20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:

Started Nov 9, 2013 | Discussions
CanonKen
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20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
Nov 9, 2013

First let me start by saying if you own a 70D, count your blessings for living in a world where this product exists, and you were able to afford it. It is a FANTASTIC camera.

Earlier this year, I upgraded my 30D to a 6D. Needless to say, it was quite a change in speed, quality, and versatility.

I recently fell into a 70D, and have been making some comparisons. The differences are much bigger than I expected.

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By my math, a 70D pixel is 38 µm² and a 6D pixel is 97 µm² (correct me if I am wrong).

--Across the board, the 6D has astonishingly little noise, even as the ISO gets over the 1000 mark.  Below 1000, there is little noise.  Above 1000, the noise is much closer to film and can actually be quite pleasing.

--The 70D, in comparison, shows a lot more noise, even at low ISO settings (well under 1000).  It is fairly pleasing noise at low ISO settings (filmlike), but quickly turns into colored pixels which are not at all nice.

--Still early, but it seems I can extract a whole lot more detail, shadows, and highlights from the 6D vs. the 70D.

Note, doing all of this in RAW with Lightroom.

Conclusion?  Both cameras are fantastic, and you are lucky to own either.  That said, it seems to be you have a whole lot more to work with in the 6D in terms of pure 'data'.  With the 6D, I can crop and enlarge to 125, 150, even 200% and get something I can process and print well.  On the 70D, things start getting a bit ugly when you try to push the image.

I was excited to have the 70D as a faster camera for wildlife (benefits of smaller pixels, fast frame rate, etc.), but I would rather work with the limits of my 6D, because the results to me seem much better.

Anyone have experience comparing cameras like this?

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CanonKen
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Please click the 'show signature' part, most of the post is in there.
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 9, 2013
No text.
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ljudice
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 9, 2013

I have a 6D and a 60D and I think they make a great combination.  If I were to see more video work in the future I would definitely upgrade the 60D to a 70D.

I have been using the 60D with telephotos and macro and the 6D for everything else.  I am amazed at the 6D's ability to handle low light and as you mention, the noise has a film like quality to it, which I have found easy to control in Lightroom 5.

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Roger Bloemers
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to ljudice, Nov 9, 2013

I have the 70D and am thinking of adding the 6D. You might be pushing me over the edge with you positive statements about the 6D. Have you ever made big enlargements with the 6D and were they much better then the 70D? thanks

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CanonKen
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Roger Bloemers, Nov 9, 2013

I have not, but it is obviously working with files from both cameras, the 6D gives you a LOT more leeway than the 70D does.

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Caerolle
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 9, 2013

Funny, I went and tried out a 6D today. I shot a few pics with it, and the same with my Fuji X-E1. I have done this kind of comparison in the past with a D7000, and really, liked the pics from my Fuji as well, and loved shooting it much more (I find dSLRs kind of sterile to shoot). Of course, these both have crop sensors. I had thought of adding a D7000 for the quick focus, but decided not to after that.

Lately I have been shooting more people, and have gotten pretty annoyed with the slower, less reliable focus on the X-E1. And, since I prefer primes, and the good ones are all full frame, I thought, why not try a full frame camera? OMIGOD! Looking at the images tonight, the 6D just blew my Fuji away. I have been reading all the stuff lately about how you can't tell the difference between crop and full frame, but the 6D pics certainly looked pretty awesome!

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Roger Bloemers
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Caerolle, Nov 10, 2013

Thanks Caerolle.   Your comments about the 6D are helpful to me.   I shoot with the Canon 70D as well as the a couple of micro 4/3 cameras.  More and more I want a really sharp photos.   I'm thinking full frame is the only way to go.

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Caerolle
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Roger Bloemers, Nov 10, 2013

Just be sure and try before you buy!  

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qianp2k
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 10, 2013

Nothing new here.  Check DXO's sensors test and system (lens+sensor) test, it explains everything.

If you frame the subject into the same AOV, 6D wins hands down especially in high ISO and when you view/print in very large size.   But if you unable to move closer or having long enough lens on a small subject such as one a small bird, with the same FL lens your 70D gives lots more details after you cropped heavily your 6D file to have the same AOV (or same portion) of the bird.  Two cameras complement each other well.  For landscape and portrait, 6D is very easy choice.  For birding 70D is a better choice unless you have very long lens that can frame the birds into large portion of VF w/o much cropping.

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Marx81
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 10, 2013

70D and 6D got different sensor size , compare them is difficult .

For my photography needs , once I went into ff , I didn't look back .

http://www.flickr.com/photos/marxx/

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Rick Knepper
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 10, 2013

CanonKen wrote:

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Still early, but it seems I can extract a whole lot more detail, shadows, and highlights from the 6D vs. the 70D.

I don't see how the 6D wins on detail at base ISO all other things being equal. Even when all things aren't equal, there should be more discernible detail. It has been proven more than once on this forum in side by side shots with a FF and crop camera. In this case, both sensors in question have 20 MP giving the 70D greater pixel density and greater capture resolution due to its smaller surface. Unless there is a significant factor(s) obliterating detail, the 70D should resolve more detail (not always the most important aspect of IQ to a given photographer). Do you have any side by sides?

OTOH, the 6D should beat the 70D in overall noise (which is what I think you mean by shadows and highlights).

