7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice

Started May 4, 2013 | Discussions
tvstaff
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7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
May 4, 2013

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

Thank you,

TVSTAFF

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birdbrain
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 4, 2013

I think PP is quite a personal thing and what may work for someone will appear quite alien to somebody else.

At the end of the day you need to have confidence in your PP.

I like what DPP can do, yes it does not have all the tweaks that say ACR has but I think it does a better first job. So my PP is open in DPP get it as good as I can get, then export the files as 16 bit TIFF's and open these in Adobe Camera Raw. Which then gives me those tweaks that DPP lacks, finally open in PS for any final processing and convert to jpeg. While in PS if I want to do a print from a file I then produce a PS file tweaked for printing.

For ACR/PS you could probably use Lightroom I would have though?

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Ak pinxit
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 4, 2013

I would suggest to start with small , minimal tool set like DPP ( although it is best software in its' class , and free , it is still can't open full potential of RAW image ) .

Once you'll feel like you're limited and wish to add some art touch to your photos - this is the right time to move to Lightroom (DXO ...) .

For me , removing color noise with ACDSee from JPGs taken by HP camera once was enough but in moment you notice that skies are not the blue as you want and reds are all smashed ... and PP begins

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rndman
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 4, 2013

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

Thank you,

TVSTAFF

I always have this question too. What is the best approach? (is there any one best??)

Until lat year I was only using DPP and I was happy.

Then I changed to LR and was happy with that as well.

To me personally, I fell it is too much to go through multiple different iterations of PP in different software(s) based on what output you eventually get.

For now I solely use LR to do everything. If RAW to TIIF/jpg conversion of DPP is significantly better that what LR does, then I may think of adding that step.

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Ak pinxit
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to rndman, May 4, 2013

rndman wrote:

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

Thank you,

TVSTAFF

I always have this question too. What is the best approach? (is there any one best??)

Until lat year I was only using DPP and I was happy.

Then I changed to LR and was happy with that as well.

To me personally, I fell it is too much to go through multiple different iterations of PP in different software(s) based on what output you eventually get.

For now I solely use LR to do everything. If RAW to TIIF/jpg conversion of DPP is significantly better that what LR does, then I may think of adding that step.

If you look closely , DPP can preserve reds much better in low light ( after applying NR ) when LR

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rdspear
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 4, 2013

What are you using EOS Utility and DPP for?  I just import directly to LR and us is for all naming, filtering/deleting, tagging, structuring, etc - all Digital Asset Management functions.  I can then do all my processing there also.  Every once in a while I need to go to Photoshop for localized special editing, but that's getting to be less and less frequent.

If EOS/DPP have something special that you need, then use what suits you best - I haven't used them since my 10D and have no idea what capabilities they have (other than assuming they are limited, as you note).  But I'm all for simplifying unless there's a good reason not to.

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tvstaff
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to rdspear, May 4, 2013

rdspear wrote:

What are you using EOS Utility and DPP for?  I just import directly to LR and us is for all naming, filtering/deleting, tagging, structuring, etc - all Digital Asset Management functions.  I can then do all my processing there also.  Every once in a while I need to go to Photoshop for localized special editing, but that's getting to be less and less frequent.

If EOS/DPP have something special that you need, then use what suits you best - I haven't used them since my 10D and have no idea what capabilities they have (other than assuming they are limited, as you note).  But I'm all for simplifying unless there's a good reason not to.

Hi RDSPEAR,

So.... you're dowloading straight from your camera to Lightroom and it's keeping everything sorted by date automatic?  And you're happy????

Please expand and thank you for your input.  I'm interested in how you're working

TVSTAFF

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Mark B.
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What are you doing in DPP?
In reply to tvstaff, May 4, 2013

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

What are you doing in DPP other than importing?  Skip DPP and do the import through Lightroom.  If the photo needs further processing, export directly to PS; otherwise skip this step as well.  You're doing a lot of duplicate exporting and importing which is adding a lot of wasted time to your workflow.

