What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??

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mistermejia
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What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
5 months ago

I have never owned or used any of these models, except my X10, but what's up with all this complaints about returning the camera because of AF?  Are this type of people using the camera in COMPLETE darkness or something?  I am just trying to understand what all this is about.

I do understand the X-E1/X-pro1 limitations comapred to other cameras out there, but only based on these two video samples bellow i don't see what the problem is at all.  To me these cameras focus completely fine.  They are not for fast continuous shooting, but i see that they focus just fine as any normal camera should.

Could it be that some of this claims are done by fuji marketters trying to brain wash you into having to spend money on the next new camera model making you think that you NEED it?

Again, based on what i am seeing in these youtube videos i honestly don't see what the problem is.  Heck, my cheap X10 does not give me AF problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiifET2zFXI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KNuvulFwY

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57LowRider
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

Funny you should bring this up, but I notice that a number of bloggers who bought, then sold because of slow AF etc, an X-Pro1 in its early days are now buying... an X-Pro1 or X-E1 and loving them. Seems that the firmware updates were all they should have waited for.

That's how to have buyers' remorse and sellers' remorse with the same kit. Superb value, if you ask me.

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David McGaughey
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The "complainers" probably are used to DSLRs
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

I have never owned or used any of these models, except my X10, but what's up with all this complaints about returning the camera because of AF? Are this type of people using the camera in COMPLETE darkness or something? I am just trying to understand what all this is about.

I do understand the X-E1/X-pro1 limitations comapred to other cameras out there, but only based on these two video samples bellow i don't see what the problem is at all. To me these cameras focus completely fine. They are not for fast continuous shooting, but i see that they focus just fine as any normal camera should.

Could it be that some of this claims are done by fuji marketters trying to brain wash you into having to spend money on the next new camera model making you think that you NEED it?

Again, based on what i am seeing in these youtube videos i honestly don't see what the problem is. Heck, my cheap X10 does not give me AF problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiifET2zFXI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KNuvulFwY

A modern DSLR with a USM/linear motor/whatever lens focuses NOW (seriously, they almost focus faster than you can think). The X-Pro1/X-E1 focus far slower.

Don't believe me - look at the imaging-resource timings. A 70D can focus and take a picture in 0.075 seconds. They timed the X-E1 at 0.438 seconds. That's over 5x slower. Which is noticeable.

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John Gellings
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to 57LowRider, 5 months ago

The first generation X-E1 and X-Pro1 have slow AF compared to many other cameras on the market.  This is a fact.  Also, not everyone photographs the same things.  If you are photographing someone posing, you may not need it.  However, if you are one the street and are reacting to "action", then you can miss the shot due to the hesitation in the AF.

That said, I use them and have adapted...but still miss a shot due to AF sometimes.  If you come from a good DSLR (or an OMD), it'll be shocking how slow the AF is with certain lenses.  If you come from another slow camera, then it won't feel so bad.

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mistermejia
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to John Gellings, 5 months ago

John Gellings wrote:

The first generation X-E1 and X-Pro1 have slow AF compared to many other cameras on the market. This is a fact. Also, not everyone photographs the same things. If you are photographing someone posing, you may not need it. However, if you are one the street and are reacting to "action", then you can miss the shot due to the hesitation in the AF.

That said, I use them and have adapted...but still miss a shot due to AF sometimes. If you come from a good DSLR (or an OMD), it'll be shocking how slow the AF is with certain lenses. If you come from another slow camera, then it won't feel so bad.

What first generation?  i thought there is only one.

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Al Valentino
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

Two things. 1) It works for me, plus I also read the manual and know the tricks, 2) It is a camera for stills, not action. So buy if you shoot stills and plan on learning how the camera thinks. It is not a point and shoot camera. the important thing is to know your needs and match them to the right tool.

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darngooddesign
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

John Gellings wrote:

The first generation X-E1 and X-Pro1 have slow AF compared to many other cameras on the market. This is a fact. Also, not everyone photographs the same things. If you are photographing someone posing, you may not need it. However, if you are one the street and are reacting to "action", then you can miss the shot due to the hesitation in the AF.

That said, I use them and have adapted...but still miss a shot due to AF sometimes. If you come from a good DSLR (or an OMD), it'll be shocking how slow the AF is with certain lenses. If you come from another slow camera, then it won't feel so bad.

What first generation? i thought there is only one.

Before the firmware updates.

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Al Valentino
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

John Gellings wrote:

The first generation X-E1 and X-Pro1 have slow AF compared to many other cameras on the market. This is a fact. Also, not everyone photographs the same things. If you are photographing someone posing, you may not need it. However, if you are one the street and are reacting to "action", then you can miss the shot due to the hesitation in the AF.

That said, I use them and have adapted...but still miss a shot due to AF sometimes. If you come from a good DSLR (or an OMD), it'll be shocking how slow the AF is with certain lenses. If you come from another slow camera, then it won't feel so bad.

