Panasonic GH3 review published

Started Apr 15, 2013 | Discussions
Aleo Veuliah
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Re: Image quality / On the other way.
In reply to PhotoKhan, Apr 16, 2013

PhotoKhan wrote:

Mushy definition. Mute and/or odd colors. Crunched contrast.

That's what I see in the samples gallery...Didn't know this could be done at this time in digital camera development history.

PK

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From the review.


Resolution

Neither Adobe Camera Raw nor Silkypix (at its default settings) quite match the camera's JPEG output in terms of fine detail rendering. Impressively, the GH3 shows this detail without its sharpening going too far and showing obvious halos.


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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to gregs4163, Apr 16, 2013

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

Richard Butler can you give an answer?

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Stephen McDonald
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Time Lag & Clipping with Video
In reply to PhotoKhan, Apr 16, 2013

I was surprised to see so much time lag (1 sec.) in video start-up and clipping of 1.5 to 2-sec. off the end of each shot. It was suggested that this could be changed with a firmware upgrade. I could tolerate the delay at start-up, but I know there would be some times I'd stop without letting it run over by 2 extra seconds. You could learn to change your shooting habits to accommodate this, but it would be annoying.

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rrr_hhh
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to gregs4163, Apr 16, 2013

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

The scoring is not with respect to what the lder models are, bBut with respect to the actual offering of other brands and those have moved forward. Also, compared to the GH2, the GH3 has some negative points as well. I think the VF problem took on point away from what DPreview team said in this thread.

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rrr_hhh
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to Aleo Veuliah, Apr 16, 2013

Aleo Veuliah wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

Actually I went back and looked at the final scores for both the GH2 & GH3 and under the Ergonomics & Handling category they scored the GH2 higher????? doesn't that contradict what they were saying throughout the review????

Yes a bit, the GH3 is larger but ergonomics are better.

the VF is probably what brings the number of point down : it is a very important aspect of ergonomics which disn't limited to the number of buttons and the way it feels in your hands.

I think that he scoring is right : the E-M5 is just a ad better camera with two ground breaking features, the new sensor and the fabulous IBIS.

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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to rrr_hhh, Apr 16, 2013

rrr_hhh wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

The scoring is not with respect to what the lder models are, bBut with respect to the actual offering of other brands and those have moved forward. Also, compared to the GH2, the GH3 has some negative points as well. I think the VF problem took on point away from what DPreview team said in this thread.

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rrr_hhh

What are the plus points for e.g an electronic shutter etc.etc  be positive.

When you think negative the results are negative.

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MichaelKJ
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to gregs4163, Apr 16, 2013

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

My understanding is that cameras are scored based on current state of the art and technology. If scores were relative to older cameras, they would eventually end up over 100%.

This is common practice. IQ tests and college admission tests (SAT, ACT) are recalibrated every few years. If the same IQ scale was used that was used 50 years ago, the average IQ today would be about 120 instead of 100.

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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to rrr_hhh, Apr 16, 2013

rrr_hhh wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

The scoring is not with respect to what the lder models are, bBut with respect to the actual offering of other brands and those have moved forward. Also, compared to the GH2, the GH3 has some negative points as well. I think the VF problem took on point away from what DPreview team said in this thread.

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rr

Well if that is how they do it then their reviewing technique is flawed! you never shoot at a moving target because you never have a firm point of reference to work from? And as far as the EVF is concerned, in the review they gave it a 3 steps forward 1 step back sort of view compared to the GH2 in my eye I believe it to be better at least contrast wise and resolution, I still can't see the problems people are having but that is me.

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Anders W
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Re: Panasonic GH3 review
In reply to Dr_Jon, Apr 16, 2013

Dr_Jon wrote:

Which is actually more annoying in some ways as Sony did a deal with Canon and Panasonic didn't... Still that's the way of things... (I suspect Sony had something Canon wanted Patent-wise.)

So are you saying that Sony licensed this particular technology from Canon? Not saying you are wrong but what source of information do you have?

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rrr_hhh
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to gregs4163, Apr 16, 2013

gregs4163 wrote:

rrr_hhh wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

The scoring is not with respect to what the lder models are, bBut with respect to the actual offering of other brands and those have moved forward. Also, compared to the GH2, the GH3 has some negative points as well. I think the VF problem took on point away from what DPreview team said in this thread.

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rr

Well if that is how they do it then their reviewing technique is flawed! you never shoot at a moving target because you never have a firm point of reference to work from?

No this is common practice since after a few years all cameras would score at maximum if not and there won't be any way to make a distinction between different brands of cameras issued the same year.

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Aleo Veuliah
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to Marco Cinnirella, Apr 16, 2013

Marco Cinnirella wrote:

Sean Nelson wrote:

Aleo Veuliah wrote:

Is it possible that some cameras have faulty EVF's and others not ?

I'm still thinking that my theory about improperly assembled or reversed eyepieces on some of the early GH3s is plausible...

But it seems highly unlikely that Panasonic would send DPR a defective GH3 Sean - if Panasonic have quietly changed the GH3 EVF optics in later batches surely it would have made sense for them to ensure that DPR had a GH3 for testing that is from the "good" batch ?!

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"When words become unclear, I shall focus with photographs. When images become inadequate, I shall be content with silence." Ansell Adams.

Maybe they made a mistake or they even have care about that. But it is strange.


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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to MichaelKJ, Apr 16, 2013

MichaelKJ wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

My understanding is that cameras are scored based on current state of the art and technology. If scores were relative to older cameras, they would eventually end up over 100%.

This is common practice. IQ tests and college admission tests (SAT, ACT) are recalibrated every few years. If the same IQ scale was used that was used 50 years ago, the average IQ today would be about 120 instead of 100.

Then that makes no sense "current state of technology" what is your baseline? which camera do you compare it to? what makes any of the scores relative? if this is there rational then the numerical score is meaningless, you never shoot at a moving target because you never have a baseline to compare?

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gregs4163
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to rrr_hhh, Apr 16, 2013

rrr_hhh wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

rrr_hhh wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

The scoring is not with respect to what the lder models are, bBut with respect to the actual offering of other brands and those have moved forward. Also, compared to the GH2, the GH3 has some negative points as well. I think the VF problem took on point away from what DPreview team said in this thread.

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rr

Well if that is how they do it then their reviewing technique is flawed! you never shoot at a moving target because you never have a firm point of reference to work from?

No this is common practice since after a few years all cameras would score at maximum if not and there won't be any way to make a distinction between different brands of cameras issued the same year.

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rrr_hhh

Which makes my point exactly the numerical score is meaningless, if you don't have a common reference point? You can have a camera score 95% from a year ago not be as good as a camera scoring 70% this year makes no sense, defies common logic and makes all other score meaningless.

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Anders W
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Re: Panasonic GH3 review
In reply to amtberg, Apr 16, 2013

amtberg wrote:

exdeejjjaaaa wrote:

Anders W wrote:

exdeejjjaaaa wrote:

Alexis D wrote:

and the best IBIS around (stabilsing any lens that is mounted on it)

and shutter shock because of that

You got that wrong. Shutters cause shutter shock. Stabilization systems don't.

no, my friend... IBIS can't handle shutter shock caused by shutter... that's why GH3 does not have it... sensor is one mass w/ body.

Cameras without IBIS, including the GH3, suffer from shutter shock, too.  I wish Panny would incorporate Oly's anti-shock controls.  Electronic shutter is the ultimate solution, but it isn't always useable.

I think we are largely in agreement here. I think pretty much all MFT bodies (and other cameras with a mechanical shutter too) suffer from shutter shock to at least some degree if you look at the matter with sufficient care and precision. Different users may see the problem more or less clearly depending on how carefully they have looked for it and how picky they are. On top of that, there may well be slight variations from one copy of a body to another.

When talking about the GH3 in this regard, is what you say based on your own experiences with the camera (I know you have one)? If so, I'd be interested in hearing more. And if you have links to other sources of information, I'd be interested in those too. I am asking just out of curiousity. As you might be aware, I have taken a certain interest in the shutter-shock issue due to my own experiences with the E-M5 and the discussions about the shutter-shock problems with that camera here.