I have some experience comparing cameras and posting reviews on DPR albeit nothing with a crop. I would suggest posting side by side images to illustrate your text. It helps folks visualize what you are saying and it actually helps the reviewer focus his/her thoughts, and, in the process, the sustained study of said images may reveal an opposite result of the first impression or preconceived assumption. That's happened to me before.

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ovlov
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 10, 2013

I've never sat down and directly compared my 7D, EOS M and 6D.  I do know from practical experience that the 6D is much better in the noise department.  The EOS M is slightly better than the 7D.

The difference between Canon's 18MP APS-C sensor and their 20MP FF sensor is way more pronounced than the bar graphs you see online would have you believe.  The RAW data is a lot more pliable as well.  I can't speak to how the new sensor compares.

I had doubts about the 6D prior to its purchase, but the image quality has definitely won me over.

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Caerolle
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Rick Knepper, Nov 10, 2013

Wow, dude, you gotta lotta gear!

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CanonKen
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Roger Bloemers, Nov 10, 2013

Instead of using sharp, I would define the difference as the 6D is 'free from all unwanted noise/distortion' vs. the 70D.  The 70D is very sharp, but there is more noise, hands down.  In effect, it does make it look sharper, but it is the total lack of all noise.

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Just another Canon shooter
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Rick Knepper, Nov 10, 2013

Rick Knepper wrote:

Unless there is a significant factor(s) obliterating detail, the 70D should resolve more detail (not always the most important aspect of IQ to a given photographer). Do you have any side by sides?

How about TDP? 50L at f/1.2 on crop vs. the cheapo 85/1.8 at f/2 on FF?

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qianp2k
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Just another Canon shooter, Nov 10, 2013

Just another Canon shooter wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:

Unless there is a significant factor(s) obliterating detail, the 70D should resolve more detail (not always the most important aspect of IQ to a given photographer). Do you have any side by sides?

How about TDP? 50L at f/1.2 on crop vs. the cheapo 85/1.8 at f/2 on FF?

DXO 85/1.8 on 6D vs 50L/1.2 on 70D 16 vs 12 mpix.

No doubt a cheaper EF lens on FF beats a very expensive lens on APS-C. However those EF lenses are not designed for crop. A more meaningful comparison should compare to native APS-C lenses designed and optimized for APS-C bodies but Canon doesn't offer such lenses (only very few EF-S lenses). For example EF-M 22/2.0 STM pancake on EOS-M (that should have similar sensor as of 70D from perspective of IQ, 70D is only slightly better) has amazing 13 mpix.

Due to much bigger sensor size and 1.6x times less pixel magnification, 6D is naturally sharper with better color tonality that becomes noticeably when view in large size.

above set at respective wide-open

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Robemo
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About the same experience ...
In reply to CanonKen, Nov 10, 2013

I worked with a 60D and 6D, but after a while I found the difference disturbing so I got rid of the 60D and APS-C lenses and got some extra EF lenses to get the most from full frame. Never regretted it.

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Rick Knepper
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Just another Canon shooter, Nov 10, 2013

Just another Canon shooter wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:

Unless there is a significant factor(s) obliterating detail, the 70D should resolve more detail (not always the most important aspect of IQ to a given photographer). Do you have any side by sides?

How about TDP?

TDP?

50L at f/1.2 on crop vs. the cheapo 85/1.8 at f/2 on FF?

Can you post the RAWs?

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Just another Canon shooter
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Rick Knepper, Nov 10, 2013

Rick Knepper wrote:

Just another Canon shooter wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:

Unless there is a significant factor(s) obliterating detail, the 70D should resolve more detail (not always the most important aspect of IQ to a given photographer). Do you have any side by sides?

How about TDP?

TDP?

Here. You can choose the Sigma 85 or the 85L on the left, as well; the difference is even more pronounced then.

50L at f/1.2 on crop vs. the cheapo 85/1.8 at f/2 on FF?

Can you post the RAWs?

No, for obvious reasons.

Most of the comparisons you have seen are in the best scenario case, at the sharpest apertures. One of the benefits of FF is to shoot with fast primes. Then the resolution jumps dramatically, compared to cop. And there are apertures you cannot get at all with crop (in eq. terms), of course.

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The Davinator
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Re: 20MP vs. 20MP - comparing my 6D vs. 70D:
In reply to Caerolle, Nov 10, 2013

Caerolle wrote:

Funny, I went and tried out a 6D today. I shot a few pics with it, and the same with my Fuji X-E1. I have done this kind of comparison in the past with a D7000, and really, liked the pics from my Fuji as well, and loved shooting it much more (I find dSLRs kind of sterile to shoot). Of course, these both have crop sensors. I had thought of adding a D7000 for the quick focus, but decided not to after that.

Lately I have been shooting more people, and have gotten pretty annoyed with the slower, less reliable focus on the X-E1. And, since I prefer primes, and the good ones are all full frame, I thought, why not try a full frame camera? OMIGOD! Looking at the images tonight, the 6D just blew my Fuji away. I have been reading all the stuff lately about how you can't tell the difference between crop and full frame, but the 6D pics certainly looked pretty awesome!

When you compared side by side, was it on print, or at 100% screen view?  The reason I ask is because comparing a landscape shot on my D800 vs my X-Pro1, in a 16x24 print, there really was no difference.  Neither had any noise, both were sharp.  I don't own the 70D nor 6D so I cannot comment really on that....but I dont imagine the 6D offered more rez than my old D800.

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