Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive Locked

Started Mar 22, 2013 | User reviews
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matty_boy
New MemberPosts: 24
Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
Mar 22, 2013

I bought an x-e1 from hong kong before they were available in the UK and couldnt wait to get my hands on what seemed to be the ultimate in quality and value mirrorless cameras and was left unimpressed after a few months of usage.

What i liked

the way aperture and shutter speed A, S and M are selected - so intuitive, should be this way on all cameras

focal length and speed of the prime lenses available as well as the price

LCD display, sharp and useful

looks cool

great build quality

What i didnt

size - always seemed slightly too big

good 16MP camera but the images arent really any better than a traditional (and much cheaper) equivalent - although prices have plummeted recently

clunky focus point selection

although praised for its EVF i found it too low resolution, too laggy and if the eye wasnt seated absolutely perfectly (which didnt feel natural) then it always appeared distorted and out of focus, also with a funny colour cast, i guess i have nothing to compare it with but i found it poor to use and avoided it unless i had to use it

useless for anything vaguely approaching action shooting, AF (as of the end of January 2013) just wasnt quick enough, any vague action rendered it useless as an image capture system

odd processed look to images. Even in RAW the files can sometimes look like they have been tampered with

unusual aberrations at some apertures (around f/3.5 on the 35mm and around f/2.8 on the 18mm) seemed like strong sagittal aberration horrible smeary looking towards the edges in some shots

Summary

I got some good pictures with the x-e1 but there were too many misses the camera is frustrating to use quickly if you like to move focus points but quick if you just rely on the center point. Lenses are relatively cheap compared to other systems but as a lens / camera package approaching £1000 i just dont think it offers enough, the images aren't unique (such as with the flawed but amazing sigma cameras) mirrorless is executed better elsewhere and there are question marks about how the camera processes even RAW images. I sold mine, its the shortest period of time I've ever owned a camera. a lot to like but more to dislike

matty_boy's score
2.0
Average community score
4.2
bad for good for
Kids / pets
good
Action / sports
poor
Landscapes / scenery
great
Portraits
good
Low light (without flash)
good
Flash photography (social)
good
Studio / still life
okay
= community average
RhysM
Senior MemberPosts: 1,706
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to matty_boy, Mar 22, 2013

I was thinking of getting either this or the Pro, you're review came at just that right time as you've confirmed everything i feared may bug me about paying £1000 for a camera that just doesn't tick all the boxes.

DJF77
Regular MemberPosts: 380Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to RhysM, Mar 22, 2013

rather than trying the camera YOURSELF, you are willing to listen to one single review that goes against what every XE1 owner will tell you?

Either you are 'special' or you are a partner in crime with the OP? The Fuji lenses are the best at their respective price point... period. Id like to know what mirrorless system the OP thought was better value and could offer results anywhere near approaching the Fuji for the same price?

You won't find another system camera anywhere near the quality of the fuji for £1000... Good luck with your NEX or M43

RhysM
Senior MemberPosts: 1,706
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to DJF77, Mar 22, 2013

I will be getting a D600 or D7100, I don't want form over function and initially thought the one of the X-Series could effectively be a miniature DSLR.

Maybe when they get the EX1 or Pro focussing as fast as the X100s I will reconsider, but for now function trumps form.

pbull
Junior MemberPosts: 47Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to RhysM, Mar 22, 2013

If you need a DSLR then this is not the camera for you.

I have a D600, M8 and the Fuji. None of these can absolutely replace the other. But I find the Fuji to be the most versatile with jaw dropping IQ.

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baobob
Veteran MemberPosts: 5,952Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to matty_boy, Mar 22, 2013

Do you like rock and TROLL?????????????????????????

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Experience comes from bad judgment

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simon
Senior MemberPosts: 2,351
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to baobob, Mar 22, 2013

baobob wrote:

Do you like rock and TROLL?????????????????????????

-- hide signature --

Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment

Hi Robert,

Thanks - I see whats going on here now 

-- hide signature --

- Simon, Sydney

mistermejia
Senior MemberPosts: 2,855Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to RhysM, Mar 22, 2013

RhysM wrote:

I will be getting a D600 or D7100, I don't want form over function and initially thought the one of the X-Series could effectively be a miniature DSLR.

Maybe when they get the EX1 or Pro focussing as fast as the X100s I will reconsider, but for now function trumps form.

+1

Every so often a camera company (or any other electronics company) makes a better camera than the rest of the competition, but eventually others catch up. From what i am seeing the D7100 is catching up, and it sure is giving me A LOT for only $1169. That is pretty amazing to me. Yes, they are apples and watermelons, but money is money, and what is it that i am getting for the same amount of money, or even for less??

I have been looking at this smaller bodies Fujis, but they are just too darn slow for me, for what they cost. I have no doubt these small cameras kick bootie, the colors are great and the high ISO IQ is great. I love Fuji, at least my S5 PRO that is. For me personally, i have been blessed that i have been able to buy an S5, simply because it has a Nikon mount lens, and it makes no sense for me to chance brands. The lenses i already have will work flawlessly on the new inexpensive D7100 so i don't have to re-invest, so that's a no brainer for me now.

But Nikon has changed the game once more. It should be interesting how other camera makers will be comming out with soon too, including Fuji.  Very interesting in deed. I don't think there is a right and wrong here and i sure don't see anything wrong with the OP low review of the camera.

Not everybody drives the same car, correct?

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Astrophotographer 10
Senior MemberPosts: 4,678Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to pbull, Mar 22, 2013

I have had XE1 since Christmas. I have 18-55, 35mm F1.4 and 14mm F2.8 lenses. I also own a Nikon D800E, Sony RX100, Sony Nex 6 and a Canon 40D.

The Fuji is the camera I use the most for terrestial shots. Its light, it has great IQ, the AF with the last firmware upgrade seems fast enough and reliable even in low light for portrait/landscape, the lenses are the best I have ever used and are "inexpensive" for their quality compared to competitors, low light performance is the best of the mirrorless cameras at this time. It has great fit and finish and the menu system is intuitive and easy to use.

Video is not so great but useable. The lenses are better than anyone elses (I am not totaly familiar with Oly lenses and I hear great things about the Oly 75mm F1.8 but every Fuji lens I have used is phenomenal). I have read though the 18mm may be the weakest lens in their lineup - others would know better.

For action other cameras may be better. The Nex 6 is new for me so I can't comment on it much so far except image quality does look very good but I prefer Fuji colours. Nex video is superb like the RX100 - wow, really polished and easy to get a great video with fantastic sound quality as well.

With regards to the evf being not clear can I ask the obvious question did you tune it with the adjuster next to it so its infocus? It can be a tad grainy at time but I have warmed to it and you can always not use it and use the LCD screen instead. I find the EVF is great for manual focusing for nightshots - it really makes it easy especially with the 3X magnify function from pushing the command dial once.

A Nikon D600 is on paper a much superior camera but really quite a different beasty. I was going to get one as a 2nd DSLR to my D800E but the dust/oil issue is a serious flaw. I am waiting to see if the rumour Nikon is about to discontinue the D600 and bring out a D600s is true. They may upgrade it to make it attractive again and do a redesign to get around this dust issue which plagues that model. Have a look at the Nikon FX forum and 20% of the threads there over the last 6 months have been about D600 dust/oil on sensor problems.

D800E is the one to get at the moment. Its the perfect camera for me. But if you want to shoot action you would need a D4 or a Canon 1Dx or perhaps a smaller DSLR with fast FPS. Canon 7D should be cheap with a new 7D2 around the corner.

The obvious difference between XE1 and a D600 is price. Your D600 costs a lot more, lenses that are comparable cost 3 to 4X as much as the Fuji equivalent. The Nikon lenses are great but the Fuji's are better for me so far. Lighter, smaller, as sharp or sharper, nice rendition, no flaring, no distortion, 1/3rd the price nearly.

The only competition to XE1 at present is OMD EM5 Oly and perhaps Nex 6. I could comment on the Nex 6 later as I use it and know it better. So far the video is fantastic, the form not as nice but its a modern form whereas Fuji is a retro form. Both are well built. Nex is typical Sony in that it is small but jam packed with technology. Both types of AF, wifi remote control on your iphone or smart phone, gps, tiltable screen, steady shot, EVF (seems the same or similar to Fuji), menus are not as well laid out as Fuji but understandable even if it will take longer to change settings, lens selection from Sony seems good on paper but when you dig in not so many nice lenses and most are slow whereas most Fujis are F2.8 or better.

