Before I sell my GR....

Started Aug 4, 2013 | Discussions
steveashe
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Before I sell my GR....
Aug 4, 2013

I'd really appreciate some sage advice.  I'm going to Europe for the first time in 40 years (on a Rick Steve's Best of Europe tour) in about 6 weeks.  I decided that there is no better time than today to realize this dream; part of my dream is to take memorable photos, and get prints of some of my photos to put on the walls of my apartment.  I bought a Ricoh GR about a month ago and have been loving it, but am asking myself the question about whether this is the "best" selection of a main camera for this sort of trip.  I'm going whole hog on this, so also purchased a Ricoh CX6 (10x zoom) so I have access to a little travel zoom camera, also a light travel monopod, little ballhead for the monopod, extra batteries etc.  I've taken lots of pics with the GR, I can appreciate why so many love this camera.  I've actually taken a number of photo's that I am proud of and have developed a good feel for the camera.  I bought Elements 11 as well and have been enjoying the post processing as well.

I'll be with a tour group of about 25 others and will be visiting Rome, Florence, Paris, Venice, Munich and the Swiss Alps.  The Vatican, Louvre, lots of museums. Lots of walking around.  Some free time in the afternoons and evenings but lots of prearranged touring as well.  Not having been on a tour like this before - and realizing that I'll need to be with my group and not wander too much - should I "really" be taking something like a Sony RX100 II with at least a bit of a zoom?  Will I really notice much of a difference in photo quality between these two camera's, all other things being equal?

I realize that this is a personal decision and am not expecting that there is one "right" decision. I would appreciate if some of you guys with travel experience might comment.

This forum seems like the best place to ask my question so please share.  Thanks very much!

Steve

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Serhan2
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

You can check GR vs RX100 comparison done by a pro photographer in another forum. You might find it useful:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1230260

I did travels with a Ricoh R6 (28-200mm) and Sigma Dp1 (28mm) as my small cameras similar to your own set up. It was a good combo with some limitations. I also used heavy dslrs thru Europe and killed my back. Now I am using mostly mirrorless cameras, sony nex and olympus pen cameras with RX100 as a P&S camera thru my travels which are good compromise for travels. I usually find the zooms more useful unless I carry 2-3 cameras with different fixed focal lengths attached. Some people might be OK with one lens set up. Recommended travel set up thru NG seminars is a wide angle to a tele/macro set up eg landscape, architectural shots to more street photo, portraits, food, etc for travel shooting. Also for European travels, wide angle is very useful if you want to shoot some architecture, eg a wider 24mm might help for a zoom. Again it depends on what you want to shoot and carry with you esp if you walk all day long.

Serhan
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rube39
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to Serhan2, Aug 5, 2013

The RX100 is a great, pocket carry everywhere 2nd camera. That is what I use it for when I travel, to back my OM-5. I use my Ricohs at home for street stuff, and appreciate them very much.

Actually, I think you would be fine with the GR as your main camera, and the CX6 as a zoom back up.

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ripleysbaby
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to rube39, Aug 5, 2013

Trip of a lifetime . I would take my GXR and A16. Ok it's not small but its not heavy. If I had the choice of 2 cameras the other would be the Nikon V1 and 10-100 zoom. Lots if people knock the 1system but its a capable tool that gives great results.
Choice 1 = GXR
Choice 2 = nikon

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schaki
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to ripleysbaby, Aug 5, 2013

The CX6 should be ok despite at bit of smudging NR with the default setting whcih I've seen from full size samples in reviews. For a long time I wondered if NR Off for the CX5 and CX6 really made some wortwhile difference and the aswer probably is yes, after finally having seen full size samples with NR Off in a Japanese review of it.

http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdc.watch.impress.co.jp%2Fdocs%2Freview%2Fnewproduct%2F20111208_496449.html

I also think that the GR combined with the CX6 might be ok for this trip unless you want more wide-angle like 24mm.

