MS Security Essentials and Windows Defender

Started Mar 20, 2013 | Discussions
Jim Cockfield
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Yep... those kinds of programs are not good
In reply to skyglider, Mar 25, 2013

skyglider wrote:

Jim Cockfield wrote:

I can't figure out why you guys are seeing that, as I've never ran the AntiError program or GeekBuddy before, even though I see them installed.

IOW, it looks like you would have needed to start it manually from what I can see in the user guide about it:

http://help.comodo.com/topic-86-1-416-4622-Starting-and-Using-AntiError.html

No, I "never ever" started AntiError manually. Every popup that said AntiError found serious issues with my PC happened all by themselves. I did click on the AntiError icon on my desktop after I uninstalled GeekBuddy to see if that also uninstalled AntiError. Clicking the AntiError icon popped up a window saying that the link was broken. So that did not start AntiError manually either.

I just installed the free version of Comodo Internet Security from here:

http://www.comodo.com/home/internet-security/free-internet-security.php

Is that the one you guys used, or did you use something like the trial version of Internet Security 2013 instead (the link above is the free version I installed).

Yes, I clicked on the link that you previously provided to me, to download Comodo IS.

Interesting.

The only thing I can think of that may explain why I've never seen that behavior is because I've been running the Comodo Firewall for a while now (an older 5.x release), which has some of the same default deny protection the full Internet Security Suite has, and I was using it as an added layer of protection along with Avira Antivir Premium.

I uninstalled the old Comodo Products before installing the newer Internet Security Suite (and I even reinstalled it a couple of days ago to observe it's defaults).  But, perhaps it retained some of the old preferences for some reason, even though I uninstalled the earlier products. So, maybe that's why I've never seen the behavior you guys are reporting.

In any event, I agree that that kind of behavior is bad (reporting vague registry errors from what it sounds like you guys are seeing, and suggesting using their tech support to solve them).  I've never even seen those components running before, even though I see program entries for them so they were installed.

So, I'll make sure to suggest opting out (or uninstalling) the GeekBuddy components going forward; as I'm only interested in the protection aspect that Comodo provides, not any of the "snake oil" addons like it sounds like their AntiError and GeekBuddy programs are giving you.

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digitalshooter
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Re: I've never seen it running
In reply to Jim Cockfield, Mar 25, 2013

Jim, I installed this one:

http://www.comodo.com/home/internet-security/antivirus.php?key5sk1=468c0b52b24ab2dac0b23c2edb3bf3a8c212136c&key5sk2=&key5sk3=1364247964000&key5sk4=&key5sk5=1364247965000&key5sk6=&key5sk7=1364247971000&key6sk1=&key6sk2=IE90&key6sk3=7&key6sk4=en-us&key6sk5=US&key6sk6=0&key6sk7=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.comodo.com%2Fhome%2Fpc-security.php&key6sk8=116602&key6sk9=13501080&key6sk10=true&key6sk11=a63aba189f00cae98eb135c48621a92516df589b&key6sk12=2034&key7sk1=37&key7sk2=43&key1sk1=dt&key1sk2=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.comodo.com%2Fhome%2Fpc-security.php

During the scan process it popped up and said it found possible malware, remember this was a fresh clean machine.  Turned out it was an hp legit file.

Have not removed any products because I wanted to see what else it may do as I install other stuff.

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digitalshooter
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No bad here its all a discussion! (nt)
In reply to skyglider, Mar 25, 2013
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digitalshooter
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Re: Yep... those kinds of programs are not good
In reply to Jim Cockfield, Mar 25, 2013

Jim, I think you have to do the custom install instead of the express and you may be given an option of all of the other install.

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digitalshooter
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When it finished the scan it did give the option to
In reply to skyglider, Mar 25, 2013

allow you to manually repair or to let them decide.  I think the prompt to call is just that a prompt.  You can still repair the issues.

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digitalshooter
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Personally, I would rather deal with the pop up from a good company
In reply to skyglider, Mar 25, 2013

rather than no pop up from a software that has poor ratings.

The only other answer is to purchase something.

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digitalshooter
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Something interesting just happened
In reply to skyglider, Mar 25, 2013

I had moved all of the comodo icons from the desktop into a folder on the desktop.  Did some windows updates, rebooted and the antierror and geekbuddy icons reappeared.

Strange

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Jim Cockfield
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I'd just uninstall it
In reply to digitalshooter, Mar 25, 2013

digitalshooter wrote:

I had moved all of the comodo icons from the desktop into a folder on the desktop. Did some windows updates, rebooted and the antierror and geekbuddy icons reappeared.

Based on what you guys are reporting, I think I'd just uninstall GeekBuddy.

I'm not in Windows right this minute. But the next time I boot into it, I think I'll do yet another reinstall and see if I can duplicate what you guys are seeing.

But, so far, I've never seen the Comodo GeekBuddy or AntiError components running on my PC, even though I see program entries for them (so they were installed, but they have not been running on my desktop).

The only thing I can think of is that I had older versions of Comodo Firewall products running for a long time. So, perhaps the new install of the latest Internet Security Suite honored some of the old settings (even though I uninstalled the older products first) and didn't let that kind of crap run.

But, if I saw it running on my PC, I'd just uninstall those components (and from what I can see from google searches, uninstalling GeekBuddy should solve the problems).

That way, you;d get the Comodo protection (AV, Firewall, etc.) without the annoyances you guys are reporting (and again, I've never even seen the problems you guys are reporting, but I wouldn't be happy about it if I saw those issues).

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digitalshooter
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I did and used the custom feature and
In reply to Jim Cockfield, Mar 26, 2013

no other stuff appeared.

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skyglider
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Re: Something interesting just happened
In reply to digitalshooter, Mar 26, 2013

digitalshooter wrote:

I had moved all of the comodo icons from the desktop into a folder on the desktop. Did some windows updates, rebooted and the antierror and geekbuddy icons reappeared.

Before I uninstalled GeekBuddy, I had renamed the desktop icon from "GeekBuddy" to "Comodo GeekBuddy" to keep all of the Comodo icons together when I sort my desktop icons.  On my next reboot, the "GeekBuddy" icon reappeared just like yours did, so I then had two GeekBuddy icons on my desktop. ..... After I uninstalled GeekBuddy and deleted both GeekBuddy icons, they have not reappeared after one reboot.

Strange

Yep, GeekBuddy is/was quite persistent.

Sky

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Jim Cockfield
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see ths thread about Comodo
In reply to skyglider, Mar 26, 2013

skyglider wrote:

digitalshooter wrote:

I had moved all of the comodo icons from the desktop into a folder on the desktop. Did some windows updates, rebooted and the antierror and geekbuddy icons reappeared.

Before I uninstalled GeekBuddy, I had renamed the desktop icon from "GeekBuddy" to "Comodo GeekBuddy" to keep all of the Comodo icons together when I sort my desktop icons. On my next reboot, the "GeekBuddy" icon reappeared just like yours did, so I then had two GeekBuddy icons on my desktop. ..... After I uninstalled GeekBuddy and deleted both GeekBuddy icons, they have not reappeared after one reboot.

Strange

Yep, GeekBuddy is/was quite persistent.

Yep. My apologies for not seeing their tactics before. But, after further research, I can confirm their behavior in that area. See the thread I started here about it:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/51159201

Don't get my wrong. Their software is great.

But, when a company like that resorts to trying to extract money by using what I'd consider to be scare tactics, they're going to be added to my s*** list (and Comodo is now on that list)

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skyglider
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Windows Defender auto updates and auto scans
In reply to skyglider, Mar 28, 2013

skyglider wrote:

VirtualMirage wrote:

How do you have Windows Updates configured on your Windows machines? Auto, manual, scheduled date, disabled?

I want to say the definitions for MSE and WD get pulled through the built in Windows Update. If this is not set to automatic or set to something like "notify but don't install" or "disabled" then MSE and WD won't get their updates.

While I have had no issues with MSE and WD, they have worked great for me and my machines have been running clean, it is a bit annoying they don't use their own updating mechanism (relying on the Windows update to pull new definitions instead).

Interesting!  I always set Windows updates to no auto updates but notify me when updates are available. I hate it when auto updates is enabled and:

  1. It starts updating my PC when I do a shutdown for the night before going to sleep.  Then I have to wait until the updates are finished or leave my PC running all night.
  2. If an auto update affects something but I wasn't aware that the auto update happened, then it would be hard to determine what caused the problem.  OTOH, when I manually do Windows updates, if something goes wrong I might be able to attribute the problem to the last update.  (Though truthfully this problem hasn't happened that I recall)

Thanks,
Sky

Just to confirm what VirtualMirage wrote for users of Windows Defender (Win8), yes it appears that Windows Defender does not have an auto update procedure of its own and updates are only via the "Windows Update" procedure.  So if "Windows Updates" are not set to automatic, then WD will not be updated automatically. ..... Regarding WD auto scans, I still haven't found a way to do auto scans.  (I have Win8 + WD on my laptop)

I removed MSE from my Win7 tower and am currently running Comodo, so I can't verify auto updates for MSE, but as noted previously, MSE does have an auto scan setting.

Sky

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ClintB
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Re: Windows Defender auto updates and auto scans
In reply to skyglider, Mar 29, 2013

Just for grins, I setup a fresh XP virtual machine and installed a newly downloaded copy of Comodo Internet Security, accepting all the defaults. It did install GeekBuddy and AntiError, which both had icons on the desktop. I fired up AntiError and it asked about disabling some browser add-ons, which I declined. After exiting out and going back in, it indicated there were some things that may need attention, like junk files, etc... Some of it, I would say, is bogus and could be kinda scary to an average user (I'm in IT and do this all day long), so I can certainly see the "scare tactic" point of view. On the other hand, when going through the Comodo install, you can do a custom installation and omit GeekBuddy which also omits AntiError.

So, I can certainly see how some folks would be upset with the AntiError thing; it used to not be there when Comodo Internet Security v6 was released a couple of months ago. Also, there are pop-ups advertising other Comodo products and that can be disabled by going into Settings > General Settings > User Interface > uncheck "Show messages from COMODO Message Center".

To recap:

Custom install, omit GeekBuddy

Disable the advertising with steps in second paragraph above.

I feel that Comodo is putting out a very nice, and free product, that has some minor annoyances that can be completely disabled, so I'm not going to poo poo them. Just be an informed user.

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skyglider
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Re: Windows Defender auto updates and auto scans
In reply to ClintB, Mar 29, 2013

ClintB wrote:

Just for grins, I setup a fresh XP virtual machine and installed a newly downloaded copy of Comodo Internet Security, accepting all the defaults. It did install GeekBuddy and AntiError, which both had icons on the desktop. I fired up AntiError and it asked about disabling some browser add-ons, which I declined. After exiting out and going back in, it indicated there were some things that may need attention, like junk files, etc... Some of it, I would say, is bogus and could be kinda scary to an average user (I'm in IT and do this all day long), so I can certainly see the "scare tactic" point of view. On the other hand, when going through the Comodo install, you can do a custom installation and omit GeekBuddy which also omits AntiError.

So, I can certainly see how some folks would be upset with the AntiError thing; it used to not be there when Comodo Internet Security v6 was released a couple of months ago. Also, there are pop-ups advertising other Comodo products and that can be disabled by going into Settings > General Settings > User Interface > uncheck "Show messages from COMODO Message Center".

To recap:

Custom install, omit GeekBuddy

Disable the advertising with steps in second paragraph above.

I feel that Comodo is putting out a very nice, and free product, that has some minor annoyances that can be completely disabled, so I'm not going to poo poo them. Just be an informed user.

Hi ClintB,

With the benefit of hindsight, you knew what to expect and being in IT, you're better informed than most folks.  But as you mentioned, you saw the AntiError "scare tactic" point of view.

Even with my background of having been a computer technician professionally for many years plus always building my own PCs, I must admit that I was a bit unnerved when AntiError said there were "serious issues" with my computer and to contact a Comodo expert.  I just knew my computer did not have any issues so declined to call Comodo while being encouraged to do so several times during an online chat with a Comodo Tech.

Thanks for pointing out the "Uncheck Show messages from COMODO Message Center" option.  On my version of Comodo 6, the path is "Tasks > Advanced Tasks > Open Advanced Settings > User Interface".  The "Show messages from COMODO message center" option was checked so I unchecked it.  Thanks for the tip!

As you mentioned, it appears that the Comodo annoyances can be disabled.  As long as Comodo doesn't pop up nag messages, I'm fine with any advertising that may appear "while I'm intentionally using it".  Like if there's a banner at the bottom of a scan result that suggests contacting Comodo for expert assistance, I'm willing to ignore that as long as Comodo also gives me the option to clean any malware it found by myself without having to make any phone calls.

Thanks,
Sky

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Jim Cockfield
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It's still a scam
In reply to ClintB, Mar 29, 2013

ClintB wrote:

[snip]

So, I can certainly see how some folks would be upset with the AntiError thing; it used to not be there when Comodo Internet Security v6 was released a couple of months ago. Also, there are pop-ups advertising other Comodo products and that can be disabled by going into Settings > General Settings > User Interface > uncheck "Show messages from COMODO Message Center".

To recap:

Custom install, omit GeekBuddy

Disable the advertising with steps in second paragraph above.

I feel that Comodo is putting out a very nice, and free product, that has some minor annoyances that can be completely disabled, so I'm not going to poo poo them. Just be an informed user.

But it's still  a scam.

Unsuspecting users (meaning your average Windows user) is not going to realize that the results of AntiError are BS, and may end up spending money on their paid support in order to fix the supposed issues.

Of course, in many cases, the issues are nothing more than a way to extra money.   For example, one of the techs told me that junk files are being created constantly and tried to get me to OK remote access to my PC. But, I'd only used Windows a few hours since a full cleanup (removing temp files, windows error logs, etc.) before the tech wanted to help me fix those issues.

So, rather than let them get away with that kind of nonsense, I'd be more inclined to try and convince governing agencies to launch an investigation to help shut them down, so that they don't take advantage of computer users with those types of tactics.

IOW, part of me wants to "look the other way", since the Comodo software is pretty good.  But, I can't ignore their scam tactics, so I will no longer suggest using them going forward, and hope that law enforcement agencies take action to shut them down (and punish any of their management staff that helped to implement and approve the scam tactics being used to increase revenue).

There is just no excuse for that kind of behavior, and it needs to be stopped, one way or another (either because users hear enough negative reviews about it, or law enforcement agencies take action against them).  Otherwise, too many users of their software are going to be unfairly taken advantage of.

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