Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7

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optoms
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Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7
10 months ago

Just a comparison for those interested to know how "huge" or "small" the new zoom lens for A7.

Not much diff.

Front view. Difference filter size. 62 vs 67

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Richt2000
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Re: Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

Thats impressive considering the sensor area is nearly 4 times the size!

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forpetessake
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apples and oranges
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

Olympus is one stop dimmer, it's equivalent to 24-80mm f/5.6 on FF. And the weight and price, all other things being equal, is growing as f^2 to f^3. So, by that metrics, Olympus is way too heavy and too overpriced.

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bluevellet
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to forpetessake, 10 months ago

forpetessake wrote:

Olympus is one stop dimmer, it's equivalent to 24-80mm f/5.6 on FF. And the weight and price, all other things being equal, is growing as f^2 to f^3. So, by that metrics, Olympus is way too heavy and too overpriced.

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Better optics for the sensor though. Fewer flaws and fewer people complaining about what they're paying for. Not quite the same story with those FE zooms so far. I'm still curious to see what happens when you attach that F4 zoom lens on a regular APS-C body, the results will be probably even worse if it follows the same pattern as the FE primes.

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optoms
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to bluevellet, 10 months ago

bluevellet wrote:

forpetessake wrote:

Olympus is one stop dimmer, it's equivalent to 24-80mm f/5.6 on FF. And the weight and price, all other things being equal, is growing as f^2 to f^3. So, by that metrics, Olympus is way too heavy and too overpriced.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter -- Winston Churchill

Better optics for the sensor though. Fewer flaws and fewer people complaining about what they're paying for. Not quite the same story with those FE zooms so far. I'm still curious to see what happens when you attach that F4 zoom lens on a regular APS-C body, the results will be probably even worse if it follows the same pattern as the FE primes.

I have not compare the image yet. But im guessing olympus one should be a better optic then sony zeiss as review arent that fantastic. i am surprised as well with the size of the FE lens But then olympus is f2.8 and longer at the end and it come with a manuel focusing system.

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Clayton1985
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to bluevellet, 10 months ago

bluevellet wrote:

Better optics for the sensor though.

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Emacs23
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

optoms wrote:

bluevellet wrote:

forpetessake wrote:

Olympus is one stop dimmer, it's equivalent to 24-80mm f/5.6 on FF. And the weight and price, all other things being equal, is growing as f^2 to f^3. So, by that metrics, Olympus is way too heavy and too overpriced.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter -- Winston Churchill

Better optics for the sensor though. Fewer flaws and fewer people complaining about what they're paying for. Not quite the same story with those FE zooms so far. I'm still curious to see what happens when you attach that F4 zoom lens on a regular APS-C body, the results will be probably even worse if it follows the same pattern as the FE primes.

I have not compare the image yet. But im guessing olympus one should be a better optic then sony zeiss as review arent that fantastic. i am surprised as well with the size of the FE lens But then olympus is f2.8 and longer at the end and it come with a manuel focusing system.

I bet 24-70 is better. Larger sensor — easier to design.

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Dennis
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to Emacs23, 10 months ago

Emacs23 wrote:

I bet 24-70 is better. Larger sensor — easier to design.

Since when ?

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NumberOne
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to bluevellet, 10 months ago

bluevellet wrote:

forpetessake wrote:

Olympus is one stop dimmer, it's equivalent to 24-80mm f/5.6 on FF. And the weight and price, all other things being equal, is growing as f^2 to f^3. So, by that metrics, Olympus is way too heavy and too overpriced.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter -- Winston Churchill

Better optics for the sensor though. Fewer flaws and fewer people complaining about what they're paying for. Not quite the same story with those FE zooms so far.

Don't know where you read this - Even on the MFT forums there are complaints and issues with the 12-40...

Taking the FE kit zoom lens, out of the equation, I've only seen people complaining about the FE prices, not their IQ - I guess, we've been reading different articles and reports...

I'm still curious to see what happens when you attach that F4 zoom lens on a regular APS-C body, the results will be probably even worse if it follows the same pattern as the FE primes.

So, you mount a FF lens on an APS-C body/sensor and if things don't work the best, it's the lens fault?! 

Best regards,
Pedro

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NumberOne
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Re: Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

optoms wrote:

Just a comparison for those interested to know how "huge" or "small" the new zoom lens for A7.

Not much diff.

Front view. Difference filter size. 62 vs 67

Good you posted these images...

There are some who have problems understanding the respective "specs" regarding size and weight, not to mention the implications of being for MFT or FF - Maybe now, at least for size/bulkiness, seeing is believing...

Best regards,
Pedro

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ijustloveshooting
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how genius A7 series are..
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

once again surprised to see how little package A series are,,,,

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edwardaneal
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Re: Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

it would be a better comparison if you didn't have the lens hood reversed on one lens and no hood on the other - I would suspect the lens would look smaller without the hood.

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KwhyChang
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Re: Size comparison of FE 4/2470 on A7 vs Olympus 12-40 f2.8 on GX7
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

Thanks for posting this. Still waiting for my 24-70.

Love my µ4/3 gear, and use it mostly. But I want it small so I use mostly the primes.

I didn't go for the fast zooms... I use the 14-140 and 100-300 occasionally. Do you have either of those? I'd be interested in see one of those side by side with the 24-70.

Nonetheless, thanks again for posting.

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viking79
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to Dennis, 10 months ago

Dennis wrote:

Emacs23 wrote:

I bet 24-70 is better. Larger sensor — easier to design.

Since when ?