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PaoloB
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to ripleysbaby, Aug 5, 2013

ripleysbaby wrote:

Trip of a lifetime . I would take my GXR and A16. Ok it's not small but its not heavy. If I had the choice of 2 cameras the other would be the Nikon V1 and 10-100 zoom. Lots if people knock the 1system but its a capable tool that gives great results.
Choice 1 = GXR
Choice 2 = nikon

If the extreme pocketability of the RX100 is not an absolute must, the Olympus E-PM2 and E-PL5 with the standard kit zooms are small enough for use in travels and at the same time (and almost at the same price)  give you better perfomrance and access to the whole m4/3 system. I have the OM-D, which has the same sensor of the above models, and the quality is much better than any of the previous 4/3 or m4/3 sensors.

The GXR with the A16 module is a very good choice in terms of quality. The main drawback is that Ricoh is still not comunicating if the system is dead or not (I'm a GXR user too, mainly for the M module, so really I'm a bit upset about that).

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Kodachrome200
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

yes for me the RX100 would not be up to par. the lens is soft. you only get about 6 real megapixels out of it. the bokeh looks tragic. you can barely get bokeh out of it anyway too.. The GR packs a serious lens that produces photos that would sit well next to the finest stuff out there. The GR sensor also produces much more natural color and alot more dynamic ranges. the photos fromt the ricoh take processing beautifully and look great even at iso 6400. the rx100 zoom is sort of a false advantage. the gr lens is pretty free of distortion. and neither camera are actually very useful for photographing things you cant get close to if you like. you should be able to frame things just by getting closer. there are shots that you need a standard or telephotolens for like headshots but again neither of these are the camera for doing that kind of photography.

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Prime85
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to Kodachrome200, Aug 5, 2013

Keep the Ricoh GR and add an Oly E-P5 or E-PM2 and 45mm/1.8 and a panny telephoto zoom and panny x-vario normal zoom.

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Tom Caldwell
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

The sort of question that will get 1,000 answers and they will all be correct.

If you don't need big prints then you can crop the images from the GR and effectively get the same as a zoom lens to a point.  Here the GR has the advantage of a great imaging combination between lens and sensor and can deliver quite well.

You can also convert and adjust raw files in camera which must be a big plus when you are on a trip. Also crop zooming on the run.

So a GR might do the job all on its own.  But in the end no matter how much advice is given you must make up your own mind.

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cptrios
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to Tom Caldwell, Aug 5, 2013

I definitely wouldn't go with the RX100 if you've gotten used to the corner-to-corner sharpness, high ISO performance, and dynamic range of the GR. All of those things are much, much worse on the RX100.

For what it's worth, I'm currently on a short European trip, and I'm carrying a GR with the GW-3 21mm adapter and a Sony RX1. While I would definitely have liked a tele lens on one or two occasions (to take pictures of incredibly exciting sheep), I don't feel like I've missed anything for not having one. The wide-angle stuff has always been much more useful to me in Europe.

My suggestion would be to pick up the GW-3 for the GR and then replace your travel zoom with some camera/lens combo that's give you good low-light performance. An E-PL5 with a Panasonic 20/1.7 or Olympus 45/1.8 would be good options. Maybe a NEX-5n with the Sony 50/1.8?

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Ybor
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

steveashe wrote:

I'd really appreciate some sage advice. I'm going to Europe for the first time in 40 years (on a Rick Steve's Best of Europe tour) in about 6 weeks. I decided that there is no better time than today to realize this dream; part of my dream is to take memorable photos, and get prints of some of my photos to put on the walls of my apartment. I bought a Ricoh GR about a month ago and have been loving it, but am asking myself the question about whether this is the "best" selection of a main camera for this sort of trip. I'm going whole hog on this, so also purchased a Ricoh CX6 (10x zoom) so I have access to a little travel zoom camera, also a light travel monopod, little ballhead for the monopod, extra batteries etc. I've taken lots of pics with the GR, I can appreciate why so many love this camera. I've actually taken a number of photo's that I am proud of and have developed a good feel for the camera. I bought Elements 11 as well and have been enjoying the post processing as well.

I'll be with a tour group of about 25 others and will be visiting Rome, Florence, Paris, Venice, Munich and the Swiss Alps. The Vatican, Louvre, lots of museums. Lots of walking around. Some free time in the afternoons and evenings but lots of prearranged touring as well. Not having been on a tour like this before - and realizing that I'll need to be with my group and not wander too much - should I "really" be taking something like a Sony RX100 II with at least a bit of a zoom? Will I really notice much of a difference in photo quality between these two camera's, all other things being equal?

