Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?

Started Sep 5, 2013 | Discussions
JulesJ
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Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
Sep 5, 2013
GodSpeaks
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 6, 2013

Change.org is a spam site.  I will never go there again.

One time I signed one of their petitions, and after that I was bombed with constant spam from them wanting me to sign this or that petition.  It took me a long long time to be rid of them.

NEVER again.

Also Jules, Adobe just does not care.

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CallMeAlan
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 6, 2013

Yeah, right, great idea.  I have no doubt Adobe will sit up and take notice, and immediately withdraw their entire monthly subscription model, whispering to each other "I can't understand why they don't seem to like it."

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I've been reading all about something called denial. I don't believe a word of it.

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JulesJ
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to GodSpeaks, Sep 6, 2013

GodSpeaks wrote:

Change.org is a spam site. I will never go there again.

One time I signed one of their petitions, and after that I was bombed with constant spam from them wanting me to sign this or that petition. It took me a long long time to be rid of them.

NEVER again.

Also Jules, Adobe just does not care.

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The greatest of mankind's criminals are those who delude themselves into thinking they have done 'the right thing.'
- Rayna Butler

I have signed a few of their petitions. I only get a few emails from them.

Wiki describes their business here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Change.org

I think they are for the good.

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sdribetahi
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 6, 2013

change.org is a liberal bastion of pantie wastes. My keyboard would melt if I clicked on that scourge of the internet.

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JulesJ
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to sdribetahi, Sep 7, 2013

sdribetahi wrote:

change.org is a liberal bastion of pantie wastes. My keyboard would melt if I clicked on that scourge of the internet.

Who cares who runs it, it has had a lot of successes. That's the sad thing out extreme political people, they miss out on half the world because they only use half their brains. They reject everything to do with the political bent they prefer and miss out on the other half. I guess you are not into most of the great artists of the last couple of centuries then Sdridibatwrk?

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Ron Poelman
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Vote with your wallet, J.
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 7, 2013

it's the only language they understand.

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Daisy AU
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Re: Vote with your wallet, J.
In reply to Ron Poelman, Sep 7, 2013

Ron Poelman wrote:

it's the only language they understand.

Exactly!

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JulesJ
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Re: Vote with your wallet, J.
In reply to Ron Poelman, Sep 7, 2013

Ron Poelman wrote:

it's the only language they understand.

It didn't cost me a cent to vote.

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JulesJ
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Re: Vote with your wallet, J.
In reply to Daisy AU, Sep 7, 2013

Daisy AU wrote:

Ron Poelman wrote:

it's the only language they understand.

Exactly!

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Daisy AU - Brisbane
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Ditto. It doesn't cost anything to vote.

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Michel J
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 8, 2013

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

Salut Jules,

I talked with Swiss photographer today, she's ulcerated by this kind of practice.

For the rest of us... who invested to get a friendly environment, but what they do with "our" money?

Cheers,

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Michel J
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happypoppeye
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Nah...
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 9, 2013

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

I would consider paying maybe up to $4.00 per month for the Adobe stuff but nothing more, but I'm not going to sign a petition. It's Adobe's business and they can do anything they want with it. I have always used Adobe PP software and probably always will, but I'm not turning it into a monthly bill and I'm not worried if they go out of business.

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JulesJ
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Re: Nah...
In reply to happypoppeye, Sep 9, 2013

happypoppeye wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

I would consider paying maybe up to $4.00 per month for the Adobe stuff but nothing more, but I'm not going to sign a petition. It's Adobe's business and they can do anything they want with it. I have always used Adobe PP software and probably always will, but I'm not turning it into a monthly bill and I'm not worried if they go out of business.

They won't be going out of business. But you miss the point. Lots of small businesses, who for decades have happily supported Adobe and used their excellent products, are not forced into a system they don't want, never asked for, and are not happy about. You say you always will use their software. When you upgrade your camera to a new one it is likely not to be supported by the software you have now. If you are happy to just use jpgs or another company's Raw converter that is ok. But eventually your last version of PhotoShop will undoubtably not work properly.

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John1940
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Re: Nah...
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 9, 2013

JulesJ wrote:

happypoppeye wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

I would consider paying maybe up to $4.00 per month for the Adobe stuff but nothing more, but I'm not going to sign a petition. It's Adobe's business and they can do anything they want with it. I have always used Adobe PP software and probably always will, but I'm not turning it into a monthly bill and I'm not worried if they go out of business.

They won't be going out of business. But you miss the point. Lots of small businesses, who for decades have happily supported Adobe and used their excellent products, are not forced into a system they don't want, never asked for, and are not happy about. You say you always will use their software. When you upgrade your camera to a new one it is likely not to be supported by the software you have now. If you are happy to just use jpgs or another company's Raw converter that is ok. But eventually your last version of PhotoShop will undoubtably not work properly.

I don't agree with your last sentence, Jules. I submit that you can always use something such as Canon's DPP RAW converter and (as I have found out) input its TIFF output into ACR, Brigge, Lightroom as well as Photoshop. Is there any difference in image quality (apart from DPP haveing a better or worse demosaicing algorithm than ACR's) if you use 16-bit TIFF? I say no.

Is there any function in any of the four Adobe offerings above that will not work properly and the same way as if one started with ACR? Not that I can see with Bridge, Lightroom or Photoshop.

If you start with ACR in any of the last three packages, then, since they use ACR as a plug-in, your workflow will probably be faster, but you pay for that by having to pay the CC fees monthly.

