Conspiracy theorists unite

Started 5 months ago | Discussions
John_A_G
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Re: darn - one more
In reply to JeffAHayes, 5 months ago

JeffAHayes wrote:

Perhaps not. Perhaps it just NEEDS TO TAKE THE WORD "REVIEW" OUT OF IT'S NAME!!!

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A word is worth 1/1000th of a picture... Maybe that's why I use so many words!

Jeff, no need to shout.  We're all adults here.

DPR still does a number of reviews.  What has changed is the proliferation of equipment.  8 years ago when the manufacturers had just 3 or 4 DSLRs it was easier to review all of them.

How much do you pay to be a member here?

And yet, you seem to believe DPR should magically be able to increase staff so they can review every camera produced?

If they removed "Review" from their name - would that make you less angry (I assume anger because of your shout and exclamation marks)?

So, if you don't believe DPR is singling out Pentax to be biased against, what would you propose they do differently in prioritizing reviews?  Besides the obvious answer of reviewing the K3.  If there are say 100 different cameras to review and they only have staff to review 20 of them, how would YOU propose they decide which 20 and in which order to review them?

Let's have your criteria and see if other members find it more valid than DPRs approach.  Here's a hint - if your solution doesn't include their camera then there will be people that are unhappy.

And, please, for the sake of argument, please assume that hiring more staff is not viable for purposes of this discussion.

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awaldram
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Re: darn - one more
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

Mmmm

Editorial bias ?

Conspiracy ?

Contempt ?

Take your pic.

Maybe DpR editorial chief is unaware that Dpreview integrity is being questioned.?

"

By Barney Britton (3 days ago)

the 645D II is in the slideshow (my aplogies - I simply failed to include that slide originally) and we'll cover it in more detail when more details are forthcoming."

http://www.dpreview.com/news/2014/02/17/cp-2014-highlights-of-the-show?utm_campaign=internal-link&utm_source=news-list&utm_medium=text&ref=title_0_7

A simple mistake and I sympathize with him but very unfortunate given the current accusations flying around.

Easily done I mean the only MF camera to be announced easily forgotten when your posting those snowy vistas of Tokyo !

Barney Briton = I'm in charge of the editorial content of dpreview.

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John_A_G
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Re: darn - one more
In reply to awaldram, 5 months ago

awaldram wrote:

Mmmm

Editorial bias ?

Conspiracy ?

Contempt ?

Take your pic.

I know.  It's expanded to Canon and Sony too.

Why do you think that is?  Is the staff just incompetent?

Or, are the Sony and Canon posters claiming the same mistreatment just plants by the DPR staff in an attempt to draw attention away from what they are doing to Pentax?

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moving_comfort
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We're through the Looking Glass here, people
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

awaldram wrote:

Mmmm

Editorial bias ?

Conspiracy ?

Contempt ?

Take your pic.

I know. It's expanded to Canon and Sony too.

Why do you think that is? Is the staff just incompetent?

Or, are the Sony and Canon posters claiming the same mistreatment just plants by the DPR staff in an attempt to draw attention away from what they are doing to Pentax?

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Alex Sarbu
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Good job...
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

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awaldram
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Re: Good job...
In reply to Alex Sarbu, 5 months ago

Alex Sarbu wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

Agreed there are facts that add up to very poor DpR performance re- Pentax .

And those who note them are not crackpots, I do wonder at Johns 'investment' in discrediting other posters?

Now if the same is true for other brands than that doesn't make a conspiracy but does maybe question DpR's relevance as a review site, as Mike pointed out they've become on gig advertorial with little to no  'News' delivered by their own journalistic endeavour.

Almost a RH plagiarist site on steroids,  How ironic.

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John_A_G
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are you saying?
In reply to Alex Sarbu, 5 months ago

Alex Sarbu wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

Are you saying your conspiracy theory is valid but the Sony and Canon ones are not?

