MFT shipments down

Started Apr 26, 2013 | Discussions
MichaelKJ
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,121Gear list
Like?
Re: Seasonal fluctuation for all... revenues down the same as units
In reply to Rriley, May 7, 2013

Rriley wrote:

MichaelKJ wrote:

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

The current Mirrorless share of the interchangeable market in Japan is 49.4%....not bad in a little over 4 years?

No increase in market share over the past year.

Re: The Canon EOS M The Future of EOS M [CR1]http://www.canonrumors.com/2013/04/the-future-of-eos-m-cr1/  "Spluttered out of the gate
The Canon EOS M system hasn’t been the sales success Canon had hoped. Bad press about the autofocus and lack of lenses are probably big reasons why. There’s also a feeling Canon isn’t totally committed to the mirrorless market, as the segment hasn’t really been a dominant player in the United States, like it has in parts of Asia...."

BCN data suggest that the EOS-M has increased in popularity recently.  With EOS-M comprising 3 of the top 4 mirrorless cameras in Japan in April, if its sales have been disappointing, what does that imply about the sales of other mirrorless?

I havent checked so I can take your word for it
however its plain you werent looking at aggregate sales

As you know, aggregate unit sales data are only published periodically by BCN (usually every 6 months). Nevertheless, one can get an idea of which companies are doing well by how many of their camera configurations are among the best sellers.

as it happens, P&O have just over 50% of the mirrorless market
last time I looked BCN Data didnt have EOS even in the top 10 (aggregate)

P&O initially had 100% of the mirrorless market.  Imo, having over 50% at this stage of mirrorless development isn't that impressive.

As I noted, the EOS-M has seen a recent increase in popularity in Japan.  Since this camera doesn't appear to have much going for it, I find this surprising.  Since my previous post, BCN released new rankings today for last week. EOS-M black double kit moved up to 6th to 5th place, EOS-M double kit white move up from 16th to 10th place, and EOS-M double kit blue moved up from 17th to 12th.

E-PL3 is in 8th and E-PL5 is 12th. Top Panasonic is the GF6 in 36th place.

CIPA Data

Im thinking the previous year was an up year, and to extent this is just more normalised data

Micro Four Thirds is the top selling mount in Japan.

Let's hope it continues to be. Maybe you aren't surprised that the best selling Panasonic didn't make the top 20 last month, but I am.

volume isnt about profit, Panasonic have enough problems

True, but the two are obviously related (you can't make a profit if you don't sell anything).

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com

-- hide signature --

Riley
any similarity to persons living or dead is coincidental and unintended
support 1022 Sunday Scapes'

 MichaelKJ's gear list:MichaelKJ's gear list
Fujifilm FinePix F31fd Olympus PEN E-PL1 Olympus OM-D E-M5 +1 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Rriley
Forum ProPosts: 21,846Gear list
Like?
Re: Seasonal fluctuation for all... revenues down the same as units
In reply to MichaelKJ, May 7, 2013

MichaelKJ wrote:

Rriley wrote:

MichaelKJ wrote:

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

The current Mirrorless share of the interchangeable market in Japan is 49.4%....not bad in a little over 4 years?

No increase in market share over the past year.

Re: The Canon EOS M The Future of EOS M [CR1]http://www.canonrumors.com/2013/04/the-future-of-eos-m-cr1/  "Spluttered out of the gate
The Canon EOS M system hasn’t been the sales success Canon had hoped. Bad press about the autofocus and lack of lenses are probably big reasons why. There’s also a feeling Canon isn’t totally committed to the mirrorless market, as the segment hasn’t really been a dominant player in the United States, like it has in parts of Asia...."

BCN data suggest that the EOS-M has increased in popularity recently.  With EOS-M comprising 3 of the top 4 mirrorless cameras in Japan in April, if its sales have been disappointing, what does that imply about the sales of other mirrorless?

I havent checked so I can take your word for it
however its plain you werent looking at aggregate sales

As you know, aggregate unit sales data are only published periodically by BCN (usually every 6 months). Nevertheless, one can get an idea of which companies are doing well by how many of their camera configurations are among the best sellers.

I say this b/se there is some disparity between the notion that EOS M is moving very strongly, and what the last aggregate scores suggest. CIPA sees Canon as 2.1% of the mirrorless market, and BCN placed EOS M 15th. If Im not mistaken EOS M is Canons only model in mirrorless, thats going to make it tough to have an impact on the market as a whole, especially were leading cameras gather 10% or so on their own.

It will occur that deals and rebates will have an impact on sales, but they are often not that enduring. This is why we apportion market share annually, there's less point doing it monthly where they are flyers or data spikes to be more or less ignored..

as it happens, P&O have just over 50% of the mirrorless market
last time I looked BCN Data didnt have EOS even in the top 10 (aggregate)

P&O initially had 100% of the mirrorless market.  Imo, having over 50% at this stage of mirrorless development isn't that impressive.

even when they had 100%, their volumes were less than they are now

As I noted, the EOS-M has seen a recent increase in popularity in Japan.  Since this camera doesn't appear to have much going for it, I find this surprising.  Since my previous post, BCN released new rankings today for last week. EOS-M black double kit moved up to 6th to 5th place, EOS-M double kit white move up from 16th to 10th place, and EOS-M double kit blue moved up from 17th to 12th.

thats the problem with data scattered across different configurations for essentially the same camera. It makes it difficult to determine whats going on in relation to other makers as a whole. When they get to aggregate data they add the packages together for a single entry for a single model. In this way market shaping is removed and the order of things more visible.

E-PL3 is in 8th and E-PL5 is 12th. Top Panasonic is the GF6 in 36th place.

CIPA Data

Im thinking the previous year was an up year, and to extent this is just more normalised data

Micro Four Thirds is the top selling mount in Japan.

Let's hope it continues to be. Maybe you aren't surprised that the best selling Panasonic didn't make the top 20 last month, but I am.

volume isnt about profit, Panasonic have enough problems

True, but the two are obviously related (you can't make a profit if you don't sell anything).

the gearing is such that lower prices stimulated sales. In which case more volume isnt providing more value to the company it is simply keeping the costs in check and keeping the wheels moving until better times return.

It is possible to make no profit or even a loss and still have higher volume, thats the point I was making.

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com

-- hide signature --

Riley
any similarity to persons living or dead is coincidental and unintended
support 1022 Sunday Scapes'

-- hide signature --

Riley
any similarity to persons living or dead is coincidental and unintended
support 1022 Sunday Scapes'

 Rriley's gear list:Rriley's gear list
Sigma DP2 Merrill Canon EOS 5D Olympus E-3 Olympus E-5 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH2 +1 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
YouDidntDidYou
Senior MemberPosts: 1,576
Like?
Re: Seasonal fluctuation for all... revenues down the same as units
In reply to MichaelKJ, May 7, 2013

1. Mft has the widest range if configurations so best seller lists don't accurately reflect their sales.

2.Panasonic and Olympus having over 50% of the mirrorless market after the might of Canon, Nikon and Sony entered the market is good going by anyone's standards.Remember that canikon were suppose to sweep aside Oly and Panny when they entered the mirrorless sector.It actually wouldnt surprise me if the Nikon 1 system was abandoned this year.

3.Olympus is actually well placed to return to profit in its imaging division because they are reducing their exposure to the fast declining and low margin p&s much quicker than their competitors, they have less exposure to the slowing DSLR market, the E-M5 looks like it has and continues to sell very well, it also looks like Olympus are selling a lot of lenses all on a comparatively low marketing budget....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Grobb
Senior MemberPosts: 1,229Gear list
Like?
Yes, this is not why.
In reply to pinnacle, May 8, 2013

pinnacle wrote: The line of reasoning promoted in the text above is not at all typical of how users are making decisions about what camera, which lenses, or what system to buy into. You are way over thinking the process (and speculating without supporting data) and then drawing unfounded conclusions about purchasing decisions.

Dan… I am not a ‘typical’ user, therefore my thought processes and decision making is not done on “unfounded conclusions”. I do my research, (see links below) were you will find all the “supporting data” you or anyone needs in order to make an informed decision before making a purchase.

pinnacle wrote: The idea that you can't get reasonably sharp images from any particular M43 lens (with the exception of the 15mm Oly) is baseless. Even the lowly regarded Oly 17mm and 14-42 kit lenses are capable of printing up to 13"x19" with acceptable results.

Dan… I am basing my idea about getting reasonably sharp images from hundreds of threads/posts on not only DPR but many other forums similar to this one: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/51378681

Here is where I get ‘some’ of my reasoning and supported data from. Not a lot of speculation going on.

http://www.photozone.de/Reviews/m43

http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Lenses/Camera-Lens-Database/Panasonic

http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Lenses/Camera-Lens-Database/Olympus

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/1041

http://www.ephotozine.com/article/ephotozine-s-best-lenses-of-2011-17505

http://www.ephotozine.com/article/ephotozine-reviews-all-panasonic-micro-four-thirds-lenses-19387

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_10?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=micro%20four%20thirds%20lens&sprefix=Micro+four%2Caps%2C867&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Amicro%20four%20thirds%20lens

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads