A77ii; Well I'm disappointed

Started 7 months ago | Discussions
1DanC
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A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
7 months ago

Looks like an expensive firmware upgrade for me.  I have to say my recent investment in a Zeiss lens has improved the quality of the images from my A77 to the extent that I feel it was the correct decision on where to invest my money.

The amount of time that Sony kept us wondering and waiting and the secrecy which made it all seem like we were looking at quantum technology changes, has led to a fizzle.  I hope that the A99ii will deliver incrementally more than this has done.

When DPREVIEW does a full review I'll look again to see if my thoughts can be swayed.  I would see little reason to upgrade.  It may present a more attractive option for pulling CaNikonites towards Sony.

Dan C

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Almazar80
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

I don't think you can implement a larger buffer, higher frame rate, expanded and faster AF with a mere firmware upgrade.  To me, the camera looks like a great upgrade.  They could have implemented the newer video codec or even 4K recording, but this camera seems to be an action tracking machine.  Let's see how it performs.

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K E Hoffman
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

Really what have you actually read..

  • Bigger buffer
  • Brighter LCD
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points
  • F2.8 AF sensor point
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF
  • Smart object tracking
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press

did you take the time to read in detail or just read an SAR post and make a decision..

http://www.sony.net/Products/di/en-gb/products/g2sw/feature.html?contentsTop=1

What did you want?  A robot to take the photos for you

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K.E.H. >> Shooting between raindrops in WA<<
Don't Panic!.. these are just opinions... go take some pictures..

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1DanC
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to K E Hoffman, 7 months ago

Yes but does it take better pictures.

The big disappointments in the current A77 for me have been the smudgy Jpegs and low light performance.

All the other gizmos are not quantum leaps given all the secrecy.

  • Bigger buffer - I never have a problem with this
  • Brighter LCD - I've never adjusted mine above mid way
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting, I hardly ever have my camera on Wide, I like to pick what I want to focus on
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points - see my previous point
  • F2.8 AF sensor point - I'll read up on this
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF - and what about the EVF in this kind of light
  • Smart object tracking - lets see what testing shows on this
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press - might make you think you're actually doing a good job when you are not. I liked the indicator in the A77 which they got rid of, I'd love to see that come back.

The GPS is gone, that's a mistake. Have they improved the JPG engine?

I'll see what the full test brings, I can't see motivation to go to it from the A77 until mine fails. The A99ii may be an option.

Dan C

PS and they've changed the hotshoe!  That means a new flash!

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K E Hoffman
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

1DanC wrote:

Yes but does it take better pictures.

The big disappointments in the current A77 for me have been the smudgy Jpegs and low light

Then we get to two issues..

Is Good focus part of IQ..(I tend to think good focus is )  If you shoot static objects .. there is not as much for you here. that is true.

The other question is.. If you need better JPGs at low light.. get a decent PP tool.  Its nice the camera has a photo lab in it.. but if the photolab doesn't meet your standards step up to the plate and deal with it...

performance.

All the other gizmos are not quantum leaps given all the secrecy.

  • Bigger buffer - I never have a problem with this
  • Brighter LCD - I've never adjusted mine above mid way
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting, I hardly ever have my camera on Wide, I like to pick what I want to focus on
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points - see my previous point
  • F2.8 AF sensor point - I'll read up on this
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF - and what about the EVF in this kind of light
  • Smart object tracking - lets see what testing shows on this
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press - might make you think you're actually doing a good job when you are not. I liked the indicator in the A77 which they got rid of, I'd love to see that come back.

The GPS is gone, that's a mistake. Have they improved the JPG engine?

I'll see what the full test brings, I can't see motivation to go to it from the A77 until mine fails. The A99ii may be an option.

Dan C

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K.E.H. >> Shooting between raindrops in WA<<
Don't Panic!.. these are just opinions... go take some pictures..

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garykohs
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

1DanC wrote:

Looks like an expensive firmware upgrade for me. I have to say my recent investment in a Zeiss lens has improved the quality of the images from my A77 to the extent that I feel it was the correct decision on where to invest my money.

The amount of time that Sony kept us wondering and waiting and the secrecy which made it all seem like we were looking at quantum technology changes, has led to a fizzle. I hope that the A99ii will deliver incrementally more than this has done.

When DPREVIEW does a full review I'll look again to see if my thoughts can be swayed. I would see little reason to upgrade. It may present a more attractive option for pulling CaNikonites towards Sony.

Dan C

If you don't shoot anything other than static object in good light, there is no reason to upgrade.

For a sports shooter like me this is a great upgrade. Thanks, Sony, for sweating the details!

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Raven Falls
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to Almazar80, 7 months ago

Almazar80 wrote:

I don't think you can implement a larger buffer, higher frame rate, expanded and faster AF with a mere firmware upgrade. To me, the camera looks like a great upgrade. They could have implemented the newer video codec or even 4K recording, but this camera seems to be an action tracking machine. Let's see how it performs.

And if they could...well, I'd sure love to get my hands on that firmware upgrade! 

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Tonkotsu Ramen
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

What isn't in this camera that you wanted? I'm curious.

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Steve Cohan
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+1, for a sports video shooter like me it's great!! nt
In reply to garykohs, 7 months ago
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I'm not a pixel peeper. I just shoot images.

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Denis247
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to K E Hoffman, 7 months ago

K E Hoffman wrote:

Really what have you actually read..

  • Bigger buffer
  • Brighter LCD
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points
  • F2.8 AF sensor point
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF
  • Smart object tracking
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press

did you take the time to read in detail or just read an SAR post and make a decision..

http://www.sony.net/Products/di/en-gb/products/g2sw/feature.html?contentsTop=1

What did you want? A robot to take the photos for you

Well, I'm not normally into toys, but ...

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K.E.H. >> Shooting between raindrops in WA<<
Don't Panic!.. these are just opinions... go take some pictures..

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IanML
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Re: +1, for a sports video shooter like me it's great!! nt
In reply to Steve Cohan, 7 months ago

Steve Cohan wrote:

Looking forward to some more great video from you, Steve, when you get your a77II.

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Ian

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EinsteinsGhost
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

Yes but does it take better pictures.

The big disappointments in the current A77 for me have been the smudgy Jpegs and low light performance.

All the other gizmos are not quantum leaps given all the secrecy.

  • Bigger buffer - I never have a problem with this
  • Brighter LCD - I've never adjusted mine above mid way
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting, I hardly ever have my camera on Wide, I like to pick what I want to focus on
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points - see my previous point
  • F2.8 AF sensor point - I'll read up on this
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF - and what about the EVF in this kind of light
  • Smart object tracking - lets see what testing shows on this
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press - might make you think you're actually doing a good job when you are not. I liked the indicator in the A77 which they got rid of, I'd love to see that come back.

The GPS is gone, that's a mistake. Have they improved the JPG engine?

I'll see what the full test brings, I can't see motivation to go to it from the A77 until mine fails. The A99ii may be an option.

Dan C

PS and they've changed the hotshoe!  That means a new flash!

You don't seem to be the intended market for a performance oriented cameras. So far you have listed... AF, tracking, buffer improvements as not something you care about. Top of your list?
- SOOC JPEG
- GPS

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1DanC
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to EinsteinsGhost, 7 months ago

I use my A77 for portraiture and a lot of landscape work, which I love doing, and like I say the Zeiss has been a brilliant investment for me.  There are a lot of ways to use a "performance" camera and not everybody wants to shoot a herd of buffalo coming at them and keeping them in accurate focus so cut me some slack.  Someone asked what improvements I would have liked to see in there, well a much better flash exposure management system if it were mentioned would be interesting to me.

I don't recall saying the GPS was on the top of my list, I think that it was a sad sacrifice to present a camera that is more fashionable with Wireless capability, and frankly, I don't shoot RAW unless I am taking critical photos where PP is needed, like a wedding for instance.   So good quality JPGs are important in my mind.  Adding to the use of useless additions, like the ability for the camera to do audio level monitoring during video is a waste, this is professional capability in a camera that doesn't provide for a license for using any recordings for any commercial purposes (at least that is the case for the A77, lets see if its different).

I am not confident that Low light performance is improved radically by PP.

Anyway the point of my post was to say that after reading up on the A77II i don't feel like dropping my A77 in the bin and chasing after the new model.  And I don't have a new wishlist that would make me go that way.  The move from my A700 to the A77 was a significant change, I had no hesitation to move to it then.  In the A77ii I see a replacement camera that provided updated features at a targeted price point, for which everybody waited a long time.  I don't see Sony reinventing a photographic experience as they did with the A700, perhaps thats why they called it the A77 ii and not the A7.

The next step for me will be full frame and another Zeiss lens and I am hoping that the upgrade from the A99 will be more significant....or the A7:-)

Dan C

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tbcass
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

Actually it seems to be more of an upgrade than I expected. What were you expecting? It's not enough to make me upgrade from my 6 month old A77 but my backup is a 2 year old A65. In a year or 2 when the A77ii price drops I'll probably buy one then and sell my A65.

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Tom
Look at the picture, not the pixels
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Miss use of the ability to do 100% pixel peeping is the bane of digital photography because it causes people to fret over inconsequential issues.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/25301400@N00/

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eastriding4310
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

Dan, I am more than a little disappointed in the "new" A77II SLT.  The seventy or eighty A77II images I have seen from the professional announcement attendees were a great disappointment.  I was hoping to see image quality far better than my current A77.  After seeing hundreds of images with great IQ from the A7r and A7, I was hoping for a great leap forward in image quality.  I got none.  The new A77 cannot even match the image quality of the old A900.

My A77 already has great bells and whistles.  A few more are not going to give me higher IQ.

