Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation

Started 9 months ago | Discussions
G Sciorio
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Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
9 months ago

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

As an enthusiast with 4K you get more opportunities to express your creativity and for pros you get the added bonus of having new services to offer your clients and grow your business.

For people to say 4K is not for them is not seeing the forest for the trees. That mentality can be safe if you're an enthusiast but pros that bypass 4K might be looking for a new career before too long.

If you're at WPPI this year I'll be giving free workshops at Unique Photo about 4K but if you're not able to make it check SCBP for some full res 4K clips and pull frames later today.

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Sonyshine
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

The manufacturers are excited about 4K but it will be  a long while before consumers are:

http://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/4k-hd-explainers-sony-lg-content-delivery-availability/

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jennajenna
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

As an enthusiast with 4K you get more opportunities to express your creativity and for pros you get the added bonus of having new services to offer your clients and grow your business.

For people to say 4K is not for them is not seeing the forest for the trees. That mentality can be safe if you're an enthusiast but pros that bypass 4K might be looking for a new career before too long.

If you're at WPPI this year I'll be giving free workshops at Unique Photo about 4K but if you're not able to make it check SCBP for some full res 4K clips and pull frames later today.

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Giulio Sciorio
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First off 4k is just a way for business to keep making money; upgrading for the sake of upgrading. 4k maybe worth it for some; but for a lot of us 1080p in 60fps is pretty much golden. Also most folks don't have the laptop power to process 4k. This is truly a pro thing - and I'm speaking as a gh3 owner. Frankly I'm stilled pssssed with Panasonic releasing the GH3 with that god awful EVF that you have to view perfectly in line in order not to get fuzziness. And Panasonic stubbornly ignores that defect. But I digress...

What I'm curious about is the crop factor of 4k. Is it different then simply doubling up like we are used to with m43. Will  a 7mm lens be 14mm in a 4k shooot? or....??

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sgm0369
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to jennajenna, 9 months ago

jennajenna wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

As an enthusiast with 4K you get more opportunities to express your creativity and for pros you get the added bonus of having new services to offer your clients and grow your business.

For people to say 4K is not for them is not seeing the forest for the trees. That mentality can be safe if you're an enthusiast but pros that bypass 4K might be looking for a new career before too long.

If you're at WPPI this year I'll be giving free workshops at Unique Photo about 4K but if you're not able to make it check SCBP for some full res 4K clips and pull frames later today.

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Giulio Sciorio
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First off 4k is just a way for business to keep making money; upgrading for the sake of upgrading. 4k maybe worth it for some; but for a lot of us 1080p in 60fps is pretty much golden. Also most folks don't have the laptop power to process 4k. This is truly a pro thing - and I'm speaking as a gh3 owner. Frankly I'm stilled pssssed with Panasonic releasing the GH3 with that god awful EVF that you have to view perfectly in line in order not to get fuzziness. And Panasonic stubbornly ignores that defect. But I digress...

What I'm curious about is the crop factor of 4k. Is it different then simply doubling up like we are used to with m43. Will a 7mm lens be 14mm in a 4k shooot? or....??

Apparently, 4k adds a 1.2x crop factor on top of m4/3's own factor. So, 7mm -> about 17mm.

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tt321
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Very well argued.

However, 'the same look and feel as your stills from 7-year old equipment' might be more appropriate as stills today include the capability of doing 36mp RAW from a high quality camera roughly the same size and shape as the GH4. That's twice the resolution and a lot more PP-ability than what a 4k frame pulled from a video stream would give you.

Maybe the majority is satisfied with a 4k frame pulled from a video stream as a still, maybe the majority is satisfied with 1080p video too...

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David Kieltyka
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

I'm not convinced that future cameras will only shoot video, but I do expect it'll be the main thing they do. I'm totally cool with that. I love everything about 4k and have been doing my pic-taking over the past couple months with 4k display in mind. I've been shooting more video too.