Nex has more support from 3rd parties like Metabones, adapters. Contax G lenses are recommended (that could also go with Fuji) and Sigma 19/30mm, Samyang 8mm fisheye (there is an xmount version), Contax g 21, 28, 35, 45 and 90 F2.8 or better.

EM5 is really the hot competition as it has IBIS, tiltable screen, a range of lenses, fast AF, long exposures unlimited without intervalometer, long exposure image buildup on screen so you can see the exposure as it is being taken build up on the screen. For me the main drawback was the cramped form and the smaller sensor which seems to have softwared up with sharpening etc a bit too much to improve performance. But a tempting camera and it did win the poll here for the best camera of 2012.

Greg.

Tom Schum
Senior MemberPosts: 3,528Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to matty_boy, Mar 23, 2013

I worked this post up using a desktop editor, and the colors didn't translate.  So, I have underlined my responses.

matty_boy wrote:

I bought an x-e1 from hong kong before they were available in the UK and couldnt wait to get my hands on what seemed to be the ultimate in quality and value mirrorless cameras and was left unimpressed after a few months of usage.

What i liked

the way aperture and shutter speed A, S and M are selected - so intuitive, should be this way on all cameras   Yes I agree

focal length and speed of the prime lenses available as well as the price  Yes my 18-55 zoom really is very nice, and not too big.

LCD display, sharp and useful  I find it adequate but not spectacular.

looks cool  Yep it sure does.

great build quality  Yes it does seem to be pretty well put together

What i didnt

size - always seemed slightly too big  I found it small, bought the thumb rest to get beyond that.

good 16MP camera but the images arent really any better than a traditional (and much cheaper) equivalent - although prices have plummeted recently  I think the image quality beats the Nikon D7000.  Even though the resolution (based on resolution shots in DPR) is about the same, the X-trans does it without moire at the limits.  The false detail is quite pleasant beyond the limits of resolution, and it makes a better photo (at least in my mind).

clunky focus point selection  Maybe so, but I don't often change the focus point.

although praised for its EVF i found it too low resolution, too laggy and if the eye wasnt seated absolutely perfectly (which didnt feel natural) then it always appeared distorted and out of focus, also with a funny colour cast, i guess i have nothing to compare it with but i found it poor to use and avoided it unless i had to use it  I like the EVF and I find it easy to use and very clear and sharp.  I am nearsighted and I view it using my distance glasses, so maybe I am seeing it at its best.  I do find it to be very easy to move the diopter thumbwheel accidentally, and this bothers me a little bit.

useless for anything vaguely approaching action shooting, AF (as of the end of January 2013) just wasnt quick enough, any vague action rendered it useless as an image capture system This has not been an issue for me but I don't do much action shooting.

odd processed look to images. Even in RAW the files can sometimes look like they have been tampered with  I like the Fuji rendering and the out of camera JPGs.  If there is anything wrong with them it is a slight color smearing at the edges of brightly colored areas.  I usually post sharpen the out of camera JPGs and I have had no trouble with that.  Also, enhancing color and contrast has been pretty straightforward, at least in Photoshop Elements 9.  If you are processing raws using last month's raw processor, you can get a "watercolor" effect which I have seen often on this forum.

unusual aberrations at some apertures (around f/3.5 on the 35mm and around f/2.8 on the 18mm) seemed like strong sagittal aberration horrible smeary looking towards the edges in some shots  I don't have those lenses.  I only have the 18-55 zoom.  My guess is Fuji is doing something to remove visible distortion, and I would love to be able to turn that feature OFF!  Surely a firmware upgrade could add that function… It isn't used when I "shoot without lens" but I have to use my non-Fuji lens then (Samyang 8mm fisheye, which has loads of distortion).

Summary

I got some good pictures with the x-e1 but there were too many misses the camera is frustrating to use quickly if you like to move focus points but quick if you just rely on the center point. Lenses are relatively cheap compared to other systems but as a lens / camera package approaching £1000 i just dont think it offers enough, the images aren't unique (such as with the flawed but amazing sigma cameras) mirrorless is executed better elsewhere and there are question marks about how the camera processes even RAW images. I sold mine, its the shortest period of time I've ever owned a camera. a lot to like but more to dislike

My experience and reading tells me my X-E1 is a good investment because the lenses are so very good!  They will continue to amaze on next year's body, which might focus much faster (for those who have to have that kind of speed), and which might have even better focus point repositioning support, etc.

