70-400 II produce worst images than version I?

Started Sep 2, 2013 | Discussions
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
Sep 2, 2013

Surfing the net for comparative reviews between old 70-400 and the new one, I found yhis youtube video.

http://youtu.be/QzKQWqTUJ6Y

But even though the reviewer sees better photos with version II, if you take print screens of the last compartive photos, version's I IQ always beat version's II. Check by yourself.

Does any of our members have acces to both versions to perform and show us independent comparative samples of several real world subjects.

I've already tested version II at my local Sony store, and focusing is very very fast... But are the outputs as focused as those provided by the slow focusing versión I?

Thanks in advance,

Ed

busch
Forum ProPosts: 29,786Gear list
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

Condor wrote:

clip

I've already tested version II at my local Sony store, and focusing is very very fast... But are the outputs as focused as those provided by the slow focusing versión I?

Yes! I went form G1 to G2 and my keeper rate improved.

-- hide signature --

Busch
Take the scenic route! Life is too short to do otherwise.
My Photos

 busch's gear list:busch's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-R1 Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS7 Sony a77 II Sony 70-200mm F2.8 G Sony 16-35mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* +14 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to busch, Sep 2, 2013

busch wrote:

Condor wrote:

clip

I've already tested version II at my local Sony store, and focusing is very very fast... But are the outputs as focused as those provided by the slow focusing versión I?

Yes! I went form G1 to G2 and my keeper rate improved

Excellent, you have G1 and G2. Could you show to all of us real world compartive samples to verify IQs by ourselves (originals please).

Thanks in advance,

Ed

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Amateur Sony Shooter
Senior MemberPosts: 5,320Gear list
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

I have G1 and had G2 for over a month for AB test, AF speed G2 is about 20-30% faster than G1 (still image), image quality they are the same. In some cases I think my G1 is touch bit sharper but that could be just micro adjustment issue. In the end I am keeping my G1.

 Amateur Sony Shooter's gear list:Amateur Sony Shooter's gear list
Sony RX100 Sony SLT-A99 Sony 70-200mm F2.8 G Sony 16-35mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* Sony 24-70mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* +6 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

G2

400mm comparative samples:

G1

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
JohnBee
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,975
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

1:1 crops?
EXIF?

-- hide signature --

This is where I'd normally write an impressive summary of my skills and proficiencies.

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Amateur Sony Shooter, Sep 2, 2013

Amateur Sony Shooter wrote:

I have G1 and had G2 for over a month for AB test, AF speed G2 is about 20-30% faster than G1 (still image), image quality they are the same...

Excellent input

In some cases I think my G1 is touch bit sharper but that could be just micro adjustment issue. In the end I am keeping my G1.

I also find G1 output's sharper than G2.

Ed

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to JohnBee, Sep 2, 2013

G1

G2

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
JohnBee
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,975
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

The fruit in the G2 image is back focused.
But what about the first set?
Where these 1:1 crops?
And what about shutter speed, aperture etc?

-- hide signature --

This is where I'd normally write an impressive summary of my skills and proficiencies.

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Michael Fritzen
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,718
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

AFAIK there's not a single claim the GII is performing optically better than the G1. However I have no doubts that keeper rate can rise quite significantly because of the improved AF speed (even more when precision is maintained or even improved).

Please consider the following points as additional possible factors for improved keeper rate: 1) SLT - so no more slapping mirror and such less vibrations; 2) Better camera-AF system with MFA providing best possible precision; 3) Better high ISO performance which allows for working with faster exposure times - much more important for tack sharp photos than commonly considered (for high resolving sensors the suggestions have left the "film-time-value" of 1/FL for quite some time, oscilating now at about 1/(2 x FL) to 1/(3 x FL) for best results.

So at least for handheld shooting at long FL it's counterproductive with modern camera to main ISO low for best low noise results when results suffer degradation from blur due to handshake and/or subject moves.

-- hide signature --

Cheers,
Michael Fritzen

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to JohnBee, Sep 2, 2013

JohnBee wrote:

The fruit in the G2 image is back focused.

What do you mean? I do not see any single piece back of the fruit focused.

In which case. Whatt's the benefit of fast focusing... If it is not focused?

But what about the first set?
Where these 1:1 crops?
And what about shutter speed, aperture etc.

Auto mode I suppose (read the OP), but who cares? The lenses were tested using the very same alpha camera.

Ed

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Ed at Ridersite
Forum ProPosts: 15,750
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

Why no EXIF?  And, why shooting on auto?  The settings could have been different.  If not, how are we to know?

I don't think peaches are a very good subject for demonstrating sharpness regardless.  Animal hair or bird feathers work much better.  It's very hard to set up a good test, but using hair or a bird feather in some way might work.

-- hide signature --

AEH
http://aehass.zenfolio.com/
http://aehass.zenfolio.com/blog
Question: What do you do all week?
Answer: Mon to Fri. Nothing, Sat & Sun I rest!

