GH3 - a pleasure to use

Started Jul 17, 2013 | Discussions
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Macintosh Sauce
Macintosh Sauce Contributing Member • Posts: 704
Re: GH3 - a pleasure to use

robonrome wrote:

Hi mac sause, so far the only weathersealed Panasonic lenses are the 12-35 and 35-100. Olympus has a 12-50 and also a 60mm macro which are weathersealed. I have the 12-35 and the 60olympus.

If I get the GH3, or its successor, I will get the 12-35mm and 35-100mm lenses for sure. Still trying to decide if I want the E-P5 or the GH3. :/

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helimech Contributing Member • Posts: 593
Re: Got my GH3 today

captura wrote:

helimech wrote:

Didn't have much chance to play with it, sadly. I was really busy.

BUT: The ergos are darn near perfect. Oh, I could find a few quibbles, but it fits my hands perfectly, the most used controls fall readily to hand, er. finger. Like anything, it will take some time to learn to use it without having to think about the controls, but it's the most comfortable, natural feeling body I've used in a long, long time. time will tell, but I think even better than my beloved EOS-1 film camera, which up until now I'd list as my fave.

But, the camera isn't perfect. I'm amazed at how poor the viewfinder optics are, and I'm surprised this camera got out of Panasonic's development shop this way. I wear glasses, which probably makes it worse, but I have to wear my glasses. Other people say that after a while they don't notice any issues, so I'll give it some time, but it's a real disappointment on a body where everything else is just so right.

I wear glasses too, the first time I lifted the GH3 up to my eye my initial reaction was "oh no, it really is as bad as some say". However after a few days adjusting and realizing that there is just a very narrow angle of non-distorted view it doesn't bother me anymore. It is a shame they didn't invest in a better EVF but its completely functional for most uses. I still perfer the GH3s near perfect ergonomics and average EVF to the OM-D's rather cramped layout but better EVF.

I am very confused by these complaints about thje GH3's EVF. How can it possibly be so much worse than the elderly G1's EVF, which I use regularly and is possibly the best I have ever encountered? Could somebody please explain what's going on here?

Now I'm near-sighted but don't wear glasses, just have the G1's diopter adjusted to my eyes.

Not sure anyone said it is worse than the G1, it is a slight step down overall from the OM-D though. Mainly its not the EVF itself but the design on the optics in front on the EVF. I think because they decided to put a 16:9 EVF in they had to design almost a wide-angle lens in front of it. Unfortunately if you are not looking dead center you get some edge blur/distortion. Its not a complete non-issue but it definitely gets blown out of proportion on forums like this.

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Aleo Veuliah
Aleo Veuliah MOD Forum Pro • Posts: 14,628
Re: GH3 - a pleasure to use
1

Good pictures. It is a fine and great camera.

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hifi Senior Member • Posts: 2,331
Re: Got my GH3 today

I wear glasses too, the first time I lifted the GH3 up to my eye my initial reaction was "oh no, it really is as bad as some say". However after a few days adjusting and realizing that there is just a very narrow angle of non-distorted view it doesn't bother me anymore. It is a shame they didn't invest in a better EVF but its completely functional for most uses. I still perfer the GH3s near perfect ergonomics and average EVF to the OM-D's rather cramped layout but better EVF.

I am very confused by these complaints about thje GH3's EVF. How can it possibly be so much worse than the elderly G1's EVF, which I use regularly and is possibly the best I have ever encountered? Could somebody please explain what's going on here?

Now I'm near-sighted but don't wear glasses, just have the G1's diopter adjusted to my eyes.

Not sure anyone said it is worse than the G1, it is a slight step down overall from the OM-D though. Mainly its not the EVF itself but the design on the optics in front on the EVF. I think because they decided to put a 16:9 EVF in they had to design almost a wide-angle lens in front of it. Unfortunately if you are not looking dead center you get some edge blur/distortion. Its not a complete non-issue but it definitely gets blown out of proportion on forums like this.

