Cancelled my E-M1 order

Started 7 months ago | Discussions
antoineb
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Anyway it's never a good idea to be an early adopter
In reply to dahod, 7 months ago

dahod wrote:

I got caught up in the hype around the E-M1 - what wasn't to like? - generally favourable reviews, new lenses on the horizon, ability to use my old 4/3 lenses, commitment to m4/3 by Olympus as its future etc etc. At last - Olympus breaks their silence and the world is good.

I read the interview with Mr. Terada (http://www.bestmirrorlesscamerareviews.com/2013/09/18/the-om-d-e-m1-new-pro-lenses-and-2014-an-interview-with-olympus-europe/) however, and it left me with a less than warm and fuzzy feeling. I could be reading it wrong and I apologize if I am but my take from it was

  1. 4/3 was a failure because it didn't result in measurably smaller camera/lens combinations - M4/3 will correct that.
  2. His target market is the "young generation with a focus on young females"
  3. He can't figure out how to attract European women buyers but he has a couple of thoughts.
  4. M4/3 can almost beat APS-C on image quality but wins on portability ("their lenses are so much bigger than ours")

Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female. I'm also okay that my E-3 and 50-200 is a big piece of gear - it takes good pictures.

This new Olympus has clearly targeted the "grab your gear and go" market. I'm not saying it won't take good pictures because it will as we've clearly seen. What I am saying though is that the Olympus commitment is now on small, portable and discrete - that's not necessarily my world.

You can say "so what? - the proof is in the pictures". That's true and the pictures are impressive but in order to keep the size down the lenses are all software corrected. There will be no big optically correct lens for this camera - the "Pro" line is it. According to Mr. Terada they "promise to establish the MFT lens line-up at the quality of the current PRO line-up". That's interesting since the 12-40 performance seems to be at or slightly above the 4/3 HG 12-60 level (albeit at constant aperture).

I think I'll wait and see how this unfolds. In the meantime I'll take Art_P's advice and look for an E-5. I want the fine focus that Olympus for some unknown reason took off my E-3

Thanks

Dave

Hi Dave,

most tech products these days, tend to suffer from some bugs.  Cameras may be based on a fairly old design but they also tend to have the capability of cumulating bugs from the electronics side, and those form the optical / mechanical side.  Think Nikon D600 with its shutter mechanism dust issues.  Think various cameras which necessitated firmware upgrades.

Always safer to wait a good 6 months so that any bugs will have been ironed out, or you can decide to NOT buy.

In any case you already own a camera, so what do you care?  There is no hurry.

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CollBaxter
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Re: You sound thin skinned and bigotted...
In reply to ApertureAcolyte, 7 months ago

ApertureAcolyte wrote:


Tereda: One thing we always say is that Japan and the Asian people like to have new things. Americans and Europeans tend to be a bit more conservative. We are expecting this. On the other hand, we strongly promote, especially in the Japanese and Asian market, cameras designed for the young generation with a focus on young females. However, we can see the potential in Europe now that so many females enjoy photography and post pictures on social networks. We tried to test the market potential in Paris once with the Pen camera where we had a touch-and-try show in the centre of the city. So many young ladies came to the event and they tried the camera and everybody said that it was really nice. But still these women have no strong buying power, that is, the income is low. However, we clearly see the possibility – they love photography and they love the Pen camera. If we can clearly see the target user, I am sure we can convince Europe and America.

You saying they cannot market products to women, which is a potential emerging market? Why ignore %50 of the population?

Your comprehension and interpretation is below average.

Oh I see we are now getting  marked and evaluated. . I Think this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

It depended on which side you sit in this interpenetration. When I read the statement I though ouch . Olympus have been a inward looking company as to markets always assuming that the rest of the world will follow Asian and Japanese trends  Maybe they are correct as China will soon be the biggest economy in the world. Also assuming European woman have no buying power is way off track.

A to highlighting well most of us can read ( I don't write  that well )  but  don't assume anything.

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Olymore
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Re: Yep-less than impressive interview
In reply to DavidH202, 7 months ago

I find it amusing that you think that the E system was in anyway 'professional'.
As it offered no advantage over larger sensor systems which had better IQ, far more comprehensive support, more lenses and accessories and far better stock availability, most professionals wisely remained with, or migrated to APSC or FF.