IMO many folks are less than thrilled because Panasonic appears to be going in a direction that doesn't address their fixations. Measurbating, for example, doesn't provide the same kick when the pixel counts don't keep going up. Other folks fantasize about a camera with the E-M1's build quality & feature set but a US $700 price tag, and the GH4 clearly won't be that. Nor will anything else any time soon, of course... Still other folks are genuinely concerned that truly high-res electronic display will mostly kill off printing. How then can I justify my pixel obsession when I only need 9 million of 'em?! And lots of people, despite the fierce disruptive innovation in imaging over the past 15 years, just don't care much for change.

-Dave-

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Sean Nelson
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to sgm0369, 9 months ago

sgm0369 wrote:

jennajenna wrote:

What I'm curious about is the crop factor of 4k. Is it different then simply doubling up like we are used to with m43. Will a 7mm lens be 14mm in a 4k shooot? or....??

Apparently, 4k adds a 1.2x crop factor on top of m4/3's own factor. So, 7mm -> about 17mm.

This misconception keeps popping up, but it's not true. The cropping only applies in the special "cinema" 1:1.85 aspect ratio mode - a new aspect ratio which is not available in any current M43 camera. In standard 16:9 (1:1.78 aspect ratio) mode 4K video uses the full width of the sensor just like 2K video does.

The cropped 1:1.85 mode results in an effective sensor size very similar to the Black Magic Pocket Cinema Camera, and I suppose its possible that was a very deliberate design choice to allow better interoperability between those cameras.   But the presence of a feature doesn't force you to use it.   Just pretend the camera doesn't have that feature and you won't have to worry about it.

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dougjgreen1
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Except I'd rather NOT shoot video
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The only reason I even use Live View is because there is no Optical viewfinder anymore.

And why would I wish to shoot 8 MP stills at a high frame rate, when I can shoot 16 MP stills that are much better, one shot at a time.

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Dheorl
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

I just don't see this happening. For starters do you have any idea how fast shooting 16MP RAW at 30fps will fill up a card? It will just be ridiculous. Not to mention the storage needed and the time spent flicking through all those photos trying to find the right one. I only really see it being used maybe by professional sports shooters.

As an enthusiast with 4K you get more opportunities to express your creativity and for pros you get the added bonus of having new services to offer your clients and grow your business.

How does 4k give you more ways of expressing your creativity? I've seen some very cool techniques and effects for getting creative with video and only two of them (out of hundreds probably) was resolution dependant, and even those are used as crutches for when you can't afford/carry the proper equipment for the job.

For people to say 4K is not for them is not seeing the forest for the trees. That mentality can be safe if you're an enthusiast but pros that bypass 4K might be looking for a new career before too long.

Really? Because clients are clearly going to pay double as much for 4k footage. In 5 years time maybe, but not now.

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Atlasman
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to Sonyshine, 9 months ago

Sonyshine wrote:

The manufacturers are excited about 4K but it will be a long while before consumers are:

http://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/4k-hd-explainers-sony-lg-content-delivery-availability/

It's not about the consumers--its about the artist.

4k brings tremendous flexibility to post production. Just as 720p brought to 480p projects.

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zackiedawg
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Great for video fans, but some photographers still may not be interested
In reply to G Sciorio, 9 months ago

G Sciorio wrote:

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

The big point worth making though is that a camera which takes video and allows you to pull a frame is no longer a still camera...this fundamental difference could be where some still camera shooters are resistant and why we state such a camera may not be for us.

From a purely professional standpoint, I can understand the argument that anything that removes chance from the equation, and guarantees capture of a precise moment no matter the skill of the photographer by shooting video and allowing the perfect moment to simply be pulled out after the fact...at the same time such an invention would not seem to bode well for skilled professional photographers who would be hard pressed to stand out from every Dick and Harry with a consumer cam who can catch that precise perfect moment just as well as they can...does this really advance a professional's career, or kill it? From the enthusiast's standpoint, it most certainly does kill the very thing they love about photography - the chance, the skill, the pursuit of capturing an elusive and perfect moment with none but a single fraction of a second and good timing to get it right. And the capture of a moment, not a moving one, and not a video of that occasion, but a single, still, shot that lets imagination wander, and lets the eye study the tiniest details - for many photographers, this is what we love about still photography. Video solutions will never be 'better' than still solutions precisely because they are video, and not still...a totally different medium. I would ask if stills photography eliminated painting...because it's faster, 'better', easier, etc. Art lovers would vehemently declare not, because it is a different medium and appreciable for its own reasons. I no more want video to stand in for stills photography than I want photography to replace painting.