What first generation? i thought there is only one.

First generation firmware. The later half of 2013 was the second generation, new and vastly improved. Same with the X100. Made a real difference for many, especially those that liked the older jpeg engines and not the X-trans II versions.

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mistermejia
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Re: The "complainers" probably are used to DSLRs
In reply to David McGaughey, 5 months ago

David McGaughey wrote:

mistermejia wrote:

I have never owned or used any of these models, except my X10, but what's up with all this complaints about returning the camera because of AF? Are this type of people using the camera in COMPLETE darkness or something? I am just trying to understand what all this is about.

I do understand the X-E1/X-pro1 limitations comapred to other cameras out there, but only based on these two video samples bellow i don't see what the problem is at all. To me these cameras focus completely fine. They are not for fast continuous shooting, but i see that they focus just fine as any normal camera should.

Could it be that some of this claims are done by fuji marketters trying to brain wash you into having to spend money on the next new camera model making you think that you NEED it?

Again, based on what i am seeing in these youtube videos i honestly don't see what the problem is. Heck, my cheap X10 does not give me AF problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiifET2zFXI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KNuvulFwY

A modern DSLR with a USM/linear motor/whatever lens focuses NOW (seriously, they almost focus faster than you can think). The X-Pro1/X-E1 focus far slower.

Don't believe me - look at the imaging-resource timings. A 70D can focus and take a picture in 0.075 seconds. They timed the X-E1 at 0.438 seconds. That's over 5x slower. Which is noticeable.

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

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darngooddesign
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Re: The "complainers" probably are used to DSLRs
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

David McGaughey wrote:

mistermejia wrote:

I have never owned or used any of these models, except my X10, but what's up with all this complaints about returning the camera because of AF? Are this type of people using the camera in COMPLETE darkness or something? I am just trying to understand what all this is about.

I do understand the X-E1/X-pro1 limitations comapred to other cameras out there, but only based on these two video samples bellow i don't see what the problem is at all. To me these cameras focus completely fine. They are not for fast continuous shooting, but i see that they focus just fine as any normal camera should.

Could it be that some of this claims are done by fuji marketters trying to brain wash you into having to spend money on the next new camera model making you think that you NEED it?

Again, based on what i am seeing in these youtube videos i honestly don't see what the problem is. Heck, my cheap X10 does not give me AF problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiifET2zFXI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KNuvulFwY

A modern DSLR with a USM/linear motor/whatever lens focuses NOW (seriously, they almost focus faster than you can think). The X-Pro1/X-E1 focus far slower.

Don't believe me - look at the imaging-resource timings. A 70D can focus and take a picture in 0.075 seconds. They timed the X-E1 at 0.438 seconds. That's over 5x slower. Which is noticeable.

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

I have an X100 with the latest firmware and I have missed a few shots due to it not focusing fast enough. I enjoy the camera enough to where this isn't a deal killer, but it is something I am aware of. A slower AF can be the difference between getting a candid street photo and a shot of someone noticing and changing their expression and posing.

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David McGaughey
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Sigh
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

Ah, so people who want something different than you are stupid sheeple. Makes sense.

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Joel Stern
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Re: The "complainers" probably are used to DSLRs
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

David McGaughey wrote:

mistermejia wrote:

I have never owned or used any of these models, except my X10, but what's up with all this complaints about returning the camera because of AF? Are this type of people using the camera in COMPLETE darkness or something? I am just trying to understand what all this is about.

I do understand the X-E1/X-pro1 limitations comapred to other cameras out there, but only based on these two video samples bellow i don't see what the problem is at all. To me these cameras focus completely fine. They are not for fast continuous shooting, but i see that they focus just fine as any normal camera should.

Could it be that some of this claims are done by fuji marketters trying to brain wash you into having to spend money on the next new camera model making you think that you NEED it?

Again, based on what i am seeing in these youtube videos i honestly don't see what the problem is. Heck, my cheap X10 does not give me AF problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiifET2zFXI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KNuvulFwY

A modern DSLR with a USM/linear motor/whatever lens focuses NOW (seriously, they almost focus faster than you can think). The X-Pro1/X-E1 focus far slower.

Don't believe me - look at the imaging-resource timings. A 70D can focus and take a picture in 0.075 seconds. They timed the X-E1 at 0.438 seconds. That's over 5x slower. Which is noticeable.

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

I shoot mainly landscapes, water, barns, etc. AF speed is not a big issue for me.

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mistermejia
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Re: Sigh
In reply to David McGaughey, 5 months ago

David McGaughey wrote:

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

Ah, so people who want something different than you are stupid sheeple. Makes sense.

No sir, there is nothing wrong if someone wants something different and that's not stupid.

I just don't see where the AF is failing from those videos that i have watched.  I don't know, maybe the videos are fake of made up?