I've owned three Sigmas and I'm no stranger to Canon either.  The Sigmas can produce better image quality only at low ISO in very good light.  The Sigma SD1 beats the X-E1 in resolution and image quality, but the SD15 and DP2 (non-M) have enough oomph to really give the X-E1 some image quality competition.  However, only at low ISO in really good light.  The Canon colors (from my 30D, the oldest of my DSLRs) are just a little bit too sweet (can't find a better word) so I seldom use it.  The X-E1 consistently nails the white balance, something my other cameras can't do (excepting my X10 of course).

Finally I have to add: the X-E1 is just more fun to use (as well as the X10), and the excellent JPGs out of camera are a joy to touch up (that's usually all I need to do).


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Tom Schum

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simon
Senior MemberPosts: 2,351
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to Tom Schum, Mar 23, 2013

Tom Schum wrote:

My experience and reading tells me my X-E1 is a good investment because the lenses are so very good! They will continue to amaze on next year's body, which might focus much faster (for those who have to have that kind of speed), and which might have even better focus point repositioning support, etc.

-- hide signature --

Tom Schum

Hi Tom,

Indeed - a timely reminder as you mention about lenses.

Good glass lasts forever (well not quite . . . but a long time) but the bodies do churn.

I remember from my Nikon days, I had all the same f/2.8 glass for years and years. I did however refresh the D-Series bodies every couple of years. Years on, the f/2.8 glass was still performing excellently.

thanks,

-- hide signature --

- Simon, Sydney

hellocrowley
Senior MemberPosts: 1,194
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to matty_boy, Mar 23, 2013

Oh no, a negative review from an actual owner, quick, let's get the pitch forks and troll stickers.

Good glass lasts forever, until it becomes obsolete because a faster focusing version comes out.

Phil Levy
Contributing MemberPosts: 586Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to baobob, Mar 23, 2013

baobob wrote:

Do you like rock and TROLL?????????????????????????

-- hide signature --

Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment

It never ceases to a puzzle me how these threads always seem to be started by new members -  this site has been going for so long now, how has someone with so much to say not been here before? This has to impact on their credibility for  such outbursts of opinion.

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John Carson
Veteran MemberPosts: 4,062Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to Phil Levy, Mar 23, 2013

Phil Levy wrote:

baobob wrote:

Do you like rock and TROLL?????????????????????????

-- hide signature --

Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment

It never ceases to a puzzle me how these threads always seem to be started by new members - this site has been going for so long now, how has someone with so much to say not been here before? This has to impact on their credibility for such outbursts of opinion.

It seems that DP Review is now automatically creating threads by posting reviews into forums. See here:

http://www.dpreview.com/products/Fujifilm/slrs/fujifilm_xe1/user-reviews

-- hide signature --

john carson

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Phil Levy
Contributing MemberPosts: 586Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to John Carson, Mar 23, 2013

John Carson wrote:

Phil Levy wrote:

baobob wrote:

Do you like rock and TROLL?????????????????????????

-- hide signature --

Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment

It never ceases to a puzzle me how these threads always seem to be started by new members - this site has been going for so long now, how has someone with so much to say not been here before? This has to impact on their credibility for such outbursts of opinion.

It seems that DP Review is now automatically creating threads by posting reviews into forums. See here:

http://www.dpreview.com/products/Fujifilm/slrs/fujifilm_xe1/user-reviews

-- hide signature --

john carson

It is bad enough putting up with constant  references to all the latest "one man" photo bloggers extreme opinions - now we have to have the forums diluted down with reviews  by random people who have never posted before. Surely not a good thing. If I want to read such content I would just go to Amazon's product pages.

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TThorne
Senior MemberPosts: 2,544Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to DJF77, Mar 23, 2013

DJF77 wrote:

rather than trying the camera YOURSELF, you are willing to listen to one single review that goes against what every XE1 owner will tell you?

Either you are 'special' or you are a partner in crime with the OP? The Fuji lenses are the best at their respective price point... period. Id like to know what mirrorless system the OP thought was better value and could offer results anywhere near approaching the Fuji for the same price?