A7 has 4000 pixel high image and 24mm page height, or 2000 line pair high image and 24mm = 83 LP/mm.

E-M1 has 3456 and 13mm page height, or 133 lp/mm requirement.

Which do you think is harder to design a lens for? A sensor that requires 133 lp/mm or 83 lp/mm? Even A7R has only 103 lp/mm requirement.

To look at this another way, pretend I wanted to get a "16 MP" image out of the camera.  For the E-M1 that would require 133 lp/mm, but a lens with only 68 lp/mm would be fine on A7 or A7R.  This is very low and easy to design, where 133 lp/mm is getting exceedingly difficult and expensive.

Eric

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joe6pack
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to viking79, 10 months ago

viking79 wrote:

Dennis wrote:

Emacs23 wrote:

I bet 24-70 is better. Larger sensor — easier to design.

Since when ?

A7 has 4000 pixel high image and 24mm page height, or 2000 line pair high image and 24mm = 83 LP/mm.

E-M1 has 3456 and 13mm page height, or 133 lp/mm requirement.

Which do you think is harder to design a lens for? A sensor that requires 133 lp/mm or 83 lp/mm? Even A7R has only 103 lp/mm requirement.

To look at this another way, pretend I wanted to get a "16 MP" image out of the camera. For the E-M1 that would require 133 lp/mm, but a lens with only 68 lp/mm would be fine on A7 or A7R. This is very low and easy to design, where 133 lp/mm is getting exceedingly difficult and expensive.

Eric

Seems to me 68 and 133 difference is just 1 stop. Which is offset by the f-stop difference between F2.8 and F4. And then the Olympus has longer reach. Seems to me Olympus wins here.

Ease of design also needs to take into account the coverage area. All things including aperture being equal, it is easier to design a lens for a smaller sensor too.

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Lab D
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Why compare the larger M43 lens and not the one with the same range?
In reply to optoms, 10 months ago

Maybe it is what you had on hand. FYI, The Panasonic would be a better lens to compare since it is also only 24-70mm and does not have the optics for a close up lens as the Sony doesn't either. You will find the Panasonic is smaller than the Olympus, but maybe that was not your point (since you left the hood one the Olympus).

As for understanding exposure think of lens apertures like this. A fat lady and a thin lady are laying on the beach. Who will get sun burnt faster? Answer: both will burn/tan the same despite the fat lady having 4x the skin area.

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Dennis
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Re: apples and oranges
In reply to viking79, 10 months ago

viking79 wrote:

Dennis wrote:

Emacs23 wrote:

I bet 24-70 is better. Larger sensor — easier to design.

Since when ?

To look at this another way, pretend I wanted to get a "16 MP" image out of the camera. For the E-M1 that would require 133 lp/mm, but a lens with only 68 lp/mm would be fine on A7 or A7R. This is very low and easy to design, where 133 lp/mm is getting exceedingly difficult and expensive.

OK, so you're saying that it's easier because it doesn't have to be as good. I've always looked at it slightly differently: that it's harder to make a sharp, distortion-free lens for a larger sensor, but it's ok that they're not as sharp because the larger sensor is less demanding.

As far as comparing the two formats, I would never expect for a moment that the m43 combo would approach the FF combo for resolution. I expect resolutions of sensors of all sizes to increase over time. m43 is at 16MP now, but will be at 36MP in 5 years. FF is at 36MP now; maybe 72MP in 5 years. Makers of both lenses are trying to eke out sharpness.

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Lab D
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Here is a real comparison
In reply to edwardaneal, 10 months ago

edwardaneal wrote:

it would be a better comparison if you didn't have the lens hood reversed on one lens and no hood on the other - I would suspect the lens would look smaller without the hood.

I may get flamed for this, but this is a better/fair comparison of 2 lenses with the same range and no lens hoods to make one look bigger.

http://camerasize.com/compact/#487.393,289.336,ha,t

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blue_skies
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Re: Why compare the larger M43 lens and not the one with the same range?
In reply to Lab D, 10 months ago

Lab D wrote:

Maybe it is what you had on hand. FYI, The Panasonic would be a better lens to compare since it is also only 24-70mm and does not have the optics for a close up lens as the Sony doesn't either. You will find the Panasonic is smaller than the Olympus, but maybe that was not your point.

As for understanding exposure think of lens apertures like this. A fat lady and a thin lady are laying on the beach. Who will get sun burnt faster? Answer: both will burn/tan the same despite the fat lady having 4x the skin area.

You are addressing aperture, not sensor. The fat lady and the thin lady receive the same amount of light rays on each of their skin cells.

But the fat lady has larger skin cells, that can pick up low ray levels easier than the thin lady, so the absorption rate will differ (same amount of light, different noise levels).

In fact, on a 4x sensor, you are two stops apart from one another for similar noise levels. This is like putting sunscreen on the thin lady - she'll never tan as neatly as the fat lady.

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Cheers,
Henry

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Dennis
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Re: Why compare the larger M43 lens and not the one with the same range?
In reply to Lab D, 10 months ago

Lab D wrote:

As for understanding exposure think of lens apertures like this. A fat lady and a thin lady are laying on the beach. Who will get sun burnt faster? Answer: both will burn/tan the same despite the fat lady having 4x the skin area.

Why ?

Why think of exposure like that ?

You don't set your exposure settings to any arbitrary value that gets you sunburned. You set them to get the best compromise between depth of field, motion effects and noise.

"f/2.8 is f/2.8" as many like to parrot, but if it results in different photos, who cares ?

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