Am I able to do shallow DoF with RX100?

I hear that the 1.8 aperture of RX100 is mostly a marketing gimmick. You aren't able to achieve a shallow DoF except for some extreme macro-like kind of shots. Is this true? I'm trying to see if I can buy a small compact camera that is capable of producing decent level of portrait shots with nice bokeh. Thank you.

Hi,

There are roughly 100 threads in this part of the forum, all answering similar questions.  So use the "search" box at the top, it is your best friend.

rio

Shallow DoF with RX100? Hmmmm not really. You will get shallow DoF only when photographing objects that are not very far away from you.

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Kind regards.
Martin

Depends on what your expectations are and what you are comparing it to.

Compared to any other camera that fits in your pocket (any other conventional P&S with a smaller sensor), the DoF is appreciably shallower in comparable scenes.

And it's probably competitive with an entry-level DSLR with the basic kit lens.

But compared to any DSLR paired with a portrait lens, it's going to be lacking.

I find it quite a capable of producing nice portraits, especially for something that you can take along anywhere.

For shallow depth of field you need a large sensor, wide aperture, longer focal length and be close to the subject.

The RX100 has a larger sensor than many compact cameras but not as large as a DSLR. The aperture opens to f/1.8 but only at the wide angle end of the zoom, so you cannot have wide aperture and long focal length at the same time.

If you get close to your subject with the zoom at the long end and the widest aperture, you will get shallower DOF than many compacts, but probably not what you are hoping for.

You really need the RX1.

But the RX1 doesn't have a long focal length

I mean that's the thing, does the RX1 even do well in with shallow DoF?

If the RX100 cannot do this, then why am I pay 3x the price for this point and shoot camera compared to others? Is it really only just for the IQ?

Well, this may answer your question a bit.

There may be some more shallow scenery in another shot

but this is one of my first shots with the RX100. I like

the shallow order of the glasses...

SONY DSC-RX100, f/2,8 @14,8 mm, 1/50, ISO 400, No Flash

It wont be like dx or full frame but its still possible to get some background separation...

wide shot is  1.8

zoom at full zoom 4.9

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http://www.pbase.com/jps1979/galleries

The fast aperture is not gimmick; it still lets in a lot of light.  Your ability to achieve shallow DOF, however, is going to be limited by the sensor size.  As for the RX1, it can achieve shallow DOF because of its large aperture and large sensor.  It does not take a long lens to achieve shallow DOF.  What most people don't realize is that given the same framing, aperture, and sensor size, all lenses will have the same DOF whether they are a 200mm lens or a 35mm lens.  For example, if you were to take a head and shoulders portrait with a 200mm lens, you would have to back away from your subject, thus increasing the DOF.  Conversely, if you were to take the same portrait with a 35mm lens, you would move closer to the subject, thus decreasing the DOF. With those two lenses at the same framing and aperture, the DOF is the same.  A smaller sensor, however, essentially crops your image.  So, instead of moving closer with a 35mm lens (for example), you stand farther away -- increasing DOF -- and crop the image to achieve the same framing.  Everything else being equal, a larger sensor will always have shallower DOF than a smaller sensor.

as the examples posted show, not only do you need to be close, the background wants to be far away, not your typical shallow dof but better than P&S.

as noted, lens/sensor size is the determining factor, as well as f stops, etc.

http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

if want compact,  fixed lens, you may want to look at Canon G1X, 1.5" sensor, slow focus but great IQ, much better shallow DOF.

quality comparisons between cameras found here

http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

other model suggestions?

Actually I'm very interested in other model suggestions! I want non interchangeable lens but decent control of DoF and pocketable.

Don't we all mate? ;O)

IMO, for your work, you need a bigger sensor than the rx100 for reliable portrait shallow dof.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_sensor_format#Table_of_sensor_formats_and_sizes

I use sensor area, square mm to more accurately compare them; sensor technicalities differ also.

rx100 has what I call 'type 1', it is slightly smaller than a 1" sensor. sensor area 116 square mm

canon G1X has 1.5" sensor, you might think only 1/3 bigger, but sensor area is 262 square mm, more than double the area.

so, the word pocketable needs to be refined, because any camera with a bigger sensor will not be pants pocketable like the rx100 truly is. I mentioned the Canon G1X because it is relatively small, I would say jacket pocketable.

Elliott

You pay the price premium because you have DSLR-like high-ISO capabilities and amazingly fast autofocus in a compact body. Also the RX100 can focus in a very dimly lit conditions which is also good. The LCD is great too, it can be seen even in sunny snowy weather. The body of the camera is also made from durable metal (it might seem like plastic at first glance)

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Kind regards.
Martin

Thanks. Any idea how the rx100 is able to get AF similar to dslr? I guess the same on sensor pdaf technology as the NEX6?

That's actually one thing I like about the RX100 as a portrait cam. It gets you thinking about how to set up the scene... it makes you work for bokeh. No regrets:



Yes. Have a look at the RX1 gallery by Joe Marquez:

http://www.thesmokingcamera.com/sony_rx1_test_photos

To my knowledge the AF sensor on the RX100 is purely contrast-detection type not a phase-detection like some cameras use. You can achieve fast contrast-detection AF by using a fast sensor that can output many fps and fast image processor. The RX100 has them both. The sensor can confirmedly output 60 fps from it's sensor and process 10 RAW images in 1 second which is quite fast (even for a DSLR, let alone compact camera).
BTW on the Nikon 1 series the contrast detection AF is even quicker than on the RX100. Is amazing how that focusing type has advanced over the years.

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Kind regards.
Martin