That's not to say that 4K may not be a wonderful advance for video display technology, and those who want to shoot video might not now have an even better resolution and capability with which to enjoy their endeavor...just respect that there are some folks not interested in capturing video, nor interested in taking away all of the skill, chance, and fun of capturing still photographs in-the-field, rather than sitting in front of a computer reviewing our video in slow-motion while clicking a keyboard button when the 'perfect moment' ambles by.

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dougjgreen1
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Bingo. You hit the nail on the head.
In reply to zackiedawg, 9 months ago

zackiedawg wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

The big point worth making though is that a camera which takes video and allows you to pull a frame is no longer a still camera...this fundamental difference could be where some still camera shooters are resistant and why we state such a camera may not be for us.

From a purely professional standpoint, I can understand the argument that anything that removes chance from the equation, and guarantees capture of a precise moment no matter the skill of the photographer by shooting video and allowing the perfect moment to simply be pulled out after the fact...at the same time such an invention would not seem to bode well for skilled professional photographers who would be hard pressed to stand out from every Dick and Harry with a consumer cam who can catch that precise perfect moment just as well as they can...does this really advance a professional's career, or kill it? From the enthusiast's standpoint, it most certainly does kill the very thing they love about photography - the chance, the skill, the pursuit of capturing an elusive and perfect moment with none but a single fraction of a second and good timing to get it right. And the capture of a moment, not a moving one, and not a video of that occasion, but a single, still, shot that lets imagination wander, and lets the eye study the tiniest details - for many photographers, this is what we love about still photography. Video solutions will never be 'better' than still solutions precisely because they are video, and not still...a totally different medium. I would ask if stills photography eliminated painting...because it's faster, 'better', easier, etc. Art lovers would vehemently declare not, because it is a different medium and appreciable for its own reasons. I no more want video to stand in for stills photography than I want photography to replace painting.

That's not to say that 4K may not be a wonderful advance for video display technology, and those who want to shoot video might not now have an even better resolution and capability with which to enjoy their endeavor...just respect that there are some folks not interested in capturing video, nor interested in taking away all of the skill, chance, and fun of capturing still photographs in-the-field, rather than sitting in front of a computer reviewing our video in slow-motion while clicking a keyboard button when the 'perfect moment' ambles by.

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Justin
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This is exactly right. I can't add a thing to it.

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jennajenna
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Re: Bingo. You hit the nail on the head.
In reply to dougjgreen1, 9 months ago

dougjgreen1 wrote:

zackiedawg wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

The big point worth making though is that a camera which takes video and allows you to pull a frame is no longer a still camera...this fundamental difference could be where some still camera shooters are resistant and why we state such a camera may not be for us.

From a purely professional standpoint, I can understand the argument that anything that removes chance from the equation, and guarantees capture of a precise moment no matter the skill of the photographer by shooting video and allowing the perfect moment to simply be pulled out after the fact...at the same time such an invention would not seem to bode well for skilled professional photographers who would be hard pressed to stand out from every Dick and Harry with a consumer cam who can catch that precise perfect moment just as well as they can...does this really advance a professional's career, or kill it? From the enthusiast's standpoint, it most certainly does kill the very thing they love about photography - the chance, the skill, the pursuit of capturing an elusive and perfect moment with none but a single fraction of a second and good timing to get it right. And the capture of a moment, not a moving one, and not a video of that occasion, but a single, still, shot that lets imagination wander, and lets the eye study the tiniest details - for many photographers, this is what we love about still photography. Video solutions will never be 'better' than still solutions precisely because they are video, and not still...a totally different medium. I would ask if stills photography eliminated painting...because it's faster, 'better', easier, etc. Art lovers would vehemently declare not, because it is a different medium and appreciable for its own reasons. I no more want video to stand in for stills photography than I want photography to replace painting.