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
JohnBee
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,975
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

Condor wrote:

JohnBee wrote:

The fruit in the G2 image is back focused.

What do you mean? I do not see any single piece back of the fruit focused.

In which case. Whatt's the benefit of fast focusing... If it is not focused?

In the G2 image the foreground leave is in focus whereas the fruit is not. Which makes it completely useless to compare with the G1 image in this particular sample. Likewise, the first two image comparisons give no valuable image data whatsoever from which to do a comparison. To which I'd add, do nothing to help the issue along I'm afraid. ie. what arguments such as these need are resolution charts and large sample averages so as to help reduce such things as copy variance and the likes.

There's more though I think this is plenty to put a proper perspective on the limitations of these particular samples imo.

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
RoxanneY
Contributing MemberPosts: 563Gear list
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

Ack!  I was assuming that Sony would do this kind of testing before releasing a new lens.  It's scary to think that the 70400G2 wouldn't be as good as the 70400G considering the prices we're talking about.

Roxanne

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Dr Tone
Regular MemberPosts: 114Gear list
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to RoxanneY, Sep 2, 2013

The lens are the same optically. Upgraded focusing and improved coating on the G2.

Individual samples might be better than the other. One isn't 100% better than the other all the time.

 Dr Tone's gear list:Dr Tone's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX100 III Sony SLT-A99 Sony 16-35mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* Sigma 35mm F1.4 DG HSM Sony 70-400mm F4-5.6 G SSM II +4 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
rob_b
Contributing MemberPosts: 514Gear list
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Ed at Ridersite, Sep 2, 2013

Interestingly, Ed, have a look at the single thread of gossamer on the G1, that is missing from the G2 image. Definitely either a different in focus position or sharpness.

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Alan_S
Senior MemberPosts: 1,479Gear list
Like?
Okay, I'll take the bait; have both lenses...
In reply to Condor, Sep 2, 2013

Condor wrote:

Does any of our members have acces to both versions to perform and show us independent comparative samples of several real world subjects.

Haven't done any direct side by side comparison until now (gotta get around to geeing the silver one photographed and advertised for sale!). Just a quick snap from both, manually focused (with focus magnifier) on the center of the image at about 4 meters; on a tripod; taken with two separate a99, same settings, RAW, processed with identical ACR settings... Far from a scientific comparison but about as close as I'm gonna get ! .. and, as expected, I don't see any difference other than the tiniest bit of focus difference with this razor thin DOF and some movement in the grass blades due to the breeze.

G1

G2

they were taken just a few minutes apart... I see the exif shows different -- just checked an in the a99 with the G2 attached I had neglected to turn Daylight Savings 'on' so it's showing an hour early.

-- hide signature --

- AlanS

 Alan_S's gear list:Alan_S's gear list
Sony SLT-A77 Sony SLT-A99 Sony 70-200mm F2.8 G Sony 16-35mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* Sony 24-70mm F2.8 ZA SSM Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* +1 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Condor
Senior MemberPosts: 1,768
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to Dr Tone, Sep 3, 2013

G2

G1

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
linzdoctor7d
Contributing MemberPosts: 768Gear list
Like?
Real test shots and review of 70-400 II lens!
In reply to Condor, Sep 3, 2013

Condor wrote:

Surfing the net for comparative reviews between old 70-400 and the new one, I found yhis youtube video.

http://youtu.be/QzKQWqTUJ6Y

But even though the reviewer sees better photos with version II, if you take print screens of the last compartive photos, version's I IQ always beat version's II. Check by yourself.

Does any of our members have acces to both versions to perform and show us independent comparative samples of several real world subjects.

I've already tested version II at my local Sony store, and focusing is very very fast... But are the outputs as focused as those provided by the slow focusing versión I?

Thanks in advance,

Ed

I trust this reviewer opinion over that dude on your you tube link any day since he does have real images to compare and not captures from a video! Hope you enjoy them sharp images in Gustav's review!

http://www.dyxum.com/DFORUM/today-try-the-new-sal70400-ssm-g-ii_topic96363_page1.html

 linzdoctor7d's gear list:linzdoctor7d's gear list
Minolta DiMAGE 7 Minolta DiMAGE A1 Konica Minolta Maxxum 7D Sony Alpha DSLR-A100 Sony Alpha DSLR-A700 +28 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Ed at Ridersite
Forum ProPosts: 15,750
Like?
Re: 70-400 II produce worst images than version I?
In reply to rob_b, Sep 3, 2013

rob_b wrote:

Interestingly, Ed, have a look at the single thread of gossamer on the G1, that is missing from the G2 image. Definitely either a different in focus position or sharpness.

I agree.  I have the G2.  No way it's that different.  The problem is, I really can't tell what the OP did.  The crops are different, the focus is different and who knows about the settings.

-- hide signature --

AEH
http://aehass.zenfolio.com/
http://aehass.zenfolio.com/blog
Question: What do you do all week?
Answer: Mon to Fri. Nothing, Sat & Sun I rest!

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads