help me buy a good slr camera

Started Jan 18, 2013 | Questions
KCook
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to Guidenet, Jan 24, 2013

Shoot, I agree that the extra controls on a semi-pro body are nicer, that is part of the reason I chose the 50D instead of the latest Rebel.  And, for an eager beaver enrolled in some high intensity program at Brooks, or where ever, those controls might make a difference too.

But my guess is that most of the noobs posting here simply want nicer photos for their family.  They will be on a DIY path that is a lot more casual than Brooks.  And the internal controls will not impede their learning.

In any event, this deficit of controls on entry level cameras applies equally to the entry level Nikons, as to the Canon 550D.  Which your post did not make clear, sounded like the 550D was somehow more crippled.

Kelly

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Guidenet
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to KCook, Jan 24, 2013

KCook wrote:

In any event, this deficit of controls on entry level cameras applies equally to the entry level Nikons, as to the Canon 550D. Which your post did not make clear, sounded like the 550D was somehow more crippled.

Kelly, are you sure? When I reread my post, it doesn't look that way, but if you took it as a take-away, I didn't mean a Canon anymore than any other entry level model by anyone. They are all about the same, IMO.

"It's just fine, but it's entry level so a little harder to learn with, but it's ok. I'd get the 18-135 with it."

There's my statement to review.

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JohnJ851
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to Guidenet, Jan 25, 2013

Is it just me that think an entry level DSLR is made for a beginner to learn the ropes?

All DSLR's are fine these days.

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Guidenet
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to JohnJ851, Jan 25, 2013

JohnJ851 wrote:

Is it just me that think an entry level DSLR is made for a beginner to learn the ropes?

All DSLR's are fine these days.

JohnJ

Personally, I don't think so. I think an entry level is just that, an entry into SLR photography. I think they are built as inexpensively as possible leaving off many of the things that make learning photography easier. Just because they are inexpensive doesn't mean they are easier to learn with, IMO.

It might be similar with an inexpensive car. Though a cheaper way to get an automobile, it might not be the best to learn how to drive for the first time. The two things have little in common. Inexpensive doesn't always mean educational.

I think it also depends on what the novice photographer wants to learn or how far they want to get into this hobby or career. If they just want to get good enough for everyday shots on vacation and family events where they start in P mode and eventually just graduate to A mode and an understanding of depth of field, I'm sure an entry level model is just fine. On the other hand, if they really want to understand exposure and learn to take full control over photography, they'd do better with a camera which has more tactile controls and external information. This is why I often ask how far they want to go and how much passion they have.

If a novice really wants to learn exposure and possibly The Zone System of photography and they want that control on tactile controls on the body; and they want the exposure information outside and visible, then a more enthusiast body might indeed be preferable to them. An entry level model might quickly prove very frustrating. That's not to say you couldn't learn everything on an entry level. I'm just talking about making it as easy and seamless as possible. There's absolutely no reason to step it up if the novice has a large enough wallet. It also means they don't need to upgrade nearly as soon.

Many new SLR owners buy something like a T3i or T4i entry level camera with a twin lens EF-S kit only to find they have to upgrade the whole shebang when they wish to take the next step. Not one piece of that starter kit might be part of the next-step kit. That next large investment might to too large for many to partake and they are held back with inexpensive mediocre gear.

However, had they purchased a little better camera and just one lens that was a little better, they might be able to slowly build that better kit around the original purchase. Say a 60D with the 18-135 STM setup or a 7D and lens. Even a 5D MKII with good EF lens might be a great idea. It just depends on what your long term goals are.

Have a great day.

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Deleted1929
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to Guidenet, Jan 25, 2013

Many new SLR owners buy something like a T3i or T4i entry level camera with a twin lens EF-S kit only to find they have to upgrade the whole shebang when they wish to take the next step. Not one piece of that starter kit might be part of the next-step kit. That next large investment might to too large for many to partake and they are held back with inexpensive mediocre gear.

Craig, I think this a bit OTT.

The standard Canon kit lenses now are very good optically and surely anyone can get superb shots from any entry level DSLR if they understand the same things they would need in order to get superb shots on any system.

I would not characterize any of the current entry level DSLRs as "mediocre".

I think we need to remember that the vast majority of people buying cameras will never be willing to spend what for some enthusiasts would be a "reasonable" amount for gear.  Photography for most people is useful only while it stays firmly below the $1000 mark or even less.  I know you think the D600 is great value ( and in absolute terms I think it is ), but for most people they'll never step up to the price of that body and lenses to exploit it ( or even learn the technique to do so ).

I think your perspective is what in IT we would call a "power user".  People who will spend more on equipment because they have a use for it ( or in IT usually to play rather silly games ).  You have a very long term involvement in photography at a serious level.  That's not how it is or will be for the majority of buyers now, I think.

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Bjorn_L
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to jaison007, Jan 25, 2013

jaison007 wrote:

Bjorn_L wrote:

jaison007 wrote:

can anybody help me to buy a SLR camera. I am in entry level stage for SLR cameras.

Pls. help me.

Take a little time to think over what you want to shoot and how. I know you have no experiance with the stuff but just use your imagination as best you can.

1. Is low light very important?

2. What about poor weather?

3. Sports or photos involving relatively fast movement?

4. Portability? How sensitive are you with regards to weight of the kit?

5. Are you going to invest in a system and slowly add lenses and periferals or do you hope to manage this with 1 body and 1 "jack of all trades" lens?

6. What about budget? How much are you looking to spend initially? Is used an option?

7. Are you interested enough to take the time to learn? Or are you looking for a better photo by just spending more?

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See my plan (in my profile) for what I shoot with. See my gallery for images I find amusing.

1. Is low light very important? yes

2. What about poor weather? weather is dusty in summer season & rainy season? how much impact will be there in means of weather condition?

3. Sports or photos involving relatively fast movement? yes for some extent around 70%.

4. Portability? How sensitive are you with regards to weight of the kit? no problem.

5. Are you going to invest in a system and slowly add lenses and periferals or do you hope to manage this with 1 body and 1 "jack of all trades" lens? may be slowly add lenses.

6. What about budget? How much are you looking to spend initially? Is used an option? medium budget.

7. Are you interested enough to take the time to learn? Or are you looking for a better photo by just spending more? yes i want to learn more & more in easy way step by step. want nice clicks on less spending.

Learning Stage.

Hi jaison,

Sorry I missed your previous post.

Since low light is important to you, I suggest you look a little at dxomark.com when considering cameras.  Low light is aided by better ISO performance and higher dynamic range.

Poor weather shooting (including dust and rain like you mentioned) means you should if possible get a sealed camera body and sealed lens.

Sports type shooting at 70% means that the availability of sports lenses is going to be super important.  This essentially rules out everything other than Nikon and Canon.

Given that size is not an issue, this opens up many of the best cameras.    These tend to be a little heavier.  To some this matters a great deal.

It is good that you are not looking for a jack of all trades lens as they do not deliver the best image quality.  Slowly adding lenses is the best way to go.  It gives you time to learn each one and more accurately select the next one.

I am not sure what medium budget means.  So I will  make several suggestions.

Sealed starter kit that is good in low light.  Nikon d7000 + Nikon 17-55 f2.8.  Neither is very cheap.  But there is nothing from Canon which competes with either of those two.  The d7000 is a good deal better in low light, the 17-55 f2.8 is both good in low light and weather sealed.  Both can be had used for some savings, but they are not super cheap.

Cheaper and also good is the Nikon d300 and d300s.  They are not as good in low light as the d7000 (although they are as good as the current Canon's 60d/7d).  Again the only sealed lens in the normal range is the Nikon 17-55 f2.8.

Other options: Nikon d600 or d700 (full frame cameras) with a Nikon 24-120 f/4 vr.  All sealed.

Pentax has several low priced sealed cameras and lenses.  They are the only brand with low cost sealed options.  However they lack sports lenses.  The Pentax is as good at low light as the same level of Nikon but the lens selection is not as good.