You won't find another system camera anywhere near the quality of the fuji for £1000... Good luck with your NEX or M43

I think the more surprising thing here is the insinuation that that somehow one person must be party to a nefarious act simply for heeding the opinion of another person who's opinion on a consumer electronics product differs from yours.

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

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Phil Levy
Contributing MemberPosts: 586Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to TThorne, Mar 23, 2013

TThorne wrote:

DJF77 wrote:

rather than trying the camera YOURSELF, you are willing to listen to one single review that goes against what every XE1 owner will tell you?

Either you are 'special' or you are a partner in crime with the OP? The Fuji lenses are the best at their respective price point... period. Id like to know what mirrorless system the OP thought was better value and could offer results anywhere near approaching the Fuji for the same price?

You won't find another system camera anywhere near the quality of the fuji for £1000... Good luck with your NEX or M43

I think the more surprising thing here is the insinuation that that somehow one person must be party to a nefarious act simply for heeding the opinion of another person who's opinion on a consumer electronics product differs from yours.

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and everyone is entitled to heed whatever opinions they wish - it would be wise however to scrutinise the credibility of said opinions, especially as it seems that the forums are now about to be infused with "Amazon-style" product reviews from all and sundry.

-- hide signature --

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DJF77
Regular MemberPosts: 380Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to Phil Levy, Mar 23, 2013

one thing I agree on is that DP really shouldn't have bothered implementing user reviews - it's bad enough reading Amazon customer reviews where people will condemn a whole system because so named camera has a 'funny grip' or 'it froze on me once' ...

No offence to the original poster but I'd rather read a professional review by someone who we know actually has experience of using cameras and has many systems to compare to. I'm not interested if Joe Bloggs finds it hard to focus or doesn't like the viewfinder etc...

TThorne
Senior MemberPosts: 2,544Gear list
Re: Nice enough but unconvincing and expensive
In reply to Phil Levy, Mar 23, 2013

Phil Levy wrote:

TThorne wrote:

DJF77 wrote:

rather than trying the camera YOURSELF, you are willing to listen to one single review that goes against what every XE1 owner will tell you?

Either you are 'special' or you are a partner in crime with the OP? The Fuji lenses are the best at their respective price point... period. Id like to know what mirrorless system the OP thought was better value and could offer results anywhere near approaching the Fuji for the same price?

You won't find another system camera anywhere near the quality of the fuji for £1000... Good luck with your NEX or M43

I think the more surprising thing here is the insinuation that that somehow one person must be party to a nefarious act simply for heeding the opinion of another person who's opinion on a consumer electronics product differs from yours.

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and everyone is entitled to heed whatever opinions they wish - it would be wise however to scrutinise the credibility of said opinions, especially as it seems that the forums are now about to be infused with "Amazon-style" product reviews from all and sundry.

-- hide signature --

www.phillevy.co.uk

So scrutinize, in this manner, a review that lists both likes and dislikes, positives and negatives? I have to ask, would you also suggest such a level of scrutiny for a review that is 100% positive?

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

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Phil Levy
Contributing MemberPosts: 586Gear list
Absolutely (nt)
In reply to TThorne, Mar 23, 2013

TThorne wrote:

Phil Levy wrote:

TThorne wrote:

DJF77 wrote:

rather than trying the camera YOURSELF, you are willing to listen to one single review that goes against what every XE1 owner will tell you?

Either you are 'special' or you are a partner in crime with the OP? The Fuji lenses are the best at their respective price point... period. Id like to know what mirrorless system the OP thought was better value and could offer results anywhere near approaching the Fuji for the same price?

You won't find another system camera anywhere near the quality of the fuji for £1000... Good luck with your NEX or M43

I think the more surprising thing here is the insinuation that that somehow one person must be party to a nefarious act simply for heeding the opinion of another person who's opinion on a consumer electronics product differs from yours.

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and everyone is entitled to heed whatever opinions they wish - it would be wise however to scrutinise the credibility of said opinions, especially as it seems that the forums are now about to be infused with "Amazon-style" product reviews from all and sundry.

-- hide signature --

www.phillevy.co.uk

So scrutinize, in this manner, a review that lists both likes and dislikes, positives and negatives? I have to ask, would you also suggest such a level of scrutiny for a review that is 100% positive?

-- hide signature --

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. - Sir Winston Churchill

-- hide signature --

www.phillevy.co.uk

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