K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment

Started Feb 3, 2013 | Discussions
awaldram
Forum ProPosts: 10,821Gear list
Like?
K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
Feb 3, 2013

No comment just 1 image and a crop, Note the 1.4 aperture

Sorry for running out of resolution but 6 MP was high enough to see the results

One very happy K5 owner !!!



 awaldram's gear list:awaldram's gear list
Pentax Q Pentax K-3 Pentax smc DA* 55mm F1.4 SDM Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +11 more
Pentax K-5
If you believe there are incorrect tags, please send us this post using our feedback form.
Gerry Winterbourne
Veteran MemberPosts: 8,190
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 3, 2013

Hi, Andrew.  Not to rain on the parade, but I've tried mine in very dim light and still get the notorious FF.

-- hide signature --

Gerry
_______________________________________
First camera 1953, first Pentax 1985, first DSLR 2006
http://www.pbase.com/gerrywinterbourne

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
awaldram
Forum ProPosts: 10,821Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to Gerry Winterbourne, Feb 3, 2013

Gerry Winterbourne wrote:

Hi, Andrew. Not to rain on the parade, but I've tried mine in very dim light and still get the notorious FF.

I think if the FF tungsten Firmware fix as reported by Pentax (think was 1.03) hasn't fixed your K5 then it has other issues that FW is unlikely to address.

My K5 had a fractional FF completely eradicated by 1.03 don't see any general variance in it Low light behavior as far as accuracy goes , But seems a lot better with fast lens and the stopping algorithm seems much faster which probably ties in with the fast glass improvement.

Its difficult for me to test Tungsten light issues as here in the UK tungsten lighting has gone the way of gas street lamps.

I can get the candles out tonight to give it a real test under heavy red lighting but don;t expect any difference from my previous tests post 1.03

-- hide signature --

Gerry
_______________________________________
First camera 1953, first Pentax 1985, first DSLR 2006
http://www.pbase.com/gerrywinterbourne

 awaldram's gear list:awaldram's gear list
Pentax Q Pentax K-3 Pentax smc DA* 55mm F1.4 SDM Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +11 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Stephenhampshire
Contributing MemberPosts: 859Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 3, 2013

awaldram wrote:

No comment just 1 image and a crop, Note the 1.4 aperture

Sorry for running out of resolution but 6 MP was high enough to see the results

One very happy K5 owner !!!



Hmm, hope this might improve the a/f with my Sigma 30mm f1.4!

-- hide signature --

Everything changes

 Stephenhampshire's gear list:Stephenhampshire's gear list
Samsung TL350 Pentax K-5 Pentax K-30 Pentax smc DA 16-45mm F4 ED AL Tamron SP AF 70-200mm F/2.8 Di LD (IF) MACRO +13 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
awaldram
Forum ProPosts: 10,821Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to Stephenhampshire, Feb 3, 2013

I'll get a better idea next weekend when we (me and the camera) are out in anger will be using probably da*300 and Siggy 400 in lowish light will give me a good idea if SDm only or across the board.

 awaldram's gear list:awaldram's gear list
Pentax Q Pentax K-3 Pentax smc DA* 55mm F1.4 SDM Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +11 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
markusm
Regular MemberPosts: 140
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 3, 2013

awaldram wrote:

Gerry Winterbourne wrote:

Hi, Andrew. Not to rain on the parade, but I've tried mine in very dim light and still get the notorious FF.

I think if the FF tungsten Firmware fix as reported by Pentax (think was 1.03) hasn't fixed your K5 then it has other issues that FW is unlikely to address.

I think it's now pretty much agreed on that the issue is an optical one, where refraction effects confuse the AF sensors. I guess that what that also means is that  you will have more problems with some lenses than with others (and I guess fast lenses will tend to do worse) and that it depends a lot on the light composition.

My K5 had a fractional FF completely eradicated by 1.03 don't see any general variance in it Low light behavior as far as accuracy goes , But seems a lot better with fast lens and the stopping algorithm seems much faster which probably ties in with the fast glass improvement.

