Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?

Started Aug 20, 2013 | Discussions
TGM123
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Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
Aug 20, 2013

All,

I primarily shoot sports and portraits.

Looks the new 7D II is only a matter of time at this point. While I don’t put too much stock in rumors, they seem to have been coalescing around better ISO performance, higher MP (20-24), 10FPS, “high grade” weather sealing, and a improved AF system (5D III like) and at a price point about $1000 cheaper than the 5D III:

http://www.canonwatch.com/rumor-canon-prototyping-various-sensors-for-the-eos-7d-mark-ii-24mp/

I am trying to decide if I should wait for the 7D II or go with the 5D III. Before these specs started gaining more credibility, I was going to pull the trigger on the 5D III but…alas…I have doubts.

So, IF these stats end up being correct, would you still want to buy the 5D MrkIII for what looks like will be an extra $1000 if you were are sports/portraits shooter?

I would love to hear your thoughts.

Thanks,

Tom

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24Peter
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 20, 2013

TGM123 wrote:

All,

I primarily shoot sports and portraits.

Looks the new 7D II is only a matter of time at this point. While I don’t put too much stock in rumors, they seem to have been coalescing around better ISO performance, higher MP (20-24), 10FPS, “high grade” weather sealing, and a improved AF system (5D III like) and at a price point about $1000 cheaper than the 5D III:

http://www.canonwatch.com/rumor-canon-prototyping-various-sensors-for-the-eos-7d-mark-ii-24mp/

I am trying to decide if I should wait for the 7D II or go with the 5D III. Before these specs started gaining more credibility, I was going to pull the trigger on the 5D III but…alas…I have doubts.

So, IF these stats end up being correct, would you still want to buy the 5D MrkIII for what looks like will be an extra $1000 if you were are sports/portraits shooter?

The canonwatch page says the 7DII would come in around $2000. I'm seeing 5DIII's being advertised in the $2400-$2600 range. The general consensus is the 7DII is not happening in 2013. For $400-600, why wouldn't you buy a 5DIII now - use it, earn money with it, enjoy it, whatever and then if the 7DII is so great when it comes out, sell the 5DIII and get a 7DII. IMO you're agonizing over nothing.

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bhollis
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 20, 2013

TGM123 wrote:

All,

I primarily shoot sports and portraits.

Looks the new 7D II is only a matter of time at this point. While I don’t put too much stock in rumors, they seem to have been coalescing around better ISO performance, higher MP (20-24), 10FPS, “high grade” weather sealing, and a improved AF system (5D III like) and at a price point about $1000 cheaper than the 5D III:

http://www.canonwatch.com/rumor-canon-prototyping-various-sensors-for-the-eos-7d-mark-ii-24mp/

I am trying to decide if I should wait for the 7D II or go with the 5D III. Before these specs started gaining more credibility, I was going to pull the trigger on the 5D III but…alas…I have doubts.

So, IF these stats end up being correct, would you still want to buy the 5D MrkIII for what looks like will be an extra $1000 if you were are sports/portraits shooter?

I would love to hear your thoughts.

First, I would say that those rumored specs are just that--rumor.  Far from clear to me that this latest list of specs has any more credibility than any of the other rumored specs that are circulating.

Second, I'd be very, very surprised if the 7D2's high ISO performance matches that of the 5D3.  Very unlikely IMO, particularly since it appears the new 70D's sensor doesn't offer much in the way of improved ISO performance over the 60D it replaces.

Third, if it has all the features listed, and great high ISO performance, I'll be very surprised if it comes in at $2,000.  If it does, then no one will buy the 5D3.

If you can afford to wait, and are willing to accept the possibility that, after waiting, the 7D2 that's actually delivered may fall well short of your hopes, then go ahead and wait.  Otherwise, if the 5D3 checks all your boxes, find the best price you can on a new or refurbished copy of the 5D3, and start shooting with what I consider to be the best all-round camera I've ever owned (and I've owned a few).

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Shield3
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to bhollis, Aug 21, 2013

Yes, and twice on Sundays.  Especially now with the raw video - no question.

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qianp2k
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

TGM123 wrote:

All,

I primarily shoot sports and portraits.

They are two very different areas.  Sports are not really FL limit as you always can find a longer lens to overcome pixel density disadvantage from a FF camera.  In other side, FF is much better in portrait photos than crop.

Looks the new 7D II is only a matter of time at this point.

Not going to happen until next year or be late around mid year next year.  5DIII is present and is quite capable for sports or fast action photos.

While I don’t put too much stock in rumors, they seem to have been coalescing around better ISO performance, higher MP (20-24), 10FPS, “high grade” weather sealing, and a improved AF system (5D III like) and at a price point about $1000 cheaper than the 5D III:

http://www.canonwatch.com/rumor-canon-prototyping-various-sensors-for-the-eos-7d-mark-ii-24mp/

7DII likely will based on 70D 20mp sensor or a newer APS-C sensor but still no way can compete to 5DIII in high ISO or even in low ISO when view in big size that determined by SNR (signal to noise ratio).  Canon FF cameras 5D3 and 6D are still much better than the best APS-C cameras from Nikon D7100/D5200 in sharpness, fine details and high ISO when view in big size.   It will be faster and you can use shorter and cheaper lenses nevertheless.  But 7DII will be no 1DX, not just from IQ but from actual performance perspective (not fooled by paper spec).

I am trying to decide if I should wait for the 7D II or go with the 5D III. Before these specs started gaining more credibility, I was going to pull the trigger on the 5D III but…alas…I have doubts.

So, IF these stats end up being correct, would you still want to buy the 5D MrkIII for what looks like will be an extra $1000 if you were are sports/portraits shooter?

It seems you can wait a bit.  Then you can find a $2500 5D3 body in the coming holiday season.  You just miss a $2500 5D3 body deal from BVI two weeks' ago.  I bought a brand new $2500 5DIII body in the last Black Friday with USA warranty card and all original OEM items included and very happy after these months.

I would love to hear your thoughts.

Good luck for your next purchase.

Thanks,

Tom

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gabiphoto
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

Honestly, do you think that Canon will make an APS-C camera with an IQ close to the one from 5D MK3 which is a full-frame camera ??? Come on, man ,be serious !!!!!  Take your money and go buy your copy of 5D MK3 and stop being such a child !!!!!!

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clarkent1234
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to gabiphoto, Aug 21, 2013

Honestly, do you think that Canon will make an APS-C camera with an IQ close to the one from 5D MK3 which is a full-frame camera ??? Come on, man ,be serious !!!!!  Take your money and go buy your copy of 5D MK3 and stop being such a child !!!!!!

Haha some people can wait for something that's not even coming out. And they don't know what's coming too. Some serious faith.

What happened to taking photos today anymore? Everyone seems to be stuck on the next version of something.

Buy the 5dmk3, it will blow your head off.

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joseph shtekler
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to clarkent1234, Aug 21, 2013

clarkent1234 wrote:

Honestly, do you think that Canon will make an APS-C camera with an IQ close to the one from 5D MK3 which is a full-frame camera ??? Come on, man ,be serious !!!!! Take your money and go buy your copy of 5D MK3 and stop being such a child !!!!!!

Haha some people can wait for something that's not even coming out. And they don't know what's coming too. Some serious faith.

What happened to taking photos today anymore? Everyone seems to be stuck on the next version of something.

Buy the 5dmk3, it will blow your head off.

You are right, if you want the best camera that just came out from the oven. you better be rich.

buy what you realy need and can afford.

I bought the 6D it good camera.  (but if I had more money I would buy the 5DIII )

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Petroglyph
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

If these rumours come true, I plan to buy the 7DII this fall (with 1.4X TC III) and then save my penny(s) for the 5D IV next year.  Unless, of course, Pentax announce they will be giving away the 60MP 645D II medium format camera to the first 1000 lucky customers.  I'll get in line for that one.  Still have to buy a lens or three for that though as I currently have zero.  .

Cheers.

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Muresan Bogdan
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

I bought one and probably buy a second one as soon as I can afford it. The IQ and ISO performance of a FF will never be beaten by an APSC  body. So the money difference is going somewhere. Also if the 7d ii comes with just one card slot the 5d has one more advantage.

In your case I guess it depends a lot what you shoot now. Do you need a new camera? I would say you don't if you can wait for a year for the 7d ii to come out. If you do need a new camera, you will not be dissapointed by the 5d III.

