α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW

Started 9 months ago | Discussions
Marla2008
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to nandbytes, 9 months ago

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

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Keit ll
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to Marla2008, 9 months ago

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

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José B
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+1 and how come Fuji can do XF 56/1.2?
In reply to Keit ll, 9 months ago

Keit ll wrote:

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

I've seen very beautiful portraits even the ones shot wide open with this lens whereas Sony/Zeiss can only do f/1.8. Other than this lens envy, I love shooting with my NEX-6 and I have an A6000 pre-ordered.

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shadowz
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to 123Mike, 9 months ago

123Mike wrote:

X-T1... cooked raw?

X-T1 softness' at high ISO could be proving that. Also shows up in the DPR comparisons.

+1

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miro3
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Re: α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW
In reply to WSLam, 9 months ago

WSLam wrote:

miro3 wrote:

but the size is different for the 100% crops, so not clear how that factors in.

I know I won't be able to please everyone. I already clearly described how the test shots were taken. I am not going to match the 100% view. Even dpreview does not do that. So I am afraid my 'help' stops here. Hopefully you will still find them useful.

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too many cameras...

Sorry for being demanding.

Appreciate your help!

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WSLam
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Re: α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW
In reply to miro3, 9 months ago

miro3 wrote:

WSLam wrote:

miro3 wrote:

but the size is different for the 100% crops, so not clear how that factors in.

I know I won't be able to please everyone. I already clearly described how the test shots were taken. I am not going to match the 100% view. Even dpreview does not do that. So I am afraid my 'help' stops here. Hopefully you will still find them useful.

-- hide signature --

too many cameras...

Sorry for being demanding.

Appreciate your help!

Thanks for understanding.

It really is very difficult to match the size of the objects in 100% view. And the point of having a higher resolution sensor is that it has more pixels covering the same area, so if I make the 100% view the same, it sorts of do away with the higher resolution advantage.

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too many cameras...

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WSLam
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to nandbytes, 9 months ago

nandbytes wrote:

123Mike wrote:

Robert Garcia NYC wrote:

123Mike wrote:

X-T1... cooked raw?

X-T1 softness' at high ISO could be proving that. Also shows up in the DPR comparisons.

That file is "souther fried cooked". NR is just on and no way of turning it off at all. I wish they would change that.

Indeed! I'd never buy an overpriced constricted limited cheat like Fuji that's for damn well sure ! I mean, who are they trying to fool?

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

To say that Fujifilm has zero merits is not only a little bias, but also a little ignorant. But this is a Sony forum, so I definitely won't be preaching the merits of Fuji over other brands here. But Sony a6000/a7R are indeed a killer combo. You can't really go wrong with any brand these days.

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too many cameras...

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nandbytes
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to WSLam, 9 months ago

WSLam wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

123Mike wrote:

Robert Garcia NYC wrote:

123Mike wrote:

X-T1... cooked raw?

X-T1 softness' at high ISO could be proving that. Also shows up in the DPR comparisons.

That file is "souther fried cooked". NR is just on and no way of turning it off at all. I wish they would change that.

Indeed! I'd never buy an overpriced constricted limited cheat like Fuji that's for damn well sure ! I mean, who are they trying to fool?

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

To say that Fujifilm has zero merits is not only a little bias, but also a little ignorant. But this is a Sony forum, so I definitely won't be preaching the merits of Fuji over other brands here. But Sony a6000/a7R are indeed a killer combo. You can't really go wrong with any brand these days.

-- hide signature --

too many cameras...

I am sorry think I came across the wrong way. But it is overpriced IMO and so was the A99 (so I bought it the price I felt was reasonable for it).

Fuji cameras are great, I actually went out with the intention of buying one and came back empty handed. Lenses are pricey too.

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nandbytes
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to Marla2008, 9 months ago

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

-- hide signature --

"If you don't have an expression, you don't have a shot" - Peter Hurley.
http://itsnotthecamera.wordpress.com/

Talking for sony a-mount its the only system with AF zeiss lenses apart from the e-mount now. Looking at results from FE35 and FE55, it seems very good. These are FF lenses as suppose to the equally pricey fuji crop lenses. What what sony e-mount may lack it more than makes up for it by supporting lenses from canon and a-mount (not to mention other mounts too). Sorry but I actually find fuji's system lame for the price. At a more reasonable price I wouldn't mind it so much.

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WSLam
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to nandbytes, 9 months ago

nandbytes wrote:

I am sorry think I came across the wrong way. But it is overpriced IMO and so was the A99 (so I bought it the price I felt was reasonable for it).