Mark

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tvstaff
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Re: What are you doing in DPP?
In reply to Mark B., May 5, 2013

Mark B. wrote:

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

What are you doing in DPP other than importing?  Skip DPP and do the import through Lightroom.  If the photo needs further processing, export directly to PS; otherwise skip this step as well.  You're doing a lot of duplicate exporting and importing which is adding a lot of wasted time to your workflow.

Mark

Thank you!  Most direct and helpful. Thank you.

TVSTAFF

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Orange88
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 5, 2013

tvstaff wrote:

rdspear wrote:

What are you using EOS Utility and DPP for?  I just import directly to LR and us is for all naming, filtering/deleting, tagging, structuring, etc - all Digital Asset Management functions.  I can then do all my processing there also.  Every once in a while I need to go to Photoshop for localized special editing, but that's getting to be less and less frequent.

Hi RDSPEAR,

So.... you're dowloading straight from your camera to Lightroom and it's keeping everything sorted by date automatic?  And you're happy????

Please expand and thank you for your input.  I'm interested in how you're working

TVSTAFF

TV,

I switched from DPP to a full Lightroom flow at the beginning of this year. I don't find it difficult to sort imported files by date. I rename all imports with a yyyy-mm-dd followed by a suitable name. It's simple to import directly into a yyyy-mm-dd folder as well.

I haven't done it but I suppose one could easily add a Keyword Tag for the date during each import and create smart collections based on dates.

Better management of all the photos on my hard drive were the reason I decided to try Lightroom and I've been very pleased with its capabilities in that area.

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jboyer
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Re: What are you doing in DPP?
In reply to tvstaff, May 8, 2013

tvstaff wrote:

Thank you!  Most direct and helpful. Thank you.

TVSTAFF

I am late to the party, and a bit off topic. I have used DPP and stopped.

The answer to the question about DPP and workflow is really: it depends. I am shooting RAW. I have been in the digital domain for over 10 years, as an amateur and I still try to figure out a good workflow.

Currently, I download all the new pictures into Lightroom (using a card reader) and tag the pictures as required. I also do a copy to an other external drive... just in case.

Then I open either a Session or a Catalog in Capture One 7 (C1). I use C1 to get the RAW into JPEG for the keepers. I export these JPEGs out to Zenfolio for private or public viewing. The JPEGs remain in their output directory, by Catalog.

The reason I use C1 is that I feel Lightroom ACR is playing catch-up with newer RAW developer. Once you used C1, getting the RAW developed in LR may give you different results, that one may like better than C1.

My comment: it depends, also relates to things like skin tones, better handled in C1, imo. But if you shoot landscapes, LR might be as good as C1 or better. Using DPP after LR and C1 feels that you are a bit crippled by the lack of options.

I tried to find out, like you did, what workflow and PP make sense. I am still searching. In the end, taking pictures is what is the most important. Taking good pictures, in fact, require very little PP.

Recent examples of C1 ==> JPEGs: Puebla, Mexico (source is 7D)

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Dale Garman
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Watch dependence on Adobe
In reply to tvstaff, May 9, 2013

Before yesterday's announcement I was a huge fan of Adobe, and LR in particular.  But with their new cloud strategy for photoshop, it feels that LR may not be far behind.  Yes I know they specifically announced LR was not cloud based.  But it seems like that may well be temporary.  At least LR is still a product you can keep, but over time it will become less useful (new cameras, new o/s etc.).  So I'm still using LR for now, but the prospect of being force into a rental scheme that raises the prices significantly for life or the product no longer works makes me pause a bit.  And I love LR so this is very painful as Adobe blows itself up in front of us.

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elfroggio
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Re: Watch dependence on Adobe
In reply to Dale Garman, May 9, 2013

Dale Garman wrote:

Before yesterday's announcement I was a huge fan of Adobe, and LR in particular.  But with their new cloud strategy for photoshop, it feels that LR may not be far behind.  Yes I know they specifically announced LR was not cloud based.  But it seems like that may well be temporary.  At least LR is still a product you can keep, but over time it will become less useful (new cameras, new o/s etc.).  So I'm still using LR for now, but the prospect of being force into a rental scheme that raises the prices significantly for life or the product no longer works makes me pause a bit.  And I love LR so this is very painful as Adobe blows itself up in front of us.

