EOS M2

Started 10 months ago | Discussions
Mahmoud Mousef
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Re: Panasonic GM1 - Features against which the M2 will be compared?
In reply to Lawrencew, 9 months ago

Lawrencew wrote:

It might be very small, but it still manages to pack in a host of features currently missing from the M.

Flash, WiFi, remote control, 43 focus points, "lightning fast" AF, Focus Peeking (even on the remote wifi App)

EOS M can receive old-skool infrared remote commands.

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Tom Hoots
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to John TF, 9 months ago

John TF wrote:

If this was next Friday I would agree with you. But don't forget that the big ProPlus(?) show starts in NYC on Wednesday and Canon has the biggest exhibit, so Wednesday or Thursday might still be likely candidates. But not after that, IMHO.

Agreed with you on that, at the least.

However, the first "new EOS-M" rumor came out on February 24, 2013.  Hasn't EVERY OTHER MIRRORLESS CAMERA MANUFACTURER announced or delivered SEVERAL new cameras (i.e., "more than one") since then?

I still really doubt that we'll see another EOS-M product -- lens, body, whatever.

Tom Hoots
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Jonathan Brady
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Tom Hoots, 9 months ago

The camera is barely a year old. Since when does Canon move at the speed of light?

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Tom Hoots
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Jonathan Brady, 9 months ago

Jonathan Brady wrote:

The camera is barely a year old. Since when does Canon move at the speed of light?

So, are you confirming that all of the rumors about new EOS-M bodies that we have seen over the past year have been COMPLETELY BOGUS?

Tom Hoots
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Jonathan Brady
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Tom Hoots, 9 months ago

Nope. I don't have that info. Neither do you.

Rumors are a combination of wish lists, prototypes, etc. So by their very nature, most do not come to fruition and thus, are considered to be "untrue" when a product finally launches.  Doesn't mean they NEVER existed.  Just that they didn't end up being the final product that does or does not hit the market. You SHOULD know THIS because pretty much everyone else does.

Also, Canon itself has given us the biggest clue that something is coming.  Putting "M2" in the DPP literature 13 times was a mistake, but not an accident.  Unless Canon decides to exit the LARGE mirrorless market (probably not a great idea), the M2 will show sooner or later just based on the DPP appearance, rumors regarding prototypes, and common sense (which seems to be in short supply).

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Iceman1973
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Jonathan Brady, 9 months ago

I agree with all you say Jonathan, and I kinda guess that canon are playing in the shadows as their  the new M might not match up to other manufaturer's offerings. But nothing wrong with that as many of us who use the current M know its ability - which is to deliver... and I mean DELIVER IQ, and it does this well. The camera only needs a few updates and it will be fine. Honestly for me, who prefers to shoot manual focus lenses, this is the prob the best mirrorless I've used (with magic lantern ofcourse) . I have a lcdvf when it's required I use it... I would say the only other camera that comes close in usability is the x100.

I feel canon should make at least an announcement to let its loyals know they have something in the works, which can be / would be delivered soon...

Sony took their time building their full frame mirrorless, and they delivered after almost a year and half. But during that year and half they have been outing other products as well, developing their line of lenses as well... why's it so difficult for canon to give the M a native 50mm 1.8? (i read that nikon are due to out a FF mirroless with a native 50mm 1.8 in a few weeks)

The M has a lot of potential, but maybe canon don't know how much. And if they do they need to address it.

The new Sony FF mirrorless offers peaking and zebra from out of the box - how difficult is it for Canon to join hands with Magic Lantern (they better do it before some other manufacturer does so) Sometimes I think maybe they takin the P!! but hey I'm just a end of line consumer what do I know!

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PhotoKhan
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Jonathan Brady, 9 months ago

Jonathan Brady wrote:

Putting "M2" in the DPP literature 13 times was a mistake, but not an accident.

Not only a mistake but, if an M2 does not come out until the end of the year, an extremely revealing one, as it indicates a deferred launch.