I won't buy it without more rigorous testing. Confirmation bias makes everyone claim that the camera now behaves a lot better. That said, I am perfectly happy with my K-5, even without the latest firmware.

Markus

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
sfa1966
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,221Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 3, 2013

Yes, looks like they've perhaps improved *something* in the AF algortihm. My AF seems a just a little bit snappier and more footsure than it was before. But that's just an unscientific gut feeling, and I left it more than 24 hours after upgrading the firmware before using the camera again, so I did not do a relatively contemporaneous "before and after" test.

Quite encouraging all the same.

-- hide signature --

Cheers,
sfa

 sfa1966's gear list:sfa1966's gear list
Sigma DP1 Sigma DP2 Merrill Pentax K-5 Pentax smc DA 15mm F4 ED AL Limited Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM +9 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
MightyMike
Forum ProPosts: 30,975
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to Gerry Winterbourne, Feb 3, 2013

I just put mine through heck, low light and all and i found no real improvement, really left me more highly considering a K-5IIs but i still want to see if we'll get a K-3 first

-- hide signature --

Mike from Canada
"I am not a great photographer! God is a great creator! All I do is capture His creation with the tools He has provided me."
'I like to think so far outside the box that it would require a telephoto lens just to see the box!' ~ 'My Quote :)'
http://www.michaelfastphotography.com/galleries/VP-BDI_3a.jpg
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?sort_order=views%20DESC&first_this_page=0&page_limit=180&&emailsearch=mighty_mike88%40hotmail.com&thumbnails=

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
breeze_of_wind
Senior MemberPosts: 1,056Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to MightyMike, Feb 3, 2013

MightyMike wrote:

I just put mine through heck, low light and all and i found no real improvement, really left me more highly considering a K-5IIs but i still want to see if we'll get a K-3 first

-- hide signature --

Mike from Canada
"I am not a great photographer! God is a great creator! All I do is capture His creation with the tools He has provided me."
'I like to think so far outside the box that it would require a telephoto lens just to see the box!' ~ 'My Quote :)'
http://www.michaelfastphotography.com/galleries/VP-BDI_3a.jpg
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?sort_order=views%20DESC&first_this_page=0&page_limit=180&&emailsearch=mighty_mike88%40hotmail.com&thumbnails=

Thanks -- I will not bother to update, and I too am waiting

See little reason to buy K5 IIs if there is a hope of a better body later this year

John

 breeze_of_wind's gear list:breeze_of_wind's gear list
Pentax K20D Pentax K-5 Pentax K-3 Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +8 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
EArenz
Regular MemberPosts: 433
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to markusm, Feb 3, 2013

Confirmation bias makes everyone claim that the camera now behaves a lot better. That said, I am perfectly happy with my K-5, even without the latest firmware.

Just addressed this concern to a limited degree at least for the K-01 with CDAF in this thread:

K-01, v1.02 FW and some AF notes

Ed

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
MightyMike
Forum ProPosts: 30,975
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to breeze_of_wind, Feb 3, 2013

There is no reason not to upgrade who knows what little tiny bugs they fixed but just don't expect glaring changes.

-- hide signature --

Mike from Canada
"I am not a great photographer! God is a great creator! All I do is capture His creation with the tools He has provided me."
'I like to think so far outside the box that it would require a telephoto lens just to see the box!' ~ 'My Quote :)'
http://www.michaelfastphotography.com/galleries/VP-BDI_3a.jpg
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?sort_order=views%20DESC&first_this_page=0&page_limit=180&&emailsearch=mighty_mike88%40hotmail.com&thumbnails=

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Stephenhampshire
Contributing MemberPosts: 859Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 3, 2013

Done both the K5 and K30 now, all OK. K30 and Sigma 30mm seems a bit more positive to on focus now, less hunting. Could be placebo, but I'm not complaining

-- hide signature --

Everything changes

 Stephenhampshire's gear list:Stephenhampshire's gear list
Samsung TL350 Pentax K-5 Pentax K-30 Pentax smc DA 16-45mm F4 ED AL Tamron SP AF 70-200mm F/2.8 Di LD (IF) MACRO +13 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
klavrack
Regular MemberPosts: 371
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to breeze_of_wind, Feb 3, 2013

breeze_of_wind wrote:

MightyMike wrote:

I just put mine through heck, low light and all and i found no real improvement, really left me more highly considering a K-5IIs but i still want to see if we'll get a K-3 first

-- hide signature --

Mike from Canada
"I am not a great photographer! God is a great creator! All I do is capture His creation with the tools He has provided me."
'I like to think so far outside the box that it would require a telephoto lens just to see the box!' ~ 'My Quote :)'
http://www.michaelfastphotography.com/galleries/VP-BDI_3a.jpg
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?sort_order=views%20DESC&first_this_page=0&page_limit=180&&emailsearch=mighty_mike88%40hotmail.com&thumbnails=

Thanks -- I will not bother to update, and I too am waiting

See little reason to buy K5 IIs if there is a hope of a better body later this year

John

Same here.  I'd replace my K-5 with a K5 III with more AF points, flash issues gone and focus peaking.  FF may be great for Pentax, but I don't want the added lens weight and expense.  Unless Nikon deals with their D600 sensor oil/dust mutiny, a  budget FF might help generate some new Pentax customers, though...lots of very PO'd owners.

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Rufus12
New MemberPosts: 15
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to MightyMike, Feb 3, 2013

Sorry to hear your camera didn't quite work out with this firmware.

It has been a couple of days since I upgraded the firmware to 1.14 and I wanted to do a more thorough testing/use before I posted an update.  Prior to this firmware upgrade, my K5 would consistently get short sighted focus under halogen lights even as high as EV10 nevermind trying under low light. Prior to this upgrade, under fw version 1.13, natural/artificial white ambient light (fluorescent/led lights) lit subjects however were correctly focused even in near low-light situations.


After applying  this latest firmware upgrade, the front-focusing behaviour under tungsten/halogen light (color temperature in the 3k kelvin range) was controlled to EV3. This is quite an improvement considering what wasn't possible previously. Only when my background illumination hits EV2 (and lower) does the FF behaviour return. For the my indoor shooting conditions, this is no longer a showstopper.   
Out of interest, I compared the results under natural/white light conditions.  With this new firmware, the focus is accurate all the way down to EV2. Only when it gets down to EV1, which is quite dim, does the FF issue returns. At that light level, it would be a struggle for me to focus accurately by eye or read a printed text. Not sure if this is the low light condition that are reported to be problematic for some. Under all circumstances, the focus locks on test target with the AF light assist beam turned off. I didn't test down EV0 as I could hardly see in the viewfinder what I'm trying to capture.   
There were a couple of additional steps I did before installing the fw upgrade which I don't recall being mentioned in the install instructions, I always reset all the camera settings to default prior to installing a firmware. I think there may be 3 different reset items in the menus and then performed all the testing under default settings just as I did in the previous tests.  In my view, fwiw, it's a good practice to reset hardware settings prior to a firmware install whether it be a camera, router, pc, or whatever equipment since some baseline could have changed. Also allows me to review possible changes in the menus and settings. Naturally one should save/copy/print or write down previous settings if required. 
Anyway, just sharing my own experience and hope it works for others as well. Now it's back to taking pictures. Good luck.
cheers
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
jatthegreat
Forum MemberPosts: 67Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to sfa1966, Feb 4, 2013

Did you notice something like this?

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50720646

and referring to this thread:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50770595

Then it is possible that the AF improvements were added to the Dec release of 1.13 itself because I updated the firmware recently and found AF improvements.

Now, I hope that the problem I saw with Dec 1.13 FW is addressed in 1.14. I'll give it a try later today.

 jatthegreat's gear list:jatthegreat's gear list
Pentax K-5 Sigma 10-20mm F4-5.6 EX DC HSM Tamron AF 18-250mm F/3.5-6.3 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) Macro Sigma 50mm F2.8 EX DG Macro Sigma 105mm F2.8 EX DG Macro +2 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
sfa1966
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,221Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to jatthegreat, Feb 4, 2013

Ah ... Can't say because I went straight from 1.11 to 1.14. But I am sure they've improved something just like you described it there.

Great shots you took in that thread, BTW.

 sfa1966's gear list:sfa1966's gear list
Sigma DP1 Sigma DP2 Merrill Pentax K-5 Pentax smc DA 15mm F4 ED AL Limited Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM +9 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
MightyMike
Forum ProPosts: 30,975
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to Rufus12, Feb 4, 2013

Most shots were EV6-EV7 mostly natural light it could have been the lens body combination also... now most of the shots came out in focus but there was a lot of hunting or just plain slowness. So in this regard i saw no real improvement making me want the low light AF performance of a K-5IIs

-- hide signature --

Mike from Canada
"I am not a great photographer! God is a great creator! All I do is capture His creation with the tools He has provided me."
'I like to think so far outside the box that it would require a telephoto lens just to see the box!' ~ 'My Quote :)'
http://www.michaelfastphotography.com/galleries/VP-BDI_3a.jpg
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?sort_order=views%20DESC&first_this_page=0&page_limit=180&&emailsearch=mighty_mike88%40hotmail.com&thumbnails=

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Raist3d
Forum ProPosts: 33,364Gear list
Like?
Mine seems improved... interesting...
In reply to awaldram, Feb 6, 2013

I just walked around tonight and it seems improved and this in low light. I turned off all lens corrections. I need to try now in daylight and see it behaves nice.

Where it starts to fail is in pretty low light and I guess this is where the K-5IIs/K-5II would pick up.

-- hide signature --

Raist3d/Ricardo (Photographer, software dev.)- I photograph black cats in coal mines at night...
“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.” - George Orwell

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
awaldram
Forum ProPosts: 10,821Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 10, 2013

awaldram wrote:

I'll get a better idea next weekend when we (me and the camera) are out in anger will be using probably da*300 and Siggy 400 in lowish light will give me a good idea if SDm only or across the board.

well the weekend came I was shooting in moderatley low light with a heavy yellow sodium element



Without any doubt AF is faster and more accurate.

The reason I'm so confident is the way I shoot.

I always have the camera on AF-c and Hi continuous shooting though I shoot single shots.

In the 2+ Years I've owned the k5 never have I had any issue accidentally firing multiple shots off.

Yet last night I had to turn Multi shot off. again and again lock rat tat tat tat two images taken.

There can only be one reason for this, the camera was acquiring lock earlier than usual so my standard 'squeeze' (to capture the right  moment) was long enough to fire two shots where pre 1.14 only one shot would have been taken in the same time frame.

With about 50,000 shots under my belt in this mode there is no rose spectacles in this, I'm having to alter my technique to cater for a faster camera.

 awaldram's gear list:awaldram's gear list
Pentax Q Pentax K-3 Pentax smc DA* 55mm F1.4 SDM Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +11 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Kerusker
Contributing MemberPosts: 764Gear list
Like?
Re: K5 Firmware 1.14 AF improvment
In reply to awaldram, Feb 10, 2013

awaldram wrote:

There can only be one reason for this, the camera was acquiring lock earlier than usual so my standard 'squeeze' (to capture the right moment) was long enough to fire two shots where pre 1.14 only one shot would have been taken in the same time frame.

As you are a very experienced K-5 shooter, your conclusion should be right.

How about the focus accuracy? Faster doesn't mean better in any way.

If it's both - faster and at least as precise as before, then I will wait till the K-5 IIs price is coming down below 1000 EUR (and keep my K-5).

On the other hand: Only hard core K-5 users are looking for improvements by latest K-5 FW. These users are of the same kind which improve their K-5 handling to get the most out of it.

Sometimes it is hard to distinguish between these kind of improvements.

-- hide signature --

][.Kerusker
we don't see that we don't see (eye's blind spot)

 Kerusker's gear list:Kerusker's gear list
Pentax K-5 II Pentax K-5 Pentax smc DA 15mm F4 ED AL Limited Pentax smc DA* 16-50mm F2.8 ED AL (IF) SDM Pentax smc DA 55-300mm F4.0-5.8 ED
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads