I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!

Started 8 months ago | Discussions
Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Mark Chan, 7 months ago

Mark Chan wrote:

Anders, lol, guilty as charged

The laugh is all on you. As everyone can see for themselves, you dodged my question. So you were caught with your pants down spreading false allegations again, just as you were a couple of months ago. See here:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53300363

(going at it again)

Judging by the evidence (as exemplified by the link above and my comments below), frequent repetition and painstakingly detailed explanations appear necessary in order for you to get the point.

I also bet I could take a faster snap of that pic you took of the cyclists with a. Manual lens.

There is no reason to bet since I already told you (at the end of the post of mine to which you reply) that a more efficient method when shooting by-passing bikers is to pre-AF or MF. The implication is that I might have shot what I shot just as well (but not better) with a manual lens.

What's the point?

You didn't get that? So let me explain. The point is to prove you wrong. It is now clear that neither of the two examples you gave to illustrate your needs for faster AF than the 20 can provide holds up. Your contrived example, where you are shooting a landscape and then suddenly, in a split-second, turn to shoot your kid running towards you "at close quarters" was dealt with already in the previous thread. Your second example was the one we are now talking about: by-passing bikers.

First, and ironically, you now spontaneously recognize (see above) that this is not a scenario where AF is at all needed. Second, I showed, by not pre-AF-ing or MF-ing as I usually would, that the 20 is capable of handling this scenario even if you try last-second AF, as I did in this case.

You can state what you feel. I can state what I feel. You can refer to your tests, I will refer to my experience.

Sure. You can state what you feel. Just don't confuse your subjective impressions with objective matters of fact.

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photo perzon
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Re: 17mm f/1.8 fuzzy compared to super sharp 20mm
In reply to Pixnat2, 7 months ago

Pixnat2 wrote:

photo perzon wrote:

Pixnat2 wrote:

Wesley Byrne wrote:

UPS just delivered my Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II. I had read the reviews and knew the Panasonic 20mm f1.7 autofocus wasn't fast, but I wasn't expecting it to be so unbearably slow. Some here have said that the 20mm f1.7 isn't that slow, and that it autofocuses about as fast as other m43 lenses when large focus adjustments are not needed, but they are wrong. This lens is useless for even slow moving subjects. I am definitely returning this lens.

I know the 20mm f1.7 has many fans, presumably folks who photograph static scenes. In my opinion, compared to the 17mm f1.8 and the 25mm f1.8, the 20mm f1.7 is a dog. Panasonic should be embarrassed for releasing this lens with barely-functional AF.

</end rant>

I bought this lens for the E-P1, but never quite liked it. I wouldn't say that the 20mm f/1.7 is slow, but rather annoying to use. Yes it's sharp, but sharpness is not even across the frame, it has noisy AF operation, PF on Oly cameras older than E-M1 and I didn't liked the bokeh.

I got the 17mm f/1.8 (an FL that I prefer), and really enjoy it. Yes it's a bit less sharp, but nothing to worry about, and it has an even sharpness from center to corner. Moreover it's quiet, fast, and the clutch mechanism makes it a joy to use. I never ever regret the slight loss of sharpness!

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To me sharpness is muh more important than fast AF and accross the frame. With f1.7 accross becomes bokeh. And fast AF to get a not so sharp image is like rush to wait.

The 20mm is sharper than the 25mm Leica. Sharper than most lenses worldwide. 99% of my shots do not need fast AF.

To each his/her own. I can figure that many are happy with it.

Just need to figure that the 17mm is plenty sharp, just a tad less than the 20mm.

I remembered a thread where people had hard times to find which picture was taken with either one!

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Frederic
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No way.  The 20mm is painfully sharp.  Amazing for pets.  The 17mm to me is a soft lens.  Fast AF but fuzzy.

Some people just don't have a discerning eye.  To me the 20mm and the 17mm are worlds apart.  I exchanged the 17mm and the other one also was just as soft.

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cmpatti
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Re: 17mm f/1.8 fuzzy compared to super sharp 20mm
In reply to photo perzon, 7 months ago

photo perzon wrote:

Pixnat2 wrote:

photo perzon wrote:

Pixnat2 wrote:

Wesley Byrne wrote:

UPS just delivered my Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II. I had read the reviews and knew the Panasonic 20mm f1.7 autofocus wasn't fast, but I wasn't expecting it to be so unbearably slow. Some here have said that the 20mm f1.7 isn't that slow, and that it autofocuses about as fast as other m43 lenses when large focus adjustments are not needed, but they are wrong. This lens is useless for even slow moving subjects. I am definitely returning this lens.

I know the 20mm f1.7 has many fans, presumably folks who photograph static scenes. In my opinion, compared to the 17mm f1.8 and the 25mm f1.8, the 20mm f1.7 is a dog. Panasonic should be embarrassed for releasing this lens with barely-functional AF.

</end rant>

I bought this lens for the E-P1, but never quite liked it. I wouldn't say that the 20mm f/1.7 is slow, but rather annoying to use. Yes it's sharp, but sharpness is not even across the frame, it has noisy AF operation, PF on Oly cameras older than E-M1 and I didn't liked the bokeh.

I got the 17mm f/1.8 (an FL that I prefer), and really enjoy it. Yes it's a bit less sharp, but nothing to worry about, and it has an even sharpness from center to corner. Moreover it's quiet, fast, and the clutch mechanism makes it a joy to use. I never ever regret the slight loss of sharpness!

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Frederic
http://azurphoto.com/

To me sharpness is muh more important than fast AF and accross the frame. With f1.7 accross becomes bokeh. And fast AF to get a not so sharp image is like rush to wait.

The 20mm is sharper than the 25mm Leica. Sharper than most lenses worldwide. 99% of my shots do not need fast AF.

To each his/her own. I can figure that many are happy with it.

Just need to figure that the 17mm is plenty sharp, just a tad less than the 20mm.

I remembered a thread where people had hard times to find which picture was taken with either one!

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Frederic
http://azurphoto.com/

No way. The 20mm is painfully sharp. Amazing for pets.

My cat loves hers.

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NZ Scott
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Re: 17mm f/1.8 fuzzy compared to super sharp 20mm
In reply to photo perzon, 7 months ago

photo perzon wrote:

No way. The 20mm is painfully sharp. Amazing for pets. The 17mm to me is a soft lens. Fast AF but fuzzy.

Some people just don't have a discerning eye. To me the 20mm and the 17mm are worlds apart. I exchanged the 17mm and the other one also was just as soft.

Can you post some examples?

I don't find mine to be "soft" or "fuzzy":

f

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Pixnat2
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Soft/Fuzzy?
In reply to photo perzon, 7 months ago

photo perzon wrote:

No way. The 20mm is painfully sharp. Amazing for pets. The 17mm to me is a soft lens. Fast AF but fuzzy.

Mine isn't that soft/fuzzy.

E-M5 + 17mm @ f/5.6, converted in LR 5

Maybe you had a lemon?

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Mark Chan
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Anders W, 7 months ago

Anders,

answer simply.  Have you had experience comparing the two lens - 17mm f1.8 and 20mm F1.7?

Which one is faster to focus?

Which one does focuses similarly fast under ALL conditions? Not conditions YOU stipulate in YOUR controlled test?

Can't answer that? Or will you still extrapolate from your findings?

The OP here had the 17mm f1.8; his statement comes from HIS direct experience using both lens, and stating he feels misled that the 20mm f1.7 would be fast enough.

YOUR picture shows a general condition that any point and shoot can take.  Your controlled tests help you identify 'conditions' in which this lovely lens of yours will focus 'comparably' with other lens.

Maybe Panasonic should hire you to promote their lens.  Do remember to tell them to place a sticker on the box stating 'AF works as fast as similar lens under 'set' conditions.  Or to 'not expect' fast AF when focusing from close range to infinity or vice versa.

Seriously and you still think you are not misinforming others as regards the strengths and weaknesses of this lens.

You state you are a scientist.  If you so want to continue claiming what you claim, do go and buy or loan a 17mm f1.8 or even the 25mm f1.8 and redo all your tests.  EVEN then state clearly under what specific conditions the 20mm f1.7 works equal to them, and what conditions do not.  Be holistic please.

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Mark Chan
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to GeorgianBay1939, 7 months ago

Tom,

Oh I do fully understand what is going on.

And the questions were not answered back then. Nor will they be answered by the person involved.

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micksh6
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to NZ Scott, 7 months ago

NZ Scott wrote:

s_grins wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

You know, I made the view that the PANA 20mm f1.7 was slow to AF and should be avoided by those that need to take pics of kids and fast moving items / people. This was quite a few threads back.

There are a few that adamantly state my (and many other's experience) is flawed and that the PAN 20mm - both versions are perfectly capable of 'catching' that moment.

Its plain not.

Choose 17mm or 25mm OLY for that.

Choose 20mm f1.7 if you don't NEED fast AF under any circumstances or are perfectly happy to live within its limitations.

It is unfortunate you got misinformed. And yes there are many that are misinforming leading to poor purchase decision.

I do not have photos of kids (I do not have grandchildren, yet), but I have one old photo of the dog. As you know, dogs even more difficult in compare with children.

I think this is a poor example. The dog is stationary - not exactly running towards the camera or anything like that.

We don't know, maybe the dog pushes the table towards photographer and does it really fast.

20mm lens owners probably didn't try photographing at bowling places or anywhere with the light level about ISO1600, F2.0, 1/20s. I did, and 20mm lens is barely usable in such situations.
17mm F1.8 lens, however, locks focus without problems. Here is an example

1

S

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Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to micksh6, 7 months ago

micksh6 wrote:

NZ Scott wrote:

s_grins wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

You know, I made the view that the PANA 20mm f1.7 was slow to AF and should be avoided by those that need to take pics of kids and fast moving items / people. This was quite a few threads back.

There are a few that adamantly state my (and many other's experience) is flawed and that the PAN 20mm - both versions are perfectly capable of 'catching' that moment.

Its plain not.

Choose 17mm or 25mm OLY for that.

Choose 20mm f1.7 if you don't NEED fast AF under any circumstances or are perfectly happy to live within its limitations.

It is unfortunate you got misinformed. And yes there are many that are misinforming leading to poor purchase decision.

I do not have photos of kids (I do not have grandchildren, yet), but I have one old photo of the dog. As you know, dogs even more difficult in compare with children.

I think this is a poor example. The dog is stationary - not exactly running towards the camera or anything like that.

We don't know, maybe the dog pushes the table towards photographer and does it really fast.

20mm lens owners probably didn't try photographing at bowling places or anywhere with the light level about ISO1600, F2.0, 1/20s. I did, and 20mm lens is barely usable in such situations.

I don't know about you, but I certainly have no difficulties getting my 20 to lock on a target like that at the light level you mention. But are you saying that this is a scenario where AF, let alone quick AF, is at all needed?

For shooting a scene like that, I'd already have set focus in advance so that I can capture the right moment.

17mm F1.8 lens, however, locks focus without problems. Here is an example

1

S

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Mark Chan
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to micksh6, 7 months ago

micksh6 wrote:

NZ Scott wrote:

s_grins wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

You know, I made the view that the PANA 20mm f1.7 was slow to AF and should be avoided by those that need to take pics of kids and fast moving items / people. This was quite a few threads back.

There are a few that adamantly state my (and many other's experience) is flawed and that the PAN 20mm - both versions are perfectly capable of 'catching' that moment.

Its plain not.

Choose 17mm or 25mm OLY for that.

Choose 20mm f1.7 if you don't NEED fast AF under any circumstances or are perfectly happy to live within its limitations.

It is unfortunate you got misinformed. And yes there are many that are misinforming leading to poor purchase decision.

I do not have photos of kids (I do not have grandchildren, yet), but I have one old photo of the dog. As you know, dogs even more difficult in compare with children.

I think this is a poor example. The dog is stationary - not exactly running towards the camera or anything like that.

We don't know, maybe the dog pushes the table towards photographer and does it really fast.

20mm lens owners probably didn't try photographing at bowling places or anywhere with the light level about ISO1600, F2.0, 1/20s. I did, and 20mm lens is barely usable in such situations.
17mm F1.8 lens, however, locks focus without problems. Here is an example

1

Another three examples that I am sure the 20mm f1.7 wont' work well in.

Through a fence. The 20mm would hunt through this.

Pretty much instantaneous; and taken with my left hand no less.

Youngsters walking by; followed their motion to add a 'bit' of character to the pic. The 20mm would still not have focused by the time they had gone past.

S

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G1Houston
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Mark Chan, 7 months ago

Mark Chan wrote:

1

Another three examples that I am sure the 20mm f1.7 wont' work well in.

Through a fence. The 20mm would hunt through this.

Pretty much instantaneous; and taken with my left hand no less.

Youngsters walking by; followed their motion to add a 'bit' of character to the pic. The 20mm would still not have focused by the time they had gone past.

S

Not sure about the points of these pictures, none of them is in focus except the last one.

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Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Mark Chan, 7 months ago

Mark Chan wrote:

Anders,

answer simply. Have you had experience comparing the two lens - 17mm f1.8 and 20mm F1.7?

Which one is faster to focus?

Which one does focuses similarly fast under ALL conditions? Not conditions YOU stipulate in YOUR controlled test?

Can't answer that? Or will you still extrapolate from your findings?

Where in this thread have I said anything specifically about the 17/1.8? I responded to the OP's general claim about the 20 versus "other lenses".

Now two months ago I asked you the following here:

"Are you claiming that the 17/1.8 is noticeably faster than other modern lenses with similar AF design like the 12/2 and the 45/1.8 included in my test? If so, on what basis do you make that claim?"

You didn't respond. I have asked the same question of others as well and I have yet to see a positive response along with the evidence required to back it up. Obviously, the question presumes fully comparable conditions (same AF target, same magnification, same light conditions etc.).

The OP here had the 17mm f1.8; his statement comes from HIS direct experience using both lens, and stating he feels misled that the 20mm f1.7 would be fast enough.

According to his gear list he had it but no longer has it. Like you, he has apparently failed to test anything and is just reporting his subjective feelings.

YOUR picture shows a general condition that any point and shoot can take.

Exactly. So I proved you doubly wrong as already explained. The scene for which you said you needed fast AF (bikers passing by) doesn't really require it. But if you insist on AF-ing at the last moment rather than prefocus (as you should), the 20 will nevertheless do the job.

By way of summary: In spite of repeated trials, you haven't been able to come up with a single credible example.

Your controlled tests help you identify 'conditions' in which this lovely lens of yours will focus 'comparably' with other lens.

Exactly.

Maybe Panasonic should hire you to promote their lens. Do remember to tell them to place a sticker on the box stating 'AF works as fast as similar lens under 'set' conditions. Or to 'not expect' fast AF when focusing from close range to infinity or vice versa.

You mean something like this: "Warning: Not appropriate for split-second switches between landscapes and kids running around in close quarters (less than 0.75 m)."

So far, the only one in need of such a sticker seems to be you and you are no longer in the market for the lens. So I don't really see any reason for Panasonic to bother with it.

Seriously and you still think you are not misinforming others as regards the strengths and weaknesses of this lens.

Absolutely. And in contrast to you, I can offer evidence rather than merely subjective feelings to back up what I am saying.

When you propagate untested subjective impressions as though they were facts and when you spread allegations about me that you can't back up, then you are not only misinforming but desinforming others. With respect to me personally, your allegations amount to pure slander.

You state you are a scientist.

I am.

If you so want to continue claiming what you claim, do go and buy or loan a 17mm f1.8 or even the 25mm f1.8 and redo all your tests. EVEN then state clearly under what specific conditions the 20mm f1.7 works equal to them, and what conditions do not.

See above.

Be holistic please.

If you knew what the word "holistic" actually means, there'd be no reason for you to ask.

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Mark Chan
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Anders W, 7 months ago

Nice Anders,

When someone whether the 20mm f1.7 AFs fast enough, you state yes.

When someone asks whether the 20mm f1.7 AFs as fast as the 17mm, you state yes, UNDER general conditions.

So great; you win. Just don't go about commenting that you don't feel there's an issue with the AF of the 20mm f1.7 when others clearly feel so.

Oh wait, you need to have 'controlled' tests as a basis of confirmation.  Or else whoever states such a claim is speaking ballyhoo and your 'controlled' tests should be more accurate.

Even though you are already stating under YOUR needed conditions it works.  Or when you haven't had a chance to try out the 17mm f1.8.

And FYI, I have had the 17mm f1.8 and the 20mm f1.7 hand in hand.  And so unlike you, I am pretty sure which one focuses faster. Clearly under ALL conditions.  THEN I sold it.

Oh wait, YOU need evidence. So I should go and record the whole process.

Do expand your test environments.

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micksh6
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Anders W, 7 months ago

Anders W wrote:

micksh6 wrote:

NZ Scott wrote:

s_grins wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

You know, I made the view that the PANA 20mm f1.7 was slow to AF and should be avoided by those that need to take pics of kids and fast moving items / people. This was quite a few threads back.

There are a few that adamantly state my (and many other's experience) is flawed and that the PAN 20mm - both versions are perfectly capable of 'catching' that moment.

Its plain not.

Choose 17mm or 25mm OLY for that.

Choose 20mm f1.7 if you don't NEED fast AF under any circumstances or are perfectly happy to live within its limitations.

It is unfortunate you got misinformed. And yes there are many that are misinforming leading to poor purchase decision.

I do not have photos of kids (I do not have grandchildren, yet), but I have one old photo of the dog. As you know, dogs even more difficult in compare with children.

I think this is a poor example. The dog is stationary - not exactly running towards the camera or anything like that.

We don't know, maybe the dog pushes the table towards photographer and does it really fast.

20mm lens owners probably didn't try photographing at bowling places or anywhere with the light level about ISO1600, F2.0, 1/20s. I did, and 20mm lens is barely usable in such situations.

I don't know about you, but I certainly have no difficulties getting my 20 to lock on a target like that at the light level you mention. But are you saying that this is a scenario where AF, let alone quick AF, is at all needed?

For shooting a scene like that, I'd already have set focus in advance so that I can capture the right moment.

Except that you won't know where the "right" moment will happen. Young kids are unpredictable, they can throw ball at any point. The boy on the picture sometimes does it few feet earlier than on that photo, but sometimes after the lane starts.

And the only landmark to prefocus here is the floor that lacks high-contrast details, plus it's not parallel to camera. Such AF target is exactly what makes troubles with 20mm lens.

Yes, I know the tricks to deal with slow-focusing lens, had to learn them during 2 years of owning 20mm F1.7. Using such tricks is what takes fun out of photography and makes it rather a job.
I'd rather choose a lens that doesn't force me to do tricks, such as 17mm F1.8.

17mm F1.8 lens, however, locks focus without problems. Here is an example

1

S

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Mark Chan
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to G1Houston, 7 months ago

G1Houston wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

Another three examples that I am sure the 20mm f1.7 wont' work well in.

Through a fence. The 20mm would hunt through this.

Pretty much instantaneous; and taken with my left hand no less.

Youngsters walking by; followed their motion to add a 'bit' of character to the pic. The 20mm would still not have focused by the time they had gone past.

S

Not sure about the points of these pictures, none of them is in focus except the last one.

Actually; the first one is overexposed given the varied lighting; shot of food stall through fence - This wasn't set the best obviously and I later took a shot of the food stall once I queued past the fence.  Point being this the sort of shot the 20mm would have had difficulty focusing.

Second one has focus at the lady's face in the middle left of the pic. hustle bustle in the market.

Third shot is the least focused as I very quickly caught focus and moved the camera along their direction to get some more blur to the background.  With the 20mm you'd have had to prefocus and wait for a couple to go by to get this shot.

The 20mm would struggle mightily with the lighting conditions. And as the other poster said, I'd rather have a lens that is capable of getting the pics when I need it without the need to prefocus in advance before I got the shot.

These three pics where with me holding an umbrella, a few bags of food, and shooting with the camera in my LEFT hand. At night in the rain.

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Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to micksh6, 7 months ago

micksh6 wrote:

Anders W wrote:

micksh6 wrote:

NZ Scott wrote:

s_grins wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

You know, I made the view that the PANA 20mm f1.7 was slow to AF and should be avoided by those that need to take pics of kids and fast moving items / people. This was quite a few threads back.

There are a few that adamantly state my (and many other's experience) is flawed and that the PAN 20mm - both versions are perfectly capable of 'catching' that moment.

Its plain not.

Choose 17mm or 25mm OLY for that.

Choose 20mm f1.7 if you don't NEED fast AF under any circumstances or are perfectly happy to live within its limitations.

It is unfortunate you got misinformed. And yes there are many that are misinforming leading to poor purchase decision.

I do not have photos of kids (I do not have grandchildren, yet), but I have one old photo of the dog. As you know, dogs even more difficult in compare with children.

I think this is a poor example. The dog is stationary - not exactly running towards the camera or anything like that.

We don't know, maybe the dog pushes the table towards photographer and does it really fast.

20mm lens owners probably didn't try photographing at bowling places or anywhere with the light level about ISO1600, F2.0, 1/20s. I did, and 20mm lens is barely usable in such situations.

I don't know about you, but I certainly have no difficulties getting my 20 to lock on a target like that at the light level you mention. But are you saying that this is a scenario where AF, let alone quick AF, is at all needed?

For shooting a scene like that, I'd already have set focus in advance so that I can capture the right moment.

Except that you won't know where the "right" moment will happen. Young kids are unpredictable, they can throw ball at any point. The boy on the picture sometimes does it few feet earlier than on that photo, but sometimes after the lane starts.

That's precisely why you shouldn't wait to AF until the boy takes action. If you do the AF at the last moment, you'll have a shutter lag of several hundred milliseconds. If you have pre-AFd or MFd, that's down to about 50 milliseconds, giving you much better prospects of catching the right moment.

And the only landmark to prefocus here is the floor that lacks high-contrast details, plus it's not parallel to camera. Such AF target is exactly what makes troubles with 20mm lens.

It doesn't have to be parallel to the camera. And I see some text at the beginning of the lane that would certainly work as an AF target if the floor wouldn't suffice (as I think it would). If nothing else helps, just ask the kid to stand somewhere along his throwing path, or move back to where he stands, get focus, and return to the proper point of capture. Or just MF on something at the same distance.

Yes, I know the tricks to deal with slow-focusing lens, had to learn them during 2 years of owning 20mm F1.7. Using such tricks is what takes fun out of photography and makes it rather a job.
I'd rather choose a lens that doesn't force me to do tricks, such as 17mm F1.8.

To me, pre-focusing whenever that is possible and no matter which lens I am using, is not even something I have to think of, let alone something that takes the joy out of photography. On the contrary, it gives me more fun by letting me concentrate on what is really important in order to get my images the way I want them.

17mm F1.8 lens, however, locks focus without problems. Here is an example

1

S

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Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Mark Chan, 7 months ago

Mark Chan wrote:

G1Houston wrote:

Mark Chan wrote:

Another three examples that I am sure the 20mm f1.7 wont' work well in.

Through a fence. The 20mm would hunt through this.

Pretty much instantaneous; and taken with my left hand no less.

Youngsters walking by; followed their motion to add a 'bit' of character to the pic. The 20mm would still not have focused by the time they had gone past.

S

Not sure about the points of these pictures, none of them is in focus except the last one.

Actually; the first one is overexposed given the varied lighting; shot of food stall through fence - This wasn't set the best obviously and I later took a shot of the food stall once I queued past the fence. Point being this the sort of shot the 20mm would have had difficulty focusing.

Second one has focus at the lady's face in the middle left of the pic. hustle bustle in the market.

Third shot is the least focused as I very quickly caught focus and moved the camera along their direction to get some more blur to the background. With the 20mm you'd have had to prefocus and wait for a couple to go by to get this shot.

The 20mm would struggle mightily with the lighting conditions. And as the other poster said, I'd rather have a lens that is capable of getting the pics when I need it without the need to prefocus in advance before I got the shot.

These three pics where with me holding an umbrella, a few bags of food, and shooting with the camera in my LEFT hand. At night in the rain.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the 20/1.7 has greater difficulty locking focus than other lenses in apples-to-apples comparisons (same light conditions, same AF target, same target magnification). The ability to lock focus is a matter of the strength of the AF signal the body is given to work with. Apart from target attributes (including illumination and magnification), that signal is purely a matter of light intake (max aperture) and (to a lesser extent) contrast/microcontrast. The 20 is doing very well in both these regards in comparison with most other lenses, including the one you used here. So what you say above is pure speculation without any factual basis.

As I have already pointed out many times, the 20 will be significantly slower than other lenses when it does hunt. But it is no more prone to hunting than other lenses under comparable conditions.

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Anders W
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Mark Chan, 7 months ago

Mark Chan wrote:

Nice Anders,

Mark, you continue to have serious problems with your reading comprehension, as exemplified (once again) below.

When someone whether the 20mm f1.7 AFs fast enough, you state yes.

No, I tell them what I already told them, for example here:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53583615

When someone asks whether the 20mm f1.7 AFs as fast as the 17mm, you state yes, UNDER general conditions.

No, I tell them what I already told them, for example here:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53583615

So great; you win. Just don't go about commenting that you don't feel there's an issue with the AF of the 20mm f1.7 when others clearly feel so.

I am not telling anyone that. I am telling them what I already told them, for example here:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53583615

Oh wait, you need to have 'controlled' tests as a basis of confirmation. Or else whoever states such a claim is speaking ballyhoo and your 'controlled' tests should be more accurate.

You are obviously speaking ballyhoo, time and again, as everyone can readily see.

Even though you are already stating under YOUR needed conditions it works.

Exactly. And I am telling others precisely what those conditions are so that they can decide for themselves whether those conditions apply to them as well or not.

Or when you haven't had a chance to try out the 17mm f1.8.

I note that you dodged my question about the way the 17/1.8 compares to the 12/2 and the 45/1.8 a second time so I simply rest my case.

And FYI, I have had the 17mm f1.8 and the 20mm f1.7 hand in hand. And so unlike you, I am pretty sure which one focuses faster.

We are both sure that the 17/1.8 focuses faster under some conditions.

Clearly under ALL conditions.

Where's your evidence and where's your answer to the question you have dodged twice?

THEN I sold it.

Feel free to sell and buy what you like.

Oh wait, YOU need evidence. So I should go and record the whole process.

Yes, evidence is important for those who want to make rational decisions. You are clearly not among them though.

Do expand your test environments.

No need for that based on anything you have to say.

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TheEngineer
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to Anders W, 7 months ago

Anders W wrote:

There is no evidence whatsoever that the 20/1.7 has greater difficulty locking focus than other lenses in apples-to-apples comparisons (same light conditions, same AF target, same target magnification).

Sorry, but thats just not true.

I lost so many good shots (some were rare once in a lifetime occasions) with the atrocious focus of the 20mm that I once almost trashed it.

It is just sooo bad.

When I have my 45mm on it, it always focuses: fast, precise, reliably. Even in almost complete darkness when I'm out at 3am taking pics.

The 20mm is exactly the opposite!

And everybody who has one and is not biased knows what I mean!

But it is no more prone to hunting than other lenses under comparable conditions.

Reality very strongly disagrees!

And thats why I finally decided to replace it with an Oly 17mm or 25mm. Something I regret not having done much sooner...

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Ulfric M Douglas
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Re: I feel misled: Panasonic 20mm f1.7 II AF is SO SLOW!
In reply to TheEngineer, 7 months ago

TheEngineer wrote:

Anders W wrote:

...

Sorry, but thats just not true.

...

And everybody who has one and is not biased knows what I mean!...

I don't think I'm biased, just lens-lucky,

my 20mm (old, MkI) doesn't give me hassle even in very bad light, in fact it is my go-to low-light lens on all my bodies.

I bought mine second-hand and I'm sure I got a superb example, I'm sure of that because it is quiet and smooth and doesn't do all the crud people commonly complain about.

I think everyone in the argument needs to realise that the operation of this lens has example-variation, probably much more than optical variation in this instance.

Heck mine's even quiet on video!

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