Canon has just as many fine lenses as Nikon including sealed lenses (just none in the APS-C normal range).  However the Canon's are not as good at low light as the Nikon or Pentax.

Given your stated goals, the d7000 seems the best fit if you can swing the cost.  If the 17-55 is too expensive, use the Kit lens which comes with the d7000, just stay out of the rain and dust as much as possible until you get a sealed lens.

If the d7000 is too much money, look at the d300.  It is a little better at sports (super advanced focus and metering system) and still really good at low light.  The d300 has no video.  The d300s does have video, but not as advanced as the d7000.

If the d300 is too much, look at a Nikon d90.  It has the same sensor as the d300 and d300s, but in a non-sealed body.  Reasonably good at everything.  And it can be had used for very cheap.  The Canon 60d is around the same performance but adds better video options than the d90 has.  Of course the 60d is priced very close to the d7000(which seems a better fit to your goals).

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jaison007
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to Bjorn_L, Jan 26, 2013

Bjorn_L wrote:

jaison007 wrote:

Bjorn_L wrote:

jaison007 wrote:

can anybody help me to buy a SLR camera. I am in entry level stage for SLR cameras.

Pls. help me.

Take a little time to think over what you want to shoot and how. I know you have no experiance with the stuff but just use your imagination as best you can.

1. Is low light very important?

2. What about poor weather?

3. Sports or photos involving relatively fast movement?

4. Portability? How sensitive are you with regards to weight of the kit?

5. Are you going to invest in a system and slowly add lenses and periferals or do you hope to manage this with 1 body and 1 "jack of all trades" lens?

6. What about budget? How much are you looking to spend initially? Is used an option?

7. Are you interested enough to take the time to learn? Or are you looking for a better photo by just spending more?

-- hide signature --

See my plan (in my profile) for what I shoot with. See my gallery for images I find amusing.

1. Is low light very important? yes

2. What about poor weather? weather is dusty in summer season & rainy season? how much impact will be there in means of weather condition?

3. Sports or photos involving relatively fast movement? yes for some extent around 70%.

4. Portability? How sensitive are you with regards to weight of the kit? no problem.

5. Are you going to invest in a system and slowly add lenses and periferals or do you hope to manage this with 1 body and 1 "jack of all trades" lens? may be slowly add lenses.

6. What about budget? How much are you looking to spend initially? Is used an option? medium budget.

7. Are you interested enough to take the time to learn? Or are you looking for a better photo by just spending more? yes i want to learn more & more in easy way step by step. want nice clicks on less spending.

Learning Stage.

Hi jaison,

Sorry I missed your previous post.

Since low light is important to you, I suggest you look a little at dxomark.com when considering cameras. Low light is aided by better ISO performance and higher dynamic range.

Poor weather shooting (including dust and rain like you mentioned) means you should if possible get a sealed camera body and sealed lens.

Sports type shooting at 70% means that the availability of sports lenses is going to be super important. This essentially rules out everything other than Nikon and Canon.

Given that size is not an issue, this opens up many of the best cameras. These tend to be a little heavier. To some this matters a great deal.

It is good that you are not looking for a jack of all trades lens as they do not deliver the best image quality. Slowly adding lenses is the best way to go. It gives you time to learn each one and more accurately select the next one.

I am not sure what medium budget means. So I will make several suggestions.

Sealed starter kit that is good in low light. Nikon d7000 + Nikon 17-55 f2.8. Neither is very cheap. But there is nothing from Canon which competes with either of those two. The d7000 is a good deal better in low light, the 17-55 f2.8 is both good in low light and weather sealed. Both can be had used for some savings, but they are not super cheap.

Cheaper and also good is the Nikon d300 and d300s. They are not as good in low light as the d7000 (although they are as good as the current Canon's 60d/7d). Again the only sealed lens in the normal range is the Nikon 17-55 f2.8.

Other options: Nikon d600 or d700 (full frame cameras) with a Nikon 24-120 f/4 vr. All sealed.

Pentax has several low priced sealed cameras and lenses. They are the only brand with low cost sealed options. However they lack sports lenses. The Pentax is as good at low light as the same level of Nikon but the lens selection is not as good.

Canon has just as many fine lenses as Nikon including sealed lenses (just none in the APS-C normal range). However the Canon's are not as good at low light as the Nikon or Pentax.

Given your stated goals, the d7000 seems the best fit if you can swing the cost. If the 17-55 is too expensive, use the Kit lens which comes with the d7000, just stay out of the rain and dust as much as possible until you get a sealed lens.

If the d7000 is too much money, look at the d300. It is a little better at sports (super advanced focus and metering system) and still really good at low light. The d300 has no video. The d300s does have video, but not as advanced as the d7000.

If the d300 is too much, look at a Nikon d90. It has the same sensor as the d300 and d300s, but in a non-sealed body. Reasonably good at everything. And it can be had used for very cheap. The Canon 60d is around the same performance but adds better video options than the d90 has. Of course the 60d is priced very close to the d7000(which seems a better fit to your goals).

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See my plan (in my profile) for what I shoot with. See my gallery for images I find amusing.

Thanks for ur help?

wat about canon eos 550d

weather this will good for me?

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Learning Stage.

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Guidenet
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to Deleted1929, Jan 26, 2013

Hi Stephen. I'm not sure this discussion is in any way off the topic. Do you really think so? Besides, it's on a side thread. 

Anyway, I completely agree with you. Relook at what I wrote and notice, I said that I ask to determine how far they want to go. I completely agree that most will stay under $1000 and most will never wish to go to that next level. There's nothing wrong with that.

I try my best to determine if the OP here or otherwise has the commitment, passion, and desire to really want to learn photography, possibly making a lifelong career or hobby from it. If so, I suggest the move to better gear and one lens only at the start. I suggest cameras which I think make it easier to learn.

If, however, they are interested in photography from more of a casual hobby basis, then you've seen me suggest the entry level kits by all brands. For those purposes, they are very capable.

Like I said, it depends on whether or not they want to really learn photography from the ground floor up. That's the people I think would do better with something like a D90 or D7000 or even a D700 where they have those refinements and features which make photography easier to learn.

There is no reason for a casual photographer to learn the Zone System either. The manufacturers have made great strides in automation in scene evaluation tools.

I promise my view is not an insult to the entry level models nor those who do well with them. I also understand there might be many who just cannot afford to make the type purchase required to purchase the more expensive gear. Some of these are serious and passionate photographers who can create compelling and beautiful images with a point and shoot or inexpensive entry level camera.

The point was strictly in regard to what type of camera helped to make it easier to learn with irrespective of cost.

Have a great weekend my friend.

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Cheers, Craig
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Guidenet
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to jaison007, Jan 26, 2013

Jason, as Bjorn and I have said. There's a line in the sand dividing entry level cameras and enthusiast cameras. Almost all the entry level models are very similar and they'd all be just fine except they are missing what you pay for in the next step.

The Canon 650D is an entry level model like the Nikon D5100, D5200 or D3100. If you want a notch up into an enthusiast camera with an optical glass pentaprism viewfinder, top mounted LCD, dual command dials and external tactile contols, you must look at Cameras like the D90, Canon 60D, Nikon D7000, D300 and above.

So, yes, the 650D will work just like any other entry-level model made by anyone. They are all very similar.

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peevee1
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Re: help me buy a good slr camera
In reply to JohnJ851, Jan 27, 2013

JohnJ851 wrote:

Is it just me that think an entry level DSLR is made for a beginner to learn the ropes?

No, it is just you. Entry level DSLRs are made for those who DO NOT  WANT to learn the ropes. To learn, you are going to be much better with Canon G-something, or Nikon P7700, or the best for learning Fuji X-E1, than with any entry level DSLR. Although pictures from a DSLR will be better in auto mode than the pictures from Canon/Nikon compacts.

All DSLR's are fine these days.

Fine for what and compared to what?

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