand what kind of machines the D4S and the EOS 1DX really are.

Very well said, Eamon.

The OP is border line trolling and doesn't seem to understand the extremely sophisticated implementations of AF-C in high end Canikon bodies and why they are used by pro sport photographers.

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alabaster
Senior MemberPosts: 1,531Gear list
Re: S-AF on stationary subjects is not relevant to the D4S
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

Eamon Hickey wrote:

josbiker wrote:

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

There is no single figure.

And how do you measure that?

It's very difficult to quantifiably measure. Perhaps impossible by any reasonable process.

But the issue of how well autofocus works for tracking moving subjects of various kinds, with various lenses, is a real question. There are real differences.

The closest thing we could get to a definitive answer would come from giving a few very experienced professional sports photographers a collection of fast aperture lenses for each tested camera, then send them out for a couple of months to shoot a selection of different professional sports with each camera.

The fact that differences on this performance issue cannot be easily measured by magazines doesn't make them any less real.

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

As regards the D4S, Nikon could not care less about measurements of its S-AF performance on stationary subjects. That's the easy job. It's long since handled on any decent modern camera. Nobody buys a D4S for its S-AF performance.

For autofocus on the D4S, Nikon is competing (with Canon) in the realm of tracking professional athletes, in many different sports, for competitive publication on deadline. If you don't understand what that last part means -- and how it impacts engineering challenges -- then you don't really understand what kind of machines the D4S and the EOS 1DX really are.

Thank you for saying nothing.

I do think that you live in the dark ages with such an answer or you are just a guy that think that Mercedes cars is everything, if you follow me.

I believe in figures rather than in some talk.

PLEASE

How old are you - 14?

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Eamon Hickey
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,166
intentionally abusing figures
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

I do think that you live in the dark ages with such an answer or you are just a guy that think that Mercedes cars is everything, if you follow me.

Thanks for speculating about what kind of person I am. Always helpful to get the opinion of anonymous dudes on the Internet.

What I actually am is somebody who knows what the D4S is for and what pro sports and photojournalism cameras are used for.

The D4S is about the last camera I would buy, but it's not a Mercedes car. It's a panel truck. It's for work -- a specific kind of work. Get it?

I believe in figures rather than in some talk.

Right, because figures never need context. The top speed of a greyhound dog is 70km/h and the top speed of a mule is about 25 km/h; the greyhound is 3X faster. Doing the math, that means the dog could carry a 50 kg. pack to the top of a mountain in 1/3rd the time. I love figures! So much better than talk.

josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: S-AF on stationary subjects is not relevant to the D4S
In reply to alabaster, 4 months ago

alabaster wrote:

josbiker wrote:

Eamon Hickey wrote:

josbiker wrote:

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

There is no single figure.

And how do you measure that?

It's very difficult to quantifiably measure. Perhaps impossible by any reasonable process.

But the issue of how well autofocus works for tracking moving subjects of various kinds, with various lenses, is a real question. There are real differences.

The closest thing we could get to a definitive answer would come from giving a few very experienced professional sports photographers a collection of fast aperture lenses for each tested camera, then send them out for a couple of months to shoot a selection of different professional sports with each camera.

The fact that differences on this performance issue cannot be easily measured by magazines doesn't make them any less real.

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

As regards the D4S, Nikon could not care less about measurements of its S-AF performance on stationary subjects. That's the easy job. It's long since handled on any decent modern camera. Nobody buys a D4S for its S-AF performance.

For autofocus on the D4S, Nikon is competing (with Canon) in the realm of tracking professional athletes, in many different sports, for competitive publication on deadline. If you don't understand what that last part means -- and how it impacts engineering challenges -- then you don't really understand what kind of machines the D4S and the EOS 1DX really are.

Thank you for saying nothing.

I do think that you live in the dark ages with such an answer or you are just a guy that think that Mercedes cars is everything, if you follow me.

I believe in figures rather than in some talk.

PLEASE

How old are you - 14?

-- hide signature --

That is what i thought an Nikon fan boy, mine is bigger thus better although that has nothing to do with intelligence.

Electronic is the answer, not mechanical mirrors.What is the difference between a D4 and a D4s you know the answers, if not than it is a waist of time.

PLEASE

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josbiker
Regular MemberPosts: 348Gear list
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

josbiker wrote:

josbiker wrote:

Fredrik Glckner wrote:

AF for still images of non moving objects is no issue at all longer with M4/3 cameras. It is more than fast enough.

The next problem is continuous AF with moving objects. In this areas, I would expect that the D4S is still faster. Even if the GH4 has taken a big leap.

http://m43photo.blogspot.com

What is your idea about the D4s and what is exactly the figure too describe that?

And how do you measure that?

And what is the difference between the GH4 and the DS4 because you describe that as a big leap?

PLEASE

Have you answers?

PLEASE

Fredrik, why do you have no answers for us/me?

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maoyama
Forum MemberPosts: 58
Re: Facts GH4 versus Nikon DS4 autofocus speed, who is the winner?
In reply to josbiker, 4 months ago

So in this thread, you personally linked to a test done by naturalexposures.com: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53604443

I looked a bit more into it, and this is what I've found on CAF on some of the Nikon tests he did. I threw out GH4's 0 pointers since he didn't do it for his Nikon tests, and would put the Panasonic at an even more disadvantage. %1 is his 5 pointers divided by the total. %2 is his 5 and 3 pointers divided by the total.

Mirrorless cameras are quickly improving, but as you can see, unlike what you seem to be claiming, they aren't there for CAF yet.  Do you disagree?

GH4
1 - 47
3 - 12
5 - 72
T - 131
%1 - 55%
%2 - 64%

D4
1 - 36
3 - 11
5 - 109
T - 156
%1 - 70%
%2 - 77%

D800
1 - 40
3 - 13
5 - 102
T - 155
%1 - 66%
%2 - 74%

D600
1 - 28
3 - 15
5 - 50
T - 93
%1 - 54%
%2 - 70%

http://www.naturalexposures.com/panasonic-lumix-gh4/
http://www.naturalexposures.com/testing-the-nikon-d4-d800-d600-in-predictive-auto-focus/

Also, for your future reference, the word "please" isn't used in English as you've been using. Maybe you mean, "Sincerely" or "Yours truly" or even "Thank you."

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