Fuji X-E2 image problems

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Fuji X-E2 image problems
9 months ago

Testing my X-E2 this weekend, and I have a couple of issues.

1) JPEGs overall soften human skin far too much, this is reported to be an issue with the X100s so it could possibly be due to face detection, but even on NR -2 it is too much - everyone looks like they have been retouched. However the real issue comes at ISO 6400 which just obliterates all detail - this must be a bug because it is incredibly unsightly. Non-people photos are fine.

2) An even bigger issue, though perhaps not Fujis fault - Lightroom 5.3 (final beta) is showing some very bad magenta shadows on a LOT of photos - again mainly faces for some reason.

Attached a 100% crop showing this on a forehead

And again in another photo - look at the eyes and nose.

3) Raw files of people all tend to boost saturation in the eyes and lips which is odd, everyone looks like they have lipstick on.

It is a shame because the camera is good, and focus is perfectly fine now; but these are big issues. I really do not know whether to return it or not...

Fujifilm X100S Fujifilm X-E2
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PGR streetshooter
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

Have you loaded the new profile in LR ? Do you use LR or what? Your exposures all look ok so my thoughts are PP work. Maybe try to do a conversion in camera.

Search out Rico, he's the guy that can figure things out and he's had the camera longer than most.

BTW...there's nothing wrong at all with anything on the XE1.
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to PGR streetshooter, 9 months ago

Have you loaded the new profile in LR ? Do you use LR or what? Your exposures all look ok so my thoughts are PP work. Maybe try to do a conversion in camera.

Search out Rico, he's the guy that can figure things out and he's had the camera longer than most.

BTW...there's nothing wrong at all with anything on the XE1.
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None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

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Jeff Charles
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

The few LR 5.2 RC samples in Rico's Flickr X-E2 set look fine. The one of the woman holding the cat does not show the discoloration you are getting.

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CraigArnold
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Also 100% crops from ISO 6400 in horrible tungsten or mixed light and you don't like the color? Good grief!

The problem here is not inside the camera, it is behind it.

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Al Valentino
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to CraigArnold, 9 months ago

CraigArnold wrote:

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Exactly. You are judging the camera based on the defaults of a beta version of a RAW converter that is often considered the poorest for X-trans in general. Perhaps best to start with jpegs processed with the camera's jpeg engine using appropriate WB adjustments.

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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to CraigArnold, 9 months ago

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Also 100% crops from ISO 6400 in horrible tungsten or mixed light and you don't like the color? Good grief!

The problem here is not inside the camera, it is behind it.

-- hide signature --

Blog ------------------------ http://craigspics.net/?tag=blog
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The jpeg issue is the level of noise reduction, not color.

Raw files should not give people purple faces.

These are NOT issues "behind the camera"

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Al Valentino
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

stimpy wrote:

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Also 100% crops from ISO 6400 in horrible tungsten or mixed light and you don't like the color? Good grief!

The problem here is not inside the camera, it is behind it.

-- hide signature --

Blog ------------------------ http://craigspics.net/?tag=blog
X100 Blog ----------------- http://craigspics.net/?cat=6
X100 Quickstart Guide -- http://craigspics.net/?page_id=1345

Raw files should not give people purple faces.

Remember, this is an X-trans demosaic algorithm which may be interpreting something wrong - like adding red or blue (which equals purple) incorrectly. It may not be raw files, it may be how they are converted that is in question.

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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to Al Valentino, 9 months ago

CraigArnold wrote:

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Exactly. You are judging the camera based on the defaults of a beta version of a RAW converter that is often considered the poorest for X-trans in general. Perhaps best to start with jpegs processed with the camera's jpeg engine using appropriate WB adjustments.

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Fuji XE1 w/14, 18-55, 55-200, Rokinon 8mm Fisheye & Tamron 90mm f/2.8 Macro

That doesn't really help the destructive amount of noise reduction though.

I get that the fuji raws are unfriendly though that is only half the problem, unfortunately.

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Ed B
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

I'm one of those people who loves the X-E1 and my only complaint about it is the autofocus tracking speed.

Everything I've read about the X-E2 sounds great but if the image quality isn't as good as the X-E1, then I'd be torn between the faster autofocus and a reduced image quality.

Maybe we can't have our cake and eat it too. The better autofocus would be great but if image quality suffers because of the sensor based PDAF pixels I'll stick with the X-E1.

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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to Al Valentino, 9 months ago

stimpy wrote:

None of these have had any pp work, sooc raws

Goodness. What does that even mean? I presume you mean you haven't changed any of the settings off their default LR settings. This is not some kind of virtue, it is simply nonsensical. Why on earth are you shooting RAW then?

If you want to know where the problem is, check the jpgs from the camera. If they look okay then LR is the problem, otherwise you may have a faulty camera.

Also 100% crops from ISO 6400 in horrible tungsten or mixed light and you don't like the color? Good grief!

The problem here is not inside the camera, it is behind it.

-- hide signature --

Blog ------------------------ http://craigspics.net/?tag=blog
X100 Blog ----------------- http://craigspics.net/?cat=6
X100 Quickstart Guide -- http://craigspics.net/?page_id=1345

Raw files should not give people purple faces.

