A6000 - losing touch

Started 8 months ago | Discussions
120 to 35
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A6000 - losing touch
8 months ago

As mentioned in various threads here, the A6000 has good features and sells at an attractive price point, the same for the A5000.

But with all the excitement about focusing speed, I find it strange that the cameras do not feature a touch screen.

The large number of PDAF points spread all over the frame is a great idea. Yet the quick focus-selection touch tool is missing.

Perhaps 80% of current camera use is with smart-phones and tablets. These devices feature a very high-res LCD that shows the difference between in-focus and out-of-focus areas very clearly, despite the large depth of field of the tiny lenses and sensors. The phone shows a green square on the focus area and allows the user to tap on a face or an object to change the focus point immediately.

How is the average iPhone user going to be convinced that this camera is not a clumsy, difficult-to-use downgrade from the phone? On the highly successful NEX-5 models with touch screen, the transition from the phone is simple with the same touch screen and focus point selection. Why not include the touch screen on all models?

Some advanced users (and there are many in this forum) might think the touch screen is just for novices and has no benefit for them. I have seen long threads about continuous auto-focus and auto-focus speed, but nothing about auto-focus pint selection.

Therefore it seems those particular posters mostly take pictures of

  • one active child
  • one playful dog
  • one bird in flight
  • one building or monument in frame

No all real-world subjects are in the above list. We often need to choose the focus point among two possible ones, while the camera generally selects the closer face or object or the one with more contrast (often the nearest lamppost or window frame). And we need to do this in a split second.

I don't think we will spot any paparazzi using the A6000 to take pictures of celebrities on the move accompanied by minders and assistants.

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Keit ll
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

I understand your preference for a touchscreen but one good point is that it will be possible to fit an extra protection screen to prevent the LCD deterioration which these cameras are prone to without compromising any function.

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nandbytes
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

hmmm... the way I see it if someone is moving from iphone to a ILC, think that person has more things to worry about (or learn about) first than just tapping screens to just replace his iphone.

But I do see your point, the reason I think it is absent is this camera is aimed at enthusiasts who I would imagine wouldn't have a problem with the old style of selecting points. I have no problem on my a-mount cameras. Also touch screen would involve further processing etc which I assume the AF system gets priority over plus the complexity of fitting in all hardware in a compact size.

Simply put, its a really nice feature I'd love to have along with GPS, wifi, a cup holder among other things. It just wouldn't be the deciding factor for someone this camera is aimed at (or so I feel).

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Donny out of Element here
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

1. The problem with my 5N is that I hate touch - I accidentally touch it all the time. Yes, one can go to menu and turn it off/on, but it's a burden when you have to take photo right now and you realize that focus is somewhere in the corner due to accidental touch. Frustrating.

2. As seen in some videos: a6k can really track moving objects. So if you have seen a part where a guy pans camera in a garage from one side to another - we can see multiple live green boxes of AF focusing instantly - so IMHO - it would be much easier now to select focus by just panning camera where you want focus to be and then either lock and recompose or shoot straight away. Much faster than trying to hold camera steady and push on a screen to choose focus point (and also after touching on a screen to choose focus point I had to recompose anyway - since it wasn't as accurate).

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bryanchicken
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

I went from phone to compact to m43 to a NEX 5R.

Other than the phone the 5R is the only one with a touch screen, and i rarely use it, even though the 5R doesn't have an EVF. With an EVF the touch screen becomes even less important.

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120 to 35
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to Keit ll, 8 months ago

Keit ll wrote:

I understand your preference for a touchscreen but one good point is that it will be possible to fit an extra protection screen to prevent the LCD deterioration which these cameras are prone to without compromising any function.

You can still buy the Sony PCK-LM13 semi-hard protector screen for the NEX-5R touch screen.

There are protective screens for phones too.

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nevercat
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

Sony decided tht a camera with an EVF will mostly be used with the EVF as a finder. In that configuration a touchscreen has no function, so Sony decided that for these cameras no touchscreen is needed. If this is the right decission (Olympus seems to think that the touchscreen is a good consept on cameras with an EVF) si up to you.

Personaly I'm not a gbig fan of the touchscreen as with me the touchscreen (both on my phone as on my tablet) seem not to do what I want them to do, sometimes it does not react to my touch, other times it do not what I expect it to do. So my hands are not good for the touchscreen. When taking pictures that would not be nice when depending on a touch screen and on the biog moment the touchscreen is not working. an other reason why I do not like the touchscreen is the way you have to hold your camera when using the touchscreen, I find it not very comfortable.

Shpould Sony put a touchscreen on the A6000? Well not for me, but I know that many will like the touchscreen, so it might be a good idea as long as it can be switched of...

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parallaxproblem
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

120 to 35 wrote:

As mentioned in various threads here, the A6000 has good features and sells at an attractive price point, the same for the A5000.