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Press Correspondent
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Parallel
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

There is a difference between a car and a mountain bike. You can ride either, but one is fast and luxurious; the other you can carry. Which one to get? Hmm... Let me ask the forum...

There is a difference between sports and portraits. One needs a long reach; the other needs a shallow DOF, but you can shoot with either camera. Which one to get? Well, the answer is actually very logical and simple: decide what your primary goal is, sports or portraits.

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qianp2k
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Re: Parallel
In reply to Press Correspondent, Aug 21, 2013

Press Correspondent wrote:

There is a difference between a car and a mountain bike. You can ride either, but one is fast and luxurious; the other you can carry. Which one to get? Hmm... Let me ask the forum...

There is a difference between sports and portraits. One needs a long reach; the other needs a shallow DOF, but you can shoot with either camera. Which one to get? Well, the answer is actually very logical and simple: decide what your primary goal is, sports or portraits.

Sports are not really FL limit as you always can find longer lens (unlike wildlife especially birding). It's basically no issue for those switched from 1D4/1D3 to 1DX. Instead of using 300L, now those sports PJs use 400L or 500L. In other side, they get wider angle when players running close, and of course better IQ especially in low light.

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Buchanan
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

Yes I would still buy the 5DIII.  I shoot mostly indoor high school sports and wanted considerably better low light performance than my Canon crop.  I can't imagine the 7DII will come close to what I now have.  If the new 7D somehow could improve on the old one by 2 stops I would change my answer but I don't see that happening.

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Graham
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Re: Would you still by the 5D Mrk III?
In reply to TGM123, Aug 21, 2013

For what it is worth, I bought the 5D Mark III (relegating my 5D Mark II to the status of backup camera) about 3 weeks ago.

The first Mark III was a huge disappointment - so many pictures with focus off - and this was supposed to be a huge improvement on the Mark II in this area!  I sent it back.  But now after a week with the replacement camera, I could not be more happy with it.  I was just unlucky with the first one.

So would I buy the 5D Mark III now?  Yes, I voted with my wallet and now that the glitch with the first model is sorted out, I would recommend it without hesitation.

Graham

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Press Correspondent
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Re: Parallel
In reply to qianp2k, Aug 21, 2013

qianp2k wrote:

Press Correspondent wrote:

There is a difference between a car and a mountain bike. You can ride either, but one is fast and luxurious; the other you can carry. Which one to get? Hmm... Let me ask the forum...

There is a difference between sports and portraits. One needs a long reach; the other needs a shallow DOF, but you can shoot with either camera. Which one to get? Well, the answer is actually very logical and simple: decide what your primary goal is, sports or portraits.

Sports are not really FL limit as you always can find longer lens (unlike wildlife especially birding). It's basically no issue for those switched from 1D4/1D3 to 1DX. Instead of using 300L, now those sports PJs use 400L or 500L. In other side, they get wider angle when players running close, and of course better IQ especially in low light.

I agree. My point was that people should start with what they want to accomplish, but not with what camera they need.

But there is a caveat. Super telephoto lenses are very expensive. If you have a FF body and need a super telephoto, it actually may be less expensive to buy a second crop body with an equivalently shorter lens. Plus you don't even need to change lenses this way and are always ready to take a shot. Keep in mind that the tele reach factor is NOT the crop factor, hut the ratio of the pixel sizes. For example, if 7D2 ends up 24mp, its tele reach factor in comparison to 1Dx would be 1.85, not 1.6.

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PeterK
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Re: Parallel
In reply to Press Correspondent, Aug 21, 2013

Press Correspondent wrote:

Keep in mind that the tele reach factor is NOT the crop factor, hut the ratio of the pixel sizes. For example, if 7D2 ends up 24mp, its tele reach factor in comparison to 1Dx would be 1.85, not 1.6.

Can you explain that please? I never knew that (not being sarcastic, although it might read like that). - Thx

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qianp2k
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Re: Parallel
In reply to PeterK, Aug 21, 2013

PeterK wrote:

Press Correspondent wrote:

Keep in mind that the tele reach factor is NOT the crop factor, hut the ratio of the pixel sizes. For example, if 7D2 ends up 24mp, its tele reach factor in comparison to 1Dx would be 1.85, not 1.6.

Can you explain that please? I never knew that (not being sarcastic, although it might read like that). - Thx

I believe he meant pixel density.  However not every pixel is the same among sensors especially in different formats, that reflected in technical measurements such as SNR, Color tonality, high ISO performance and system sharpness/resolution (when frame with the same AOV)...Once 5D3 frame the subjects into similar AOV (or even less as long as not significantly less), then such 7D2 has no chances to win in IQ.

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Press Correspondent
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Re: Parallel
In reply to PeterK, Aug 21, 2013

PeterK wrote:

Press Correspondent wrote:

Keep in mind that the tele reach factor is NOT the crop factor, hut the ratio of the pixel sizes. For example, if 7D2 ends up 24mp, its tele reach factor in comparison to 1Dx would be 1.85, not 1.6.

Can you explain that please? I never knew that (not being sarcastic, although it might read like that). - Thx

Sure. Consider 5D3, a FF sensor with 5.25 mkm pixels. Take its sensor and "crop" it with scissors (or just cover the outer parts by black paper). Now you have a cropeed sensor with the same pixel size. Will there be a difference when you look at the whole picture? Of course. The croped sensor photo will not be as WIDE. So on the wide end the crop factor rules. Now look at the picture at 100% magnification. Will you see any difference? Obviously not. It is the same pixels you are looking at. If a dustant bird ended up 300 pixeks across, it still is 300 pixels acriss. The tele reach of this cropped sensor is 1x, not 1.6x. In fact, Canon 20D has vertially the same pixel size, 6.26 mkm. There is absolutely no tele reach advantage in using 20D compared to 5D3 despite the crop vs. FF difference. If you go further, 5D3 has a tele reach advantage over cropped 10D. I hope this helps.

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Muresan Bogdan
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Re: Parallel
In reply to Press Correspondent, Aug 22, 2013

Well you got it all wrong here. As somebody said, all pixels are not equal. So if the pixel density is very high ( crop body with 24mp for example) you have a very big drop in shapness ( it's plain physics - difraction phenomenon mostly). So you might and up with that 300 pixels bird that looks mushy while on a FF body you get a 200 pixel bird that is very sharp and so it might take a resize to 300 pixels and still look better than your APS-C. Add noise into the equation and a crop from a FF sensor upscaled might look better than the APS-C equivalent without upscaling.

It has a lot to do with the conditions you are shooting in but my main point is that you cannot split the systems into FF - GOOD FOR PORTAIT, APS-C GOOD FOR SPORTS AND WILDLIFE as you did. I believe that the 5dMk 3 is a highly capable camera when it comes to sport and wildlife also, not just portraits. And also using a longer lens is the correct way to go, the crop reach will never give you the same results. If it would be so, all the sports and wildlife photographers would be using M43 or point and shoots

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schmegg
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Re: Parallel
In reply to Muresan Bogdan, Aug 22, 2013

Muresan Bogdan wrote:

Well you got it all wrong here. As somebody said, all pixels are not equal. So if the pixel density is very high ( crop body with 24mp for example) you have a very big drop in shapness ( it's plain physics - difraction phenomenon mostly). So you might and up with that 300 pixels bird that looks mushy while on a FF body you get a 200 pixel bird that is very sharp and so it might take a resize to 300 pixels and still look better than your APS-C. Add noise into the equation and a crop from a FF sensor upscaled might look better than the APS-C equivalent without upscaling.

"might" being the operative word. It would also most probably contain less real subject detail and more interpolated data.

It has a lot to do with the conditions you are shooting in but my main point is that you cannot split the systems into FF - GOOD FOR PORTAIT, APS-C GOOD FOR SPORTS AND WILDLIFE as you did. I believe that the 5dMk 3 is a highly capable camera when it comes to sport and wildlife also, not just portraits. And also using a longer lens is the correct way to go, the crop reach will never give you the same results. If it would be so, all the sports and wildlife photographers would be using M43 or point and shoots

Nope - they'd all be using Nokias! LOL!

The majority of sports and wildlife photographers, in the Canon world, have been using crop sensors for many years.

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