For people in North America, Adobe's Creative Cloud is not a good deal, but everywhere else in the world it will be fantastic opportunity. Do you realize that it cost the same to buy the full Creative Suite 6 in the UK as to fly to New York, drop by at B&H or Adorama or ... and fly back.

Just a couple of month ago, the Australian government interrogated Adobe on why they charge so much more for the Creative Suite as compared to the US and the answer was "Because we can..."

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meland
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In reply to Mark B., May 9, 2013

Mark B. wrote:

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

What are you doing in DPP other than importing?  Skip DPP and do the import through Lightroom.  If the photo needs further processing, export directly to PS; otherwise skip this step as well.  You're doing a lot of duplicate exporting and importing which is adding a lot of wasted time to your workflow.

Mark

Don't forget that DPP's Digital Lens Optimiser (DLO) is vastly more sophisticated than anything available anywhere else in its ability to correct peripheral illumination, colour blur, chromatic aberration and distortion via profiles for each individual lens.  There's a great article in the current issue of EOS Magazine that explains this in detail.

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jboyer
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Re: DLO
In reply to meland, May 9, 2013

meland wrote:

Mark B. wrote:

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

What are you doing in DPP other than importing?  Skip DPP and do the import through Lightroom.  If the photo needs further processing, export directly to PS; otherwise skip this step as well.  You're doing a lot of duplicate exporting and importing which is adding a lot of wasted time to your workflow.

Mark

Don't forget that DPP's Digital Lens Optimiser (DLO) is vastly more sophisticated than anything available anywhere else in its ability to correct peripheral illumination, colour blur, chromatic aberration and distortion via profiles for each individual lens.  There's a great article in the current issue of EOS Magazine that explains this in detail.

A very good point, though I was under the impression that LR (and Capture One) had this feature. The question, though, is that DOL is restricted to Canon lenses. LR is not.

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meland
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Re: DLO
In reply to jboyer, May 9, 2013

jboyer wrote:

meland wrote:

Mark B. wrote:

tvstaff wrote:

Hi all,

Wondering if I can improve my workflow as like many of us, we get into habits and often keep them.... good or bad!

1. Right now I use the the EOS utility to download direct from my 7D, it in turn it organizes everything on my hard drive by date.  I then delete the shots on each 32 or 64 card

2. I am now in DPP and have the abilitily to use DPP's functions which are limited compared to Lightroom

3.  I will as a general rule go into lightroom and just import the photos I want to edit and export them when finished back into the same folder I imported them from to keep everything by date.

4.  Photoshop is used but not that much but I'm open to making it part of workflow if it will enhance any or all parts of the chain.

Any advice from my friends here to improve this process???

What are you doing in DPP other than importing?  Skip DPP and do the import through Lightroom.  If the photo needs further processing, export directly to PS; otherwise skip this step as well.  You're doing a lot of duplicate exporting and importing which is adding a lot of wasted time to your workflow.

Mark

Don't forget that DPP's Digital Lens Optimiser (DLO) is vastly more sophisticated than anything available anywhere else in its ability to correct peripheral illumination, colour blur, chromatic aberration and distortion via profiles for each individual lens.  There's a great article in the current issue of EOS Magazine that explains this in detail.

A very good point, though I was under the impression that LR (and Capture One) had this feature. The question, though, is that DOL is restricted to Canon lenses. LR is not.

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I think you'll find that DPP's DLO profiles for each Canon lens are considerably more sophisticated than say those in LR and Capture One which only apply a general lens correction.The DLO software module is unique in that it contains a database of the range of Canon lenses and camera bodies that enables it to calculate and correct for seven types of lens aberration, diffraction loss and even the effect of the optical low pass filter on the CMOS sensor.  This correction takes into account not only the lens in use, but also the subject distance and the specific focal length used when the image was taken - particularly important with zoom lenses.  And of course Canon also updates these profiles regularly with direct access to the lens designers' mathematical models used when the lens was designed.  It is of course restricted to Canon lenses and that may be an issue if you have others.

