And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...

Started 10 months ago | Discussions
kcamacho11
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Smiller4128, 10 months ago

Smiller4128 wrote:

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr5-trusted-sources-no-a7000-aps-c-e-mount-coming-in-2014-main-focus-on-fe-from-now-on/

No more support for the APS-C in terms of a NEX7 replacement or APS-C lenses...odd considering they just released the A6000....

Can't get my hands on my X100S soon enough! (And my X-T1 when it releases!)

I made the switch back when I had an NEX-7, and I couldn't possibly be happier.

It is not even about the cameras themselves, but even more so about the entire system as a whole.

Where are the fast F1.2, F1.4 primes?

Where are the fast F2.8 mid zooms? Not even a F2.8-F4?

Where are the fast tele zooms?

Fuji is serious about providing lenses for the semi-pro/professionals, and Sony certainly is not.

They just provide you with over-priced lenses like the Zeiss 16-70 F4 for $999, in which their prices do not justify their performance.

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SVPhotography
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to historianx, 10 months ago

It didn't have to be that way - Sony purchased Minolta in 2006 (first camera - 1928) for their optical know-how and IP.

The A-mount is a Minolta mount.

But they let it all go to waste...

historianx wrote:

Compared to Fujifilm (1934, first cam 1948), Olympus (1919, first cam 1936), Nikon/Nikkor (1917, first cam 1948), Canon (1937, first cam 1937) and other Japanese optics/camera/film companies, Sony (1946, first cam 1996) simply has no historic legacy or experience in R&D and manufacture of *still* cam systems. When someone I know buys anything else but Sony, I personally thank them and tell them they made the right decision. A colleague of mine rented an A7 to see how well it would do with his Leica M lenses, but quickly returned and rejected it because "it feels like a Gameboy first, and a camera second." Well put. And when I told him about X-E1 bodies hovering near $500, and the Leica M-Adapter for under $200, well that got his attention real fast.

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kcamacho11
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to taz98spin, 10 months ago

taz98spin wrote:

Same here! But so many m43 users claim that the E-M5/E-M1 IQ is better than APSC and FF..

Which makes me laugh, but oh well..

In the end of the day, sensor size ALWAYS wins no matter what.

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Mike in Kansas
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to juvx, 10 months ago

juvx wrote:

Mike in Kansas wrote:

I've always felt that Sony is a consumer electronics company, and Fuji is a photo/imaging company. Both make good products, but I feel that Fuji will be more true to their optics roots than Sony will ever be.

Try the A7r with the 55mm FE lens and get back to me. It blows 3000$ DSLRS (5d MK3) with 2000$ lenses away....

Great - they have a good product now.  Where will it be in a few years?  If I'm going to move from one system (Nikon) to another (Fuji), I want there to be a good possibility that it will still be supported and updated in 5 years or so.  I feel that Fuji will do that, Sony not so much.  But that is my own opinion that may not be shared by others.  If, on the other hand, you feel that cameras are disposable electronics like iPhones, then Sony might suit you fine.

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kcamacho11
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to LPoe, 10 months ago

LPoe wrote:

To me, Sony appears to be throwing a bunch of stuff on the wall to see what sticks.
-Lpoe

http://www.lpoephoto.com/

That is EXACTLY what they are doing, and I completely agree.

Instead, Fuji has a great game-plan of providing cameras and lenses which their customers demand, satisfying the needs of semi-pros/professionals who want high-grade equipment and optics.

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Tapper123
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Dimitriy, 10 months ago

Even if the new 24mp sensor is great, it doesn't mean Fuji will stop either.

I have no doubt we'll see improved sensors from Fuji in 2014 as well, maybe with XPro2 in the Fall for example.

Doesn't matter if Fuji is a few months behind Sony in introducing new tech; at least they're competently developing a coherent system, and that matters more in the long run.

Dimitriy wrote:

why? they are coming with new aspc bodies with new generation sensor and processor. From description new sensor won't be just about focus assist, but should deliver better iq. when did fuji last come with improved iq sensor? I agree that so far it's still better than sony's sensor, but to say that sony gave up on apsc is just not true. With lenses it's always been sony's weak spot. They produce enough lenses, just not enough good ones. Of course, you can always buy Touit 32mm and 12mm or zeiss 24mm. They are not much more expensive than fuji's and just as good or better in case of Touit. What sony brings to the table is better focusing and video. Fuji still leads with iq, original lenses and interface. we'll see how good a6000 sensor really is and whether it changes iq balance.

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kcamacho11
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Tapper123, 10 months ago

Tapper123 wrote:

Even if the new 24mp sensor is great, it doesn't mean Fuji will stop either.

Not only that, but where are the serious pro-grade or weather-sealed lenses?

Where are the weather-sealed APS-C bodies?

It is just more than the cameras themselves. Sony is lacking in fast, pro lenses.

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juvx
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Mike in Kansas, 10 months ago

Mike in Kansas wrote:

juvx wrote:

Mike in Kansas wrote:

I've always felt that Sony is a consumer electronics company, and Fuji is a photo/imaging company. Both make good products, but I feel that Fuji will be more true to their optics roots than Sony will ever be.

Try the A7r with the 55mm FE lens and get back to me. It blows 3000$ DSLRS (5d MK3) with 2000$ lenses away....

Great - they have a good product now. Where will it be in a few years? If I'm going to move from one system (Nikon) to another (Fuji), I want there to be a good possibility that it will still be supported and updated in 5 years or so. I feel that Fuji will do that, Sony not so much. But that is my own opinion that may not be shared by others. If, on the other hand, you feel that cameras are disposable electronics like iPhones, then Sony might suit you fine.

Who said it wont be supported???? wtf is this coming from? haha they simply rebranded the NEX to Alpha... they will still release new e mount lenses.... just no successor to the NEX 7... not sure what the problem is.... Also keep in mind SIGMA makes some GREAT e mount lenses. Iv owned a few and they were great.

There are a lot more companies that make e mount lenses then x mount...Rokinon, Sigma, Sony, Zeiss, Tamron, there about 80 lenses to choose from and more will come out.... not sure what you guys are even talking about? not supported? lol ...

Really, what makes you guys think it E mount wont be supported for many many years to come, explain?

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juvx
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to kcamacho11, 10 months ago

kcamacho11 wrote:

LPoe wrote:

To me, Sony appears to be throwing a bunch of stuff on the wall to see what sticks.
-Lpoe

http://www.lpoephoto.com/

That is EXACTLY what they are doing, and I completely agree.

Instead, Fuji has a great game-plan of providing cameras and lenses which their customers demand, satisfying the needs of semi-pros/professionals who want high-grade equipment and optics.

Its actually pretty simple...

sub 1000$ - APSC

over 1000$ - FF

Not sure why its so hard for people to grasp. Its a really good strategy actually think about it.

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Tapper123
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to juvx, 10 months ago
I really dont like to see people sounding like fuji fanboys. I love fuji and have a x-e1 with the 27mm F2.8 pancake right next to me right now at all times but sony's is on the right track, it will just take time to develop.

That's the problem -- people don't trust Sony to stay on the right track, or any track.

I love Sony stuff in general. RX100II is my main camera right now (planning to buy into a mirrorless system next year and watching closely; Fuji is top of list for me so far), but I felt burned with NEX and just don't feel good about investing a big sum of money into a Sony system.

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Joel Stern
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to SVPhotography, 10 months ago

SVPhotography wrote:

It didn't have to be that way - Sony purchased Minolta in 2006 (first camera - 1928) for their optical know-how and IP.

The A-mount is a Minolta mount.

But they let it all go to waste...

So you have to ask, what are they thinking (or not)?

historianx wrote:

Compared to Fujifilm (1934, first cam 1948), Olympus (1919, first cam 1936), Nikon/Nikkor (1917, first cam 1948), Canon (1937, first cam 1937) and other Japanese optics/camera/film companies, Sony (1946, first cam 1996) simply has no historic legacy or experience in R&D and manufacture of *still* cam systems. When someone I know buys anything else but Sony, I personally thank them and tell them they made the right decision. A colleague of mine rented an A7 to see how well it would do with his Leica M lenses, but quickly returned and rejected it because "it feels like a Gameboy first, and a camera second." Well put. And when I told him about X-E1 bodies hovering near $500, and the Leica M-Adapter for under $200, well that got his attention real fast.