And ironically far more professionals seem to be adopting m43 than the E system simply because it has an advantage of low weight and small size over the larger sensor systems but with IQ very close to APSC.

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olyflyer
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Re: Cancelled my E-M1 order
In reply to dahod, 7 months ago

dahod wrote:

I got caught up in the hype around the E-M1 - what wasn't to like? - generally favourable reviews, new lenses on the horizon, ability to use my old 4/3 lenses, commitment to m4/3 by Olympus as its future etc etc. At last - Olympus breaks their silence and the world is good.

I read the interview with Mr. Terada (http://www.bestmirrorlesscamerareviews.com/2013/09/18/the-om-d-e-m1-new-pro-lenses-and-2014-an-interview-with-olympus-europe/) however, and it left me with a less than warm and fuzzy feeling. I could be reading it wrong and I apologize if I am but my take from it was

  1. 4/3 was a failure because it didn't result in measurably smaller camera/lens combinations- M4/3 will correct that.
  2. His target market is the "young generation with a focus on young females"
  3. He can't figure out how to attract European women buyers but he has a couple of thoughts.
  4. M4/3 can almost beat APS-C on image quality but wins on portability ("their lenses are so much bigger than ours")

1. Some of us has been saying that for a long time, and the M4/3 can only MARGINALLY correct that because the lenses with equivalent apertures and focal lengths will still be large.

2. So what? Why would that bother you as a potential male, middle class and supposedly intelligent buyer? Are the cameras going to be produced in pink colours only or what?

3. He should try to hire some European women. I know a few who could help him out.

4. I guess he hasn't seen the APS-C mirrorless alternatives yet. Again, we must look at equivalent apertures, not only focal length.

Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female. I'm also okay that my E-3 and 50-200 is a big piece of gear - it takes good pictures.

This new Olympus has clearly targeted the "grab your gear and go" market. I'm not saying it won't take good pictures because it will as we've clearly seen. What I am saying though is that the Olympus commitment is now on small, portable and discrete - that's not necessarily my world.

You can say "so what? - the proof is in the pictures". That's true and the pictures are impressive but in order to keep the size down the lenses are all software corrected. There will be no big optically correct lens for this camera - the "Pro" line is it. According to Mr. Terada they "promise to establish the MFT lens line-up at the quality of the current PRO line-up". That's interesting since the 12-40 performance seems to be at or slightly above the 4/3 HG 12-60 level (albeit at constant aperture).

I think I'll wait and see how this unfolds. In the meantime I'll take Art_P's advice and look for an E-5. I want the fine focus that Olympus for some unknown reason took off my E-3

Thanks

Dave

It sounds as you were not seriously interested in it the first place, because those seems to be very weak excuses for not even giving the camera a chance. OK, pre-order does not cost anything, then to find a reason to cancel that order before it is time to commit and pay is easy.

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ApertureAcolyte
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Re: You sound thin skinned and bigotted...
In reply to CollBaxter, 7 months ago

CollBaxter wrote:

ApertureAcolyte wrote:

Tereda: One thing we always say is that Japan and the Asian people like to have new things. Americans and Europeans tend to be a bit more conservative. We are expecting this. On the other hand, we strongly promote, especially in the Japanese and Asian market, cameras designed for the young generation with a focus on young females. However, we can see the potential in Europe now that so many females enjoy photography and post pictures on social networks. We tried to test the market potential in Paris once with the Pen camera where we had a touch-and-try show in the centre of the city. So many young ladies came to the event and they tried the camera and everybody said that it was really nice. But still these women have no strong buying power, that is, the income is low. However, we clearly see the possibility – they love photography and they love the Pen camera. If we can clearly see the target user, I am sure we can convince Europe and America.

You saying they cannot market products to women, which is a potential emerging market? Why ignore %50 of the population?

Your comprehension and interpretation is below average.

Oh I see we are now getting marked and evaluated. . I Think this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

Is it still cool to drop ancient cliche catch phrases like that? People don't use black kettles no more...

It's very clear. Read the sentence structures. OP interprets the sentences without looking at sentence structure. For example:

On the other hand, we strongly promote, especially in the Japanese and Asian market, cameras designed for the young generation with a focus on young females.

Is he saying the focus of the cameras design is for women, or is he saying the strong promotion has a particular focus on young women? Former or latter?