But with all the excitement about focusing speed, I find it strange that the cameras do not feature a touch screen.

The large number of PDAF points spread all over the frame is a great idea. Yet the quick focus-selection touch tool is missing.

Perhaps 80% of current camera use is with smart-phones and tablets. These devices feature a very high-res LCD that shows the difference between in-focus and out-of-focus areas very clearly, despite the large depth of field of the tiny lenses and sensors. The phone shows a green square on the focus area and allows the user to tap on a face or an object to change the focus point immediately.

How is the average iPhone user going to be convinced that this camera is not a clumsy, difficult-to-use downgrade from the phone? On the highly successful NEX-5 models with touch screen, the transition from the phone is simple with the same touch screen and focus point selection. Why not include the touch screen on all models?

Some advanced users (and there are many in this forum) might think the touch screen is just for novices and has no benefit for them. I have seen long threads about continuous auto-focus and auto-focus speed, but nothing about auto-focus pint selection.

Therefore it seems those particular posters mostly take pictures of

  • one active child
  • one playful dog
  • one bird in flight
  • one building or monument in frame

No all real-world subjects are in the above list. We often need to choose the focus point among two possible ones, while the camera generally selects the closer face or object or the one with more contrast (often the nearest lamppost or window frame). And we need to do this in a split second.

I don't think we will spot any paparazzi using the A6000 to take pictures of celebrities on the move accompanied by minders and assistants.

I'm also sorry they didn't include a touch screen as I like it very much on my NEX-5R and think it has many benefits: touch to focus being the most important and very, very handy

I don't understand why Sony miss this feature off their 'better' cameras and think there must be a very stubborn marketing manager somewhere in their organisation who is doing them a lot of harm with his/her intransigence on this matter

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Riquez
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

I guess I would need to buy the NNU-40 accessory (Nose neutralizing  unit)

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nevercat
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to Riquez, 8 months ago

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

Touchscreen could switch off when using the EVF, no real problem there...

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parallaxproblem
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to Riquez, 8 months ago

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

Touch screen switches-off when the EVF activates (which it does automatically when your face gets close to it because of a proximity sensor), at least that is what happens on the NEX-5R with external EVF fitted

You also have the option to have the touchscreen permanently switched-off if you don't like it

No downsides to touchscreens (capacative ones anyway, resistive ones reduce IQ slightly because of the extra layer).  I don't understand why they aren't fitted to all Sony cameras

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Riquez
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to parallaxproblem, 8 months ago

parallaxproblem wrote:

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

Touch screen switches-off when the EVF activates (which it does automatically when your face gets close to it because of a proximity sensor), at least that is what happens on the NEX-5R with external EVF fitted

My attempt at a joke, but yes I agree there is no harm to have the option for all & disable if you so wish.

Personally its not very high on my want list, but I wouldn't turn it down.

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120 to 35
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to Riquez, 8 months ago

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

I guess I would need to buy the NNU-40 accessory (Nose neutralizing unit)

There are two options:

The simple option is to disable touch when looking through EVF. The eye sensor is built into all EVF cameras and there is no need for an accessory.

The advance option is to use eye-detect to switch the function of the LCD to a act as swipe pad in the right hand area only. Advanced cameras such as the Nikon D4 have a joystick near the thumb position. The swipe pad can be a substitute for the joystick.

And you should be able to turn touch screen off if you do not use it.

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parallaxproblem
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to Riquez, 8 months ago

Riquez wrote:

parallaxproblem wrote:

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

Touch screen switches-off when the EVF activates (which it does automatically when your face gets close to it because of a proximity sensor), at least that is what happens on the NEX-5R with external EVF fitted

My attempt at a joke, but yes I agree there is no harm to have the option for all & disable if you so wish.

Personally its not very high on my want list, but I wouldn't turn it down.

I guess it depends on how you do AF...  I like to chose my own focus point and so the touchscreen speeds that process up enormously rather than having to 'jog' the focus point around the screen by repeatedly pressing the D-button.  With MF lenses the touchscreen allows you to select the point for 'focus assist' again without needing to 'jog' the point around

I don't use touchscreen for anything else myself (certainly not for menus etc) and if you let the camera chose the AF point and don't use MF lenses then a touchscreen probably isn't so much use to you

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abortabort
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

120 to 35 wrote:

As mentioned in various threads here, the A6000 has good features and sells at an attractive price point, the same for the A5000.

But with all the excitement about focusing speed, I find it strange that the cameras do not feature a touch screen.

It might have something to do with all the internet experts always saying they 'don't need gimmicks like touchscreen'. It comes up a lot. Sony started the push and have slowly reduced their reliance on it. While it is definitely useful, it is one of those things that did polarise people's opinions. Seems Sony have worked hard to cut costs (and price) on the a6000, so touch was probably reserved for other models and/or considered 'non-essential'.