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Joel Stern
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Dimitriy, 10 months ago

Dimitriy wrote:

a6000 is a replacement for both nex-6 and nex-7. 24mb sensor, better processor, better focus and more robust body actually puts it closer to nex-7. what would a7000 bring? slightly better ovf? the fact that price is from nex-6 is a bonus.

I just read it is not a replacement yet for the 7, that is forthcoming....so what does that mean and is it true?

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Joel Stern
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to juvx, 10 months ago

juvx wrote:

Mike in Kansas wrote:

I've always felt that Sony is a consumer electronics company, and Fuji is a photo/imaging company. Both make good products, but I feel that Fuji will be more true to their optics roots than Sony will ever be.

Try the A7r with the 55mm FE lens and get back to me. It blows 3000$ DSLRS (5d MK3) with 2000$ lenses away....

But do you want to only have a 35mm and a 55mm lens that are of quality to use?

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Joel Stern
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to kcamacho11, 10 months ago

I sat on the fence with fuji for a long time, made my excuses, too big with lenses (heavy for my arthritis, watercolor effect, etc).. Af never an issue for me.  Tried both the X100S, really liked it but the  Ricoh GR was more portable, used the XE and had my issues with the zoom size when extended. What else is there in APSc that stands up to Fuji, Ricoh my preferred brand abandoned us with the GXR, this is what scares me about Sony. I have had Sony TV's and video recorders for when my daughter was little, but video is meaningless for me. I have always love still photograph. I almost went the m43 route but there are compromises, they are a bit smaller but when you get into the better lenses you lose the advantage. IQ, well I have read the arguments on the M43 forum about NR being applied to Fuji RAW, I see the DPR comparisons but do not see it anywhere else. Fuji glass is glass I feel I can trust. Bodies will come and go, glass will stay. I would rather today have an XE1 than an A6000 as I know where Fuji is going (I think). I also think I know where Sony is going, going to change when they do not get what they want. I believe they will go totally full frame and the lenses will be developed for that format. I do not need FF, sure it is nice, I am an old film guy, now I view my pics on my computer, whenI did film I made 8x10's, I am sure I will not do bigger now when I start printing again (if)... APSc is fine for me, I have good PP as I like to shoot RAW but if a jpeg is good then so be it.... I just personally do not trust Sony to stay on track, whatever that means for them.

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57even
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Sony = all products and no strategy
In reply to Smiller4128, 10 months ago

Smiller4128 wrote:

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr5-trusted-sources-no-a7000-aps-c-e-mount-coming-in-2014-main-focus-on-fe-from-now-on/

No more support for the APS-C in terms of a NEX7 replacement or APS-C lenses...odd considering they just released the A6000....

Can't get my hands on my X100S soon enough! (And my X-T1 when it releases!)

Sony's camera division seems to be the most schizophrenic company in the world. They have many camera systems, many of them innovative, but as soon as they produce them they seem to lose interest and chase another pipe dream. Its as if they read forums instead of polling real users.

The A7 is a perfect example of a camera designed to a forum pundits wet dream instead of proper market research and user feedback. Very capable on paper, but not user friendly and with some very annoying features and a whole roadmap of big, slow lenses. Almost as if they never asked an actual customer to test it. Will be nice when it's finished, but unlike Fuji don't expect existing customers to see the benefits. It will just be a new model.

It also looks like it was designed with an etch-a-sketch instead of a CAD system.

They do innovate, but every time you buy into their proprietary tech (Betamax, Discman, Memory Stick, NEX, non-ISO flash shoes) they become obsolete.

No thanks. I have no problem using their component technology in other products, their R&D is pretty good on the whole, but they have severe problems trying to productise any of it. I have not bought one of their finished articles for many years after a highly unsatisfactory experience with one of their high-res CRT monitors. Customer service? Non existent. Add rootkits and their exploitative music business and I am not interested in them as a direct customer.

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Joel Stern
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to johnbandry, 10 months ago

johnbandry wrote:

Ever since Sony were found to be installing root kits some years back, I have not bought, nor even looked at, another Sony product, no matter how tempting its tech appears to be. They also deliberately break the DVD standard on video DVDs. I won't buy from a company I can't trust.

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John Bandry

I never knew that, thanks for the link.... This will change my future electronic habits as well.

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khunfred
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to LPoe, 10 months ago

"At a certain point you're not buying a camera, you're investing in a system/platform. That's the real strength of Canikon. People are invested in the platform and the more lenses and accessories they have the harder it is to switch".

Sony has a huge system: cameras, TVS, microwaves, fridges...ahaha. Sony don't sell a camera. Sony sells a "Sony". I'm not kidding: it's a different approach of the market, maybe more consumerist. Each brand has a different philosophy. Everyone knows the Sony brand, even in the North pole. But for most of the people, Fuji is a mountain near Tokyo, not an innovative camera maker.

Even if I was very interested in the A7: putting a FF sensor in a so small body looks like magic. But after 6 months, what about the lens roadmap? What lenses and when?
So my next equipment will be 100% Fuji. Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks that this brand is managed with some brains who are "thinking" before "producing". Maybe I will miss 80/85mm lens that I used to shoot with, but I will deal without it.

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Alohaman
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Smiller4128, 10 months ago

Smiller4128 wrote:

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr5-trusted-sources-no-a7000-aps-c-e-mount-coming-in-2014-main-focus-on-fe-from-now-on/

No more support for the APS-C in terms of a NEX7 replacement or APS-C lenses...odd considering they just released the A6000....

Can't get my hands on my X100S soon enough! (And my X-T1 when it releases!)

I can't see how "no A7000 in 2014" translates to "no more support for NEX7 replacement or APS-C lenses". The NEX-7 and NEX-6 came out about a year apart.  So if we have to wait another year for the A7000 to come out what's the problem?

We all should be careful because the conspiracy-theorist in me believe that all the camera companies are brainwashing us in wanting the newest and the best equipment right now.  If we don't have these, we cannot be good photographers.

One "commentator" (I can't remember who) said that we photographers are looking for a camera that can eliminate all of our deficiencies. Can't hold the camera steady>>image stabilization; can't focus quickly>>96-point auto-focus;  can't remember where we took the photo>>GPS; can't get the right exposure>>230 point AE.

He said the only thing left is a GPS-gyroscope controlled camera with billions of sample photos in its memory bank that can point the camera for us.  If we are standing in the middle of St. Mark's square in Venice, knowing where we are the camera will turn us around and shoot the best pictures for us. Every photo is in focus, correctly exposed, perfectly composed, shutter release perfectly timed and every shot is a keeper! Can't have it any better!

I like technology as much as others; but hey, leave something for the photographer to do.

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khunfred
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to Joel Stern, 10 months ago

Joel Stern wrote:

Who knows what any camera company will do tomorrow, but we know Sony will probably continue to change directions. I have only used my wife. For me that is enough.

So sorry fot the bad joke, but sometimes I can't resist.

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kcamacho11
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Re: And THIS is why I'm switching to Fuji from Sony...
In reply to juvx, 10 months ago

juvx wrote:

Who said it wont be supported???? wtf is this coming from? haha they simply rebranded the NEX to Alpha... they will still release new e mount lenses.... just no successor to the NEX 7... not sure what the problem is.... Also keep in mind SIGMA makes some GREAT e mount lenses. Iv owned a few and they were great.

There are a lot more companies that make e mount lenses then x mount...Rokinon, Sigma, Sony, Zeiss, Tamron, there about 80 lenses to choose from and more will come out.... not sure what you guys are even talking about? not supported? lol ...

Really, what makes you guys think it E mount wont be supported for many many years to come, explain?

E-mount will be supported....but ask yourself this?

Why does Sony keep releasing new APS-C mirrorless cameras, yet no roadmap for pro-grade future E-mount lenses?

The Zeiss 16-70 F4 is $1000, with mixed reviews. Price does not justify it's performance.

The Zeiss Touit's are F1.8 and extremely over-priced.

The Zeiss 24 F1.8 is $1000, while Fuji has F1.4 lenses for less, and now even a fast F1.2.

Where are the weather-sealed APS-C bodies and lenses?

It is clear that Sony is focusing more on Full Frame mirrorless now.

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