That's not to say that 4K may not be a wonderful advance for video display technology, and those who want to shoot video might not now have an even better resolution and capability with which to enjoy their endeavor...just respect that there are some folks not interested in capturing video, nor interested in taking away all of the skill, chance, and fun of capturing still photographs in-the-field, rather than sitting in front of a computer reviewing our video in slow-motion while clicking a keyboard button when the 'perfect moment' ambles by.

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Justin
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This is exactly right. I can't add a thing to it.

Perhaps you could add that shooting at 4k will eat up your memory card so fast you won't have time to replace it and not miss a scene LOL.

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Lab D
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You SHOULD be interested.
In reply to zackiedawg, 9 months ago

Tell me one person who is paid to shoot 480i these days?  Who wants their most precious moments captured in analog 4x3?

In a few years many people will have 4k TVs and computer screens.  Years after that 8K will be a standard.  Do you really want to pull out the crappy 1080p footage (and no ILC shoots actual 1080p resolution) for you kids to see?    Remember all those 1MP picture you took years ago that now can’t even fit on you computer screen?  Remember how awful that SD video you took a while back looks?   That’s the way people will feel about your video from today’s cameras.

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Lab D
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Video replays says you are wrong
In reply to zackiedawg, 9 months ago

zackiedawg wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

From a purely professional standpoint, I can understand the argument that anything that removes chance from the equation, and guarantees capture of a precise moment no matter the skill of the photographer by shooting video and allowing the perfect moment to simply be pulled out after the fact...

Every minute it seems a video replay changes an important play in sports, catches a bad guy in the act, or captures a special unforeseen moment.  More major or minor event are posted on YouTube these days than ever were caught on stills because it is so easy.   Think all the pcitures we ended up with of the Boston terrorists.

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G Sciorio
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to tt321, 9 months ago

tt321 wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Very well argued.

However, 'the same look and feel as your stills from 7-year old equipment' might be more appropriate as stills today include the capability of doing 36mp RAW from a high quality camera roughly the same size and shape as the GH4. That's twice the resolution and a lot more PP-ability than what a 4k frame pulled from a video stream would give you.

Maybe the majority is satisfied with a 4k frame pulled from a video stream as a still, maybe the majority is satisfied with 1080p video too...

I shot many covers with a 5MP Olympus E1 and the work still looks good. Regarding post production, its becoming a trend again (thank god) do create in camera and with that advantage 4K is great for artists. Also who cares about 36MP or full frame. For those that really need a jump in image detail, well they're using a Phase One.

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Giulio Sciorio
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G Sciorio
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to David Kieltyka, 9 months ago

David Kieltyka wrote:

I'm not convinced that future cameras will only shoot video, but I do expect it'll be the main thing they do. I'm totally cool with that. I love everything about 4k and have been doing my pic-taking over the past couple months with 4k display in mind. I've been shooting more video too.

IMO many folks are less than thrilled because Panasonic appears to be going in a direction that doesn't address their fixations. Measurbating, for example, doesn't provide the same kick when the pixel counts don't keep going up. Other folks fantasize about a camera with the E-M1's build quality & feature set but a US $700 price tag, and the GH4 clearly won't be that. Nor will anything else any time soon, of course... Still other folks are genuinely concerned that truly high-res electronic display will mostly kill off printing. How then can I justify my pixel obsession when I only need 9 million of 'em?! And lots of people, despite the fierce disruptive innovation in imaging over the past 15 years, just don't care much for change.

-Dave-

Yes most photographers don't care for change. They fought tooth and nail moving from analog to digital. The transition happened regardless. Same thing with still to hybrid. It's happening regardless of the few stodgy pros who think that photography should still be complicated and done only with large cameras.

The tide has turned to small and smart.

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G Sciorio
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Re: Getting a Grip on the 4K Video Conversation
In reply to Dheorl, 9 months ago

Dheorl wrote:

G Sciorio wrote:

There's seems to be some push back in this forum (and other enthusiast forums) about 4K video. I'm reading a lot of stuff like "it's not for me" which I can appreciate. The thing is that if your camera has a live view you're shooting video. You might only be shooting one frame at a time but it's video folks.

The launch of the GH4 allows 8megapixel recording at 30 frames per second AKA 4K.

I've been working with the camera for some time and can say that even with version 0.1 the files look amazing. Overall the camera is about twice as fast as the GH3 including AF tracking.

More so that the speed is that as with GH3 the GH4 allows photographers to shoot video like a photographer that freaken huge! So you don't have to do anything other than light, shoot stills and hit that little red button to make video clip that has the same look and feel as your stills.

Eventually cameras will only shoot video and you'll be pulling frames. You can do that right now with the GH3, as I do for editorial assignments, and with the GH4 the frames of video are printable and more importantly sellable.

I just don't see this happening. For starters do you have any idea how fast shooting 16MP RAW at 30fps will fill up a card? It will just be ridiculous. Not to mention the storage needed and the time spent flicking through all those photos trying to find the right one. I only really see it being used maybe by professional sports shooters.

I'm quite aware of the bandwidth. Memory cards, computers and software are catching up.

As an enthusiast with 4K you get more opportunities to express your creativity and for pros you get the added bonus of having new services to offer your clients and grow your business.

How does 4k give you more ways of expressing your creativity? I've seen some very cool techniques and effects for getting creative with video and only two of them (out of hundreds probably) was resolution dependant, and even those are used as crutches for when you can't afford/carry the proper equipment for the job.

Well for one you can make your photography move. Video does not have to mean filmmaking or even short videos. It can be an animated portrait. It can mean when you're shooting a bird, child or any other subject that moves fast to be able to pull the perfect frame. It can be anything you want it to be if you apply your creative brain to it.

For people to say 4K is not for them is not seeing the forest for the trees. That mentality can be safe if you're an enthusiast but pros that bypass 4K might be looking for a new career before too long.

Really? Because clients are clearly going to pay double as much for 4k footage. In 5 years time maybe, but not now.

I've grown my business significantly in a down economy when other pros complain that their business is shrinking. Yes now. In 5 years it will be common place and we'll be talking about 8K and people will be saying" 4K is great I don't need 8K" then you'll shoot 8K and want it.

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zackiedawg
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Re: Video replays says you are wrong
In reply to Lab D, 9 months ago

Lab D wrote:

zackiedawg wrote:

From a purely professional standpoint, I can understand the argument that anything that removes chance from the equation, and guarantees capture of a precise moment no matter the skill of the photographer by shooting video and allowing the perfect moment to simply be pulled out after the fact...

Every minute it seems a video replay changes an important play in sports, catches a bad guy in the act, or captures a special unforeseen moment. More major or minor event are posted on YouTube these days than ever were caught on stills because it is so easy. Think all the pcitures we ended up with of the Boston terrorists.

Unquestionably...but those are video-centric mediums - sports VIDEO, YouTube (video)...even the stills captured from video of the Boston terrorists which could be considered analysis of surveillance via consumer video.  I don't argue the value of pulling stills from video - I argue the JOY of it, or lack thereof, for those of us who enjoy the challenge of capturing a still moment.  For those who like video, 4K sounds great.  For those who have no interest in video, the prospect of using high-res video in place of skill, timing, practice, and pure joy...just doesn't sound desirable or interesting.

I'm not arguing against the existence or use of 4K, just in defense of still photography remaining still photography - always a capture of a single fleeting moment rather than a continuous stream of moments.

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Sean Nelson
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Re: You SHOULD be interested.
In reply to Lab D, 9 months ago

Lab D wrote:

In a few years many people will have 4k TVs and computer screens. Years after that 8K will be a standard. Do you really want to pull out the crappy 1080p footage (and no ILC shoots actual 1080p resolution) for you kids to see?

There's a reason why consumer laser printers stopped at 1200dpi for black and white and 2400dpi for colour.   The technology is available to to a lot more, but there isn't any demand for it because people can't see the improvement.

2K video is good enough for most people's needs.   I think 4K video has a chance of catching on, but 2K material is going to look reasonably decent even on 4K displays.    And I can't see 8K gaining a lot of traction in the marketplace unless people get used to their displays taking up the entire wall.

I may be missing some radical new trend such as a mass switch to head-mounted goggles that give you a 180 degree field of view, but for traditional display technology I think 4K is pretty much at or beyond the limits of what the market wants.

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