It is one thing to point out or question a mistake.  It's something else to say  there is a directed bias or conspiracy against a particular brand.  They are two very different things.

I merely point out that people in other brands feel the same way you do - that DPR is maliciously trying to do injustice to their brand.  Why are your accusations valid and theirs are not?

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awaldram
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

Alex Sarbu wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

Are you saying your conspiracy theory is valid but the Sony and Canon ones are not?

It is one thing to point out or question a mistake. It's something else to say there is a directed bias or conspiracy against a particular brand. They are two very different things.

I merely point out that people in other brands feel the same way you do - that DPR is maliciously trying to do injustice to their brand. Why are your accusations valid and theirs are not?

It looks like Alex is saying there are valid complaints not conspiracies.

And that your accusations that all is crackpot consiracists is your imagination rather than any 'crackpot group you trying desperately to promote

Indeed I can only remember 1 person besides you promoting a conspiracy theory, and He said it once.

You on the other hand seem to be driving it with vigour and fervour ....Why?

Maybe your writing more than your reading?

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John_A_G
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Re: Good job...
In reply to awaldram, 5 months ago

awaldram wrote:


And those who note them are not crackpots, I do wonder at Johns 'investment' in discrediting other posters?

The "investment" is that people that post in terms of conspiracy theory discredit themselves.  It only looks silly to people here when it's someone from another brand doing it.  If DPR makes a mistake - by all means point it out.  But you lose credibility when you insinuate it is part of a malicious conspiracy against your brand.

Now if the same is true for other brands than that doesn't make a conspiracy but does maybe question DpR's relevance as a review site, as Mike pointed out they've become on gig advertorial with little to no 'News' delivered by their own journalistic endeavour.

Now, questioning the competence  of the DPR editorial staff as a whole is another matter.  I think it's perfectly valid to discuss and debate how useful and relevant the reviews are.  That's very different than suggesting DPR is "out to get" Pentax.

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John_A_G
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to awaldram, 5 months ago

awaldram wrote:


Indeed I can only remember 1 person besides you promoting a conspiracy theory, and He said it once.

You on the other hand seem to be driving it with vigour and fervour ....Why?

so, no one here in Pentax land is suggesting DPR has a bias against Pentax?  That they intentionally mislink things only to harm Pentax?  Given the DPR staff is more than one person a bias has to be institutional - that's a conspiracy.

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Alex Sarbu
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Re: Good job...
In reply to awaldram, 5 months ago

awaldram wrote:

Alex Sarbu wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

Agreed there are facts that add up to very poor DpR performance re- Pentax .

Yep. No conspiracy, though and we should keep in mind both sides of the story - e.g. that DPReview has limited resources, reviews are complex and so on. Some comments are indeed forgetting this.Some.

In the mean time, if I want to check the K-3's studio samples I'd go to the A7's review, select let's say the K-3 and the K-50, and compare them. As an effect, the A7's click counter will be increased and DPReview will be made aware of me being quite interested in more Sony reviews

Alex

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Alex Sarbu
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

Alex Sarbu wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

A number of people in Pentax land have taken issue with my bashing the conspiracy theorists. It should warm your heart to know that you are not alone. The conspiracy is actually bigger than you think. You now have company in Canon land. It is confirmed that DPR not only conspires against Pentax, but also against Canon too. The DPR conspiracy against specific manufacturers must be stopped.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53012682

This way, valid complaints are drowned in the imaginary sea of conspiracy theories. Soon, nobody would dare to notice e.g. that the K-3 preview is well hidden, and doesn't link to the studio samples available since ages ago. Dare to point out about anything - doesn't matter what - and you'll be a conspiracy-loving lunatic.

Alex

Are you saying your conspiracy theory is valid but the Sony and Canon ones are not?

I will talk about my conspiracy theory as soon as I would formulate my first one. Don't hold your breath, though.

It is one thing to point out or question a mistake. It's something else to say there is a directed bias or conspiracy against a particular brand. They are two very different things.

And we need a Canon user on a crusade to help us make the difference?

I merely point out that people in other brands feel the same way you do - that DPR is maliciously trying to do injustice to their brand. Why are your accusations valid and theirs are not?

Are we discussing the points made by specific people (which should be on a case by case basis), or your strawman?

Alex

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John_A_G
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to Alex Sarbu, 5 months ago

Alex Sarbu wrote:

Are you saying your conspiracy theory is valid but the Sony and Canon ones are not?

I will talk about my conspiracy theory as soon as I would formulate my first one. Don't hold your breath, though.

Conspiracy: a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful.

Considering DPR staff is more than one person - any effor to do something harmful to Pentax brand must be a conspiracy.

So, when you make statements like:

"If it has a Pentax label, it's not exciting no matter what. But your average entry level DSLR, or yet another mirrorless - with the proper brand - is, and will be reviewed with priority"

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53061917

Or here were you suggest DPR didn't review the K3 yet because;

"There were other cameras with higher priority (including entry level cameras with the "proper" brand).:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53145514

you really aren't insinuating that DPR staff intentionally ignores Pentax in favor of other brands?

It is one thing to point out or question a mistake. It's something else to say there is a directed bias or conspiracy against a particular brand. They are two very different things.

And we need a Canon user on a crusade to help us make the difference?

Nope - just someone who sees the silly behavior by a minority of people in any system - just like Canon and Sony forums have a minority of users that seem to think DPR has something against their specific brand.

I merely point out that people in other brands feel the same way you do - that DPR is maliciously trying to do injustice to their brand. Why are your accusations valid and theirs are not?

Are we discussing the points made by specific people (which should be on a case by case basis), or your strawman?

Alex

Well - since you and I are discussing - let's talk about your specific accusations - that DPR ignores a K-3 review precisely because of the brand.  Since DPR staff is more than one person and that missing reivew is "doing harm" then that accusation fits the definition of conspiracy.  So - do you think DPR conspires just against Pentax or is the conspiracy larger?

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John_A_G
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

awaldram wrote:

Indeed I can only remember 1 person besides you promoting a conspiracy theory, and He said it once.

You on the other hand seem to be driving it with vigour and fervour ....Why?

so, no one here in Pentax land is suggesting DPR has a bias against Pentax? That they intentionally mislink things only to harm Pentax? Given the DPR staff is more than one person a bias has to be institutional - that's a conspiracy.

Ah, here we have Awaldram himself making the bias claim. And, as we see by definition, since there is more than one person involved at DPR any bias must be with a group, and since DPR isn't admiting it - it must be a conspiracy:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52986743

So, we already see where both you and Alex are beating the institutional "bias" (aka conspiracy) drum.  So, yes, that's more than 1 person.

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jimrpdx
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

If everyone is mistreated equally, that's equality right? 

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Alex Sarbu
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

Alex Sarbu wrote:

Are you saying your conspiracy theory is valid but the Sony and Canon ones are not?

I will talk about my conspiracy theory as soon as I would formulate my first one. Don't hold your breath, though.

Conspiracy: a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful.

OK....

Considering DPR staff is more than one person - any effor to do something harmful to Pentax brand must be a conspiracy.

Only if there is a plan, and it is secret - by your own definition.

So, when you make statements like:

"If it has a Pentax label, it's not exciting no matter what. But your average entry level DSLR, or yet another mirrorless - with the proper brand - is, and will be reviewed with priority"

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53061917

That was sarcasm, directed at viking79's claim that "Pentax needs to do something exciting, K-3 is not.".

Or here were you suggest DPR didn't review the K3 yet because;

"There were other cameras with higher priority (including entry level cameras with the "proper" brand).:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53145514

That is a fact, acknowledged by DPReview and which can be verified by a quick glance at the Reviews section.

you really aren't insinuating that DPR staff intentionally ignores Pentax in favor of other brands?

They said that themselves: they are not ignoring Pentax, but more popular brands or products will be reviewed with priority.