I want a great full sized body mirrorless camera with A7r IQ in A mount with built in IS.

I know that you were expressing genuine disappointment, and it is too bad that others on this forum do not respect you or your concerns.  I too am tired of "mush hair" from my jpegs.

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tqlla
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to eastriding4310, 7 months ago

eastriding4310 wrote:

Dan, I am more than a little disappointed in the "new" A77II SLT. The seventy or eighty A77II images I have seen from the professional announcement attendees were a great disappointment. I was hoping to see image quality far better than my current A77. After seeing hundreds of images with great IQ from the A7r and A7, I was hoping for a great leap forward in image quality. I got none. The new A77 cannot even match the image quality of the old A900.

My A77 already has great bells and whistles. A few more are not going to give me higher IQ.

I want a great full sized body mirrorless camera with A7r IQ in A mount with built in IS.

I know that you were expressing genuine disappointment, and it is too bad that others on this forum do not respect you or your concerns. I too am tired of "mush hair" from my jpegs.

Are you being sarcastic in your post?

You were expecting the APSC 24MP A77ii, to match the Full Frame A7/A7R?

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eastbayrae
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

1DanC wrote:

Looks like an expensive firmware upgrade for me. I have to say my recent investment in a Zeiss lens has improved the quality of the images from my A77 to the extent that I feel it was the correct decision on where to invest my money.

The amount of time that Sony kept us wondering and waiting and the secrecy which made it all seem like we were looking at quantum technology changes, has led to a fizzle. I hope that the A99ii will deliver incrementally more than this has done.

When DPREVIEW does a full review I'll look again to see if my thoughts can be swayed. I would see little reason to upgrade. It may present a more attractive option for pulling CaNikonites towards Sony.

Dan C

It's pretty easy Dan: don't buy it if you don't like it. That is the great thing about capitalism. I didn't care for it so I bought an a99.

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K E Hoffman
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to eastriding4310, 7 months ago

eastriding4310 wrote:

Dan, I am more than a little disappointed in the "new" A77II SLT. The seventy or eighty A77II images I have seen from the professional announcement attendees were a great disappointment. I was hoping to see image quality far better than my current A77. After seeing hundreds of images with great IQ from the A7r and A7, I was hoping for a great leap forward in image quality. I got none. The new A77 cannot even match the image quality of the old A900.

My A77 already has great bells and whistles. A few more are not going to give me higher IQ.

I want a great full sized body mirrorless camera with A7r IQ in A mount with built in IS.

I know that you were expressing genuine disappointment, and it is too bad that others on this forum do not respect you or your concerns. I too am tired of "mush hair" from my jpegs.

You seriosly didn't assume an apc cameras was going to get the high iso of a FF sensor. That is what creats disappointment, The a99 / a7 cropped to apc is only 10 mp how on earth would an apc at 24 mp match that. Spending some time with dxomark would be a good place to start avoiding disappoint ,

As to mushy hair.. you have not figured out how to use the tool.

BTW improved AF and visual stabilized framing are not bells and whistles unless you only shoot wigs with a tripod.

- -
K.E.H. >> Shooting between raindrops in WA<<
Don't Panic!.. these are just opinions... go take some pictures..

 K E Hoffman's gear list:K E Hoffman's gear list
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Miike Dougherty
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to 1DanC, 7 months ago

1DanC wrote:

Yes but does it take better pictures.

The big disappointments in the current A77 for me have been the smudgy Jpegs and low light performance.

All the other gizmos are not quantum leaps given all the secrecy.

  • Bigger buffer - I never have a problem with this
  • Brighter LCD - I've never adjusted mine above mid way
  • 5 times the AF points.. with AF limiting, I hardly ever have my camera on Wide, I like to pick what I want to focus on
  • Larger frame coverage with AF points - see my previous point
  • F2.8 AF sensor point - I'll read up on this
  • -2 EV (full moon level light ) AF - and what about the EVF in this kind of light
  • Smart object tracking - lets see what testing shows on this
  • EVF / LCD stabilization active with button press - might make you think you're actually doing a good job when you are not. I liked the indicator in the A77 which they got rid of, I'd love to see that come back.

The GPS is gone, that's a mistake. Have they improved the JPG engine?

I'll see what the full test brings, I can't see motivation to go to it from the A77 until mine fails. The A99ii may be an option.

Dan C

PS and they've changed the hotshoe! That means a new flash!

You are absolutely right about the JPEG files.  Once Photoshop CS6 could easily open the RAW files and convert them to TIFF, I haven't post processed a JPEG file in ages. I hope the RAW file code hasn't changed since I don't think Adobe is updating Adobe RAW any more.

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eastriding4310
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Re: A77ii; Well I'm disappointed
In reply to K E Hoffman, 7 months ago

Well Ken,  I already own an aps c camera that has higher jpeg IQ than the A99 raw, the A7 and equals that of the A7r, so yes, I was expecting Sony to step up. And, yes, I am very disappointed that they did not.

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