If you are requesting nikon D4 speed that's fine, i sure don't have a problem with that

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Gilli Bird
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to Al Valentino, 5 months ago

Two things. 1) It works for me, plus I also read the manual and know the tricks, 2) It is a camera for stills, not action. So buy if you shoot stills and plan on learning how the camera thinks. It is not a point and shoot camera. the important thing is to know your needs and match them to the right tool.

This, exactly.  This is the perfect  camera if you are like me, someone who likes to stop and stare at a rock a while before photographing.

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David McGaughey
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Re: Sigh
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

David McGaughey wrote:

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

Ah, so people who want something different than you are stupid sheeple. Makes sense.

No sir, there is nothing wrong if someone wants something different and that's not stupid.

I just don't see where the AF is failing from those videos that i have watched. I don't know, maybe the videos are fake of made up?

If you are requesting nikon D4 speed that's fine, i sure don't have a problem with that

So 5X slower than a "consumer" level Canon DSLR, in good light, is acceptable? In low light, the difference will get more severe.

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FBoneOne
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

even with the latest firmware on lens and camera, the XP1 can hunt when doing street photography in at times tricky lighting conditions. I am not talking pitch dark here, just deeper shadows or street lamps.

you can look at it both ways, yes, top dSLRs usually will do better in similar conditions - my 1D mk4 beats my XP1 every day in this regard but nobody likes to be targeted by a 1D with 16-35 / 2.8 whereas the XP1 is simply incognito 99% of the time.

The other way is to remember that Cartier Bresson never had AF even as slow as the XP1 is and still did Ok. Zone focusing is still a photographer's best friend in those conditions.

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Joel Stern
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Re: Sigh
In reply to mistermejia, 5 months ago

mistermejia wrote:

David McGaughey wrote:

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

Ah, so people who want something different than you are stupid sheeple. Makes sense.

No sir, there is nothing wrong if someone wants something different and that's not stupid.

I just don't see where the AF is failing from those videos that i have watched. I don't know, maybe the videos are fake of made up?

If you are requesting nikon D4 speed that's fine, i sure don't have a problem with that

I think it is about wanting lightening fast, some need this, some want this, some are less concerned.

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Joel Stern
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Re: Sigh
In reply to David McGaughey, 5 months ago

David McGaughey wrote:

mistermejia wrote:

David McGaughey wrote:

I completely understand that other and newer cameras are faster. But based on the videos i am seeing the camera focuses perfectly fine. I don't and have NEVER counted the AF seconds or amount of time from my fuji S5 PRO after owning the nikon D7000. I just know that it focuses and it does it very well. I have two kids and i have never had focusing speed "issues" with even the older S5 or the X10.

I just think that people just plainly WANT more, even if they don't even need it. There is nothing wrong if a camera focuses even "faster", but like i said, i have never paid attention tho this millisecond thing going on here. That's just my opinion.

Ah, so people who want something different than you are stupid sheeple. Makes sense.

No sir, there is nothing wrong if someone wants something different and that's not stupid.

I just don't see where the AF is failing from those videos that i have watched. I don't know, maybe the videos are fake of made up?

If you are requesting nikon D4 speed that's fine, i sure don't have a problem with that

So 5X slower than a "consumer" level Canon DSLR, in good light, is acceptable? In low light, the difference will get more severe.

I think it was posted above that the XE1 focuses in less than 1/2 second.  For some of those who shoot still photography this is fine, others want faster.

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kodora
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Re: Sigh
In reply to David McGaughey, 5 months ago

That's acceptable to me. And I guess to many other people as well. Is the iPhone acceptably quick to focus? Does the slower focusing speed (relative to your consumer level DSLR) stop people from using it to take pictures?

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mistermejia
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Re: What's all this about "slow" AF with X-E1/X-Pro1??
In reply to FBoneOne, 5 months ago

FBoneOne wrote:

even with the latest firmware on lens and camera, the XP1 can hunt when doing street photography in at times tricky lighting conditions. I am not talking pitch dark here, just deeper shadows or street lamps.

you can look at it both ways, yes, top dSLRs usually will do better in similar conditions - my 1D mk4 beats my XP1 every day in this regard but nobody likes to be targeted by a 1D with 16-35 / 2.8 whereas the XP1 is simply incognito 99% of the time.

The other way is to remember that Cartier Bresson never had AF even as slow as the XP1 is and still did Ok. Zone focusing is still a photographer's best friend in those conditions.

I am no camera engineer, but tricky focusing and hunting in deeper shadows and under street lighting, isn't that a sensor issue and has nothing to do with AF speed??

The dude in the video doing the AF testing in his room looks like he turned the lights off, and was using a very small amount of available light, but the camera focuses perfectly fine. But of course these cameras need contrast and you can't point at a plain black area because the camera won't focus, but that's a whole different subject already. No?

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