Remember, this is an X-trans demosaic algorithm which may be interpreting something wrong - like adding red or blue (which equals purple) incorrectly. It may not be raw files, it may be how they are converted that is in question.

-- hide signature --

Fuji XE1 w/14, 18-55, 55-200, Rokinon 8mm Fisheye & Tamron 90mm f/2.8 Macro

Yeah pretty sure that issue is with lightroom, though the jpegs do show a very very slight hint of magenta in the same areas. The noise reduction is more of a concern, especially as it seems to have been around since x100s was launched

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Al Valentino
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to Ed B, 9 months ago

I hate to say this, but one runs a risk by being the first kid on the block with something new. I am confident that whatever the issue, poor converter or poor files, it will be worked out rapidly.

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Bernie Ess
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Question
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

Did I understand correctly, the 2 face crops are JPEGs out of the camera in ISO6400?

If yes, are you aware that those pix contain originally almost only noise? Look at any other 16MP crop camera by Nikon, Sony or whowever: Image impression at ISO6400 is almost exclusively determined by the amount and type of noise reduction. Your crops look totally normal to me.

I guess you just expect too much.

Bernie

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Re: Question
In reply to Bernie Ess, 9 months ago

Did I understand correctly, the 2 face crops are JPEGs out of the camera in ISO6400?

If yes, are you aware that those pix contain originally almost only noise? Look at any other 16MP crop camera by Nikon, Sony or whowever: Image impression at ISO6400 is almost exclusively determined by the amount and type of noise reduction. Your crops look totally normal to me.

I guess you just expect too much.

Bernie

God no. This is terrible. Even my phone shows more detail in low light.

The raws show a fine level of detail, which proves it's a jpeg processing problem. Specifically at that iso.

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intruder61
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In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

stimpy wrote:

God no. This is terrible. Even my phone shows more detail in low light.The raws show a fine level of detail, which proves it's a jpeg processing problem. Specifically at that iso.

post the whole image with exif data.

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Bernie Ess
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Re: Question
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago
God no. This is terrible. Even my phone shows more detail in low light.

The raws show a fine level of detail, which proves it's a jpeg processing problem. Specifically at that iso.

Sorry, I have seen cameras that have been worse at ISO3200, including full frame. If your phone shows less noise at ISO6400 in a 100% crop, I want to buy it!!! At least you may post a test shot of it at ISO3200 or higher...

You might think of posting a link to the whole shot (of the 2 crops) on flickr plus a RAW conversion. In skin - specially baby skin - there just IS no detail, you won't see pores or skin textures in an ISO6400 shot. All there remains is noise.

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Re: Question
In reply to Bernie Ess, 9 months ago
God no. This is terrible. Even my phone shows more detail in low light.

The raws show a fine level of detail, which proves it's a jpeg processing problem. Specifically at that iso.

Sorry, I have seen cameras that have been worse at ISO3200, including full frame. If your phone shows less noise at ISO6400 in a 100% crop, I want to buy it!!! At least you may post a test shot of it at ISO3200 or higher...

You might think of posting a link to the whole shot (of the 2 crops) on flickr plus a RAW conversion. In skin - specially baby skin - there just IS no detail, you won't see pores or skin textures in an ISO6400 shot. All there remains is noise.

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'All the technique in the world doesn’t compensate for the inability to notice.' (Elliot Erwitt)

Well in the raw there IS detail... So go figure.

I'll get some raws and 100% posted tomorrow, though plenty of samples online of x100s users with the same problem.

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PGR streetshooter
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Jpeg from camera
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

So, have you converted a raw file to a jpeg in camera?
Just wondering.....
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sgoldswo
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to stimpy, 9 months ago

stimpy wrote:

Testing my X-E2 this weekend, and I have a couple of issues.

1) JPEGs overall soften human skin far too much, this is reported to be an issue with the X100s so it could possibly be due to face detection, but even on NR -2 it is too much - everyone looks like they have been retouched. However the real issue comes at ISO 6400 which just obliterates all detail - this must be a bug because it is incredibly unsightly. Non-people photos are fine.

2) An even bigger issue, though perhaps not Fujis fault - Lightroom 5.3 (final beta) is showing some very bad magenta shadows on a LOT of photos - again mainly faces for some reason.

Attached a 100% crop showing this on a forehead

And again in another photo - look at the eyes and nose.

3) Raw files of people all tend to boost saturation in the eyes and lips which is odd, everyone looks like they have lipstick on.

It is a shame because the camera is good, and focus is perfectly fine now; but these are big issues. I really do not know whether to return it or not...

LR 5.3 beta does have a bit of a colour issue - it's turning my E-M1 RAWs odd colours. I don't expect much from LR generally, though with my own X-E2 raws it seems to be fine colourwise if not as sharp as I've come to expect from Aperture.

I'm going to honest, I wouldn't judge my D800E by its output at ISO 6400, so I wouldn't worry too much about some unsightly results you've had with your X-E2...

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Bernie Ess
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Re: Fuji X-E2 image problems
In reply to sgoldswo, 9 months ago
I'm going to honest, I wouldn't judge my D800E by its output at ISO 6400, so I wouldn't worry too much about some unsightly results you've had with your X-E2...

Plus, JPEG generally applies stronger noise reduction with all brands. I still think those 100% (?) crops are very ok. It is ISO6400, 5 stops above base ISO...

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