The reason why, could be an interesting question.

PK

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justmeMN
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Iceman1973, 9 months ago

I feel canon should make at least an announcement to let its loyals know they have something in the works, which can be / would be delivered soon...

An announcement like that would hurt sales of the original EOS M, and Canon apparently has plenty of those left to sell.

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tomtom50
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to justmeMN, 9 months ago

justmeMN wrote:

I feel canon should make at least an announcement to let its loyals know they have something in the works, which can be / would be delivered soon...

An announcement like that would hurt sales of the original EOS M, and Canon apparently has plenty of those left to sell.

How much did they over-produce?!!!

The fire sale has been going months, prices as low as $400 for EOS-m + 22mm + 18-55 + 90EX.

And still there are more!

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Jonathan Brady
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to tomtom50, 9 months ago

The current 2 lens + flash kits are coming in from Australia.  So, the US is picking up Australia's slack!    lol

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Gesture
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Jonathan Brady, 9 months ago

Wish I could pick up a kit on site in Aussie Land. There really is no way to rationalize the EOS-M introduction, pricing, marketing, sales, etc.

I look at the EOS-M and G1X as trial balloons by Canon to see what they could accomplish in that product space. Maybe, Fuji, Panasonic and Sony will finally nudge Canon and Nikon into modern times. It's more of a mystery why there is no G1X successor in place of yet another G (G16) small sensor, optical peephole camera than no EOS-M successor.

I've accepted that there could be no EOS-M2 and just enjoy my EOS-M. Backup bodies are still available at good prices. I've seen $250 for body only. In fact, instead of an EOS-M2, I'd just as soon see continued firmware updates. There has to be a way to make that focus box smaller and improve manual focus mode. The slow focus and buffer are what they are.

It's rare, but there have been quality orphan products in the past, most notable being Sony R1.

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Jonathan Brady
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Gesture, 9 months ago

Agreed.  Orphaned products/lines do happen, rarely.

To me, the real oddity to people claiming there won't be an M2 (aside from the fact that they seem to be ignoring 13 mentions of the M2 in DPP and a new sensor that seems destined to be in a mirrorless camera) is that they're basing MUCH of it on a quote from a Nikon exec about how the mirrorless market in the US hasn't been what they expected.  Ironically, Nikon just announced a NEW MIRRORLESS CAMERA.  One that will be WAY more niche than any of their other 1 series cameras.

So, if I'm understanding the logic behind claiming there won't be an M2 it's that...

The original M didn't sell well because it was AF-crippled and priced too high, a Nikon exec said US mirrorless sales are less than impressive, 1 lens hasn't been made available for US markets yet (happens with other manufacturers too - doesn't mean anything), and it's been about a year since the M hit the market.  Does that about wrap it up?  lol

Like you, I appreciate the M for what it is, and what it's capable of.  I've taken quite a few pictures that my family and I will value for many years to come with it - it's HIGHLY capable.  For me, an M2 (with the right lenses available) is my opportunity to move forward and ditch my 60D.

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Tom Hoots
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Jonathan Brady, 9 months ago

Jonathan Brady wrote:

Agreed. Orphaned products/lines do happen, rarely.

To me, the real oddity to people claiming there won't be an M2 (aside from the fact that they seem to be ignoring 13 mentions of the M2 in DPP and a new sensor that seems destined to be in a mirrorless camera) is that they're basing MUCH of it on a quote from a Nikon exec about how the mirrorless market in the US hasn't been what they expected. Ironically, Nikon just announced a NEW MIRRORLESS CAMERA. One that will be WAY more niche than any of their other 1 series cameras.

Jonathon,

Crikey!  Do you suppose that it takes a bit of lead time to write narrative text in a software program, and furthermore, perhaps some time between the software development and the actual distribution of that software, Canon might have CHANGED THEIR MINDS about actually developing, producing, and marketing the "M2" that's mentioned in DPP?  I consider the DPP mentions to be just about PRECISELY as reliable as all of the rumors from the Canon Rumors web site have been, in regards to any reality that an M2 might ever get released.

