First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: Which first two lenses?

Started Apr 21, 2013 | Discussions
six34sigma
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Re: First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: Which first two lenses?
In reply to six34sigma, Apr 26, 2013

And here is are his lens recommendations for the D800. Read the article carefully it caused a bit of controversy when it first came out.

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2012/03/d800-lens-selection

Good luck.

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Re: First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: my rubbish advice?
In reply to r0gue, Apr 26, 2013

r0gue wrote:

I'm new to DSLRs.  Some photography enthusiast friends gave me a lot of instruction and I found myself enticed to a full frame D800.  That was a loong contemplation and a LOAD of research and advice.  But that said, I find the lens decision a little more challenging.

(I think) I want a nice prime for faces, family, friends. Thinking of a 50 or 85.  Either in a 1.4 or 1.8.

And (I think) I want a nice ll around zoom lens.

I'd love to hear some advice from all of you.  I'll keep poking around to continue learning.  Thank for your help!

Hey, I shoot with a D300 (am a rank amateur) and a bunch of MF primes. Here is some crazy advice...

IF, I was just getting kit for a D800, I would consider this combination, which is a bit pricey but certainly not over the top and somewhat cheaper than one culd go for similar IQ and helluva fun:

1 ) Either the Zeiss 28mm 2.8 Distagon (unless one can afford the 28 f2 or 25mm) OR the Sigma 35mm 1.4 approx. 1,050

2) Voigtlander Nokton 58mm 1.4 = approx. 470

3) Samyang 85mm 1.4 = approx. 330

4) Nikon 80-200 2.8  = approx. 1,100

That is roughly 2,950 worth of lens goodness .. .    (only a bit more than one 70-200 VR II) .

I note those lenses, because in my humble opinion, one is looking at optical quality, build quality and RENDITION. I don't have those lenses, but at least two (if not three) could be on my radar in time...after I deal with some other things first.

But, its a matter of taste, what you want in a lens.

Good luck.

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Re: Guidenet's Logical advice..sound...no text (nt)
In reply to Guidenet, Apr 26, 2013
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Enjoy.....believe in yourself..

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Re: First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: Which first two lenses?
In reply to Dodi73, Apr 26, 2013

Dodi73 wrote:

Two lenses without breaking a bank?

Sigma 35 f/1.4 and Nikon 85 f/1.8 OR Tamron 90 f/2.8 VC USD (which is macro AND stabilized)

Add the 50 if you like, it will be transparent for you

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All the best from northern Italy, Dino.
I'm on the NIK side of photography.

Good advice too. 35MM for walk around and short tele for portraits and getting a bit closer. Can add in time.

Thing is, if you shoot a lot of closer work (people, family, street) , the 35mm or a 28mm will be very useful, and if you do a lot of portraits or indoor work that needs a bit of distance (say basketball non professional) the 85mm 1.8 will be useful.'

Depends what your subjects and style are.

Also, go to pbase and flickr and input in a search for various lenses, you can see the images people are getting with them, type of images and rendition of the lenses.

You have to like the lens.

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Enjoy.....believe in yourself..

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Antony John
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Re: First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: Which first two lenses?
In reply to Bajerunner, Apr 26, 2013

Some further interesting comments from others.

I'll throw in my tuppence worth for 2 lenses:

Zeiss 35mm F2 - it's manual focus but has great rendition (one of my favourites) and is suitable for landscape and group photos . If you're serious about photography then you need to learn how to manually focus anyway because auto focus doesn't always get you optimum results. Added to this is that many (myself included) have found that using MF really makes you think more about your composition and framing. It's a good way to learn.

Nikon 85mm F1.8 AF-S - I've read it's a good lens and it should suite you for portraits (for now anyway you might want to go longer in future).

Ultimately you should try and plan your whole lens requirements up front, pick a few of interest for the moment and then fill in with the others as you go along. Other than wasting money, getting rid of equipment as you go along can be a pain (for some) and rather get it (mostly - one always makes mistakes) right from the outset. Quality glass you're happy with will stay with you longer than your camera.

HTH

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mattr
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Re: What I would do...
In reply to r0gue, Apr 26, 2013

r0gue wrote:

Re: the 50/1.8G,.. is the 1.4 better than the 1.8?  It seems people generally feel they are.  I understand the depth of field is tighter, but I also get that maybe there are coating difference?

Many actually like the 50/1.8G slightly better, see for example here:

http://nikonrumors.com/2011/11/03/seven-50mm-prime-lenses-for-nikon-f-mount-compared-by-cary-jordan.aspx/

I'm not aware of any coating difference.

I'm going to pick the primes for now since so many folks are in agreement that they are pretty good glass.  I'm going to hold off on the telephotos.

They are certainly very good. Just keep in mind that two primes only will impose quite a few limitations on your photography, even with the ability to crop with the D800. There is a reason why most professional photographers use almost exclusively zooms. The prime only setup seems to be more common with hobbyists and pixel peepers (I include myself in this category)...

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nathantw
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Re: Perturbed by the Rudeness and Hostility on these Forums
In reply to PHXAZCRAIG, Apr 26, 2013

PHXAZCRAIG wrote:

The 1.8 indeed seems as good as it's reputation (though I've not shot it much yet).   I STILL can't justify the 1.4, but somehow I still wonder if I would have liked it even more.

Just because of that itch that doesn't go away, I'd say just get the 1.4g, pair it with a Sigma 35F1.4, and be happy.

It's because of comments like this that mirrored my comments and thoughts one time that I learned long ago to just save and buy what *I* felt was the best. The reason is that you'll always be second guessing and saying "I wonder..."

Sometimes I'm happy with the lowest model but there are times I just go for it all and get what I perceived as the best at the time. Though the 85 f/1.8G sounded awesome, I wanted something a little different than a direct replacement to my 85 f/1.8AF, so I got the f/1.4G. Was it worth it? Sure, I don't have any "wanting" of anything the 85 f/1.8G might have other than $1000 I would have saved.

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marco1974
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Re: First Post - D800 soon, Please Advise: Which first two lenses?
In reply to r0gue, Apr 26, 2013
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Robin Casady
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Re: Perturbed by the Rudeness and Hostility on these Forums
In reply to Anthony Nadia, Apr 26, 2013

Anthony Nadia wrote:

Like you, I am new to the DPReview forums and am rather dismayed at some of the responses received to simple questions like yours.  On this past weekend, while perusing the various forums, I've read responses which are downright hostile, rude, condescending, irreverent, sarcastic, and often irrelevant.  People reaching out with honest questions are sometimes ridiculed, criticized and berated.  Who does that???  These haters seem to be bitter, angry, unhappy, or more likely, insecure with themselves.

Use the Complain button when you run across posts that are rude or hostile. The moderators don't always notice the bad posts until someone complains. Using the button will help keep the forum civil.

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Robin Casady
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D800 is cheaper in the long run.
In reply to Cytokine, Apr 26, 2013

Cytokine wrote:

Since the 1920's FX was the norm, and DX the newcomer, many of us here started with film slr's!

Actually, 4x5 was the norm in the 1920's. FX (35mm) cameras were known as miniature cameras.

Remember Speed Graflex cameras?

Starting with a D800 and learning on it is cheaper than working your way though a series of lesser cameras and finally upgrading to a D800.

I see nothing wrong with learning on a D800. It will teach one good technique because it wont hid the mistakes.

When I was in school, one of my better photo teachers would start beginners with a 4x5 view camera. It forced one to consider each shot and learn the basics.

I really don't understand the logic behind thinking a beginner is better off with a D5200 or D7100. The only reason I can see to go that route is if one is not sure they are really interested, or they can't afford anything else.

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r0gue
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Put it in the cart. Put some lenses in the cart. Got cold feet. Lookin' DX :)
In reply to r0gue, Apr 26, 2013

It just got to bothering me. All that expense and I'm so uninformed.  And that was the first time I really got to thinking, that there IS value to starting smaller.  And if I get a nice DX at a good price, I won't be out much.  So with the current promotion in play, I'm shifting gears.

Please visit my DX threadif you are willing to continue helping a pain like me! 

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r0gue
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DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to r0gue, Apr 30, 2013

I did it!  Yes, FINALLY!!! 

The Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 85mm f/1.8G Lens -overwhelmingly recommended in this thread- is currently out of stock, and I wanted a mid-range zoom anyway, so when I saw the info below, I thought that would be a perfect first lens.  Plus it's $100 off when purchased with the body.  Nikon recommended  sub-$500, nice range, good quality.

  • Today DxO Mark published their test results for the Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR lens ($596.95) which was also on the list of recommended lenses for the D800E camera. The lens has a performance identical to the 24-120mm f/4G lens ($1,296.95) and outperforms the 28-300mm ($1,046.95) in almost every measurement....

I gotta start somewhere.  The Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR  lens seems a reasonable point to try.  If Nikon recommends it, who am I to differ.  If one day I decide to select something else, the $100 saved at purchase will limit my losses.

and again..  extreme thanks for the patience and input from you all.

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Leonard Migliore
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And don't cancel it
In reply to r0gue, May 1, 2013

OK. Now you have a good camera and a good lens. What you may find is that it takes a while to get the hang of it; one of the features of a DSLR is that you can adjust a lot of things and the camera doesn't care if you adjust them wrong or right. So persevere until you get all the sharpness and depth of color that you've paid for. They're in there somewhere.

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Re: DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to r0gue, May 1, 2013

Way cool. Excellent choice, enjoy your new camera. Great value and great camera, I would get one to go with my D300 ..if I could, but I cant, that's fine with me.

Enjoy your 'Hasselblad'...   so they say it can be close in image. For 2,700 or so, great value and I expect it'll hold its value like the best Nikon's do.

Well done.

Now I'll be a bit of a mischievous fellow and tell you to go and look at some Zeiss 25mm 2.8, Sigma 35mm 1.4, Zeiss Planar T 50mm 1.7, Voigtlander Nokton 58mm 1.4 lenses on flickr and pbase....

Then there is the Nikkor 50MM 1.2......

  Those will be temptations enough for a while ... 

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Enjoy.....believe in yourself..

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r0gue
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Re: And don't cancel it
In reply to Leonard Migliore, May 1, 2013

Leonard Migliore wrote:

Re: And don't cancel it

I promise.  I won't.:-P

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r0gue
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Re: DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to Bajerunner, May 1, 2013

Bajerunner wrote:

Now I'll be a bit of a mischievous fellow

Tell me of all the good stuff in the world that I need to one day get that you like.  I'm just hoping the ones I did buy are solid choices.;-)

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GregWCIL
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Re: DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to r0gue, May 1, 2013

r0gue wrote:

I did it!  Yes, FINALLY!!! 

The Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 85mm f/1.8G Lens -overwhelmingly recommended in this thread- is currently out of stock, and I wanted a mid-range zoom anyway, so when I saw the info below, I thought that would be a perfect first lens.  Plus it's $100 off when purchased with the body.  Nikon recommended  sub-$500, nice range, good quality.

  • Today DxO Mark published their test results for the Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR lens ($596.95) which was also on the list of recommended lenses for the D800E camera. The lens has a performance identical to the 24-120mm f/4G lens ($1,296.95) and outperforms the 28-300mm ($1,046.95) in almost every measurement....

I gotta start somewhere.  The Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR  lens seems a reasonable point to try.  If Nikon recommends it, who am I to differ.  If one day I decide to select something else, the $100 saved at purchase will limit my losses.

and again..  extreme thanks for the patience and input from you all.

Congratulations on your choice, Rogue. I think your choice of a lens is excellent. First, that is a lens that lets you try lots of things --from fairly wide to a moderate zoom. Remember that the D800 lets you choose crop mode which will turn your 85 into a 130 for a little more reach.)

I can tell from your posts, that you are a very analytical person. I think you will find that over the next weeks and months that lens will let you try your skills at a fairly wide range of shots. Only your own experience with it will lead you to "want something more". That "more" may be a wider lens, a faster lens for low light or a longer lens for wildlife.

