Interesting read by Thom Hogan

Started Feb 14, 2014 | Discussions
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socode Regular Member • Posts: 356
Re: Another trust issue...

justmeMN wrote:

Do you trust that, five years from now, your chosen brand will still be making digital cameras? As the entire market contracts, the smaller players will be forced out of the market.

Sony and Panasonic are megacorps, that can get along just fine without camera divisions. Olympus is a thriving medical technology company, that doesn't really need a camera division either.

It's a pity that e.g. Canon didn't bother producing a digital Canon F1, but they didn't.

So I don't really care as long as someone makes an ILC with a smaller registration distance than the lenses I have, and adapters. Given that there are electronic control adapters for EF lenses, and purely mechanical adapters are hardly difficult to make, it's far too late to put that particular genie back in the bottle. I may take a punt and end up with an FE lens as well.

So it's odd that I have a FF camera which allows me to use lenses from many systems - old lenses (which are now 30 years old or more) which I couldn't use on Canon DSLRs, as well as EF lenses from more recently, and it also has new lenses of high quality. It's higher resolution than any Canon SLR, there is a version cheaper than any Canon FF, it addresses my size and weight concerns, and I can use a DSLR as well.

And you think I should somehow be more concerned than I was?

EinsteinsGhost Forum Pro • Posts: 11,977
Re: Interesting read by Thom Hogan

socode wrote:

spacemn wrote:

GaryW wrote:

spacemn wrote:

GaryW wrote:

Where does it say that the fast-hybrid AF works on,say, the Nex-6?

The point is, if Sony is only going to produce FE lenses going forward, it'd be nice to be able to use them effectively on existing cameras. Maybe that would be a problem with APS-C lenses too? If it requires a FW update for every new lens, that's a pain, and Sony is less likely to do that for older cameras. It's a weakness in the e-mount.

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Gary W.

It is not plausible to think that FE lenses won't work with PDAF AF on APS-C bodies. My APS-C 35mm f/1.8 for instance works fine with PDAF with my A7.

I think it is a big part of Sony's strategy that FE lenses must be attractive on APS-C bodies as well.

APS-C lenses should be attractive on APS-C bodies, but yet Sony requires a FW update for PDAF to work. (I applied this FW update on my Nex-6 already.) They have a short list of lenses that were part of that update. Next week, they could come out with a lens -- either APS-C or FE -- and PDAF wouldn't be supported (probably).

For example both 35mm and 55mm FE lenses have a great FOV on APS-C bodies. The FE 70-200mm is great on APS-C as well. Only ultra wide and standard FE zooms are probably not a great idea on APS-C bodies, but here we are talking about 2-3 lenses.

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Gary W.

To me that sounds like a paranoid assumption.

It was perfectly understandably when some lenses had to be firmware updated to support a brand new PDAF technology.

With all due respect it isn't at all. It points to some reasonably-foreseeable aspect of the lens protocol that was simply excluded or missed by original engineers working to a deadline and delivering the bare minimum.

I doubt that. Developments today were likely planned 2-3 years ago. In fact, if you look at the original E-mount kit lens, Sony called it: E 18-55 OSS. That tells me that Sony had sketched out the possibility of going with FE lenses.

As for FE 55, one of the demo video for a6000 used that lens. In fact, I would assume that every new or updated lens (at least over last couple of years) and on both mounts by Sony, might be ready for focal plane AF system.

Does anyone with a real understanding of this know exactly what needs to be added? Commands to move a stepper motor to a precise stop? Do the lenses need to return current step point rather than simply a distance?

A good clue to me comes from RX10. It is a CDAF camera but it uses SSM which is unusual as PDAF requires a quick linear movement, but does not work well for CDAF. To meet CDAF requirements, Sony has used a piezo electric motor (which Sony uses for in-body image stabilization). So, SSM drives the lens in either direction quickly, and the secondary motor acts as a brake. If I were to bet on it, this dual motor SSM design may be part of new lenses on both mounts, and those updated on A-mount.

 EinsteinsGhost's gear list:EinsteinsGhost's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-F828 Sony SLT-A55 Sony Alpha NEX-6 Sigma 18-250mm F3.5-6.3 DC OS HSM Sony 135mm F2.8 (T4.5) STF +12 more
EinsteinsGhost Forum Pro • Posts: 11,977
Re: With regard to Canikon lenses…….

rrccad wrote:

canon / nikon could remove the mirror and leave the registration distance. they could even do hybrid systems where the mirror is only used in specific cases and not in others. going mirrorless doesn't necessarily mean adopting a different mount.

Let us assume that Canon and Nikon will simply remove the mirror (bye bye OVF)

Let us assume that every lens will still focus as well without the aid of mirror-based PDAF system they were designed for, as opposed to focal plane AF system (where they happen to suck today). Remember, this is also where Sony A-mount stands today.

Those are significant assumptions and you seem to be betting on those. But here is yet another one you didn't think about:

Using mirror only in specific cases, not in others. This, just may be Sony's formula on A-mount if the above assumptions don't work well. The question is, how willing are you to receive an EVF? Sony SLTs have metering and VF off the sensor. The SLT itself is only for mirror based PDAF.

On Canon and Nikon, metering, VF and AF are off the mirror. When you lift the mirror up, you lose all three.

But, my bet would be on lenses requiring update to their AF system (not so much on E-mount system, since every lens can be already expected to have that).

I'd bet on that mass far more than for instance .. FE mount?

There is no FE mount, unless you think Nikon has a DX mount and a FX mount, and likewise, Canon has EF mount and EF-S mount. Get the basics right: Its E-mount, and launched only 3+ years ago and clearly has your attention already.

 EinsteinsGhost's gear list:EinsteinsGhost's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-F828 Sony SLT-A55 Sony Alpha NEX-6 Sigma 18-250mm F3.5-6.3 DC OS HSM Sony 135mm F2.8 (T4.5) STF +12 more
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