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Just Having Fun
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...and OK for some who wear glasses...
In reply to Sergey Borachev, Apr 16, 2013

I wear glasses, reading glasses.   Any camera with a diopter on the VF works for me.

I was confused at first when people started claiming the GH3 VF does not work well for those who wear glasses because I fond no issues with mine.

So let's just say that anyone who chooses to wear glasses and not use the diopter may have issues.

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Dr_Jon
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Re: Panasonic GH3 review
In reply to Anders W, Apr 16, 2013

Just an assumption based on Canon having several relevant patents, although Sony might have got round them in some way but I think it would be tricky as it's a simple theory. No great insight.

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Anders W
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Re: Panasonic GH3 review
In reply to exdeejjjaaaa, Apr 16, 2013

exdeejjjaaaa wrote:

Anders W wrote:

exdeejjjaaaa wrote:

Alexis D wrote:

and the best IBIS around (stabilsing any lens that is mounted on it)

and shutter shock because of that

You got that wrong. Shutters cause shutter shock. Stabilization systems don't.

no, my friend... IBIS can't handle shutter shock caused by shutter... that's why GH3 does not have it... sensor is one mass w/ body.

If you'd remember earlier discussions between us about this matter, you'd know that there is little in the way of evidence to support this theory of yours.

Does the E-M5 IBIS cause shutter shock? Clearly not. The shutter causes it.

Does the E-M5 IBIS significantly exacerbate the shock caused by the shutter? Not that I know. What evidence for that proposition would you point to?

Does the E-M5 IBIS counteract the shutter shock? Regrettably not. Unfortunately, this makes the E-M5 IBIS close to useless (in my personal experience) with certain lenses at certain shutter speeds. But IBIS doesn't make things worse than they would otherwise have been, and, last but not least, it helps greatly with other lenses and/or at other shutter speeds than the particular ones affected by the shutter shock.

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rrr_hhh
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Re: About the EVF.
In reply to gregs4163, Apr 16, 2013

gregs4163 wrote:

MichaelKJ wrote:

gregs4163 wrote:

I agree with you 100% I can't for the life of me see any of the problems they are talking about? color or focus mine seems to be perfectly fine in my eyes???? Another thing too is they seem to agree that the GH3 is a step up from the GH2 in image quality, ergonomics, video etc... the list goes on, yet they give it the same exact score (79%) as the GH2???? shouldn't it get points for moving forward and building on an already great camera!

My understanding is that cameras are scored based on current state of the art and technology. If scores were relative to older cameras, they would eventually end up over 100%.

This is common practice. IQ tests and college admission tests (SAT, ACT) are recalibrated every few years. If the same IQ scale was used that was used 50 years ago, the average IQ today would be about 120 instead of 100.

Then that makes no sense "current state of technology" what is your baseline? which camera do you compare it to? what makes any of the scores relative? if this is there rational then the numerical score is meaningless, you never shoot at a moving target because you never have a baseline to compare?

The numerical score isn't everything in a review. You have the comments and the comparator widget of the studio scene and you ave sample pictures which you could download. Would it make more sense to you if the GH3 got five points better than the GH2, but then three points less than the E-M5 which is on parr with it if not better.

BTW, the score corresponds quite well with what users are sharing here : many GH2 owners are reluctant to upgrade the GH3 or went over to the E-M5.

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Re: Panasonic GH3 review published
In reply to Richard Butler, Apr 16, 2013

R Butler wrote:

I know it's taken a while (even after we got a camera to work on), but our GH3 review is finally ready.

We worked with Andrew Reid at EOSHD to make sure we really did justice to the camera's video capabilities, so we hope you find something useful or interesting in there:

Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH3 review

Richard - dpreview.com

Thank you for the review, even though it's rather controversial and is a subject of numerous discussions! One thing is clear, Panasonic managed to create something new and interesting, and not just another minor upgrade of the GHx-class of cameras.

There is no surprise that the GH3 shakes the traditionally conservative still-imaging and video-cinematographers by establishing the strong link between these two complimentary tools of art/journalism/craft/documentary, and establishing the new high level among the affordable still/motion-picture cameras.

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John Buechler
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Re: Panasonic GH3 review published
In reply to tgutgu, Apr 16, 2013

You are correct. John Buechler

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