A6000 or X-T1?

Started 4 months ago | Discussions
Jkim7
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A6000 or X-T1?
4 months ago

I will probably ask the question that has been asked many times before, but I would really appreciate the advice, before committing myself

Two new cameras, both similar in concept, sensor size, dimensions and popularity. Yet X-T1 with kit lens is double the price of A6000 with it's kit lens. Can it be twice as good?

I heard lots of good about Fuji lenses, especially about 18-55mm kit. Yet, A6000 with 16-70mm Zeiss lens is exactly the same price as X-T1 with kit lens. If one is prepared to spend this much money, would Sony-Zeiss combination be better, compared to Fuji kit?

My requirements are reasonably straightforward (I think). I want something compact and portable (so no FF or DSLR). IQ is important, so no m43 or smaller sensors. Fast AF is nice, but not critical. I do tend to like manual controls, so I would probably hate Sony's "Power zoom" kit lens. I must admit, Fuji's dials look attractive, although I didn't have a chance to actually try to use one

Sturdy build and quality 'feel' is also quite important

I do not have any lenses I can reuse, so this is not a factor

Thank you

Fujifilm X-T1 Sony a6000
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Marcos Villaroman
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Jkim7 wrote:

Two new cameras, both similar in concept, sensor size, dimensions and popularity. Yet X-T1 with kit lens is double the price of A6000 with it's kit lens. Can it be twice as good?

Very seldom is "twice the price should be twice as good".  A better question is "item x is as good as item y at twice the price?" and how well will the camera body hold up in three years?  If you really invest a lot of money, you might want to consider how good the perspective brand's customer service support are.

I heard lots of good about Fuji lenses, especially about 18-55mm kit. Yet, A6000 with 16-70mm Zeiss lens is exactly the same price as X-T1 with kit lens. If one is prepared to spend this much money, would Sony-Zeiss combination be better, compared to Fuji kit?

You are buying into an interchangeable lens system.  You should evaluate all the lens you are probably going to buy.  If you got an annual camera budget, consider what lens you'd by right now vs. what you might buy in a year or two.  Some people also consider what they can borrow from friends or can rent.

My requirements are reasonably straightforward (I think). I want something compact and portable (so no FF or DSLR). IQ is important, so no m43 or smaller sensors. Fast AF is nice, but not critical. I do tend to like manual controls, so I would probably hate Sony's "Power zoom" kit lens. I must admit, Fuji's dials look attractive, although I didn't have a chance to actually try to use one

Ergonomics might be a big deal for you then.  You'll need to read over the camera manuals and try both cameras for yourself.  When it comes to lens, it is not just power zoom vs. manual zoom; it is also how manual focus works and possibly how you set aperture.  Some people hate having to dive into menus to set things.

Sturdy build and quality 'feel' is also quite important

These days, it is more about perception that reality when it comes to "sturdy build" or "quality feel".  But, perception is a big part of enjoyment, so again you have to try them both --- don't just believe what others have said about it.

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darngooddesign
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Jkim7 wrote:

Two new cameras, both similar in concept, sensor size, dimensions and popularity. Yet X-T1 with kit lens is double the price of A6000 with it's kit lens. Can it be twice as good?

I heard lots of good about Fuji lenses, especially about 18-55mm kit. Yet, A6000 with 16-70mm Zeiss lens is exactly the same price as X-T1 with kit lens. If one is prepared to spend this much money, would Sony-Zeiss combination be better, compared to Fuji kit?

You are right that the Sony body is significantly cheaper than the X-T1. The Sony kit zoom is not as good as the X-T1, its probably akin to the cheaper Fuji XC 16-50 zoom; I would probably just find a used one of those which go for around $200 on Amazon.

If you like menial controls you will want the Fuji as the sony is firmly in the PASM dial and unmarked control wheel camp. Nothing wrong with that as it can give you equal manual control of the camera. Its just not the same thing as dedicated dials and physical controls; its up to you to decide which you prefer. The X-E2 is very close to the X-T1 and is closer in price to the Sony.

As far as IQ, just spend some time on Flickr looking at sample photos from both cameras and then decide which you prefer.

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Jkim7
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to darngooddesign, 4 months ago

darngooddesign wrote:

Jkim7 wrote:

Two new cameras, both similar in concept, sensor size, dimensions and popularity. Yet X-T1 with kit lens is double the price of A6000 with it's kit lens. Can it be twice as good?

I heard lots of good about Fuji lenses, especially about 18-55mm kit. Yet, A6000 with 16-70mm Zeiss lens is exactly the same price as X-T1 with kit lens. If one is prepared to spend this much money, would Sony-Zeiss combination be better, compared to Fuji kit?

You are right that the Sony body is significantly cheaper than the X-T1. The Sony kit zoom is not as good as the X-T1, its probably akin to the cheaper Fuji XC 16-50 zoom; I would probably just find a used one of those which go for around $200 on Amazon.

If you like menial controls you will want the Fuji as the sony is firmly in the PASM dial and unmarked control wheel camp. Nothing wrong with that as it can give you equal manual control of the camera. Its just not the same thing as dedicated dials and physical controls; its up to you to decide which you prefer. The X-E2 is very close to the X-T1 and is closer in price to the Sony.

As far as IQ, just spend some time on Flickr looking at sample photos from both cameras and then decide which you prefer.

What are some reasons why you'd prefer X-T1 over an A6000 and why the higher price is justified?

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Chanthis
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Upgrade path to full frame.
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Don't underestimate it. If you have the cash, you can buy some of the FF Zeiss lenses. The Sony Zeiss 55mm 1.8 is one of the sharpest lenses ever made, and it will cover the full 35mm frame when you decide to upgrade.

Like fast autofocus and tracking? From what I can see, the A6000 will run rings around the Fuji. There are some amazing A6000 videos on youtube of subject tracking all throughout the frame. The X-T1 has tracking, and it's supposed to be half decent, but it will pale in comparison to the Sony. Sony tracks throughout the entire frame, not just the center. I've seen some people on this forum post examples of continuous focus. The vast majority are flawed tests, i.e., using apertures with huge depth-of-field, subject far away, etc.

Like flash? The Sony system is superior. No high speed flash with the Sony, which is great for outdoor fill using wide apertures. You can do it on the Fuji. Just screw on (and off) ND filters.

Jkim7 wrote:

I will probably ask the question that has been asked many times before, but I would really appreciate the advice, before committing myself

Two new cameras, both similar in concept, sensor size, dimensions and popularity. Yet X-T1 with kit lens is double the price of A6000 with it's kit lens. Can it be twice as good?

I heard lots of good about Fuji lenses, especially about 18-55mm kit. Yet, A6000 with 16-70mm Zeiss lens is exactly the same price as X-T1 with kit lens. If one is prepared to spend this much money, would Sony-Zeiss combination be better, compared to Fuji kit?

My requirements are reasonably straightforward (I think). I want something compact and portable (so no FF or DSLR). IQ is important, so no m43 or smaller sensors. Fast AF is nice, but not critical. I do tend to like manual controls, so I would probably hate Sony's "Power zoom" kit lens. I must admit, Fuji's dials look attractive, although I didn't have a chance to actually try to use one

Sturdy build and quality 'feel' is also quite important

I do not have any lenses I can reuse, so this is not a factor

Thank you

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Peter Sills
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Re: Upgrade path to full frame.
In reply to Chanthis, 4 months ago

I would say if you need high-speed tracking focus - Sony.  This is the one area in which the camera excels.  (other than video - which I personally have no use for)

Fuji has it all over Sony in the following categories:

Ergonomics
Lens Selection
Lens Quality
Image Quality (especially Jpeg)
Image Stabilization (both are in lens)
Support - FW Upgrades
Support - Straight Customer Support
Reliability
Weather Sealing

Hope this helps.  Coming from an ex-Sony user.

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mrstone
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Wait a second, isn't this the same question I have asked on Sony thread earlier today:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3649264

What is going on? I didn't post twice

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tesilab
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Re: Upgrade path to full frame.
In reply to Peter Sills, 4 months ago

Peter Sills wrote:

I would say if you need high-speed tracking focus - Sony. This is the one area in which the camera excels. (other than video - which I personally have no use for)

Fuji has it all over Sony in the following categories:

Ergonomics
Lens Selection
Lens Quality

Overall I would prefer Fuji's lens catalog to Sony's also. But the statement about lens quality isn't strictly correct.

I think the Fuji lens lineup has more consistent quality for reasonable price, and some more attractive fast lenses, but in absolute terms, there are some native lens offerings for Sony that Fuji cannot touch (e.g. 55 1.8) , and there are more coming.

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darngooddesign
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Re: Upgrade path to full frame.
In reply to Chanthis, 4 months ago

Are A6000 lenses compatible on full frame cameras with an adapter?

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Lmendy
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

I was in my local camera store.  I was quite surprised to see several A7's and A7r's  in the case (I was handling an XT1).  I asked the salesperson why there used A7 and A7r.  He said that they are great cameras.  The one common complaint was color.  He said that customers who were use to Nikon, Canon and Leica (this store has quite a few well heeled customers) felt the colors were to over the top and garish.  This complaint may not be true of the A6000.  Also, I have heard over the years that Sony does not support their equipment and customers as well as Fuji.

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darngooddesign
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Jkim7 wrote:

What are some reasons why you'd prefer X-T1 over an A6000 and why the higher price is justified?

You might choose the Fuji for its image quality, Q button and menu UX, physical controls, ergonomics, industrial design, better higher res EVF, higher res LCD scree which is not 16:9, quality of JPGs out of the camera, etc.

You might look at the way Fuji adds value to current and out of date cameras via firmware updates as examples of your X-T1 getting better and faster over time. Not to mention the way they handled the light leak issue as examples of a company which is committed to their customers.

In regards to the price premium, you also have to compare the price of the A6000 and a zoom of equal quality to the X-T1 and its kit zoom. That begin said the Sony is much less expensive as a body, as you would expect because they being a much larger consumer electronics company are masters of low priced goods.

So its up to the user to decide if they like the X-T1 more and whether they think its justified paying a premium to get the camera they like.

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tesilab
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Re: Upgrade path to full frame.
In reply to darngooddesign, 4 months ago

darngooddesign wrote:

Are A6000 lenses compatible on full frame cameras with an adapter?

Yes, but of course you are shooting either in crop mode, or what I would call "extreme vignetting" mode. The 10-18 APSC zoom actually has quite a bit of reach, so covers FF at certain focal lengths.

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SaltLakeGuy
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Completely different tools
In reply to Lmendy, 4 months ago

for completely different purposes. Sony is a master at "features" to be sure. The focus system for high speed tracking on the 6000 is likely to find few competitors. If one is purchasing a camera with good working knowledge of photography and is looking for the best IQ possible the Fuji is the better choice. Indeed Fuji's flash technology isn't up to the latest greatest either, but once again with photographic knowledge you certainly can get the job done. I prefer to look at it as perhaps a bit like comparing a sports oriented car to a more luxury (Porsche vs. Lexus). With one you'll corner faster and also feel every bump in the road, with the other you have the comfort and quality of build with a bit more room to maneuver inside.. Either way they get the job done. If Sony had a half dozen more lenses it might be a conversation to have. As it is they are woefully behind in lens designs for their new cameras. So in the end if it's ALL about fast moving subject tracking by all means go Sony. If it's ultimate IQ and learning the craft go Fuji.

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WalkaboutSean
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Does the X-T1 offer focus peaking? I have a couple of NEX cameras and focus peaking opens up a wealth of lens options (for example, vintage Nikkors).

Are you interested in video? I suspect the A6000 will trump the X-T1.

However, the X-T1 will offer a superior still shooting experience (well executed dials) and that magical Fuji color. Don't underestimate the role of Fuji color; IMHO it's the secret sauce that makes the X cameras shine.

These are really very different cameras. The A6000 is like a digital Swiss Army knife (great at many tasks) while the X-T1 is a more focused photographic instrument.

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Chanthis
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FX vs DX, and Fuji lens quality.
In reply to darngooddesign, 4 months ago

It's like the Canon or Nikon mount. They make both "DX" and "FX" lens, both will bayonet to the camera, only the FX lenses will cover the full frame.

Invest in the full-frame E lenses for your A6000, and be all set to upgrade to FF when you're ready.

Will Fuji come out with a full-frame camera? Maybe, but I doubt it.

Are Fuji lenses the second coming? No. They are for the most part very good, but most are not stellar. The new 53 f 1.2 looks stellar. The 23m f 1.4 looks less so. The 35mm is actually quite average from what I can see on photozone and others with soft corners and edges that never get very sharp with stopping down. The kit zoom, although better than the average kit zoom, is a just slightly better than mediocre. Check the reviews.

darngooddesign wrote:

Are A6000 lenses compatible on full frame cameras with an adapter?

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mrstone
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to WalkaboutSean, 4 months ago

When I played with X-T1 in the shop, I did notice focus peaking. It was subtle, but useful. Never seen one on Sony's, co cannot compare unfortunately

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Clayton1985
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Re: A6000 or X-T1?
In reply to mrstone, 4 months ago

mrstone wrote:

When I played with X-T1 in the shop, I did notice focus peaking. It was subtle, but useful. Never seen one on Sony's, co cannot compare unfortunately

Sony's focus peaking is very well implemented IMO.

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Redlion
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I choose X-T1
In reply to Jkim7, 4 months ago

Owned the NEX-6 and some Sony lenses and here was my experience:

Menu diving on the NEX6 for many common things often detracted from my ability to get the shot.

As an eyeglass wearer I did not find the viewfinder pleasant to use in daylight and usually just used the external LCD screen anyway.

After I got the X-T1, I sold my NEX6.

No more menu diving to get in the way of the shot.  Now I can glance at my configuration and change it anytime quickly.

The viewfinder is a dream come true.  I almost always use the viewfinder now, and even enjoy shooting manual lenses such as my Nikon 50mm F1.2 using the dual viewfinder mode.

Joe

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Robert Garcia NYC
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Re: I choose X-T1
In reply to Redlion, 4 months ago

I know, just get both. Problem solved: )

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Jim in Hudson
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Re: I choose X-T1
In reply to Redlion, 4 months ago

Redlion wrote:

Owned the NEX-6 and some Sony lenses and here was my experience:

Menu diving on the NEX6 for many common things often detracted from my ability to get the shot.

As an eyeglass wearer I did not find the viewfinder pleasant to use in daylight and usually just used the external LCD screen anyway.

After I got the X-T1, I sold my NEX6.

No more menu diving to get in the way of the shot. Now I can glance at my configuration and change it anytime quickly.

The viewfinder is a dream come true. I almost always use the viewfinder now, and even enjoy shooting manual lenses such as my Nikon 50mm F1.2 using the dual viewfinder mode.

Joe

I believe this is the reason Sony went away from the NEX interface and instead ported over the Alpha interface for the A6000.

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