I sold my G1 a while ago, but in some ways I prefer that viewfinder over the GH3 one.  One of the very first things that really impressed me with the G1 was the viewfinder.  It was a big, bright picture - an absolute joy to use.  Including mine, I have looked through about 5 different GH3 EVF's and they all suffer from the same problem:  from my guess, Pany saved something on the budget in the optics for the EVF and there is a more narrow angle of view when looking through it before the view becomes a little distorted.  I am used to it, but there has been the odd time when it is a little annoying, but you are right - it does get blown out of proportion on the forums.  Not a deal breaker by any means - the GH3 is still an excellent camera.

hifi Senior Member • Posts: 2,331
Re: GH3 - a pleasure to use

Macintosh Sauce wrote:

robonrome wrote:

Hi mac sause, so far the only weathersealed Panasonic lenses are the 12-35 and 35-100. Olympus has a 12-50 and also a 60mm macro which are weathersealed. I have the 12-35 and the 60olympus.

If I get the GH3, or its successor, I will get the 12-35mm and 35-100mm lenses for sure. Still trying to decide if I want the E-P5 or the GH3. :/

If you are looking at the 6D (very nice camera BTW), then maybe consider the GH3, as it has the bigger body and grip - it is more DSLR like.  Also - with the Pany 12-35 & 35-100 lenses, look at how much smaller/lighter/less expensive they are as compared to the FF equivalents.  You can't go wrong.

Bob Meyer Veteran Member • Posts: 5,375
Re: Got my GH3 today

captura wrote:

I am very confused by these complaints about thje GH3's EVF. How can it possibly be so much worse than the elderly G1's EVF, which I use regularly and is possibly the best I have ever encountered? Could somebody please explain what's going on here?

Now I'm near-sighted but don't wear glasses, just have the G1's diopter adjusted to my eyes.

As has been mentioned, it's not really the EVF, but the optics between the eyepiece and the screen. If your eye isn't perfectly centered, the periphery of the screen appears smeared and blurred, and the further off center your eye is, the worse the smearing.

With glasses off, the problem is much less significant. In fact, with my glasses off, I barely notice it at all. Unfortunately, my astigmatism is too bad for me to shoot without my glasses.

The screen itself is actually very good. Sharp, contrasty, and with very quick response, so you get none of the motion blur or lag that sometimes afflict the older EVFs.

After a little more time playing with the camera, I'm getting use to having to position my eye perfectly, and notice the issue less, but it's still disappointing. With glasses, I have a hard time seeing the corners of the screen, too.

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Bob Meyer Veteran Member • Posts: 5,375
Re: Got my GH3 today

helimech wrote:

I still perfer the GH3s near perfect ergonomics and average EVF to the OM-D's rather cramped layout but better EVF.

I think I agree with that. I gave the OM-D a shot, but am not happy with the ergos or menu system. The other option I'd consider, instead of the GS3, is the G6, but I'm pretty sure it's not going to be as nice, in terms of feel, as the GH3.

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Mahmoud Mousef Senior Member • Posts: 2,526
Re: $1,049 until 20 July

Bob Meyer wrote:

Mahmoud Mousef wrote:

ness of reducing the price on that puppy...

Down to $1,049 for a couple more days, at B&H and Amazon.

Shave 300 off that, then things start getting interesting

(granted, a bit to early to ask for that and the video crowd are probably snapping this up regardless)

Corkcampbell
Corkcampbell Forum Pro • Posts: 14,922
I don't understand about the glasses; why do you have to wear them?

I also wear glasses, but I set the diopter adjustment to my eyes, and do everything in the viewfinder, including chimping, which I would do anyway. Very rarely do I put on my glasses to look at the display on the back of the camera - usually viewing shots much later. I've never even tried to look in the EVF of my new GH3 with glasses on. By the way, I do the same with my other cameras, such as my OM-D.

The only reason I can see for not doing the same is if the diopter adjustment doesn't work for your eyes' weaknesses, perhaps not strong enough.

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 21,706
Re: Got my GH3 today

Bob Meyer wrote:

helimech wrote:

I still perfer the GH3s near perfect ergonomics and average EVF to the OM-D's rather cramped layout but better EVF.

I think I agree with that. I gave the OM-D a shot, but am not happy with the ergos or menu system. The other option I'd consider, instead of the GS3, is the G6, but I'm pretty sure it's not going to be as nice, in terms of feel, as the GH3.

And the viewfinder on the G6 may not be as nice as the one on the G1. (somebody said...)

robonrome
robonrome OP Senior Member • Posts: 1,898
Re: I don't understand about the glasses; why do you have to wear them?

Corkcampbell wrote:

I also wear glasses, but I set the diopter adjustment to my eyes, and do everything in the viewfinder, including chimping, which I would do anyway. Very rarely do I put on my glasses to look at the display on the back of the camera - usually viewing shots much later. I've never even tried to look in the EVF of my new GH3 with glasses on. By the way, I do the same with my other cameras, such as my OM-D.

The only reason I can see for not doing the same is if the diopter adjustment doesn't work for your eyes' weaknesses, perhaps not strong enough.

maybe its a the type of glasses. i need reading glasses but like u just tweak the diopter for evf use without glasses. perhaps if one is short-sighted that doesnt work?

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sea_dragon Contributing Member • Posts: 742
Re: Got my GH3 today

The EVF on the GH3 is the only thing on the camera I don't like. The optics in front of the EVF are the issue and I personally can't get a distortion free view of it no matter what.

I recently checked out the G6 and the EVF is much better optically. No blurring/smearing and the image seems larger overall. I hope the next iteration of the GH3 will have this type of EVF.

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Pete Berry Senior Member • Posts: 2,592
Re: Got my GH3 today

Bob Meyer wrote:

captura wrote:

I am very confused by these complaints about thje GH3's EVF. How can it possibly be so much worse than the elderly G1's EVF, which I use regularly and is possibly the best I have ever encountered? Could somebody please explain what's going on here?

Now I'm near-sighted but don't wear glasses, just have the G1's diopter adjusted to my eyes.

As has been mentioned, it's not really the EVF, but the optics between the eyepiece and the screen. If your eye isn't perfectly centered, the periphery of the screen appears smeared and blurred, and the further off center your eye is, the worse the smearing.

With glasses off, the problem is much less significant. In fact, with my glasses off, I barely notice it at all. Unfortunately, my astigmatism is too bad for me to shoot without my glasses.

The screen itself is actually very good. Sharp, contrasty, and with very quick response, so you get none of the motion blur or lag that sometimes afflict the older EVFs.

After a little more time playing with the camera, I'm getting use to having to position my eye perfectly, and notice the issue less, but it's still disappointing. With glasses, I have a hard time seeing the corners of the screen, too.

Bob, I  found that removing the eyepiece surround opens the FOV up a bit with glasses on. It slides upward, and took a good bit of pressure the first time.

PB

helimech Contributing Member • Posts: 593
Re: I don't understand about the glasses; why do you have to wear them?

I also wear glasses, but I set the diopter adjustment to my eyes, and do everything in the viewfinder, including chimping, which I would do anyway. Very rarely do I put on my glasses to look at the display on the back of the camera - usually viewing shots much later. I've never even tried to look in the EVF of my new GH3 with glasses on. By the way, I do the same with my other cameras, such as my OM-D.

The only reason I can see for not doing the same is if the diopter adjustment doesn't work for your eyes' weaknesses, perhaps not strong enough.

Well guess what, that only reason, is my reason. I would need a couple extra clicks of the diopter to get a clear picture. Plus my vision is bad enough without glasses that I would not feel comfortable walking around without them, therefore I would have to raise my glasses up everytime I wanted to take a shot.

I don't know why manufacturers don't take glasses wearers more into account when designing viewfinders. It's not like we are a small number of people, yet 90% of viewfinders I find are compromised in some way (sometimes small ways) for glasses wearers. Even if the stock cushion was larger but you could buy a smaller one for use with glasses I wiuld be happy.

