X-trans is a winner

Started Jan 27, 2014 | Discussions
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marco1974
marco1974 Senior Member • Posts: 1,588
X-trans is a winner
3

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

Fujifilm official sample image for the new XF 56/1.2 at f/5.6

Marco

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Macintosh Sauce
Macintosh Sauce Contributing Member • Posts: 704
Re: X-trans is a winner

Nice!

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vkphoto
vkphoto Senior Member • Posts: 1,632
Re: X-trans is a winner

Hi Marco,

very nice!

Couple quick questions:

Did you post process raw in ACR(LR)?

Do you think that image is more prone to moire at large aperture settings (f/1.2-2.0)?

Thanks,

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BillyInya
BillyInya Senior Member • Posts: 1,453
Re: X-trans is a winner

marco1974 wrote:

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

Fujifilm official sample image for the new XF 56/1.2 at f/5.6

Marco

Yep, and one of the reasons the new X-T1 *could* fill the shoes of the famous S5 Pro (and to a lesser extent the S3 Pro) as a superb tool for weddings. I'm not convinced Fuji are even aiming at that with the X-T1 but it will be interesting to see how it stacks up.

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meagre offerings
meagre offerings Senior Member • Posts: 4,812
Re: X-trans is a winner
18

Hi Marco,

very nice!

Couple quick questions:

Did you post process raw in ACR(LR)?

Do you think that image is more prone to moire at large aperture settings (f/1.2-2.0)?

Thanks,

-- hide signature --

This is a official fujifilm promotional shot, which Marco also posted on the Leica forum trying to start a flaming war by telling them that no Leica could take a shot like this without falling into a hell of moire. He also conveniently forgot to mention it was a fujifilm promotional shot, and sadly for Marco, they didn't rise to his childish attempts at trolling.

Best

Pc
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also ex secretary/treasurer and only member of the `lesser leica owners club`.

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unknown member
(unknown member) Regular Member • Posts: 362
Re: X-trans is a winner
2

Hi Marco,

very nice!

Couple quick questions:

Did you post process raw in ACR(LR)?

Do you think that image is more prone to moire at large aperture settings (f/1.2-2.0)?

Thanks,

-- hide signature --

This is a official fujifilm promotional shot, which Marco also posted on the Leica forum trying to start a flaming war by telling them that no Leica could take a shot like this without falling into a hell of moire. He also conveniently forgot to mention it was a fujifilm promotional shot, and sadly for Marco, they didn't rise to his childish attempts at trolling.

Best

Pc
--
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also ex secretary/treasurer and only member of the `lesser leica owners club`.

Here is the original photographer if anyone is interested

http://www.laroquephoto.com/blog/2014/1/20/the-razors-edge-p2-sessions

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Brad Evans
Brad Evans Contributing Member • Posts: 616
Re: shrug...
4

marco1974 wrote:

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

Fujifilm official sample image for the new XF 56/1.2 at f/5.6

Marco

As much as I like my Fuji cam, I have several non-Fuji cameras (and lens) that could capture that shot at the same or better level of quality and without moiré...

............
Brad
Urban photoblog: http://www.citysnaps.net
.

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The Davinator
The Davinator Forum Pro • Posts: 16,414
LOL
13

Don't get me wrong....I love e Xtrans sensor.  But at f9, no sensor will have moire.

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DonSantos
DonSantos Senior Member • Posts: 1,145
Re: LOL
1

Dave Luttmann wrote:

Don't get me wrong....I love e Xtrans sensor. But at f9, no sensor will have moire.

How do you figure?

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Randy Benter
Randy Benter Veteran Member • Posts: 3,145
Re: X-trans is a winner
9

marco1974 wrote:

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

I think you might have misunderstood the info regarding X-Trans and moire. I have seen just as much moire in X-Trans cameras as in the average Bayer camera. The 2 cameras simply deal with moire in different ways; one with an irregular CFA pattern and the other with an AA filter. Both methods reduce moire, but neither completely eliminates it. We will never know how a Bayer camera would have handled this image, but a Bayer camera with AA filter likely would not have had a problem with it.

It is OK if you did not understand this before you posted. At least you didn't troll-post this same thing in the Leica and Nikon forums; that would have been embarrassing...oh wait...

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The Davinator
The Davinator Forum Pro • Posts: 16,414
Re: LOL
5

DonSantos wrote:

Dave Luttmann wrote:

Don't get me wrong....I love e Xtrans sensor. But at f9, no sensor will have moire.

How do you figure?

Diffraction lessens moire.  Diffraction with aps-c starts at f7.1

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afragisk
afragisk Senior Member • Posts: 1,290
Re: X-trans is a winner

marco1974 wrote:

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

I think you might have misunderstood the info regarding X-Trans and moire. I have seen just as much moire in X-Trans cameras as in the average Bayer camera. The 2 cameras simply deal with moire in different ways; one with an irregular CFA pattern and the other with an AA filter. Both methods reduce moire, but neither completely eliminates it. We will never know how a Bayer camera would have handled this image, but a Bayer camera with AA filter likely would not have had a problem with it.

It is OK if you did not understand this before you posted. At least you didn't troll-post this same thing in the Leica and Nikon forums; that would have been embarrassing...oh wait...

That's so funny:)))
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Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: LOL
2

Dave Luttmann wrote:

DonSantos wrote:

Dave Luttmann wrote:

Don't get me wrong....I love e Xtrans sensor. But at f9, no sensor will have moire.

How do you figure?

Diffraction lessens moire. Diffraction with aps-c starts at f7.1

That's an incredibly shallow understanding, and "at f9, no sensor will have moire" is completely wrong.

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Shawn67
Shawn67 Senior Member • Posts: 1,050
Re: X-trans is a winner
8

OK... but there is moire in that image....

Shawn

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The Davinator
The Davinator Forum Pro • Posts: 16,414
Re: LOL
6

Zardoz wrote:

Dave Luttmann wrote:

DonSantos wrote:

Dave Luttmann wrote:

Don't get me wrong....I love e Xtrans sensor. But at f9, no sensor will have moire.

How do you figure?

Diffraction lessens moire. Diffraction with aps-c starts at f7.1

That's an incredibly shallow understanding, and "at f9, no sensor will have moire" is completely wrong.

At f9, an aps-c  will have any moire reduced by 40%.  Do t tell me what my understanding level is  Mr webexpert.

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Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: LOL

Dave Luttmann wrote:

At f9, an aps-c will have any moire reduced by 40%. Do t tell me what my understanding level is Mr webexpert.

True.  I think you're doing a great job of demonstrating (the lack of) it yourself.

And where, might I ask, did you pull that 40% number from?

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Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: X-trans is a winner
2

There's plenty of luminance moire to be found, too.  What a silly thread.

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Chris Dodkin
Chris Dodkin MOD Veteran Member • Posts: 6,715
Just a reminder - play nicely in the sandpit please
2
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The future is just a click away...

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ghohan422
ghohan422 Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: X-trans is a winner

marco1974 wrote:

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

Marco

Part of the problem is that it's currently fashionable to have weak or non-existent AA filters on enthusiast/professional cameras. So most camera makers are doing it, ignoring the fact that the AA filters were originally there for a reason.

You can have high frequencies present in your image + some artifacts, or you can have a softer image that is (relatively) free from artifacts.

That's true for the x-trans sensor too, although it does seem to do a pretty good job limiting moiré!

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unknown member
(unknown member) Veteran Member • Posts: 3,441
Re: X-trans is a winner

Try this with a Bayer sensor and find yourself in moiré hell:

Post the RAW File from this Photo...

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