Fuji cameras are great, I actually went out with the intention of buying one and came back empty handed. Lenses are pricey too.

from what I understand, the problem is mirrorless sales simply aren't all that great globally speaking. Fuji, like many others, are struggling. It looks like Fuji is leaning towards the higher end of the mirrorless market and hence the way they price their stuff.

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too many cameras...

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nandbytes
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Re: ISO6400 X-T1 vs a6000
In reply to WSLam, 9 months ago

WSLam wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

I am sorry think I came across the wrong way. But it is overpriced IMO and so was the A99 (so I bought it the price I felt was reasonable for it).

Fuji cameras are great, I actually went out with the intention of buying one and came back empty handed. Lenses are pricey too.

from what I understand, the problem is mirrorless sales simply aren't all that great globally speaking. Fuji, like many others, are struggling. It looks like Fuji is leaning towards the higher end of the mirrorless market and hence the way they price their stuff.

-- hide signature --

too many cameras...

Look at my gear, I have some "high end" stuff. Buying high-end gear isn't the same as buying overpriced gear. If people dont think its overpriced that fair enough for them, let them go buy it. I see a lot more value in A7 or D610 with FF AF zeiss lenses or some legendary nikon lenses.

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nandbytes
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Re: +1 and how come Fuji can do XF 56/1.2?
In reply to José B, 9 months ago

José B wrote:

Keit ll wrote:

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

I've seen very beautiful portraits even the ones shot wide open with this lens whereas Sony/Zeiss can only do f/1.8. Other than this lens envy, I love shooting with my NEX-6 and I have an A6000 pre-ordered.

FF vs crop

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José B
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Re: +1 and how come Fuji can do XF 56/1.2?
In reply to nandbytes, 9 months ago

nandbytes wrote:

José B wrote:

Keit ll wrote:

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

I've seen very beautiful portraits even the ones shot wide open with this lens whereas Sony/Zeiss can only do f/1.8. Other than this lens envy, I love shooting with my NEX-6 and I have an A6000 pre-ordered.

FF vs crop

for me it does not matter. I would buy a 56/1.2 if that is available in e-mount whether or not that is FE. I have considered the Zeiss 1.8/55 FE even though I have the SEL 50/1.8. But it would really entice me even more if it the Zeiss was f/1.2

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nandbytes
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Re: +1 and how come Fuji can do XF 56/1.2?
In reply to José B, 9 months ago

José B wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

José B wrote:

Keit ll wrote:

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

I've seen very beautiful portraits even the ones shot wide open with this lens whereas Sony/Zeiss can only do f/1.8. Other than this lens envy, I love shooting with my NEX-6 and I have an A6000 pre-ordered.

FF vs crop

for me it does not matter. I would buy a 56/1.2 if that is available in e-mount whether or not that is FE. I have considered the Zeiss 1.8/55 FE even though I have the SEL 50/1.8. But it would really entice me even more if it the Zeiss was f/1.2

zeiss isn't 1.4 or 1.2 for a reason. Have u seen how big a-mount zeiss 50mm/1.4 is.

On a FF you'll get a thinner DoF with 1.8 than on a crop. What you are losing more is on the light front. Of course you many not care but zeiss doesn't seem to make many crop lenses so you are out of luck.

 nandbytes's gear list:nandbytes's gear list
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whtchocla7e
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Re: α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW
In reply to WSLam, 9 months ago

The results looks as good as any other aps-c camera of the past two years.

Good to know Sony didn't screw it up with the A6000.

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WSLam
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Re: α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW
In reply to whtchocla7e, 9 months ago

whtchocla7e wrote:

The results looks as good as any other aps-c camera of the past two years.

Good to know Sony didn't screw it up with the A6000.

Just wait till you try the AF on this thing. Then you will know even if they put a worse sensor in it, it would still be 'progress'.

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too many cameras...

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José B
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Re: +1 and how come Fuji can do XF 56/1.2?
In reply to nandbytes, 9 months ago

nandbytes wrote:

José B wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

José B wrote:

Keit ll wrote:

Marla2008 wrote:

nandbytes wrote:

People with more money than brains I think. I can get a used A99 (in fact I did lol) for price of a XT1. I could get a nikon D610 now actually with new offers for the same price. Or if I want compactness an A7. Also not to mention you can use a wide range of lenses on A7.

Playing the devil's advocate as I don't like Fuji's retrol controls or output much, but I sure do like their lens line up ! I'm a Sony shooter all the way, and I do love my manual focus lenses, but for anyone wanting quality AF lenses, the SOny system is pretty lame...