I have talked about the Nikon statements, but also about the abysmal sales figures from Olympus and others -- including Canon's EOS-M.  Yes, we read how mirrorless is doing quite well in Japan, but the EOS-M has a whopping TWO PERCENT of the Japan market, last I read.  Meanwhile, with all of the fire sales and Canon USA's decision not to sell the 11-22mm lens, it just boils down to how the EOS-M has been an ABYSMAL SALES FAILURE -- not one company on this planet can continue "selling" a camera that it cannot make a profit with.

So, just look at the G1X before it, and now the EOS-M -- yes, even Nikon with its "death march" press release has managed to produce a new mirrorless camera, while Canon has produced NOTHING.  Meanwhile, profitable or not, the other mirrorless manufacturers are developing and producing absolute BOATLOADS of new cameras.

I still submit that Canon will easily sell FAR MORE SL1 DSLR cameras than they'll ever sell any EOS-M cameras they will ever produce -- so WHY BOTHER??  Especially with the Canon USA decision with the 11-22mm lens, what makes far more sense to me is that they are just going to abandon these cameras and the EOS-M system -- they put a nail in the coffin when they released the SL1, which gives them a small and lightweight camera that can still fit within their DSLR range that they protect so strongly.

I'm not so sure that Canon will "cease production" of the G1X and the EOS-M -- the development has been done, and they can crank out and sell whatever quantities that they can sell.  They might as well milk them until the sales are completely moribund.

The original M didn't sell well because it was AF-crippled and priced too high, a Nikon exec said US mirrorless sales are less than impressive, 1 lens hasn't been made available for US markets yet (happens with other manufacturers too - doesn't mean anything), and it's been about a year since the M hit the market. Does that about wrap it up?

I think it's absolute folly to dismiss Canon USA's decision not to sell the 11-22mm lens, just like it's folly to dismiss how you can now buy full two-lens-plus-flash systems for less than some of Canon's compact-sensor cameras.  You can say that "Oh, it's just the United States," but the US market isn't exactly chopped liver, and in fact plenty of online retailers are dumping EOS-M systems originally destined to be sold in other markets into the US market, and for anyone else who can place an international order with them.

In the end, it just boils down to "something isn't right here" -- and there's just no doubt whatsoever that "what's wrong" is "no profits."  And I just don't expect Canon to develop a new camera that it still can't make any profits with -- it's as pure and simple as that.

As I've said again, I'm not saying ANYTHING AT ALL about the actual pieces of equipment that are the current EOS-M bodies and lenses -- they are quality products, and they produce great image quality.  They have "pros and cons" to them like any other camera or system, but they are what they are.  As I've said before, I've got two bodies -- I'm not knocking the actual equipment at all.

However, the fact remains that the EOS-M's feature set fell far below the average feature set of its competitors in the market, and it was INSANELY overpriced against those competitors -- even without the fatal slow focusing failure that it shipped with, it already had two strikes against it compared to the competition.  It all adds up to why its sales were nearly stillborn, right from the start.  And now we have whole new generations -- GENERATIONS -- of competitors that have leapfrogged over it.

Well, I suppose I'm near the limit here, so I'll leave it there.  But I think it all boils down to how the most prudent thing Canon can do FINANCIALLY is to just stop where they are, and walk away.

Tom Hoots
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UCSB
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Re: EOS M2
In reply to Tom Hoots, 9 months ago

^^  Trying to analyze Canon's future plans without access to them is foolish.  Canon works on their own timetable and generally does not share info prior to an announcement.  I've been following Canon since 1987 when I switched to the EOS system;  there is no way to second guess Canon on a pure strategy move like the EOS M line.  It is very rare to be able to time new product announcements or product specifications (exceptions would be the EOS Rebel line that is released every year) coming from Canon.

Sometimes an intelligent person just has to admit that they do not know what is unfolding ... end of story.

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MisterPootieCat
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Odds are not good
In reply to Tom Hoots, 9 months ago

Tom Hoots wrote:

John TF wrote:

If this was next Friday I would agree with you. But don't forget that the big ProPlus(?) show starts in NYC on Wednesday and Canon has the biggest exhibit, so Wednesday or Thursday might still be likely candidates. But not after that, IMHO.

Agreed with you on that, at the least.

However, the first "new EOS-M" rumor came out on February 24, 2013. Hasn't EVERY OTHER MIRRORLESS CAMERA MANUFACTURER announced or delivered SEVERAL new cameras (i.e., "more than one") since then?

I still really doubt that we'll see another EOS-M product -- lens, body, whatever.

Yeah, as the weeks and months slip away it certainly looks like Canon has quietly slipped out the back door of the MILC stage. Prices for the EOS M are still dropping, the EOS M/18-55/90EX kit is now $359 at B&H. The lens adapter is down to $129.

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Gesture
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Re: Odds are not good
In reply to MisterPootieCat, 9 months ago

It is kind of amazing that stock is still available.

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MisterPootieCat
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Re: Odds are not good
In reply to Gesture, 9 months ago

Gesture wrote:

It is kind of amazing that stock is still available.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Canon must've made a boatload of them!

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Lawrencew
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Re: Odds are not good
In reply to MisterPootieCat, 9 months ago

MisterPootieCat wrote:

Gesture wrote:

It is kind of amazing that stock is still available.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Canon must've made a boatload of them!

What makes you think they no longer make them, or only made one batch?

If you buy one today, they have V2 software installed.  That at least indicates they cannot have been languishing in some warehouse since manufacturer pre-V2. (though pre-built units can of course be configured and packaged on-demand)

There's never been any shortage of EOS M, and the deals don't seem like drying up, so perhaps it is simply still in production.

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Setter Dog
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Re: Viewfinder and different body style...
In reply to akjos, 9 months ago

akjos wrote:

I got my m few days ago and its love/ hate relationship...
Love the lenses and touchscreen is nice but lcd is hardly visible in bright light ... Lack of viewfinder and external buttons and atrocious grip ( or lack of) make it quite a pain to use...
Love the lenses ( zoom and 22)
I was almost ready to sell it

I've had mine since early in the period when B@H was selling them for $350. I have the same complaints as akjos. I feel like I'm taking pictures with a bar of soap made of lead.

The little camera takes really great pictures but I just don't find it a fun camera to use. I looked on eBay with the idea of selling it. The only used one that actually sold went for $150 before fees and sales commissions. At that value point, I'll keep it as an extra. I like the images well enough that I would consider the M2, but only if it had an EVF and was easier to grip.

Jack

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MisterPootieCat
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Re: Odds are not good
In reply to Lawrencew, 9 months ago

Lawrencew wrote:

MisterPootieCat wrote:

Gesture wrote:

It is kind of amazing that stock is still available.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Canon must've made a boatload of them!

What makes you think they no longer make them, or only made one batch?

I didn't say they only made one batch. But you can't order the EOS M from Canon anymore. And it's already common knowledge the kits have been cannibalized for the lens adapter and 22mm lenses.

If you buy one today, they have V2 software installed. That at least indicates they cannot have been languishing in some warehouse since manufacturer pre-V2. (though pre-built units can of course be configured and packaged on-demand)

This has been discussed already, Canon could easily update the firmware in older cameras prior to shipping. It wouldn't be the first time they've done it.

There's never been any shortage of EOS M, and the deals don't seem like drying up, so perhaps it is simply still in production.

Yeah, products that don't sell tend to back up in the pipeline. I have 2 EOS M bodies, the second one I bought (from the same vendor) has a much lower serial number, kind of blows the fresh batch theory out the window.

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