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Zee Char
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Re: 7D Workflow EOS > DPP > LIGHTROOM - Open to advice
In reply to tvstaff, May 10, 2013

I was a DPP die hard user for many years. Still a an excellent converter but Adobe despite becoming crooks as of late has done some very good improvements. Highlight recovery, NR, etc  and the masking slider in the detail panel are just superior.

PS was made for the designer and LR was made for the photographer. Although I'm bound to LR's catalogue system mass edits are so easy now. Cut PP time in half - at least. No more exporting 700 TIFFS out of DPP for work on in PS. Saved a ton of storage space. I just do everything in LR. No TIFFS. I can export a file into PS for additional editing if need be. Heck I even delete the Jpegs after export once I get them on a CD or flash drive. I can always go back and export again if need be.

When I finally warmed up to LR I noticed I started using PS more for my hobby shots. Usually less that a dozen images so it is no big deal. I said that I would flip flop between DPP and PS but I don't seem to be doing that. I have a resize/edge sharpening action which is my favourite output method so far. You can't run actions in LR.

I am still torn because after taking years for knock me off DPP Canon introduces DLO. I do find NR and DLO painstakingly slow. I do like the reds better with DPP but overall if I choose DPP faithful and ACR/LR camera faithful there is little difference. Adobe has come a long way in the last few years.

If Canon could improve NR (currently not that bad) improve highlight recovery, all the other mentioned stuff and add some features not necessarily as sophisticated as LR, maybe a cross between LR and ACR I would pay for it.

There is a local award winning fine art photographer that works with LR exclusively. You can pretty much do everything in LR.

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Jerry-astro
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In reply to Zee Char, May 10, 2013

I'm in the same boat.  Kept trying to use DPP in hopes that I could get used to its very clunky (IMHO) user interface and simply gave up on it.  Meanwhile, LR has kept getting better and better and rather than jumping into PS for say 30-40% of my images, it's dropped to maybe 1-2%, if that.  The improvements in NR, couple with the adjustment brush, means I can selectively apply NR to my images with at least equivalent results to anything I tried doing in PS... and a whole lot easier.  All the stuff Zee talks about below about recovering (or muting) highlights and shadows is extremely useful and very powerful.  Along with the adjustment brush, you can select specific areas of your image and selectively modify exposure, highlights, shadows, saturation... you name it.  It's pretty awesome.

For the OP... I'd suggest taking DPP out of the equation entirely unless you have some specific need for it or you find that it does something much better than LR for your own purposes.  With LR, you can easily import your images directly from the CF card (assuming you have a reader) into LR and wherever in your directory structure you desire.  You can also rename them on the fly (as I've had to do since I exceeded the 9999 numbering limit for unique filenames).  Given the way you're doing PP, I can't really see how DPP is adding any value at all to your workflow and instead, it is probably just slowing you down.

Zee Char wrote:

I was a DPP die hard user for many years. Still a an excellent converter but Adobe despite becoming crooks as of late has done some very good improvements. Highlight recovery, NR, etc  and the masking slider in the detail panel are just superior.

PS was made for the designer and LR was made for the photographer. Although I'm bound to LR's catalogue system mass edits are so easy now. Cut PP time in half - at least. No more exporting 700 TIFFS out of DPP for work on in PS. Saved a ton of storage space. I just do everything in LR. No TIFFS. I can export a file into PS for additional editing if need be. Heck I even delete the Jpegs after export once I get them on a CD or flash drive. I can always go back and export again if need be.

When I finally warmed up to LR I noticed I started using PS more for my hobby shots. Usually less that a dozen images so it is no big deal. I said that I would flip flop between DPP and PS but I don't seem to be doing that. I have a resize/edge sharpening action which is my favourite output method so far. You can't run actions in LR.

I am still torn because after taking years for knock me off DPP Canon introduces DLO. I do find NR and DLO painstakingly slow. I do like the reds better with DPP but overall if I choose DPP faithful and ACR/LR camera faithful there is little difference. Adobe has come a long way in the last few years.

If Canon could improve NR (currently not that bad) improve highlight recovery, all the other mentioned stuff and add some features not necessarily as sophisticated as LR, maybe a cross between LR and ACR I would pay for it.

There is a local award winning fine art photographer that works with LR exclusively. You can pretty much do everything in LR.

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