I totally agree. I do like the Fuji's retro looks but the main attraction for me is the lens range which is getting better all the time. It sounds like a cliché but Fuji really do seem to understand Photography & Photographers....

I've seen very beautiful portraits even the ones shot wide open with this lens whereas Sony/Zeiss can only do f/1.8. Other than this lens envy, I love shooting with my NEX-6 and I have an A6000 pre-ordered.

FF vs crop

for me it does not matter. I would buy a 56/1.2 if that is available in e-mount whether or not that is FE. I have considered the Zeiss 1.8/55 FE even though I have the SEL 50/1.8. But it would really entice me even more if it the Zeiss was f/1.2

zeiss isn't 1.4 or 1.2 for a reason. Have u seen how big a-mount zeiss 50mm/1.4 is.

On a FF you'll get a thinner DoF with 1.8 than on a crop. What you are losing more is on the light front. Of course you many not care but zeiss doesn't seem to make many crop lenses so you are out of luck.

yes I realize how big the Zeiss 50/1.4, I have the 50/1.2 L for Canon and I do use it for my Canon croppers. My point is if Fuji, which I presume a competitor in the mirrorless space can do it, why not Sony/Zeiss? In any case, I'm not leaving Sony for Fuji because of that----I really enjoy my NEX-6 + Zeiss emount lenses and the A6000 is on the way. Plus I'm hopeful that Zeiss will launch an 85/1.8 FE hopefully within a year.

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forpetessake
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Re: Here's what
In reply to wb2trf, 9 months ago

wb2trf wrote:

forpetessake wrote:

ijustloveshooting wrote:

im really surprised too see how a6000 petforms at iso6400 comparing to A7R...really great performance.

It's too premature to say, as nobody has yet done any formal testing. At a first glance I don't see anything different about A6000 images compared to NEX-5* or 6. And the other comparison with the Fuji seems to support that. I did a side by side comparison of X-E1 and NEX-5N last year and they were probably 1/2 stop apart in term of noise for the same exposure, and similar result I see here too. So until the formal measurements confirm differently I would expect the A6000 sensor to be very much alike the previous 16MP sensor in terms of noise and DR.

If we are now getting 24mp with the low light performance of 16mp, and nothing more, that is still quite good progress in that dimension. The Nex 7's 24mp was not as good as the 5n's, for example. THE big deal about the A6000 looks like it is the AF performance, but if they manage some high ISO gains as well, that's great.

For my style of shooting, faster AF is a big win, (I could pick up 10% of oof shots), and if I can get 24mp with the high ISO of 16, that gives me better cropping ability. That's a good deal.

Had you read the thread you would have noticed that the discussion was around the noise, not the other issues. But since you raised them, here is my analysis.

If anybody needs more pixels they will get ~22% linear density increase compared to the current 16MP sensors, for most people it will be a wash. In 99% of uses, the resolution is limited by the lenses, not the number of pixels. Also since most people don't print large, they will never see the difference anyway.

If somebody wants a faster AF they will get it. Soccer moms will be happy, the rest -- I'm not that sure. Sony doesn't have a good lens lineup. Sony cameras are the best choice for manual lenses, not for the native ones. I've got Fuji to use with good native lenses, I sold almost all my Sony lenses, they are just mediocre in comparison. But I use Sony with manual lenses, which is a better platform for that. So for all people who use Sony bodies with manual lenses it's also a moot point.

So, what's left? A better grip? -- Yes, but I doubt it's a good reason to upgrade.

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abrahavt
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Re: Here's what
In reply to forpetessake, 9 months ago

I have the Sony 10-18, 16-70, 24 and 50 lenses on my 5N and I am real happy. Don't think they are inferior in any way to the Fuji lenses. Not knocking Fuji. I have a X100S which I really like. I have decided to hitch my wagon to the Sony bandwagon because of their lead in sensors. Waiting for the A6000 so that I can supplement the 5N which I will use with the 10 or 12 manual focus legacy lenses which I own. I dont see Fuji or any other company catching up with Sony when it comes to sensors and as long as Sony brings out good lenses in collaboration with Zeiss I am sticking with them.

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rinkos
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Re: α6000 & α7R ISO100-6400 JPG+RAW
In reply to WSLam, 9 months ago

also if anyone is interested in slrclub site the a6000 is with a7 or a7r ( cant remember ) ..each has a review and although its in korean jpegs there is always a photo chart of iso tests so you can see both of the cams for yourselves

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