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Mahmoud Mousef Senior Member • Posts: 2,526
Re: Got my GH3 today

hifi wrote:

I sold my G1 a while ago, but in some ways I prefer that viewfinder over the GH3 one. One of the very first things that really impressed me with the G1 was the viewfinder.

Just as an aside:

The viewfinder on my DMC-G2 (exactly the same as the DMC-G1) was the biggest let-down to me. I remember it as the one big disappointment I had with the camera after trying it for the first time. Noisy in low-light, laggy in low-light. My impressions of it were very negative (and still are). I remember thinking to myself that the reviewers who bragged about it...their impressions were the opposite of mine.

robonrome
robonrome OP Senior Member • Posts: 1,898
Re: Got my GH3 today

Mahmoud Mousef wrote:

hifi wrote:

I sold my G1 a while ago, but in some ways I prefer that viewfinder over the GH3 one. One of the very first things that really impressed me with the G1 was the viewfinder.

Just as an aside:

The viewfinder on my DMC-G2 (exactly the same as the DMC-G1) was the biggest let-down to me. I remember it as the one big disappointment I had with the camera after trying it for the first time. Noisy in low-light, laggy in low-light. My impressions of it were very negative (and still are). I remember thinking to myself that the reviewers who bragged about it...their impressions were the opposite of mine.

viewfinder perceptions will always (like most things i guess) be somewhat personal preference, personal requirement (eg glasses wearer) and personal experience (past camera ovf/efv) history dependant.

the gh3 evf while it has flaws, also have pluses, not least of which it is certainly brighter and less prone to motion effects and low light grainyness than other evfs ive used. i'm fortunate that the flaws for me have effectively become "invisible" thru use. i no longer notice them and they have zero impact on the useability of the camera for me. i still however appreciate the evf brightness and relative clarity (edge distortions notwithstanding) especially in low light.

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Bob Meyer Veteran Member • Posts: 5,375
Re: Got my GH3 today

Mahmoud Mousef wrote:

Just as an aside:

The viewfinder on my DMC-G2 (exactly the same as the DMC-G1) was the biggest let-down to me. I remember it as the one big disappointment I had with the camera after trying it for the first time. Noisy in low-light, laggy in low-light. My impressions of it were very negative (and still are). I remember thinking to myself that the reviewers who bragged about it...their impressions were the opposite of mine.

In the respects you mention, the GH3 is much, much better. It's the optics between the eye and the screen that are the problem. I suspect the issue is caused by Panasonic's decision to put a 16:9 screen in there. In order to make that viewable in essentially the same size package as the GH2's viewfinder, they needed to use wide-angle lenses, which is where the distortion comes from.

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Bob Meyer Veteran Member • Posts: 5,375
Re: Got my GH3 today

Pete Berry wrote:

Bob, I found that removing the eyepiece surround opens the FOV up a bit with glasses on. It slides upward, and took a good bit of pressure the first time.

PB

Thank you, Pete.  I will give this a try tomorrow.

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Bob Meyer Veteran Member • Posts: 5,375
Re: Got my GH3 today

captura wrote:

And the viewfinder on the G6 may not be as nice as the one on the G1. (somebody said...)

In the reviews I've seen, the EVF on the G6 has gotten nothing but praise.

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sea_dragon Contributing Member • Posts: 742
Re: Got my GH3 today

Bob Meyer wrote:

In the respects you mention, the GH3 is much, much better. It's the optics between the eye and the screen that are the problem. I suspect the issue is caused by Panasonic's decision to put a 16:9 screen in there. In order to make that viewable in essentially the same size package as the GH2's viewfinder, they needed to use wide-angle lenses, which is where the distortion comes from.

I think you're exactly right Bob.  The G6 EVF is much easier to look at with regards to optics, but I don't think it has the 16:9 ratio of the GH3.

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