ACR used by those packages creates an internal equivalent of TIFF by doing demosaicing first. All subsequent work is done on that. There is full capability to change anything or everything in terms of the original RAW settings after that conversion to a real TIFF or an internal version with RGB at every pixel location. If I use ACR by itself and create a real TIFF and don't tell the other packages that it came from ACR as a separate package, I get exactly the same result image quality-wise as if I used, for example, Photoshop with its ACR plug in. If anyone has tried this and has come to a different conclusion, I'd like to hear about it.

John1940

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GodSpeaks
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 9, 2013

JulesJ wrote:

I have signed a few of their petitions. I only get a few emails from them.

Wiki describes their business here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Change.org

I think they are for the good.

Sorry Jules, my experience is otherwise.

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JulesJ
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Re: Nah...
In reply to John1940, Sep 9, 2013

John1940 wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

happypoppeye wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

I would consider paying maybe up to $4.00 per month for the Adobe stuff but nothing more, but I'm not going to sign a petition. It's Adobe's business and they can do anything they want with it. I have always used Adobe PP software and probably always will, but I'm not turning it into a monthly bill and I'm not worried if they go out of business.

They won't be going out of business. But you miss the point. Lots of small businesses, who for decades have happily supported Adobe and used their excellent products, are not forced into a system they don't want, never asked for, and are not happy about. You say you always will use their software. When you upgrade your camera to a new one it is likely not to be supported by the software you have now. If you are happy to just use jpgs or another company's Raw converter that is ok. But eventually your last version of PhotoShop will undoubtably not work properly.

I don't agree with your last sentence, Jules. I submit that you can always use something such as Canon's DPP RAW converter and (as I have found out) input its TIFF output into ACR, Brigge, Lightroom as well as Photoshop. Is there any difference in image quality (apart from DPP haveing a better or worse demosaicing algorithm than ACR's) if you use 16-bit TIFF? I say no.

Is there any function in any of the four Adobe offerings above that will not work properly and the same way as if one started with ACR? Not that I can see with Bridge, Lightroom or Photoshop.

If you start with ACR in any of the last three packages, then, since they use ACR as a plug-in, your workflow will probably be faster, but you pay for that by having to pay the CC fees monthly.

ACR used by those packages creates an internal equivalent of TIFF by doing demosaicing first. All subsequent work is done on that. There is full capability to change anything or everything in terms of the original RAW settings after that conversion to a real TIFF or an internal version with RGB at every pixel location. If I use ACR by itself and create a real TIFF and don't tell the other packages that it came from ACR as a separate package, I get exactly the same result image quality-wise as if I used, for example, Photoshop with its ACR plug in. If anyone has tried this and has come to a different conclusion, I'd like to hear about it.

John1940

I'm sure you are right John. But i have been using PS professionally since PS4 and this change is definitely not to my liking. I want to upgrade when I want to upgrade. The monthly cost to us in Europe is also higher that to the US (as was the cost of upgrading) so it will not be cheap.

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Michel J
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Re: Nah...
In reply to happypoppeye, Sep 10, 2013

happypoppeye wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

Then please sign this Change.Org petition please.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model

Jules

I would consider paying maybe up to $4.00 per month for the Adobe stuff but nothing more, but I'm not going to sign a petition. It's Adobe's business and they can do anything they want with it. I have always used Adobe PP software and probably always will, but I'm not turning it into a monthly bill and I'm not worried if they go out of business.

oh! really...?

No matter the price you pay: in the consumerism dogma, "Clouds Computing" is the final step of total subservience to planned obsolescence (and one more step towards a safe paranoid world...?).

Is like passing the point of no return, when we are no longer 'owners' of softwares we buy. Boot net, and so on ...

If you know how much an iPad is "unfriendly" in this matter, you can know how much you can be enslaved in the future......

Cheers,

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Michel J
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ericN2
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 10, 2013

Votes on paper type of thing are and have always been a total utter waste of time. NOBODY takes any real notice - they may make noises of some sort in a kind of acknowledgment but NOTHING ever gets done or changed.

As Ron (above here probably) has said..Vote with your wallet closed.. THAT does affect them and that's when they really do see that it is something that seems likely to hurt their pockets.
I'd NEVER buy anything from Adobe or otherwise on some sort of Subscription basis.. make them aware of this intended decline in sales and THAT is seen to have a much bigger affect on them ... then they will realise that they may well be financially worse off in pocket.. money seems to be what encourages or discourages most things these days.

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/eric
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JulesJ
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to ericN2, Sep 10, 2013

ericN2 wrote:

Votes on paper type of thing are and have always been a total utter waste of time. NOBODY takes any real notice - they may make noises of some sort in a kind of acknowledgment but NOTHING ever gets done or changed.

Well, best you never state a view to anyone then. I have always spoken out against what i think is wrong, as have millions over history and changed many things for the better.

But buy taking your (non) stance, you can never complain about anything.

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ericN2
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Re: Adobe Cloud. Against monthly subs?
In reply to JulesJ, Sep 10, 2013

JulesJ wrote:

ericN2 wrote:

Votes on paper type of thing are and have always been a total utter waste of time. NOBODY takes any real notice - they may make noises of some sort in a kind of acknowledgment but NOTHING ever gets done or changed.

Well, best you never state a view to anyone then. I have always spoken out against what i think is wrong, as have millions over history and changed many things for the better.

But buy taking your (non) stance, you can never complain about anything.

Jules -

Of course you do ... you complain by NOT buying.. I'd like to bet that avoidance of a product by NON-sales has had far more effect, more often, than just a vocal (or written , which is worse) method of expressing your feelings.  The beauty of it is that there are many alternatives in this case..indeed  Adobe is by means in the same controlling position as they were in years ago.. other excellent products are being sold and used and Adobe now really has a competitive world to live in.

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/eric
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