My own experience is similar. I bought a D800 last fall. I got the 16-35mm VR zoom, 70-200 zoom and a 50mm1.8.  I later added a 2x teleconverter because 200 just isn't enough reach for most wildlife.

But my biggest surprise is that I use the super wide zoom most of the time. I really enjoy landscape photography and find I use it at or near the widest settings most of the time. Only your own experience will tell you what you will buy next.

Have fun and post some pics.

Greg

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Reilly Diefenbach
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Re: DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to r0gue, May 1, 2013

Yowsah!  And this is what you'll get with the D800 and the zoom you picked.  Dead sharp center to border, going to soft on the edges and corners.  Overframe by 5mm where possible and be sharp edge to edge if that's important to the shot.  A lot of times it isn't.

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Re: DONE - Solid Advice
In reply to GregWCIL, May 1, 2013

GregWCIL wrote:

r0gue wrote:

I did it!  Yes, FINALLY!!! 

and again..  extreme thanks for the patience and input from you all.

Congratulations on your choice, Rogue. I think your choice of a lens is excellent. First, that is a lens that lets you try lots of things --from fairly wide to a moderate zoom. Remember that the D800 lets you choose crop mode which will turn your 85 into a 130 for a little more reach.)

I can tell from your posts, that you are a very analytical person. I think you will find that over the next weeks and months that lens will let you try your skills at a fairly wide range of shots. Only your own experience with it will lead you to "want something more". That "more" may be a wider lens, a faster lens for low light or a longer lens for wildlife.

My own experience is similar. I bought a D800 last fall. I got the 16-35mm VR zoom, 70-200 zoom and a 50mm1.8.  I later added a 2x teleconverter because 200 just isn't enough reach for most wildlife.

But my biggest surprise is that I use the super wide zoom most of the time. I really enjoy landscape photography and find I use it at or near the widest settings most of the time. Only your own experience will tell you what you will buy next.

Have fun and post some pics.

Greg

Wonderful explanation and advice. Spend the first 6 months or so learning the camera and you will realize what you 'miss' i.e. a low light fast lens (wider aperture) or a telephoto to get in extra close, or a wide angle for close architecture such as churches and halls or group ohotgraphy or close street photography or a fast (wide aperture) telephoto zoom for sports (as examples).

Take your time. Enjoy.

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Re: DONE - D800 & Nikkor 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR Lens
In reply to r0gue, May 1, 2013

r0gue wrote:

Bajerunner wrote:

Now I'll be a bit of a mischievous fellow

Tell me of all the good stuff in the world that I need to one day get that you like.  I'm just hoping the ones I did buy are solid choices.;-)

Haha. Firstly, I am no pexpert by far far far, just an amateur. That said, even I have likes and 'drools'.

What Greg mentioned below about taking your time and learning what you need in anything further is important and great advice.

That said, here are my OPINIONS

- a fast prime or fast zoom in 'your required focal length' will eventually be a need. Whether you shoot wildlife or sports and need a fast tele zxoom, or shoot indoor architecture or close groups or street photography and need a fast wide zoom or prime, a fast lens in you 'forte' will eventually be wanted.

If you anticipate the need for shooting family in low light situations i.e. parties, the Nikon 50 1.8G for $200 is a very nice little thing, though I do not have it, I have a few fast manual focus lenses, but they are rather horses for courses' and not for everyone. I have a 50 1.4 and two 28 2.8's.

That is sensible spending on a low light lens without breaking the bank or getting silly.

Later you may want something different. Here are some examples and remember this is just simple guidance and depends on what you shoot and an amateur opinion.

Remember also, one other thing, do not waste money on lenses and as with everything else, be sure you want something and buy it 'one time' i.e. don't waste money on something 'less' and have to re-buy what is better, but save and buy the better one first, if you can afford it.

- Portraits - if you shoot family portraits, I am sure many would recommend the new Nikon 85 1.8G.

However, some will probably say that if you also shoot a lot of sports and some near wildlife etc i.e. a lot of general shooting, save and just buy the Nikkor 70-200 2.8 II, which is about 2,300. A few quality lenses purchase will fast get to that anyway. That lens will do portraits, close wildlife, sports etc for you.

If you can do without VR (image stabilization) Nikon has an 80-200 2.8 which I am aiming for and is very nice indeed. The pro lens before the VR's came along. That lens is 'only' 1,100 new. You can buy a used one for less.

Some swear by image stabilization, but I don't give a hoot about it. Some will probably chip in that if you are shooting such as D800 with the high res, you will need VR, not sure, they are more learned than I and I have not used it.

- Rendition - Don't discount this. By this is meant how the lens brings in the subject and the image looks from that lens.. hard to explain, real explanation is looking at some images on flickr and pbase of various lenses. It involves how a lens shows depth of field (in focus and out of focus) but its far more than that. Its also contrast /microcontrast, colour interpretation etc. Some call it how the lens 'draws'. The 70--200's and 80-200 both draw very nicely in my opinion. I don't have them I have seen many images form them. That is why I say, before buying a lens go to the image ssites and see how the lens does by many people, includding on your type camera.

i.e. How do the images form the lens 'look'.

- Cost - if you are only a hobbyist, unless you are wealthy and can afford it, or have not many responsibilities such as family etc, aim for quality but also value. No point buying the most expensive unless earning money from it, BUT you do want quality that will last and lenses will be with you for life, unless you sell them. An example is that for the average person, an 85 1.8G at 500 dollars is more suitable than an 85 1.4 G for about 1,600 dollars. The 85 1.8 is about a thousand less and gives immaculate quality apparently (I don't have). That is just one example.

- My 'drools' - Ha, Honestly, I like the look of specific lenses from viewing many times on image sites. The Zeiss lenses I mentioned are some. You don't have to spend, just look at some image sites for examples of the Zeiss lenses. The ones I mentioned are the 'less expensive' Zeiss    but not cheap. But look darn nice to me. Zeiss are manual focus though, horses for courses.

The Voigtlander Nokton 58mm same thing. The Samyang 85 1.4 is a manual focus lens and cheaper than the Nikon 85 1.8G. but another nice lens, if one uses manual focus.

I did not mention the expensive Zeiss, like the 100 Macro which is mucho dinero indeed, but apparently a dream lens all say. Have not really studied images form it....didn't bother with the price what it is.

Some third party lenses like Sigma 35 1.,4 are very nicer with one issue, the third party providers reverse engineer the electronics, so when there is a cameras update, you may have to send the lens for rechipping..but if that is only every few years, maybe not an issue..depending on you. Also, some have issue using live view focus also...it seems. I would not mind, don't use live view focus.

Zooms - traditionaly theory is that zooms can not equal primes in image quality. That said, there are some great zooms, if one pays and one must balance it with that you need and what size you are printing etc, what you are willing top pay. For telephoto, if you save and save, I doubt anyone would criticize the 70-200 2.8 VRII which some say is just as good as primes. Also, the Nikon 14-24 2.8 G (abput 2,000) (I think that is it) is praised all around and the images I have seen by photographers using it, are impeccable. Bear in mind too, take care in buying wide angles, a top quality wide angle wont be cheap and maybe, just maybe, if you are really into wide angles, that 14-14 2.8 . 'bought once' is better than buying a prime here and there and not being satisfied....it is not cheap, but its apparently and looks from images to be as good as any wide angle prime. However, Tokina also make wide angle zooms and they may do you fine, have very good quality anyway and cost much, much less. Or Nikon also has a 16-35 f4 VR. It is about what you need, no  point wasting money.

Maybe...its better to save and save for the best and leave it at that? Dunno, that's a choice. Three or so primes could easily come to what one of those two great zooms would come to.  So, a nifty fifty (50 1.8G) and those two zooms could easily do many people probably. Not cheap but...we only live once in this life. And not that expensive considering those zooms should last years. Amortise that cost over say, then years?

At the end of the day...

- buy nice lenses within your budget....don't just spend but spend on what you 'need' or 'really want'

- think about rendition, I think its important

- take your time...photos with your current gear will indicate what you need or want next.

Those are my humble and AMATEUR opinions!!1

Most of all...

Enjoy!!!!!

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Enjoy.....believe in yourself..

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