EOS M, what's the point?

Started Sep 25, 2013 | Discussions
Peter63
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EOS M, what's the point?
Sep 25, 2013

I started with the 22 kit and love it for the compact form combined with great IQ. I bought the 18-55 but don't use it much because it makes the camera too big for a belt pouch. I took both lenses and M hiking last weekend and loved the light weight and capability but realized I want better macro ability, extension tubes just aren't working that well for me. So now I think I should get the EF adapter but then someone pointed out that the M plus adapter weigh the same as an SL1. I would rather have the SL1 with the efs 18-55 stm (same weight as efm 18-35 stm) and bring my 60 macro.

So now I am back to using the M with the 22 as an everyday cam in a belt pouch. I won't give up my DSLR, and I still want to buy a 70d and /or a 6d.

So I guess my question is for anyone who is keeping a DSLR and an M, when do you take the M instead of the DSLR and why? Is it weight, size, stealth, or something else?

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WatsonPhoto
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

When I take the EOS M:

  • If I am travelling to a foreign country where there is a risk of mugging/robbery
  • For street photography
  • Where there is an extended hiking trip

I take the D800 when:

  • I am doing work in the studio
  • special event
  • to the race track for motorcycle/car racing photography
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Nigel Wilkins
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

I have the M & a 6D.  90% of my photography is landscape in the mountains, usually on or near a summit before sunrise, which normally involves 2-3 hours uphill hiking to get there.  The M goes every time.  Since I bought the 11-22mm lens when they were first available, the 6D hasn't been out of the house.  It's all down to the weight & size reduction, which makes life easier.

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nobuchika
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to WatsonPhoto, Sep 25, 2013

EOS M allows you flexibility.

If you want a very compact lightweight shooter with APS-C IQ, use the 22 pancake. If you want the ability to use a wide assortment of lenses to yield images on par with APS-C DSLR's [sports/action withstanding], you have that option with the adapter, and the total package will be no larger/heavier than the SL1 or other DSLR with the same lens.

Unlike the M, you can't strip down the SL1 and DSLR's further to become as compact, lightweight, and inconspicuous.

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Photato
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Value and Size
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

The value (Quality/Cost) of the M is unbeatable as long as you don't need fast AF.

I needed a Wide and Fast lens for my 60D but the best I could do was the Canon 24 f2.8 that by itself isn't as wide nor fast as the 22 f2 and more expensive than the M+22 Kit.

I am using it for video (M on tripod) and as carry everywhere camera.

When Canon released the new firmware and the 11-22 lens it was a 1-2 punch I couldn't resist and took the plunge.

When in doubt check the $2,500 Sony RX1  similar 35mm f2 lens and can't change it.

The IQ difference of these 2 cameras is very small though.

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Markintosh
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

Peter63 wrote:

I started with the 22 kit and love it for the compact form combined with great IQ. I bought the 18-55 but don't use it much because it makes the camera too big for a belt pouch. I took both lenses and M hiking last weekend and loved the light weight and capability but realized I want better macro ability, extension tubes just aren't working that well for me. So now I think I should get the EF adapter but then someone pointed out that the M plus adapter weigh the same as an SL1. I would rather have the SL1 with the efs 18-55 stm (same weight as efm 18-35 stm) and bring my 60 macro.

So now I am back to using the M with the 22 as an everyday cam in a belt pouch. I won't give up my DSLR, and I still want to buy a 70d and /or a 6d.

So I guess my question is for anyone who is keeping a DSLR and an M, when do you take the M instead of the DSLR and why? Is it weight, size, stealth, or something else?

It's almost year passed since I purchased my EOS-M. Since then my 5DMKII left house may be 3-4 times for a special occasions. EOS-M goes everywhere and I love the fun of shooting with it and result. I'm using 5DMKII with couple special lenses (mostly manual focus) and for rare work projects. I like both cameras but using mostly EOS-M, due to it's size, and compactness, even with bigger lenses. EFM lenses are gems as well:)

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Thanks,
Markintosh.

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tomtom50
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

Peter63 wrote:

I started with the 22 kit and love it for the compact form combined with great IQ. I bought the 18-55 but don't use it much because it makes the camera too big for a belt pouch. I took both lenses and M hiking last weekend and loved the light weight and capability but realized I want better macro ability, extension tubes just aren't working that well for me. So now I think I should get the EF adapter but then someone pointed out that the M plus adapter weigh the same as an SL1. I would rather have the SL1 with the efs 18-55 stm (same weight as efm 18-35 stm) and bring my 60 macro.

So now I am back to using the M with the 22 as an everyday cam in a belt pouch. I won't give up my DSLR, and I still want to buy a 70d and /or a 6d.

So I guess my question is for anyone who is keeping a DSLR and an M, when do you take the M instead of the DSLR and why? Is it weight, size, stealth, or something else?

I use my m when I want to like the camera I am using.

I use my T1i when I want to catch my 3-year old in focus

Actually I never use my T1i. When I need fast I use my RX100.

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Jefenator
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 25, 2013

My main shooter is also a mirrorless (Sony NEX). It can go plenty of places of course, but I usually don't bring it unless there is some expectation that I will be doing some serious shooting. I guess it's just that much bigger and more expensive.

I take the 22mm kit in a belt holster almost everywhere. Walking to work, playing music gigs, almost anything. I'm grateful for all the impromptu photo ops I've been able to exploit. I only leave it home for the most mundane of outings (and more than once I've kicked myself for that). IMHO this is the real niche for the EOS-M, the thing it does a little bit better than any of the others.

The 11-22 has my attention as well. That plus the 22mm kit costs less than just the UWA zoom for my other system. I could bring both systems and not have to change lenses. If it ever becomes readily available here in the states, it's going to be hard to pass up. (Might have gone thru Canada but they're all back-ordered now and my big road trip starts on Friday.)

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Mahmoud Mousef
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

Peter63 wrote:

So I guess my question is for anyone who is keeping a DSLR and an M, when do you take the M instead of the DSLR and why? Is it weight, size, stealth, or something else?

Weight, size and semi-stealth sums it up.

Also, a good lens allowing lots of light to get in (22mm).

Quality of the 18-55 lens is apparently good but I don't have much of a need (or want) to buy it. I think the 22mm is as big as I want the M to become. Any bigger and I think at that point I would rather be using any camera with a viewfinder, flash & a tilting LCD integrated.

The 22mm kit is great for low-light shots without intimidating the locals with a bigger camera.

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PSonoda
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

When I started comparing the SL1 to the M. I noticed that the M plus adaptor weighs slightly more than the SL1. But when you factor the physical size and quality of optics available in the M mount, the value is hard to beat. You can buy a SL1 with a kit lens for $750. For that same basic price, you can get a $400 22mm kit with flash, a 18-55 m lens and adapter. The optics are better on the lenses and are better made plus significantly smaller overall.

the 11-22 sounds great and compares well to the 10-22 ef s mount. But it costs less.

If you are looking for the most compact shooter, the M is a little better. IMHO If you are looking for the best deal/ value, that will depend on the purpose for this kit.

Personally, the M build quality reminds me more of my 7d. The SL1while nice feels more entry level. And the EF 18-55 lens feels, well, cheap. The M version feels better built. Optically there is not too much difference between the two. I wish the SL1 was around when I bought my wife her T4i. I think she likes the size better.

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Phil Hill
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Size and FD lenses.
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

My two reasons for getting the EOS M were size (with the 22 mm), and compatibility with my FD lenses. I’m not likely to be using it with my EF lenses because the size advantage is lost, along with the viewfinder.

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maxotics
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Re: Size and FD lenses.
In reply to Phil Hill, Sep 26, 2013

The viewfinder is lost, but the size is still smaller than a DSLR, even with the adapter, which just adds a little length to the camera. I use mine with a Sigma 10-20mm. It fits in my fanny pack. A DSLR won't, at least not well. Even the SL1 I suspect.

I also agree with the other poster about the build quality of the EOS-M. Like most "first" things manufactured, they didn't go cheap. It's a small really solid little camera! The more I use it, the more I'm surprised it wasn't a big hit. Not surprised Canon looks like they're going to try again.

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007peter
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Answer = SL1 lack an affordable EF-S 22mm STM pancake :(
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

Canon 22mm STM is the entire plot to the success of M:

  • Without it, M is a dead weight
  • Without a pancake lens, M+18-55+external flash is bulkier than SL1

So why haven't I bought a SL1:

  • SL1 is over-price @ $799. Its nothing more than a 3yrs old T2i + touchscreen
  • There are no affordable EF-S fast prime
  • $500 Sigma 30mm f/1.4 HSM = 435g
  • $449 Canon 28mm f/1.8 USM = 310g
  • $289 Canon 35mm f/2.0 "ARC" = 210g

Canon 35mm f/2 comes closet, I owned one and wasn't impressed. I discover its prone to nasty CA and it uses an ancient ARC motor that sound like beehives when focusing. Here is couple examples:

Until canon release an affordable 20~30mm f/1.8~f/2.0 prime for EF-S DSLR, M is the cheapest option for an affordable fast wide prime.  If canon release such a lens, I'll sell all my mirrorless (M43 + NEX + M) for a SL1.

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maxotics
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Re: Answer = SL1 lack an affordable EF-S 22mm STM pancake :(
In reply to 007peter, Sep 26, 2013

Is SL1 anything more than an EOS-M in a plastic body with a viewfinder?

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padmasana
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Re: EOS M, what's the point?
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

I bought the EOS M when the bargains came around in the U.S. market. I didn't give much thought to where it would fit into my lineup (main logic was this: $300 for that cool little camera? sold!) and had been cruising along comfortably with DSLRs and point and shoots.

Over the last three months, it's replaced my Powershot S95 and SX260 in all occasions. They were used mostly for road and mountain biking (12-15 hours a week) and for casual stuff. Obvious improvements in lens choice and image quality have made its slightly bigger profile more than acceptable. It fits in a jersey pocket no matter what EF-M lens is on it.

When I know I'm going to need other qualities out of a camera, such as response, focus speed and accuracy (and face demanding circumstances, such as low light or fast action) I tend to stick with the a 5D3 and a 7D.

I love the EOS M and what it can do, but I also love the DSLRs and what they can do. The M is stealthy, light and capable. The DSLRs are big, offer the greatest control and are very, very capable.

The M hasn't resolved the dilemma of no matter which camera and lens I choose, I'm making tradeoffs. It does, however, significantly narrow the margin that exists between the two platforms I am familiar with.

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peter42y
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Re: Value and Size
In reply to Photato, Sep 26, 2013

Photato wrote:

The value (Quality/Cost) of the M is unbeatable as long as you don't need fast AF.

I needed a Wide and Fast lens for my 60D but the best I could do was the Canon 24 f2.8 that by itself isn't as wide nor fast as the 22 f2 and more expensive than the M+22 Kit.

I am using it for video (M on tripod) and as carry everywhere camera.

When Canon released the new firmware and the 11-22 lens it was a 1-2 punch I couldn't resist and took the plunge.

When in doubt check the $2,500 Sony RX1 similar 35mm f2 lens and can't change it.

The IQ difference of these 2 cameras is very small though.

I cannot agree more.

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Jefenator
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Re: Value and Size
In reply to Photato, Sep 26, 2013

Photato wrote:

When in doubt check the $2,500 Sony RX1 similar 35mm f2 lens and can't change it.

The IQ difference of these 2 cameras is very small though.

I think of my EOS-M 22mm kit as being a poor man's RX1. The $2500 camera might have a bit more resolution, subject isolation and low light ability, but the $300 camera is more fun. 

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WT21
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Personal answer. but here's a macro idea
In reply to Peter63, Sep 26, 2013

Peter63 wrote:

I started with the 22 kit and love it for the compact form combined with great IQ. I bought the 18-55 but don't use it much because it makes the camera too big for a belt pouch. I took both lenses and M hiking last weekend and loved the light weight and capability but realized I want better macro ability, extension tubes just aren't working that well for me. So now I think I should get the EF adapter but then someone pointed out that the M plus adapter weigh the same as an SL1. I would rather have the SL1 with the efs 18-55 stm (same weight as efm 18-35 stm) and bring my 60 macro.

So now I am back to using the M with the 22 as an everyday cam in a belt pouch. I won't give up my DSLR, and I still want to buy a 70d and /or a 6d.

So I guess my question is for anyone who is keeping a DSLR and an M, when do you take the M instead of the DSLR and why? Is it weight, size, stealth, or something else?

Get a $50 legacy macro + adapter. Like an FD 50mm 3.5, or a Takumar or something. Cheap, and macro focus often needs manual anyway. A bonus (unlike tubes) is that you get a fun lens for portrait and other uses. I used MF macros on my m43 system when I had it. A lot of fun, and usually <$100 total with adapter. You can usually sell the lens again later with little or no loss, and the old lenses (e.g. Takumar) have some pretty different character to them. FDs have nice color and contrast.

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Photato
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Re: Value and Size
In reply to Jefenator, Sep 27, 2013

Jefenator wrote:

Photato wrote:

When in doubt check the $2,500 Sony RX1 similar 35mm f2 lens and can't change it.

The IQ difference of these 2 cameras is very small though.

I think of my EOS-M 22mm kit as being a poor man's RX1. The $2500 camera might have a bit more resolution, subject isolation and low light ability, but the $300 camera is more fun.

Or poor man's $ 8,000 Leica M9 (body only!)

Even if I had any of those cameras I wouldn't be taking it anywhere for fear of losing it, accidental fall or getting it stolen. Like it wouldn't be fun.

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Jefenator
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Re: Value and Size
In reply to Photato, Sep 27, 2013

Photato wrote:

Jefenator wrote:

I think of my EOS-M 22mm kit as being a poor man's RX1. The $2500 camera might have a bit more resolution, subject isolation and low light ability, but the $300 camera is more fun.

Or poor man's $ 8,000 Leica M9 (body only!)

Even if I had any of those cameras I wouldn't be taking it anywhere for fear of losing it, accidental fall or getting it stolen. Like it wouldn't be fun.

I dunno - the Leica seems kind of bulky?

http://j.mp/192egyT

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