It is one thing to point out or question a mistake. It's something else to say there is a directed bias or conspiracy against a particular brand. They are two very different things.

And we need a Canon user on a crusade to help us make the difference?

Nope - just someone who sees the silly behavior by a minority of people in any system - just like Canon and Sony forums have a minority of users that seem to think DPR has something against their specific brand.

Yeah, you're the one who can see the Truth...

I merely point out that people in other brands feel the same way you do - that DPR is maliciously trying to do injustice to their brand. Why are your accusations valid and theirs are not?

Are we discussing the points made by specific people (which should be on a case by case basis), or your strawman?

Alex

Well - since you and I are discussing - let's talk about your specific accusations - that DPR ignores a K-3 review precisely because of the brand. Since DPR staff is more than one person and that missing reivew is "doing harm" then that accusation fits the definition of conspiracy. So - do you think DPR conspires just against Pentax or is the conspiracy larger?

BS. That's what your strawman is, complete BS.

Alex

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Alex Sarbu
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

awaldram wrote:

Indeed I can only remember 1 person besides you promoting a conspiracy theory, and He said it once.

You on the other hand seem to be driving it with vigour and fervour ....Why?

so, no one here in Pentax land is suggesting DPR has a bias against Pentax? That they intentionally mislink things only to harm Pentax? Given the DPR staff is more than one person a bias has to be institutional - that's a conspiracy.

Ah, here we have Awaldram himself making the bias claim. And, as we see by definition, since there is more than one person involved at DPR any bias must be with a group, and since DPR isn't admiting it - it must be a conspiracy:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52986743

By which definition?

On another post you admitted by mistake that you need a secret plan before starting considering the idea of a conspiracy; now you're saying it's enough to have two biased persons?

There is no talk about such secret plans in my posts, and I doubt you'll find something in Andrew's.

So, we already see where both you and Alex are beating the institutional "bias" (aka conspiracy) drum. So, yes, that's more than 1 person.

Logic FAIL - but I guess it's necessary for your strawman.

Alex

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hanhait
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Olympus too
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

I am not going to look it up, but I remember similar remarks in the Olympus forum.

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awaldram
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Re: are you saying?
In reply to John_A_G, 5 months ago

John_A_G wrote:

John_A_G wrote:

awaldram wrote:

Indeed I can only remember 1 person besides you promoting a conspiracy theory, and He said it once.

You on the other hand seem to be driving it with vigour and fervour ....Why?

so, no one here in Pentax land is suggesting DPR has a bias against Pentax? That they intentionally mislink things only to harm Pentax? Given the DPR staff is more than one person a bias has to be institutional - that's a conspiracy.

Ah, here we have Awaldram himself making the bias claim. And, as we see by definition, since there is more than one person involved at DPR any bias must be with a group, and since DPR isn't admiting it - it must be a conspiracy:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52986743

So, we already see where both you and Alex are beating the institutional "bias" (aka conspiracy) drum. So, yes, that's more than 1 person.

I see no such claim are you saying DpR 'forgetting to put a slide of a new camera' was anything but lethargy ?

Or that a preference to review higher selling units above and before the k3 is not bias ?

At what point does it become obvious bias and lethargy ?!

I honestly think your quite mad ....as a hatter

bias = inclination or prejudice for or against one person or group nothing remotley todo with

Conspiracy = a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful

So obvious i.e in the open can never be a conspiracy i.e secret.

as I say crazy crazy crazy.

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Alex Sarbu
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Re: Olympus too
In reply to hanhait, 5 months ago

hanhait wrote:

I am not going to look it up, but I remember similar remarks in the Olympus forum.

I'm sure there must be such remarks for every brand.

That's why valid complaints are:

+ to the point, i.e. specifically stating what appears to be an issue

+ supported with proof/argumentation

+ reasonable - DPReview can't make everyone happy, and don't have the capacity to review everything, fast.

Alex

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