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cheddargav
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to 120 to 35, 8 months ago

I have the GX7, I love innovation: touchscreens just don't suit photography

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Riquez
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to parallaxproblem, 8 months ago

parallaxproblem wrote:

Riquez wrote:

parallaxproblem wrote:

Riquez wrote:

How do you look into an EVF & avoid your nose touching the screen?

Touch screen switches-off when the EVF activates (which it does automatically when your face gets close to it because of a proximity sensor), at least that is what happens on the NEX-5R with external EVF fitted

My attempt at a joke, but yes I agree there is no harm to have the option for all & disable if you so wish.

Personally its not very high on my want list, but I wouldn't turn it down.

I guess it depends on how you do AF... I like to chose my own focus point and so the touchscreen speeds that process up enormously rather than having to 'jog' the focus point around the screen by repeatedly pressing the D-button. With MF lenses the touchscreen allows you to select the point for 'focus assist' again without needing to 'jog' the point around

I don't use touchscreen for anything else myself (certainly not for menus etc) and if you let the camera chose the AF point and don't use MF lenses then a touchscreen probably isn't so much use to you

I do a lot of focus stacking shots at work & am always jogging that point around! But since it's a controlled environment on tripod I never really feel that it's a chore. Now you mention it though, it might be something I liked if I tried it.

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sean lancaster
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to parallaxproblem, 8 months ago

parallaxproblem wrote:

120 to 35 wrote:

But with all the excitement about focusing speed, I find it strange that the cameras do not feature a touch screen.

The large number of PDAF points spread all over the frame is a great idea. Yet the quick focus-selection touch tool is missing.

I'm also sorry they didn't include a touch screen as I like it very much on my NEX-5R and think it has many benefits: touch to focus being the most important and very, very handy

I don't understand why Sony miss this feature off their 'better' cameras and think there must be a very stubborn marketing manager somewhere in their organisation who is doing them a lot of harm with his/her intransigence on this matter

My NEX 5N is getting old. My touch screen has no peeling or any damage after years of use. I kept a protective screen on it and it's still perfect. I would like to upgrade my Emount camera, but I use touch to focus with my 5N on nearly every shot to avoid focus and recompose. I use focus and recompose on my Canon 6D for every shot because moving the focus point is not quick enough when grabbing a quick shot. Or, I shoot with the center point and crop later. I still love my 5N for allowing me to put the focus on someone's eyes, for example, and get the shot exactly how I want it in an instant. My 5N will trudge on for now as my back up camera. I am a full frame shooter who uses an OVF on nearly every shot and I would jump at the opportunity for Sony to add a touch screen (with an ON/OFF option because I know people hate it) to a good camera like what they're offering in the A6000. Sigh.

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Helen
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to cheddargav, 8 months ago

cheddargav wrote:

I have the GX7, I love innovation: touchscreens just don't suit photography

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I have the GX7 also and am not generally that attracted to touchscreens, but they do come in handy for belting through the menus at high speed, for example (and moving the AF target around during movie shooting). On previous Sonys, I've found a touchscreen useful as the only way of getting at a small spot AF target without giving up the customisation of a button, but perhaps the A6000 has another way around this (the NEX 6 didn't).

Presumably Sony has now "gone off" the idea of touchscreens on their mirrorless cameras - first they downgraded the capacitive screen of the 5N to resistive on the 5R and 5T, and now, with the replacements apparently bridging the gap between two previous models, neither the A5000 nor the A6000 has a touchscreen - so once the NEX models are all gone, there won't actually be a touchscreen-equipped mirrorless model in the range (based on those announced so far).

An aside: looking at the comparison pictures of the A6000 next to the NEX 6 and NEX 7 on DPReview, it looks as though Sony has deleted the damage-prone "TruBlack" coating treatment on the LCD monitor's surface... (I see their example of the NEX 7 shows how it can deteriorate, though I've been fortunate not to have this happen).

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sean lancaster
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Re: A6000 - losing touch
In reply to abortabort, 8 months ago

abortabort wrote:

120 to 35 wrote:

As mentioned in various threads here, the A6000 has good features and sells at an attractive price point, the same for the A5000.

But with all the excitement about focusing speed, I find it strange that the cameras do not feature a touch screen.

It might have something to do with all the internet experts always saying they 'don't need gimmicks like touchscreen'. It comes up a lot. Sony started the push and have slowly reduced their reliance on it. While it is definitely useful, it is one of those things that did polarise people's opinions. Seems Sony have worked hard to cut costs (and price) on the a6000, so touch was probably reserved for other models and/or considered 'non-essential'.

The cost to Sony is just a few dollars, if that. I can get a replacement touch screen for my iPhone for under $10 from some vendors, so they are making a profit on top of the profit that the factory is making. It's cheap tech.

EDIT: quick Google search - $6.37 with free shipping.

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