It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to herbymel, 7 months ago

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

As far as pure sharpness is concerned the lens Iain is shooting with is no slouch.

Agreed.

But,respectfully, he has to get a whole lot closer for the same shot.

With the birds he's shooting that's a whole lot easier...some of those birds will come within feet of you if given the chance.

So what lens would you have for bird photography if offered?

600mm f4 VR or 70-200 f4 ?

Yes, me too.

solely depended on what I was shooting and how far away they were...if I was shooting what Iain was and how he shoots. He'd look a little ridiculous on his walks through the park with the 600mm strapped to him. Given the distance...the 600mm would be an entire waste of time...wouldn't even be able to acquire focus...given my own shooting...I don't bother with birds like that. No interest, not really much for ducks either. I will take and am saving for a 500mm, but I also have a 300mm and a 80-200...it's not the size of the lens, when you use it, and the conditions that you use it in. Personally I'd also like the 70-200 and am considering that as a purchase down the line as well. I like the 80-200, but don't use it as much because what I shoot is usually further away and more challenging. It also doesn't have VR and as I get older I find I could use it.

I've owned or own all the lenses you mentioned.  I still own the 70-200 VR1 but its front focusing badly and need to send it in.  Its about 7 years old.  The 80-200 afs f2.8 was a great lens but no VR thats why I purchased the 70-200 f2.8 VR.  The 300 f4 AFS is a fine lens as I had argued with others when Rudy was ready to purchase.  The 300 VR 1 is one of  my favorite lenses of all time.  The 600mm was purchased because the 300 VR with TC didn't have enough reach and the 500 would of need the TC often where the 600mm for a couple more grand does not need the TC's nearly as often.  I also owned a few lenses you didn't mention one being the original 80-400mm non vr non AFS lens yuck.

My first love with photography was landscapes and for some reason I fell in love with Birding about 10 years ago or more I don't even remember.  Its very challenging in everyway and very rewarding as well.  Good luck with your next lens!

Cheers,

Ray

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Shunda77
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Tusk24, 7 months ago

Tusk24 wrote:

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

I've gotten far sharper results than with my 55-300, now that really is David and Goliath.

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to wildlifr, 7 months ago

wildlifr wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Back in the dog house you go never to leave again.

Ray

Did the same thing a few weeks ago. I don't anticipate changing my mind. Very sharp shots, BTW.

Yep you can't argue with stupid.:)

Cheers mate,

Ray

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Brev00
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Humanoid, 7 months ago

Humanoid wrote:

Brev00 wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

JimPearce wrote:

Excellent colour and detail Ray. Who won?

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Jim

Hi Jim,

Guess nobody appreciates me over here in "kiddy land". I suppose I should shoot more Zoo type images and post them here. Its only a rumor, but I hear zoo critters don't runaway and you can snap until you get it right.:)

I don't understand the reason for this comment. If it is for a lack of response to these images, they have only been up for a short while. Give us some time to view. I actually saw your report in the full frame forum first and was interested in opening the dx version. No need for the condescension. I think many people are interested and, sometimes, open a thread without commenting. That does not mean that the images do not have impact. As far as I know, there is no record of thread views. Maybe there is some other meaning to the above comment. Until you say, I am going to go to my backyard where I am taking pics of a chained goose.

I was replying to Jim with the quote as he had stated a few days ago nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.

Ray

Yes, yes, a reply to Jim. I was interrupting your conversation but just to ask what you were talking about.  You do realize that your post was not private.  I can only respond to the words on my screen and they don't seem too positive about the DX Forum.  I could be misinterpreting.   And, how on earth can you see my bunched panties? The NSA has gone too far.

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Shunda77, 7 months ago

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Hi Shunda,

At least he didn't say my exposures were off:)

peace,

Ray

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to herbymel, 7 months ago

herbymel wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

JimPearce wrote:

Excellent colour and detail Ray. Who won?

-- hide signature --

Jim

Hi Jim,

Guess nobody appreciates me over here in "kiddy land". I suppose I should shoot more Zoo type images and post them here. Its only a rumor, but I hear zoo critters don't runaway and you can snap until you get it right.:)

The D7100 held up nicely in my shootout and still impresses, even shot at a higher ISO to stack the deck against it.

The level of detail with the D800e is noticeable.:) The lack of the crop factor hasn't really been an issue yet with the 600mm lens.

The D7100 color seems more robust/richer over the D800e with the same settings, but the auto WB of the D800e is slightly better. I may go back to shooting auto wb.

I have a few decent images with the TC14eII, but not quite dialed in with it yet. I'll post a pic below. I think I'm going to send the D800e in to Nikon to maximize the sharpness like I have with the D7100, as I feel I'm in between adjustments.

The thin dof with the D800e is the worst part and requires images that would be F7.1 with the D7100 to be around F9 with the D800e.

The ISO of the D800e is real nice and whats not to love about the crop factor.:)

Shot on a monopod and mh-01 pro head.

Ray

I understand what you mean with fighting the DOF...been having my own joy with the 1.4 lousy light on the 300 f4 trying to shoot eagles lately on the D800...Today was the first day that the light was decent, but I still don't have things quite dialed back in since I got it back from Nikon. I'm not sure if it came back better or worse from when Nikon had it.

I know what you mean.  When I sent the D7100 in they adjust the focus but I still had quite a bit of backfoucus -7 on the 600mm for instance. They did adjust the focus so I could at least fine tune it and get decent images. Or what I consider to be decent lol.

How does live view images compare to a normal phase detect image?  If live view is stellar you should be able to af fine tune your rig to be very close to the live view image.  If live view images or contrast detect focus is not sharp then you will have to send it back to Nikon.  Stick with it and best of luck!

Ray

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herbymel
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Humanoid, 7 months ago

Humanoid wrote:

solely depended on what I was shooting and how far away they were...if I was shooting what Iain was and how he shoots. He'd look a little ridiculous on his walks through the park with the 600mm strapped to him. Given the distance...the 600mm would be an entire waste of time...wouldn't even be able to acquire focus...given my own shooting...I don't bother with birds like that. No interest, not really much for ducks either. I will take and am saving for a 500mm, but I also have a 300mm and a 80-200...it's not the size of the lens, when you use it, and the conditions that you use it in. Personally I'd also like the 70-200 and am considering that as a purchase down the line as well. I like the 80-200, but don't use it as much because what I shoot is usually further away and more challenging. It also doesn't have VR and as I get older I find I could use it.

I've owned or own all the lenses you mentioned. I still own the 70-200 VR1 but its front focusing badly and need to send it in. Its about 7 years old. The 80-200 afs f2.8 was a great lens but no VR thats why I purchased the 70-200 f2.8 VR. The 300 f4 AFS is a fine lens as I had argued with others when Rudy was ready to purchase. The 300 VR 1 is one of my favorite lenses of all time. The 600mm was purchased because the 300 VR with TC didn't have enough reach and the 500 would of need the TC often where the 600mm for a couple more grand does not need the TC's nearly as often. I also owned a few lenses you didn't mention one being the original 80-400mm non vr non AFS lens yuck.

My first love with photography was landscapes and for some reason I fell in love with Birding about 10 years ago or more I don't even remember. Its very challenging in everyway and very rewarding as well. Good luck with your next lens!

Cheers,

Ray

Thanks Ray

I shoot with someone who has the original 80-400...the new one is interesting though...in a pinch I think I could handhold the 500 for a bit, the 600 I'm not too sure, and getting the extra couple grand to get to the 500 is getting to be a stretch at the moment...hopefully by the summer. For the most part I am happy with the 300 F4, but lose too much light when I strap on the 1.4. I did sell my old manual focus 300 2.8 to get part of the way there. Was my sports lens for the newspaper...talk about fun in getting action shots My main interest in wildlife is larger mammals, but eagles, owls and other large birds are of interest and good practice.

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Tusk24
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Shunda77, 7 months ago

Shunda77 wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

I've gotten far sharper results than with my 55-300, now that really is David and Goliath.

Was just turning off the computer when I saw your late response Shunda, so you've gotten better results with your 55-300mm lens?

What's that wide open at 300mm, 1.8 (5.6)?

Yeah, in your dreams.

Goodnight and respect to all photographers who see, and bless them.

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Tusk24, 7 months ago

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

Here we go.  Do you really think it takes an exotic lens to have sharp images?  I'll tell you it does not, however, the more expensive lenses do help when you need the reach because they are longer.:)   Other than that it comes down to the photographer and their skill level.

Shooting at 300mm and adding converters  would be considered the minumum for birding/wildlife and I have been there for 7 years before upgrading to the 600mm a couple years ago. I appreciate well exposed sharp images from anyone who posts them with whatever gear they use.

I've earned my way to the heavy, back breaking, leg numbing 600mm VR lens and love it lol.  I hope someday you can enjoy it, as much as I do.:)

Being able to fill the frame is a beautiful thing!

peace,

Ray

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to herbymel, 7 months ago

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

As far as pure sharpness is concerned the lens Iain is shooting with is no slouch.

Agreed!

Ray

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Tusk24, 7 months ago

Tusk24 wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

As far as pure sharpness is concerned the lens Iain is shooting with is no slouch.

Agreed.

But,respectfully, he has to get a whole lot closer for the same shot.

This is very true and I've been there believe me.  The minimum should be 300mm with converters for birding and the 300mm f4 AFS can open up another world for many, but there is a learning curve.  I have nothing but praise for that lens its the best bang for the buck.

The 70-200 f4 or VR is not enough even with a converter on the later mentioned VR lens.  I know because I own it. You can still have great fun with it and getting close to the subject may require a photo blind.  The 70-300 does not appear to be that sharp at the long end and forget converters with it.  As Nikon shooters we only have the AFS and non AFS 300mm lenses to choose from and with TC's they are adequate. I  just recently sold my 300 afs f4 to help finance a camera purchase.  I did enjoy that lens and the ability to get very close to the subject.

cheers,

Ray

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to herbymel, 7 months ago

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

Gee whiz Iain, I think ole ray is doing a bit better with the D7100 than you have been, I'm still trying to figure out how you got such noisy soft ISO 360 shots.

These ducks are superbly sharp and detailed.

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

As far as pure sharpness is concerned the lens Iain is shooting with is no slouch.

Agreed.

But,respectfully, he has to get a whole lot closer for the same shot.

With the birds he's shooting that's a whole lot easier...some of those birds will come within feet of you if given the chance.

Yeppers just have to sit on the duff for a while and they will come to you.:)

Ray

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Shunda77
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Tusk24, 7 months ago

Tusk24 wrote:

Shunda77 wrote:

Tusk24 wrote:

Perhaps the ducks ought to be superbly sharp with a monster lens like the 600mm VR.

Talk about David and Goliath.

I've gotten far sharper results than with my 55-300, now that really is David and Goliath.

Was just turning off the computer when I saw your late response Shunda, so you've gotten better results with your 55-300mm lens?

Yes, Much better than what Iain posted on the other thread.

What's that wide open at 300mm, 1.8 (5.6)?

I get sharp results at 5.6 and excellent bokeh with this lens.

Yeah, in your dreams.

Well it's the reality, a sharp photograph is a sharp photograph end of story.

Goodnight and respect to all photographers who see, and bless them.

Sweet dreams.

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herbymel
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Humanoid, 7 months ago

Humanoid wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

JimPearce wrote:

Excellent colour and detail Ray. Who won?

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Jim

Hi Jim,

Guess nobody appreciates me over here in "kiddy land". I suppose I should shoot more Zoo type images and post them here. Its only a rumor, but I hear zoo critters don't runaway and you can snap until you get it right.:)

The D7100 held up nicely in my shootout and still impresses, even shot at a higher ISO to stack the deck against it.

The level of detail with the D800e is noticeable.:) The lack of the crop factor hasn't really been an issue yet with the 600mm lens.

The D7100 color seems more robust/richer over the D800e with the same settings, but the auto WB of the D800e is slightly better. I may go back to shooting auto wb.

I have a few decent images with the TC14eII, but not quite dialed in with it yet. I'll post a pic below. I think I'm going to send the D800e in to Nikon to maximize the sharpness like I have with the D7100, as I feel I'm in between adjustments.

The thin dof with the D800e is the worst part and requires images that would be F7.1 with the D7100 to be around F9 with the D800e.

The ISO of the D800e is real nice and whats not to love about the crop factor.:)

Shot on a monopod and mh-01 pro head.

Ray

I understand what you mean with fighting the DOF...been having my own joy with the 1.4 lousy light on the 300 f4 trying to shoot eagles lately on the D800...Today was the first day that the light was decent, but I still don't have things quite dialed back in since I got it back from Nikon. I'm not sure if it came back better or worse from when Nikon had it.

I know what you mean. When I sent the D7100 in they adjust the focus but I still had quite a bit of backfoucus -7 on the 600mm for instance. They did adjust the focus so I could at least fine tune it and get decent images. Or what I consider to be decent lol.

How does live view images compare to a normal phase detect image? If live view is stellar you should be able to af fine tune your rig to be very close to the live view image. If live view images or contrast detect focus is not sharp then you will have to send it back to Nikon. Stick with it and best of luck!

Ray

It's getting there...thought I had all my camera settings back to what I normally have them at and then realized that it was still on AFS, instead of 9pt AFC..so wasn't where I normally would be...not sure how this one compares with some of the others I got, but it's one I did some work on so far.

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Stacey_K
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Humanoid, 7 months ago

Humanoid wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

You know Ian, I just pulled you out of my ignore list, but gladly will place your back in there. Don't tell me what or when to post sheesh what a silly person you must be. Your better off learning how to use a camera instead of slaming people that do. Back in the dog house you go never to leave again.

Ray

What's comical is this Iain guy posted some bird shots the other day, I'm sure he feels were  "composition masterpieces", but were simply a bird with blurry sticks around it.

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to herbymel, 7 months ago

herbymel wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

herbymel wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

JimPearce wrote:

Excellent colour and detail Ray. Who won?

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Jim

Hi Jim,

Guess nobody appreciates me over here in "kiddy land". I suppose I should shoot more Zoo type images and post them here. Its only a rumor, but I hear zoo critters don't runaway and you can snap until you get it right.:)

The D7100 held up nicely in my shootout and still impresses, even shot at a higher ISO to stack the deck against it.

The level of detail with the D800e is noticeable.:) The lack of the crop factor hasn't really been an issue yet with the 600mm lens.

The D7100 color seems more robust/richer over the D800e with the same settings, but the auto WB of the D800e is slightly better. I may go back to shooting auto wb.

I have a few decent images with the TC14eII, but not quite dialed in with it yet. I'll post a pic below. I think I'm going to send the D800e in to Nikon to maximize the sharpness like I have with the D7100, as I feel I'm in between adjustments.

The thin dof with the D800e is the worst part and requires images that would be F7.1 with the D7100 to be around F9 with the D800e.

The ISO of the D800e is real nice and whats not to love about the crop factor.:)

Shot on a monopod and mh-01 pro head.

Ray

I understand what you mean with fighting the DOF...been having my own joy with the 1.4 lousy light on the 300 f4 trying to shoot eagles lately on the D800...Today was the first day that the light was decent, but I still don't have things quite dialed back in since I got it back from Nikon. I'm not sure if it came back better or worse from when Nikon had it.

I know what you mean. When I sent the D7100 in they adjust the focus but I still had quite a bit of backfoucus -7 on the 600mm for instance. They did adjust the focus so I could at least fine tune it and get decent images. Or what I consider to be decent lol.

How does live view images compare to a normal phase detect image? If live view is stellar you should be able to af fine tune your rig to be very close to the live view image. If live view images or contrast detect focus is not sharp then you will have to send it back to Nikon. Stick with it and best of luck!

Ray

It's getting there...thought I had all my camera settings back to what I normally have them at and then realized that it was still on AFS, instead of 9pt AFC..so wasn't where I normally would be...not sure how this one compares with some of the others I got, but it's one I did some work on so far.

That shot looks nice and sharp!  I would say single area worked out well on this shot.  Looks like he just entered the shade and you almost got him with the sun on his face.   Terrific shooting!

Ray

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Humanoid
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Re: It aint over until the duck quacks:) D7100
In reply to Stacey_K, 7 months ago

Stacey_K wrote:

Humanoid wrote:

Iain G Foulds wrote:

... Ray: I would gently offer that the art of photography is the consideration of the composition as a whole, and not merely pointing a camera and taking sharp pictures of things.

... In the world, there are trillions of sharp duck photos. It is the context and and compliment of the background and foreground which separates and distinguishes.

... Hey, don't post photos if you are only looking for compliments.

You know Ian, I just pulled you out of my ignore list, but gladly will place your back in there. Don't tell me what or when to post sheesh what a silly person you must be. Your better off learning how to use a camera instead of slaming people that do. Back in the dog house you go never to leave again.

Ray

What's comical is this Iain guy posted some bird shots the other day, I'm sure he feels were "composition masterpieces", but were simply a bird with blurry sticks around it.

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Stacey

LOL Stacey you made me slurp my coffee thanks for the laugh so early in the morning:)  I'm going to see if I can get some sharp images of sticks with blurry birds around them:)

peace,

Ray

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