It depended on which side you sit in this interpenetration. When I read the statement I though ouch . Olympus have been a inward looking company as to markets always assuming that the rest of the world will follow Asian and Japanese trends Maybe they are correct as China will soon be the biggest economy in the world. Also assuming European woman have no buying power is way off track.

A to highlighting well most of us can read ( I don't write that well ) but don't assume anything.

Read it over and over again. You're way off the mark of what the guy is saying. Maybe you forget that Europe is still under austerity?

Do you follow the news?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/10308506/IMF-warns-France-on-austerity-overkill.html

I quote the OP:

"Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female."

lol gtfo, where do these people come up with this nonsense?? Talk about extreme hyperbole!!!!

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ApertureAcolyte
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Re: Cancelled my E-M1 order
In reply to dahod, 7 months ago

dahod wrote:

I got caught up in the hype around the E-M1 - what wasn't to like? - generally favourable reviews, new lenses on the horizon, ability to use my old 4/3 lenses, commitment to m4/3 by Olympus as its future etc etc. At last - Olympus breaks their silence and the world is good.

I read the interview with Mr. Terada (http://www.bestmirrorlesscamerareviews.com/2013/09/18/the-om-d-e-m1-new-pro-lenses-and-2014-an-interview-with-olympus-europe/) however, and it left me with a less than warm and fuzzy feeling. I could be reading it wrong and I apologize if I am but my take from it was

  1. 4/3 was a failure because it didn't result in measurably smaller camera/lens combinations - M4/3 will correct that.
  2. His target market is the "young generation with a focus on young females"
  3. He can't figure out how to attract European women buyers but he has a couple of thoughts.
  4. M4/3 can almost beat APS-C on image quality but wins on portability ("their lenses are so much bigger than ours")

Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female. I'm also okay that my E-3 and 50-200 is a big piece of gear - it takes good pictures.

This new Olympus has clearly targeted the "grab your gear and go" market.

They are a business.

I'm not saying it won't take good pictures because it will as we've clearly seen. What I am saying though is that the Olympus commitment is now on small, portable and discrete - that's not necessarily my world.

Olympus is committed to both demographics... thus the OMD / PEN lines. Do you really think the OM-D is catering to the "grab and go" market? Do you really think they are committing the majority of their promotional activity at trade shows the to EM1 because they want the "grab and go market? Is that why they are demonstrating full frame vs m4/3 prints at such events?

Reality, far removed from your deranged rant and insane reaction to a mere interview, is that Olympus is getting very serious about making the 4/3's system something to be taken very seriously as a professional system. They also want to make some money on the lower end of the market and chase an emerging demographic (women) by introducing them to interchangeable lens cameras.

What they are doing is commendable, which is aiming to draw in more people into the pursuit.

You can say "so what? - the proof is in the pictures". That's true and the pictures are impressive but in order to keep the size down the lenses are all software corrected. There will be no big optically correct lens for this camera - the "Pro" line is it. According to Mr. Terada they "promise to establish the MFT lens line-up at the quality of the current PRO line-up". That's interesting since the 12-40 performance seems to be at or slightly above the 4/3 HG 12-60 level (albeit at constant aperture).

"seems to be"... says it all, that you haven't actually touched the new lens...

It's probably a good thing you cancelled your order to be honest. You seem to be irrationally emotional about equipment.

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ptox
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You DO remember
In reply to ApertureAcolyte, 7 months ago

ApertureAcolyte wrote:

I quote the OP:

"Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female."

lol gtfo, where do these people come up with this nonsense?? Talk about extreme hyperbole!!!!

You DO remember where you're posting?

Anyway, I had to laugh at that as well. What a flake! -- cancelling his order of a camera he presumably wants because of an executive's poorly expressed thoughts in a single, totally irrelevant interview.

Not very manly and pragmatic of him...

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GBC
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Re: Not shiny enough...?
In reply to Michael99, 7 months ago

I can guarantee the CAF will be better that your E520.

The E5 is one of the fastest focussing bodies, and is still right near the top with SAF and an SWD lens. Having a mirrorless version match it is a major achievement.

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rovingtim
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Wrong
In reply to ptox, 7 months ago

ptox wrote:

Not very manly and pragmatic of him...

Its extremely manly to flee from anything that is even remotely associated with women. Except women, of course.

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AccidntlTourist
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Re: Not shiny enough...?
In reply to Michael99, 7 months ago

I will keep my order in place but if the camera does not show a large improvement over my E-520 in S-AF and C-AF it is going back and my 4/3rds lenses will be up for sale.

Pretty much everything I've read suggests that E-M1 focusing with 4/3 lenses will be about the same. In other words you are unlikely to see a "large improvement"!

Robin Wong:

EXPECTATIONS VS REALITY”

"… the older Four Thirds DSLR lenses were running on a completely different system (Phase Detect AF), and even at their fastest and most efficient focusing, being mounted on the DSLR E-5 (which I am very familiar with), still falls behind the Micro Four Thirds' focusing speed. No Four Thirds lens previously had anything that can focus as fast as whatever the newer Micro Four Thirds lenses can do! I personally would love to have the older lenses miraculously perform as well as the Micro Four Thirds lenses in terms of AF speed, but let's face the reality: I have just established that it is not practical in any logical sense."

"… the Four Thirds lenses, even at their most efficient state, will not outdo the faster, newer and more technologically advanced AF system in the Micro Four Thirds lenses, …"

http://robinwong.blogspot.com.au/

Time to sell?

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Will -

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Marty4650
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Makes sense, since the EM1 is a specialty item
In reply to dahod, 7 months ago

The EM1 may not have been the camera for you if you are happy with your E3.

This camera was designed for people with a large investment in 4/3 lenses who wanted a way to use them on a more modern camera. If the E3 image quality is good enough for you (and it certainly IS pretty darn good) then why would you want a $1400 camera that doesn't handle as well as they camera you already own?

For people without HG and SHG lenses, then the EM5, GH3, EP5 or GX7 makes much more sense. The EM1 offers virtually no major improvement over those cameras, other than PDAF ability.

I don't plan to get an EM1 either... but I do want that 12-40mm lens.

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John Mason
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Re: Swapping the E-3 for an E-5? - focus adjustment
In reply to dpalugyay, 7 months ago

Big plus for E5 over E3 unless somehow all your lenses did not need adjustment.  Both of my SHG lenses did making my E5 vastly better than the E3 I owned for a short time.

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CollBaxter
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Re: You DO remember
In reply to ptox, 7 months ago

ptox wrote:

ApertureAcolyte wrote:

I quote the OP:

"Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female."

lol gtfo, where do these people come up with this nonsense?? Talk about extreme hyperbole!!!!

You DO remember where you're posting?

Anyway, I had to laugh at that as well. What a flake! -- cancelling his order of a camera he presumably wants because of an executive's poorly expressed thoughts in a single, totally irrelevant interview.

Not very manly and pragmatic of him...

Toxic P

You Sir are rude with these continual narcissistic remarks.

The OP expressed an opinion and a reason for his actions . It does no require a personal attack.

Hell this is just about cameras not all are as virally eloquent as some would like to think they are.

Ieeeeeesh

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Big Ga
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Re: You sound thin skinned and bigotted...
In reply to CollBaxter, 7 months ago

CollBaxter wrote:

It depended on which side you sit in this interpenetration.

Do you mean, are you giving? or are you taking?

Hmmm .... inter .... maybe its both ??? maybe even at the same time !?!?

Nice one Col. We like the way you're thinking ..... brings tears to my eyes though ....

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g_r_w
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It has very good C-AF. Why would anyone cancel based off an interview?
In reply to dharma108, 7 months ago

dharma108 wrote:

I was pretty disappointed with what Teradasan said in the interview. Priorities looked way off to me. Instead of talking about wanting to ensure the best IQ and AF/CAF they can possibly attain with m43, he's speaking about wanting to increase the percentage of young female purchasers!

Ah, excuse me--sumimasen Teradasan, more and more me thinks I will be sitting this one out and continue to enjoy the E5.

Next iteration? Hopefully better battery life-dual card slots-and decent to very good CAF.

Dual AF makes C-AF both fast and accurate, so I don't see the complaint there.

No dual card slots - no argument there... it doesn't have them, so if it is your list of requirements - fair enough.

I just don't really see the point of making the judgement of keeping or cancelling a pre-order based off a bad interview with Olympus management.

Bad reviews, yes.  Bad interviews?!?

Not to say, the OP didn't make the right decision for themselves, I just find it a strange rationale.

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CollBaxter
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Brings tears to my eys as well.
In reply to Big Ga, 7 months ago

Big Ga wrote:

CollBaxter wrote:

It depended on which side you sit in this interpenetration.

Do you mean, are you giving? or are you taking?

Hmmm .... inter .... maybe its both ??? maybe even at the same time !?!?

Nice one Col. We like the way you're thinking ..... brings tears to my eyes though ....

Ha

Bloody hell.

You where the first one to pick it up. It also bring tears to my eyes. Maybe some thought  I was being extremely deep here.

That's what you get when you are a bit dyslexic and Google and a you are a bit sloppy.

I saw it later but alas the edit time had run out.

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Husaberg Grok
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Re: You DO remember
In reply to CollBaxter, 7 months ago

CollBaxter wrote:

ptox wrote:

ApertureAcolyte wrote:

I quote the OP:

"Right off the bat, I'm at a disadvantage because I'm certainly neither young nor female."

lol gtfo, where do these people come up with this nonsense?? Talk about extreme hyperbole!!!!

You DO remember where you're posting?

Anyway, I had to laugh at that as well. What a flake! -- cancelling his order of a camera he presumably wants because of an executive's poorly expressed thoughts in a single, totally irrelevant interview.

Not very manly and pragmatic of him...

Toxic P

You Sir are rude with these continual narcissistic remarks.

The OP expressed an opinion and a reason for his actions . It does no require a personal attack.

Hell this is just about cameras not all are as virally eloquent as some would like to think they are.

Ieeeeeesh

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Collin
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If the OP's post wasn't designed to wind-up the members and elicit response, I don't know what to you'd call it.

The fact that he hasn't responded in his own senseless thread, speaks volumes.

Pure attempt to wind up the masses...... To the OP; Order, cancel order, do what you want. I don't care, even if your reasons are so very clever.

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Must....Think.....of something......Clever........

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g_r_w
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Re: you guys are just hilarious
In reply to klauser, 7 months ago

klauser wrote:

some blogger posts snipplets of a discussion with Terada, there is mentioning of female buyers and boom size inferiority complex kicks in (sensor size and other things that I don't want to think of).

I also met Mr Terada and when he held his presentation he was hammering (even though hammering is hardly a appropriate term to be associated with the soft spoken Terada with his fine sense of humor) about best IQ, best IQ, on par or better IQ than aps-c, IQ still trailing "ff" regarding shallow dof and low light, but always with a much better portability than the other systems. Now what's wrong with that, guys?

If you do need those extra 5 percent of IQ and you don't mind portability restrictions interfering with the other 95 percent of IQ, no worries, go and get ff. You will probably love it.

k.

+1 - from what I've seen it is either as good or noticeably better than APS-C.

There is a discernible difference between it and 35mm equiv when viewed side-by-side.  I question whether most people would notice with no comparison shot though.

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goblin
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Re: You DO remember
In reply to Husaberg Grok, 7 months ago

Husaberg Grok wrote:

...

If the OP's post wasn't designed to wind-up the members and elicit response, I don't know what to you'd call it.

The fact that he hasn't responded in his own senseless thread, speaks volumes.

...

Ditto. I'd go further: I don't believe this specific one was ever on order. Sad news for my position in the waiting list

I wonder if I should put a thread "I ordered the E-M1". Reminds me of Vogon poetry all the way. "...Ode to the little gum ballas I found under my armpits earlier this morning..."

It's been two weeks already, guys. Suck it up. Buy it, or do not. Free country and stuff...

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Torlang
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Re: Cancelled my E-M1 order
In reply to astone, 7 months ago

astone wrote:

goblin wrote:

That's one less buyer in the waiting list in front of me. Thanks for that

Two less buyers. I canceled my order of camera and lens at Amazon. Got caught up in the hipe but now I seen no reason to replace my M-5. List is getting shorter for you.--

ABS

I am perfectly content with my E-5 for what I use it for. I will continue to shoot with it until it won't shoot no more, or when the price tag to get it repaired exceeds the value of the body. Then, I'll invest in a Nikon system suitable for what I am shooting. Good weekend, all. happy shooting.

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E-5 / E-620 / 50-200 SWD / 12-60 SWD / FL-50R's and other paraphernalia

 Torlang's gear list:Torlang's gear list
Olympus E-620 Olympus E-5 Olympus Zuiko Digital ED 12-60mm 1:2.8-4.0 SWD Olympus Zuiko Digital ED 50-200mm 1:2.8-3.5 SWD +3 more
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