I realize that this is a personal decision and am not expecting that there is one "right" decision. I would appreciate if some of you guys with travel experience might comment.

This forum seems like the best place to ask my question so please share. Thanks very much!

Steve

If you will be in situations where you want to use a longer lens sell the GR. You already have doubts. The RX100II is overpriced but will work better for telephoto. I had the RX100 and the LCD is hard to use in very bright light, not as good as GR.

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chris24net
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

Personally, I wouldn't take the GR as my main camera. I love mine, but for a 6 week trip of a lifetime, the 28mm focal length would be too limiting. And a RX100 wouldn't be high enough IQ for me.  I use the Fuji X-E1 for my travel work. The 18-55 is a great all around lens. And if that is too big or expensive, the new X-M1 is the same image quality in a smaller package if you can live without a EVF. And the new 16-50 is supposedly pretty darn good. A stop slower than the 18-55, but smaller, lighter and cheaper. You can get the X-M1/16-50 package for $800.

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steveashe
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to chris24net, Aug 5, 2013

Exactly the kind of discussion I was hoping for.  I appreciate the feedback.  I'm really not set on any option right now; the GR seems to ask the user to be mindful of their surroundings, then if appropriate, take a picture.

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Prime85
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to chris24net, Aug 5, 2013

x-E1 wit 18-55 would be near ideal.  Also get the 14mm lens.  I would get over the xM1 for the faster zoom lens.

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SLOtographer
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 5, 2013

I wouldn't sell the GR.  It's utterly discreet and a useful focal length for Europe travel.  Plus if you invest in improving how you use a 28mm focal length, I would bet that your keepers will be of better quality in terms of composition.

A GR + an RX100 should suffice for travel.  Or pick your favorite mirrorless setup for a good mix of IQ and size/weight.

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digitalphotographer
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GR and RX100M2
In reply to Serhan2, Aug 6, 2013

Serhan2 wrote:

You can check GR vs RX100 comparison done by a pro photographer in another forum. You might find it useful:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1230260

Thanks for the link to that forum, it was a great read. Like him, I had a GR and RX100M2, finding that they both compliment each other quite well.

Of course GR is sharper than RX100(M2) at 28mm wide open, but it's impossible to capture everything with just a wide angle hoping to get the same FOV by cropping, so having RX100M2 for longer focal lengths is really useful if not essential.

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Bobtheamateur
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Don't sell the GR......
In reply to chris24net, Aug 6, 2013

chris24net wrote:

Personally, I wouldn't take the GR as my main camera. I love mine, but for a 6 week trip of a lifetime, the 28mm focal length would be too limiting. And a RX100 wouldn't be high enough IQ for me. I use the Fuji X-E1 for my travel work. The 18-55 is a great all around lens. And if that is too big or expensive, the new X-M1 is the same image quality in a smaller package if you can live without a EVF. And the new 16-50 is supposedly pretty darn good. A stop slower than the 18-55, but smaller, lighter and cheaper. You can get the X-M1/16-50 package for $800.

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Don't sell the GR.  It is a great cam and can be taken along as a second cam.  My mirrorless system consists of all the Fuji X -cams as well as a Ricoh GR.  Fuji has done a good job crafting this system and the trip of a lifetime, if you go with small cams, requires you take photo equipment that will serve the best interests.

If you don't mind dragging a little gear around.... any "X" cam with 3 lenses will cover most things you encounter.  The 14mm, 18-55 Zoom, and the 55-200 Zoom are a great triad though the 55-200 is large and a bit heavy but the IQ and image stabilization is great.  The GR and the Fuji will give you great IQ and the Fuji has great high ISO.  These kind of trips require a minimum of 2 cams.....you drop one, one stops working....you lose one, etc..... you have a backup.

Or you could just bring a Nikon D600 and a 24-120 and that's it! Oh, and a sensor cleaning kit-:)

Have a great trip.

Bob

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steveashe
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Re: Don't sell the GR......
In reply to Bobtheamateur, Aug 6, 2013

Thanks guys. I'm having fun reading the replies. A little clarification on my part; I'm leaving in 6 weeks, and it's a 2 week trip (still a trip of a lifetime for me). I couldn't afford it 5 years ago when I was married, probably won't be able to afford it in 7 or 8 years when I try to retire, so what the heck - now seems like a great time! Both kids in college, $80k a year. Anyone relate:-)? I'll bet so.

The particular tour I'm doing requires 2 - 8 miles of walking a day. Tour notes suggest only take a carry on bag and a backpack sort of thing on this trip. Lots of schlepping up stairs and between city center kinda family run hotels. I'm trying to keep the camera equipment a light as possible yet still account for my newly found enjoyment of photography and my late 50's want for the "good stuff". The more I play with the GR, and the more I understand the sensibility of a snapshot sort of camera the more I think it's the right cam for me on this trip. Between the GR and the little CX6 10x travel zoom I think I'll be good. It's also destiny; last night while reading up on the GR on the Ricoh site, I noticed that it featured a pic of a hotel that I stay at in Times Square for business, almost every week for years. Weird.

If you'd like, please keep the comments coming. More diversity than I expected. Think I should probably concentrate on composition and seeing the world through a 28mm lens for now.

http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/gr_special/#18

Gracias,

Steve

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Gesture
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to SLOtographer, Aug 6, 2013

Why sell the GR, you like the camera and it will be great for streetscapes and inside museums, etc. I would supplement with an Olympus E-PLX and kit lens.  Small and the kit lens has great close focus capabilities. Someone in your group will bring along a monster DLSR with 5 lenses and flashes.  But, with your thoughtfulness, it won't be you.

Second, consider video capabilities of whatever camera(s) you bring. You may want it more than you think.  I've just started to explore the video of otherwise fine single exposure cameras and it grows on one.

HAVE FUN.

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Jorge Ledesma
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Re: Before I sell my GR....
In reply to steveashe, Aug 6, 2013

steveashe wrote:

I'd really appreciate some sage advice. I'm going to Europe for the first time in 40 years (on a Rick Steve's Best of Europe tour) in about 6 weeks. I decided that there is no better time than today to realize this dream; part of my dream is to take memorable photos, and get prints of some of my photos to put on the walls of my apartment. I bought a Ricoh GR about a month ago and have been loving it, but am asking myself the question about whether this is the "best" selection of a main camera for this sort of trip. I'm going whole hog on this, so also purchased a Ricoh CX6 (10x zoom) so I have access to a little travel zoom camera, also a light travel monopod, little ballhead for the monopod, extra batteries etc. I've taken lots of pics with the GR, I can appreciate why so many love this camera. I've actually taken a number of photo's that I am proud of and have developed a good feel for the camera. I bought Elements 11 as well and have been enjoying the post processing as well.

I'll be with a tour group of about 25 others and will be visiting Rome, Florence, Paris, Venice, Munich and the Swiss Alps. The Vatican, Louvre, lots of museums. Lots of walking around. Some free time in the afternoons and evenings but lots of prearranged touring as well. Not having been on a tour like this before - and realizing that I'll need to be with my group and not wander too much - should I "really" be taking something like a Sony RX100 II with at least a bit of a zoom? Will I really notice much of a difference in photo quality between these two camera's, all other things being equal?

I realize that this is a personal decision and am not expecting that there is one "right" decision. I would appreciate if some of you guys with travel experience might comment.

This forum seems like the best place to ask my question so please share. Thanks very much!

Steve

Do yourself a favor, you're going on a once in a lifetime trip based on your description, take another camera, the GR is not the camera for this. Buy a Fuji XE1/18-55 and you'll thank everyone who suggested one later when you come back and see your images in full glory throughout different focal lengths.

The simple fact that your asking for us to chime in, is a little whinny hint, that you're not sure at all so its better to be safe as oppose to sorry. Trust me, I'm the photographer that Pentax selected to promote the Ricoh GR on their site and in my  humble opinion. The GR 28mm view is way to limiting for a trip where you're going to see lots of interesting sites, people, art, etc etc.

Below is a set from this past Sunday. I took the XE1/18-55mm combo and that was all I need to document everything. This is just a sampling. Make sure to check the exif as well, the GR can't even come close to the X trans sensor. The top 3 images are basically out of camera with a slight adjustment, the BW was Silver Efex, and the rest VSCO film.

These are my 2 cents, cheers

JL

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